# Where to get full tactical gear.



## teenprepper1 (Jan 13, 2013)

Hi, I am looking for an online store that has all of the apparel tactical gear. I need to basically look like a U.S army soldier, full camo, tactical vest, bug out bag (strong tactical bag for food, med supplies, tools, shelter, water) , holster, rifle sleeve for AR-15, and portable shelters? also is there a list of possible shtf events? like new madrid earthquake, super volcano yellowstone, with recommendations on what to do? any recommendations? Thanks!


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Check your local army surplus.


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## Sentry18 (Aug 5, 2012)

www.Rangerjoes.com

www.uscav.com

www.sportsmansguide.com

www.armysurplusstore.com

www.1starmy.com

www.majorsurplus.com

www.militarygear.com


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

For gear, just Google Tactical. For disaster training joiin CERT.


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## Cabowabo (Nov 6, 2012)

For training.
http://www.goarmy.com/
http://www.marines.com/home?WT.srch=1&WT.mc_id=G_Brand_Top%20Perf1543
In all seriousness you're putting the cart BEFORE the horse. 
Good tactical training isn't cheap. Ammo cost + class cost + travel and lodging = expensive.

Do I mind if I ask why you want to look like a soldier after SHTF? If you claim to have served and you never did, you'll be like the guys on Stolen Valour.

Training before gear. And what is a rifle sleeve for an AR-15? I've never seen one.


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## labotomi (Feb 14, 2010)

teenprepper1 said:


> also is there a list of possible shtf events? like new madrid earthquake, super volcano yellowstone, with recommendations on what to do? any recommendations? Thanks!


I think there's an online forum where people discuss a lot of possible SHTF events.

Preparedsociety.com


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## ZoomZoom (Dec 18, 2009)

teenprepper1 said:


> I need to basically look like a U.S army soldier...
> also is there a list of possible shtf events? like new madrid earthquake, super volcano yellowstone, with recommendations on what to do?


I honestly don't feel right answering until I know what you're going to do.

Look like a soldier? If you're doing it for theatricial purposes, that's cool (but doesn't explain why you need knowledge about SHTF events).

The only other time I'd think it appropriate is Halloween but asking for that gear, I'm guessing you're too old to trick-or-treat.

Impersonating a member of the military isn't cool in my book.


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## FatTire (Mar 20, 2012)

Try googling 'mall ninja supplies' for the gear the OP seems to be looking for...

Sorry, call me paranoid but the post seems quite suspicious to me..


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## Cabowabo (Nov 6, 2012)

If you want to put on the uniform of the United States military. Walk your butt over to the recruiters office and sign up your name. You can sign for as little as 2 years I think in the Army. Air Force and Navy pretty sure the min. is 4 years. Marines I think is also 4 years is the minimum active time.

Their is nothing lower then someone who didn't have the balls to join, and wants to wear a uniform. I'll put it this way, when I leave the service, I'm hanging my uniforms up in my closet and thats it. For "tactical pants" I prefer 5.11 cargo pants, and earth tone shirts. 

You don't need a uniform, and if you wear a uniform that you didn't EARN, and no amount of $$$ can buy the right to wear it. But if you didn't Earn that right, you better not wear it. That means no MARPAT, No Multicam, no ACU, and no ABU, no BDU. And if you don't know what those are you ain't go no business wearing 'em anyway.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Cabowabo said:


> If you want to put on the uniform of the United States military. Walk your butt over to the recruiters office and sign up your name. You can sign for as little as 2 years I think in the Army. Air Force and Navy pretty sure the min. is 4 years. Marines I think is also 4 years is the minimum active time.
> 
> Their is nothing lower then someone who didn't have the balls to join, and wants to wear a uniform. I'll put it this way, when I leave the service, I'm hanging my uniforms up in my closet and thats it. For "tactical pants" I prefer 5.11 cargo pants, and earth tone shirts.
> 
> You don't need a uniform, and if you wear a uniform that you didn't EARN, and no amount of $$$ can buy the right to wear it. But if you didn't Earn that right, you better not wear it. That means no MARPAT, No Multicam, no ACU, and no ABU, no BDU. And if you don't know what those are you ain't go no business wearing 'em anyway.


This is why as a costume designer I always bought/rented uniforms worn by other countries and adjusted real patches and insignias so the uniforms could never be taken for the real thing by REAL servicemen.

I normally use Boy Scout patches if I have to design a military uniform for work.

I respect real servicemen too much to allow an actor to wear a uniform they didn't earn.


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## 21601mom (Jan 15, 2013)

Cabowabo said:


> If you want to put on the uniform of the United States military. Walk your butt over to the recruiters office and sign up your name. You can sign for as little as 2 years I think in the Army. Air Force and Navy pretty sure the min. is 4 years. Marines I think is also 4 years is the minimum active time.
> 
> Their is nothing lower then someone who didn't have the balls to join, and wants to wear a uniform. I'll put it this way, when I leave the service, I'm hanging my uniforms up in my closet and thats it. For "tactical pants" I prefer 5.11 cargo pants, and earth tone shirts.
> 
> You don't need a uniform, and if you wear a uniform that you didn't EARN, and no amount of $$$ can buy the right to wear it. But if you didn't Earn that right, you better not wear it. That means no MARPAT, No Multicam, no ACU, and no ABU, no BDU. And if you don't know what those are you ain't go no business wearing 'em anyway.


Quoted for truth!!!!

And Cabowabo, thank you for your service!


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## Cabowabo (Nov 6, 2012)

21601mom said:


> Quoted for truth!!!!
> 
> And Cabowabo, thank you for your service!


Thank you ma'am. Believe it or not I didn't do the job for thanks, and I don't mention such service for it. I do have a problem with people wanting to dress or act military when they never did the time.


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

Just recognize you're takng to a kid.


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## crabapple (Jan 1, 2012)

teenprepper1 said:


> Hi, I am looking for an online store that has all of the apparel tactical gear. I need to basically look like a U.S army soldier, full camo, tactical vest, bug out bag (strong tactical bag for food, med supplies, tools, shelter, water) , holster, rifle sleeve for AR-15, and portable shelters? also is there a list of possible shtf events? like new madrid earthquake, super volcano yellowstone, with recommendations on what to do? any recommendations? Thanks!


If this TEEN-prepper is for real, he/she will need all of this & more.
Let's cut teenprepper1 a little slack.

Best way to answer your post is to have you tell us a little about yourself.
Not your name or cell#, but why you want to prep.
What makes you think you need to be a prepare.

How do we know you are not a 31 year old NSA agent.

The best way to learn is do a Search on this form for threads about what you want to learn.
Then ask questions, be nice & most people will be nice right back.
That what I did when I came on the site.
Their are good people here, but they want to know you mean it & you are not fooling around wasting their time.


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## Dakine (Sep 4, 2012)

in a SHTF situation there are reasons for looking like or NOT looking like a soldier:

FOR:
You might be mistaken as a soldier and not shot at

You might "blend in" wearing cammies, with other people or with the environment and have an easier time traveling

Possible someone may offer assistance to someone that they think is a soldier instead of a civilian (if they start asking questions you can't answer they may become suspicious and then this could become an "against")

AGAINST:
You might be mistaken for a solider and shot at. (during Katrina some residents who didn't abandon New Orleans were shooting at the Coast Guard rescue helicopters picking people up off of rooftops, so yeah, it happens)

If someone spots you and thinks you are a soldier, they just might decide to grab you and find out what kind of gear, identification cards, information you have, etc

Actions that don't fit a pattern of a trained soldier will give you away, someone may hold it against you that you tried to impersonate a soldier.

LE/MIL may mistake you as a deserter or AWOL if you're just wandering about and hold you until your identity is established

if you have a backpack, rifle scabbard or other gear that is all blinged out with molle and various addon packs, someone just may decide it looks interesting enough to take it away from you.


There's a wide variety of well made rugged clothes in earth tones that will not make you appear that you have anything out of the ordinary and in that case it would be better than camouflage clothes.

You may want to really consider what you feel the benefits are of appearing to be a soldier. In some limited circumstances it could be a benefit, but there's a lot more risk associated with it than you may have first considered.


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## Zanazaz (Feb 14, 2012)

Luckily, we live in a nation that still has a few freedoms left. Many of my relatives both living and dead, ( including my dad, a Marine ) served in the military. They all believed in freedom. Of course I don't believe ANYONE should impersonate military personnel for any reason.

But unless it becomes illegal to wear BDUs etc. then anyone should be able to wear them. For hunting, for paintball, Halloween, whatever.... They are just clothes after all. Notice I wrote CLOTHES, not UNIFORM.

Unless we find out different then we should cut teenprepper some slack. We don't know his intention, and it seems to me he didn't communicate his intention with us very well. 

As far as I'm concerned, if I can legally buy it, then I will wear it if I want to wear it. Anyone thinking differently really needs to rethink what they think freedom is.


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## Cabowabo (Nov 6, 2012)

I'll put it this way. Someone with military experience can pick out an imposter. Their is a certain kind of walk, demeanor, the way they talk. That you can't just pick up by playing video games and watching war movies. You are taught to do things a certain way, that if it isn't imbedded into you, people will spot you as an imposter. 

If you think that former military regardless of branch will take kindly to you wearing a uniform you didn't earn think again. Look up YouTube videos of vets handling people who claimed stuff they didn't earn. Now think about if their is no Rule of Law what will happen to those people.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Geek999 said:


> Just recognize you're talking to a kid.


All the more reason to establish right from wrong in regards to their request.


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## Cabowabo (Nov 6, 2012)

Zanazaz said:


> Luckily, we live in a nation that still has a few freedoms left. Many of my relatives both living and dead, ( including my dad, a Marine ) served in the military. They all believed in freedom. Of course I don't believe ANYONE should impersonate military personnel for any reason.
> 
> But unless it becomes illegal to wear BDUs etc. then anyone should be able to wear them. For hunting, for paintball, Halloween, whatever.... They are just clothes after all. Notice I wrote CLOTHES, not UNIFORM.
> 
> ...


What he said, in his first post made it seem like he intended on passing himself off as military. BDU's are a very common camo to use for hunting or paintball etc. But I doubt he would go with BDU'S. Anyone that knows anything about the military would know that no branch of hte military still uses those, and based off his name. He would be to young to have been able to wear them in the military.

Personally I might consider gettting a couple sets of multi cams for myself. To use for field work when cammo is needed. But at that point their is a difference between me wearing them and you. No offense.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Zanazaz said:


> Luckily, we live in a nation that still has a few freedoms left. Many of my relatives both living and dead, ( including my dad, a Marine ) served in the military. They all believed in freedom. Of course I don't believe ANYONE should impersonate military personnel for any reason.
> 
> But unless it becomes illegal to wear BDUs etc. then anyone should be able to wear them. For hunting, for paintball, Halloween, whatever.... They are just clothes after all. Notice I wrote CLOTHES, not UNIFORM.
> 
> ...


From experience it is very hard to get CURRENT uniforms. That is why I mentioned going to an army surplus. He can get any manner of retired patterns/colors/fabrics/nationality and achieve the "look" he wants without coming across as a prat.


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

Grimm said:


> All the more reason to establish right from wrong in regards to their request.


You might be talking him into abandoning the forum before finding out what it is about. You might be talking him into not joining the military when he is of an age to do so. You might be talking him out of becoming a prepper by teaching him that preppers are a bunch of (choose your favorite derogatory appellation).

All that needs to be said is "It is inappropriate to wear a military uniform unless you are military." Anything beyond that is unnecessarily harsh.

As for wearing "tactical" gear, every mall ninja has a closet full. If he wants to get some tactical gear and go play paintball, then there is no need to get down his throat.

Just once I'd like to see someone new show up and be given a bit of slack until we find out what they are all about, particularly some teenager.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Geek999 said:


> You might be talking him into abandoning the forum before finding out what it is about. You might be talking him into not joining the military when he is of an age to do so. You might be talking him out of becoming a prepper by teaching him that preppers are a bunch of (choose your favorite derogatory appellation).
> 
> All that needs to be said is "It is inappropriate to wear a military uniform unless you are military." Anything beyond that is unnecessarily harsh.
> 
> ...


All I said to the OP is to try the army surplus shops. I agree though that it is inappropriate for non military to wear military uniforms and gear.


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## Zanazaz (Feb 14, 2012)

Cabowabo said:


> What he said, in his first post made it seem like he intended on passing himself off as military. BDU's are a very common camo to use for hunting or paintball etc. But I doubt he would go with BDU'S. Anyone that knows anything about the military would know that no branch of hte military still uses those, and based off his name. He would be to young to have been able to wear them in the military.
> 
> Personally I might consider gettting a couple sets of multi cams for myself. To use for field work when cammo is needed. But at that point their is a difference between me wearing them and you. No offense.


True he didn't make himself very clear. Also I'm not offended. I'm just stating my opinion. I believe in freedom, and maintaining those freedoms.

However, this is what you wrote:



> You don't need a uniform, and if you wear a uniform that you didn't EARN, and no amount of $$$ can buy the right to wear it. But if you didn't Earn that right, you better not wear it. That means no MARPAT, No Multicam, no ACU, and no ABU,* no BDU*. And if you don't know what those are you ain't go no business wearing 'em anyway.


I agree about the uniform part, but as I mentioned before, if a person can legally buy something then they can legally wear it, whether it's BDUs, multicam, or whatever. Maybe that's not what you meant, and of course you could just be referring to uniforms. If that's the case we are in perfect agreement. You using it in the field and someone using it during paintball are of course two different things. If I want to wear them on my property or wherever, as long as I am not breaking any laws, I should be able to.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Zanazaz said:


> True he didn't make himself very clear. Also I'm not offended. I'm just stating my opinion. I believe in freedom, and maintaining those freedoms.
> 
> However, this is what you wrote:
> 
> I agree about the uniform part, but as I mentioned before, if a person can legally buy something then they can legally wear it, whether it's BDUs, multicam, or whatever. Maybe that's not what you meant, and of course you could just be referring to uniforms. If that's the case we are in perfect agreement. You using it in the field and someone using it during paintball are of course two different things. If I want to wear them on my property or wherever, as long as I am not breaking any laws, I should be able to.


This is were we will disagree. Just because you can buy something does not give you the RIGHT to use/wear/own something. It is a federal crime to impersonate military personnel. It is also a felony to impersonate law enforcement. So by these laws I may have the right to buy something but I can not pretend to be something I am not.


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## labotomi (Feb 14, 2010)

Grimm said:


> This is were we will disagree. Just because you can buy something does not give you the RIGHT to use/wear/own something. It is a federal crime to impersonate military personnel. It is also a felony to impersonate law enforcement. So by these laws I may have the right to buy something but I can not pretend to be something I am not.


It is not a crime to wear either uniform. It is only a crime trying to pass yourself off in an official capacity.


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## Zanazaz (Feb 14, 2012)

Grimm said:


> This is were we will disagree. Just because you can buy something does not give you the RIGHT to use/wear/own something. It is a federal crime to impersonate military personnel. It is also a felony to impersonate law enforcement. So by these laws I may have the right to buy something but I can not pretend to be something I am not.


I am talking about camouflage clothing that is all. Not uniforms. He came across in his post that no one should be able to wear camouflage clothing unless they are in the military. I was just trying to clarify my position, and in fact I mentioned not breaking any laws.


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## FrankW (Mar 10, 2012)

I see a lot of thread hi jacking in here. 

-The young man asked a question.
-People answered.

Haranguing him on his choice of words and going off on tangents is not the proper response.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

labotomi said:


> It is not a crime to wear either uniform. It is only a crime trying to pass yourself off in an official capacity.


I did use the word impersonate.


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## labotomi (Feb 14, 2010)

Grimm said:


> I did use the word impersonate.


Yes you did. I was clarifying because I thought your post made it sound as if one could buy uniforms legally, but to wear them was illegal.


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## FrankW (Mar 10, 2012)

Jeez, lighten up some folks. He was just trying to get some practical gear for SHTF.
The closest thing he could think of was military stuff.

Whats the big deal?

Its just clothes.

I am active duty military it does not bother me one bit, if civilians wear the same gear.

And why should it?

We are in no way above the citizens and have no right they do not possess.


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## Caribou (Aug 18, 2012)

Camo is not a uniform until you start adding patches and emblems of rank. 

Upon separation I was told that I could legally wear my uniform for thirty days to allow me time to get home in uniform. If you want to get down to legalities nobody, except those on active duty, has a right to wear the uniform. After removing the patches I continued to wear parts of my "uniform" till it wore out. These were great work clothes.

Boyscout emblems? I'll have to give that some thought as to whether that protects the the honor of or demeans our servicemen. I do believe that it is meant in an honorable light.

I would like to see our newbie tell us more about himself but as a group so instilled with OPSEC we should understand if he chooses not to.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Caribou said:


> Camo is not a uniform until you start adding patches and emblems of rank.
> 
> Upon separation I was told that I could legally wear my uniform for thirty days to allow me time to get home in uniform. If you want to get down to legalities nobody, except those on active duty, has a right to wear the uniform. After removing the patches I continued to wear parts of my "uniform" till it wore out. These were great work clothes.
> 
> ...


I alter the patches enough to pass as military but they are based on BS patches. The last time I did this I was designing costumes for a pilot and the uniforms needed to be unique enough to pass as military but nothing that could get us in trouble. The concept was a secret military recruiting unit not on record because of the tactics they used to sign new recruits.

I used uniforms from the Korean War and custom designed patches.


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## Caribou (Aug 18, 2012)

Grimm, I think you know how much I like and respect you. I'm just taking a bit to wrap my head around BS patches on military uniforms. Fake unit patches on fake uniforms for fake units doesn't bother me at all. When I watch a movie I want to be entertained, accuracy to detail is seldom important. In fact, movies are often a way to escape reality. It just brought to mind some actor walking around with a fire starting patch on his shoulder.


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## crabapple (Jan 1, 2012)

Cabowabo said:


> What he said, in his first post made it seem like he intended on passing himself off as military. BDU's are a very common camo to use for hunting or paintball etc. But I doubt he would go with BDU'S. Anyone that knows anything about the military would know that no branch of hte military still uses those, and based off his name. He would be to young to have been able to wear them in the military.
> 
> Personally I might consider gettting a couple sets of multi cams for myself. To use for field work when cammo is needed. But at that point their is a difference between me wearing them and you. No offense.


I got the ideal TP1 was looking at the gear as a suit of armor to wear when bugging out after TSHTF.
I am not sure that is a good ideal as other have posted.
But we should ask question to find out what this teen means to do.


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## Cabowabo (Nov 6, 2012)

Grimm,
Its Hollywood, the people in those movies are given a lot of lieway to tell the story. 

My problem its a short distance between using an old uniform for paintball, hunting, or for its camouflage ability and stolen valor. Especially when someone wants to add a bunch of extra military stuff to it. 

Their is way to much stolen valor in this country. And when "teenprepper" said that he wanted to look like a soldier essientally. I took it as he eventually wants to look and try to act in a way that he has no idea how to do.


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

I can understand your concern, but we have a dismal record on how we treat new members before they establish themselves. Typically, a new member typically gets on, posts a question, and people start flaming them.

This is hardly the first time someone has gotten that treatment and I feel it is particularly unfortunate when the individual is young and inexperienced. I would like to see us encouraging new members to prep, rather than chasing them off because we jump to some conclusion based on their first question.

It is easy enough to make the same points as kindly advice from an elder, instead of acting in a way that chases away the new member.


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

Many people buy surplus military gear just because it is made very heavy duty and will provide good service before it wears out. I know many people on this forum have bought some surplus gear.


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## drfacefixer (Mar 8, 2013)

Cabowabo said:


> Grimm,
> 
> Its Hollywood, the people in those movies are given a lot of lieway to tell the story.
> 
> ...


True. Hollywood has to get it right. Since WWII, war epics have been a way to further the honor and valour of the American G.I. Long ago there were a lot of notable men from Hollywood that served. This hasn't been allowed without strict review since the force went all volunteer. The military has a vested interest in making the public feel good about what it does. Look at the credits of many of the films and you'll see that the military had a hand in consulting. Even Independence Day had military support up until the director would not remove the references to area 54. The USAF withdrew live footage of its fighter stunts and the movie was finished with special effects. Just think of how many people have joined or at least became interested in pursuing a military career because of movies like black hawk down, saving private Ryan, a few good men, Memphis belle, big red one, hurt locker, and of course lets not forget M.A.S.H. The list is actually huge.


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## Cabowabo (Nov 6, 2012)

Geek999 said:


> I can understand your concern, but we have a dismal record on how we treat new members before they establish themselves. Typically, a new member typically gets on, posts a question, and people start flaming them.
> 
> This is hardly the first time someone has gotten that treatment and I feel it is particularly unfortunate when the individual is young and inexperienced. I would like to see us encouraging new members to prep, rather than chasing them off because we jump to some conclusion based on their first question.
> 
> It is easy enough to make the same points as kindly advice from an elder, instead of acting in a way that chases away the new member.


Geek, 
I won't apologize for thinking this could easily try to be a stolen valor incident or turn into it. I watched a video the other day on militias and they all were wearing military camo. It made me think, how many of those guys are just playing soldier?

However you are right, most people buy military surplus stuff because its built a certain way. I personally buy mil-spec or better for my personal gear, because I'd trust it in combat in the military I'd trust it for self defense as a civilian.

You are right, that some of us jump on a new member of the board before they have a chance to establish themselves. I will apologize for my initial assumption that teen prepper wanted to look like a soldier so he could play soldier after a collapse without going through the training of the life style before a collapse. However I do think that assumption was probably spot on.

Teen prepper, when you plan on starting a topic such as this. Provide more information. Less information is not a good thing because it leaves conversations like this where its 4 pages so far of people trying to decide why you want to look like a soldier. Information is important.

Also, before you go spend a lot of money on cammo (that shit ain't cheap) and other gear. I'd like you to think about the disaster likelyhood chart. The big disasters, EMP, Invasion, Economic collapse etc. Are less likely to happen then you losing your job, an illiness etc. If you prep for the small stuff first, by first being debt free, and starting small you're end up in a better position. Their is no way to prep for an EMP. And an invasion, we have to fall from withen before we fall from another military force (like the romans did.)

Also the BOB, weapons etc are sexy. Trust me (ya oughta see my collection, damn) but ask yourself this where are you going to bug out to?


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

I'm not looking for apologies and my comments are not just about this new member or about the comments of any particular member on this thread. I am making a broad statement that we treat new members badly and I think we need to change that.

I think most new members here get flamed before the end of their first thread. I believe we have chased away a lot of potential members with no thought to how they might have added to the forum or how we might have benefited from their presence.

It takes a bit of practice to write clear posts. With a long standing member the back and forth straightens out any confusion. There is no reason we can't be polite to a new member long enough for them to clarify what they are talking about.

I think that we are particularly hard on the occasional teenager who shows up. Unlike my youth when everyone's father was a WWII vet, most kids today have not been exposed to the military and don't know the protocol. Even then most of us had worn out fatigue hand me downs that we used when camping or doing something messy outside. No one ever mistook me as a high school kid for someone impersonating a member of the military and I doubt that teenprepper would have a problem either. If the subject had ever come up I would have simply said "This is my Dad's shirt."

I've not been in the military, but I currently have a car that used to be his. It has a decal on the back about being retired military. I keep the decal on the car out of respect for him and I intend to keep it as long as I own the car. If anybody ever asks I'll tell them the same thing, i.e. "This was my Dad's car and he was retired military."

No one here has any reason to be accusatory to a new member. Any stolen valor issue is coming from your imagination, and not from anything he said and even if that was what he intended the issue could also be dealt with politely.

A little courtesy to a new member is all I am asking.


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## BillM (Dec 29, 2010)

*Tactical Gear*

In a societal collapse, tactical gear and clothing will get you killed.

People will kill you for what you are wearing or carrying.

I would want to look like everyone else, nothing special .

Be the grey man!


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## HardCider (Dec 13, 2013)

BillM said:


> In a societal collapse, tactical gear and clothing will get you killed.
> 
> People will kill you for what you are wearing or carrying.
> 
> ...


I agree, buy heavy duty canvas or oiled canvas gear that will not only last but allow you to go a little less noticed. The dirtier and more broke in the better.
Teenprepper, you're doing great. Prep on little brother prep on. And as far as the old cranks on here, take em with a pince of salt and thick skin


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## nightwing (Jul 26, 2014)

I have a funny story ( well not really)

you can make resistant gear for pistol from half inch conveyor belt rubber 
and or radial tires.
Is it perfect no is it heavy well yes if you layer it as it should be to work.
but it is knife and icepick proof and most standard velocity bullets will not 
penetrate but this is true of light vests like level 1 & II 
reminds me of old roman leather vest.

you wold need a chop saw or some other way to cut the radial tire treads 
a belt sander to smooth radial belt wire or you can make a denim cover.
Conveyor belt rubber is tough but it is made like bias ply tires no steel belt.
if you layer it like wood shingles on a roof it is effective.
cut the tread off tires make "shingles" rivet with roofing nails to horizontal 
overlapping belts or conveyor belt rubber 3 layers not comfortable but neither is threat level III and if like most of us you have more time than money
it is better than wearing a tee shirt.

Know that there are calibers that even modern vest will not work against 
and even modern vests have shock panels ( stainless steel plate) if the vest 
was truly resistant that would not be needed and the mfg. confuse the terminology 
by calling them trauma plates shock plates but it boils down to it is stainless and that is very tough if you have a drill press you could incorporate some 1/8th inch into this 
design.

home made is not perfect but you gotta do what you gotta do if your stuck in a 
sh*tuation and projects keep you occupied and not focused on problems.
I looked up a very good vest for even rifle and it cost a very good price 6,000 bucks 
and down to 500 to 600 for level II and those will not stop very few rifle rounds.

this is an alternative to sitting on the ground and crying I ain't got nothing 
I think I will sleep with the worms.


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## FrankW (Mar 10, 2012)

BillM said:


> In a societal collapse, tactical gear and clothing will get you killed.
> 
> People will kill you for what you are wearing or carrying.
> 
> ...


*no no no no no!*

This is that Selco thinking that applies in an environment where snipers are looking for people to shoot while besieging an ethnic enclave!

That was Selcos environment. very unique very specific.

Anywhere else, if you look like prey you will be treated as prey.

And the argument _"when he attacks me he will be surprised that I am not helpless then , he ,he "_ is complete bubkis too.

The best way to survive is not to be attacked in the first place!
The few fights you engage in the better and this is accomplished by not looking like prey.

....is to appear competent, alert and armed.

How many thugs do you know that randomly attempt to rob police officers?

They are very much NOT grey men, but are all fully employed so should have full wallets plus they have all that nice gear, b*ut thugs will look for easier pickings anyway right???*

Thats human nature. This entire "Grey man' philosophy based on the special case of sarajevo is misapplied when attempting to use it in a sliding SHTF thats most likely in the US.

There may even come a time when you cannot leave the house unmolested UNLESS you are visibly armed or escorted by one who is.


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

In a shtf situation there will bee a fine line in between remaining inconspicuous and still deterring unwanted attention. Also there will be a fine line between blending with a civilian population and being able to quietly fade into a wooded environment. I generally will carry two outfits in my bob. My gear is tactical but I do have a pack cover that is more civilian oriented and enough space to pack my more military looking gear under it. There is no one size fits all solution and weight requirements limit the possibilities you can be prepared for. Earth tone clothing and a pack cover that will disguise most of my more tactical needs has been the solution I've settled on for my bob. I have been looking for a reversible pack cover with multicam on one side dark blue on the other for a while. Reversible rain gear would be nice as well. A lot of these decisions will be decided by the environment each person will travel through and the scenarios you deem more likely.


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## Ozarker (Jul 29, 2014)

teenprepper1 said:


> Hi, I am looking for an online store that has all of the apparel tactical gear. I need to basically look like a U.S army soldier, full camo, tactical vest, bug out bag (strong tactical bag for food, med supplies, tools, shelter, water) , holster, rifle sleeve for AR-15, and portable shelters? also is there a list of possible shtf events? like new madrid earthquake, super volcano yellowstone, with recommendations on what to do? any recommendations? Thanks!


Lots of scolding, seems warranted in much of it.

Impersonation of a military service member or making false claims as to military service is in violation of federal law. Not just the UCMJ, but felony statues.

Secondly, there are millions who have served and most can spot a fake a mile off we also know a BSer at the drop of a hat.

Impersonating a government officer or employee is also a violation of law. Especially during any disaster or official business being conducted.

Some wise guy claimed to be in the National Guard after the Joplin tornado, he was nailed and hauled off by police. There would be a whole list of charges that could be brought, impersonating a govt. official during an emergency, trespass, interfering with the duties of police officer, government official, military service member, then they could drill deeper and make claims as to your intent of doing so, were you there to pillage and go looting? Were you attempting to disrupt emergency procedures? They can charge you with additional charges and you'll need to defend yourself.

The OP must have been playing too many video games and watching too much TV. Don't feel bad kid, many older adults have identity issues too. If you want to be something, become something and join. There are many organizations that assist in emergency situations, join the military, the police department, join the weather service, forestry service, volunteer or regular fire department, become an EMS, your local Emergency Management Authority, heck, go volunteer with the Red Cross.

Kids......:brickwall:


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## irishboy61 (Jul 7, 2014)

BillM said:


> In a societal collapse, tactical gear and clothing will get you killed.
> 
> People will kill you for what you are wearing or carrying.
> 
> ...


Not necessarily. I for one plan to use a ghoul lie suit and yes for my young age it might be playing army to some of you but believe me. I plan to be going into the navy to try and be a SEAL. All my family members that are men have been in and I want to continue the tradition. Anyway if you like your hard tactical gear it is best to team up with a lot of other peepers or friends that can help you. This reason is for safety. If you have other people with you there is a less likely chance of you getting messed with. Strength in numbers


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## crabapple (Jan 1, 2012)

Ozarker said:


> Lots of scolding, seems warranted in much of it.
> 
> Impersonation of a military service member or making false claims as to military service is in violation of federal law. Not just the UCMJ, but felony statues.
> 
> ...


Could be I am wrong here.
But I think this Impersonation of a military personal or spotting a fake a mile away is much about nothing.
1) first you must have a form formal uniform(all the right tags/labels,ribbons).
2) you have to claim to be what you look like.
3) playing dress up is not illegal or every stripper in town would stay in jail, actor also. Intent has something to do with, but we may never know TP1 intent or guide them to the right way, be cause we scolded first & never got the chance to ask question.
The best trainee in my training camp learn all the parade ground moves in a 9-12 reform school for troubled youths.
Some of the trainees I went though basic with knew less the I learned in ROTC.

I wore my SCNG field jacket as a winter coat to reck school, every vet that I met at Tech, gave me the speech about going to jail for wearing the jacket.
I cross a fort to get to the tech school, never got stopped for anything.
Other then vets in school no one every said anything about my use of my jacket while out of uniform.

I could be wrong, but I still do not know of any teens impersonating a miletary person. As for ling about what they did in the military, half of the vet in the SCNG
with me had to be ling about some of their service, because they never wore the ribbons for all the wild stuff they said they did.

I still think that tp1 was asking about what to wear when TSHTF.
Just went about it all wrong, think we missed a change to start a teen out right.
My teen never needed to ask this he has the training, but not everyone has the chance.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Ozarker said:


> Lots of scolding, seems warranted in much of it.
> 
> Impersonation of a military service member or making false claims as to military service is in violation of federal law. Not just the UCMJ, but felony statues.
> 
> ...


*THANK YOU!*

I said this and got yelled at by the members that encourage the mall-ninjas.
:flower:


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

crabapple said:


> Could be I am wrong here.
> But I think this Impersonation of a military personal or spotting a fake a mile away is much about nothing.
> 
> ***Cut for length***
> ...


TP1 Never said that he was looking for the patches BUT he did say _*FULL*_ tactical gear. One can imply that he wants to impersonate military. Since the twit has not been back to defuse the bomb he set it is very clear at this point that those giving him hell are 100% correct. The kid has bad intentions and we all called him out on it. Good riddance to bad rubbage, in my opinion.

FYI TP1 has logged in to the forum after this topic/thread was started and he has not responded to any of the posts here.


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## FrankW (Mar 10, 2012)

Ozarker said:


> Lots of scolding, seems warranted in much of it.
> 
> Impersonation of a military service member or making false claims as to military service is in violation of federal law. Not just the UCMJ, but felony statues.
> 
> ...


Nowhere and I mean nowhere in his post did he say or even imply he wanted to impersonate anyone!

Isn't it obvious he just wants the msot practical clothng for SHTF and the best way to accomplish that is in his mind with some militaryt style clothing.

We cna debate strategies in various conjectured situations but i dont see why so many folks fly off the handle and hi jack this thread with diatribes about impersonation.


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

Grimm said:


> One can imply that he wants to impersonate military. Since the twit has not been back to defuse the bomb he set it is very clear at this point that those giving him hell are 100% correct. The kid has bad intentions and we all called him out on it. Good riddance to bad rubbage, in my opinion.


I don't agree. What is clear is that he was immediately made unwelcome.

That's enough to make most people say "good riddance" to the forum.


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## nightwing (Jul 26, 2014)

I think now most people have a distrust of any authoritarian figures 
and in a extremely horrible scenario I think it would be inadvisable 
to wear police security or military uniforms or gear the only uniforms
that may be welcome would be EMT and firefighters.

I think that the blue helmets and berets of the U.N. may be like waving 
a flag in front of a bull not the best of ideas.

Inasmuch as I agree with BillM I think any bug out bag even if it was pink
with sparkles would be a target by those that have nothing and looking
for any trade goods water food and weapons or even clothing it will not take many days before morons will realize they stink and they will not wash them
but take the time to steal or kill for them just like now ---
they kill each other for tennis sneakers and jackets just imagine how 
very ugly it could get in some areas.vract:


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## crabapple (Jan 1, 2012)

nightwing said:


> I think now most people have a distrust of any authoritarian figures
> and in a extremely horrible scenario I think it would be inadvisable
> to wear police security or military uniforms or gear the only uniforms
> that may be welcome would be EMT and firefighters.
> ...


I agree, but think that teenprepper1 could have change his/her mind with enuff soft voices telling him/her that.
I think the big stick ran him/her off.

But what do I know, it could have been a terrorist looking for like minded people or a TROLL who is laughing his/her butt off at us.
But we all have the right to our option & I am glad we all had our say.


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

crabapple said:


> I agree, but think that teenprepper1 could have change his/her mind with enuff soft voices telling him/her that.
> I think the big stick ran him/her off.
> 
> But what do I know, it could have been a terrorist looking for like minded people or a TROLL who is laughing his/her butt off at us.
> But we all have the right to our option & I am glad we all had our say.


Sounds like you are ready to close this down. I fear we don't have agreement on how to treat the next teenager, or inarticulate adult, who shows up. That discussion might be better in the *Are we shrinking?" Thread.


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## FatTire (Mar 20, 2012)

Not everyone should be helped. Not everyone that shows up to a forum such as this has good intentions. If a person shows up with bad intentions, a thin skin, perhaps its best if they get ran off..


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## squerly (Aug 17, 2012)

I wouldn't worry too much about TeenPrepper, he's been coming around since he joined back in Jan 2013. My guess is that he will eventually come back, as he usually does, read the entire thread and get the gist of what everyone has been trying to say. 

But that being said, Geek's post is valid. A lot of newbies leave shortly after their first few posts because we jump first instead of taking the time to understand who they are and what their sometimes poorly written first posts actually mean.


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## BlueShoe (Aug 7, 2010)

I didn't read the whole thread but noticed two things. 

The OP gave me the impression that this was an experiment to gauge reaction from the members. Secondly I noticed that one of the members started off being an aid, but then changed horses in mid stream to take a very vocal opposing position complete with name calling of an assumed teen. Interesting. :nuts:


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

FatTire said:


> Not everyone should be helped. Not everyone that shows up to a forum such as this has good intentions. If a person shows up with bad intentions, a thin skin, perhaps its best if they get ran off..


I saw nothing in his post to suggest bad intentions. That was entirely a reaction of others. As for a thin skin, I also saw no reaction to indicate that and I don't think it is fair to infer it from his non-response.

I'd say the whole thread could be condensed to:

"Hi, I have a question."

"Go away troll. You aren't welcome."

at which point he does exactly that.

I think we can, and should, do better.

I realize there may be some jerks that show up, but if we jump on every new member in the fashion we jumped on teenprepper, I don't see why anyone would want to join.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

squerly said:


> I wouldn't worry too much about TeenPrepper, he's been coming around since he joined back in Jan 2013. My guess is that he will eventually come back, as he usually does, read the entire thread and get the gist of what everyone has been trying to say.
> 
> But that being said, Geek's post is valid. A lot of newbies leave shortly after their first few posts because we jump first instead of taking the time to understand who they are.


Seriously those that get 'run off' probably shouldn't be here in the first place. Majority are mall ninjas, trolls , asshats that start drama for entertainment or DDP fans looking for more stupid to laugh at between episodes.

Yes, as a whole we here at PS are a bit protective of the forum and current membership. Nothing wrong with being proactive and chasing out the trolls and taking out the trash. But if someone can't post an intro post and do a tad bit of research of past posts before starting a 'what should I have in my BOB' then are they really ready to even be here?

We are all on different walks towards preparedness. We come here to share ideas, gain information, take a break from the stress in our lives and even pass on a joke or two. As a community here at PS we have come to expect a certain level of etiquette from each other as well as new members. Everyone should be held to this standard.

When I joined PS I stuck to the canning and recipe threads. This is where I was comfortable and had a bit of knowledge. As I became more confident in my walk of preparedness I started posting in other areas and making what I consider friends with other members. Respect is a big part of this forum that I have not seen on others. The BIG reason I joined PS and not the others. Also the fact there were no mall ninjas and trolls.

Thick skin is not a requirement here but if you can't listen to everyone and see all the valid points then you should leave. You don't have to change your opinion to suit the majority here but be respectful of their right to their opinions as you are yours.

That being said we do get the post once and drop off the face of the planet new members that are not chased off. They realize this is not what they thought and move on. Others find the dichotomy of the members entertaining and stir the pot for shits and giggles. Then there are the just plain stupid as shit new members who look at this as a fun game and need to get bitch slapped for wasting the groups time with their BS.

Either way if we as a whole were not the way were ARE then this forum would be over run with mall ninjas, trolls and BS artists. *I say keep up the good work, group.* We are making the mods' job easier by running the twits off before crap happens.


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## squerly (Aug 17, 2012)

FatTire said:


> Not everyone should be helped. Not everyone that shows up to a forum such as this has good intentions. If a person shows up with bad intentions, a thin skin, perhaps its best if they get ran off..


Go to his profile and read all of his posts. After doing so, see if you feel TP is one of these persons of which you refer.


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

Grimm, So you have no interest in helping a teenager learn about prepping?

It seems to me that it wouldn't take a lot to convince a teenaged "mall ninja" that there was something to prepping for real and for every person we convince to really prep, that is one less we have to deal with during a SHTF event because he'll be taking care of himself.

It is in our best interest to have more people prep and fewer people SOL in a real disaster. Somebody who shows up here can become part of the solution, even if he doesn't seem serious on his first post.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Geek999 said:


> Grimm, So you have no interest in helping a teenager learn about prepping?
> 
> It seems to me that it wouldn't take a lot to convince a teenaged "mall ninja" that there was something to prepping for real and for every person we convince to really prep, that one less we have to deal with during a SHTF event because he'll be taking care of himself.
> 
> It is in our best interest to have more people prep and fewer people SOL in a real disaster. Somebody who shows up here can become part of the solution, even if he doesn't seem serious on his first post.


I did say they may not be ready for the forum. Being ready and don't belong are very different.

As far as teenagers go, if they think this is one of their stupid video games and committing crimes are part of prepping them they have to go! If they can use common sense (majority of teens don't have any) then I will welcome them with open arms like the group did with Sybil and Prepper.


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

Grimm said:


> I did say they may not be ready for the forum. Being ready and don't belong are very different.
> 
> As far as teenagers go, if they think this is one of their stupid video games and committing crimes are part of prepping them they have to go! If they can use common sense (majority of teens don't have any) then I will welcome them with open arms like the group did with Sybil and Prepper.


Nothing was said about video games. Committing crimes? More jumping to conclusions. Tactical clothing is widely sold in surplus stores, over the Internet, etc. There is nothing illegal about buying such clothing.

I also disagree about teenagers having common sense. Some have it and some don't, just like adults. Let's face it, any one of us could list a few of the current "adult" members who are "out there", albeit we might not all have the same list. I've got an ignore list full of people that I'd rather lose than teenprepper.

If you see someone you don't think you want to converse with why not just put them on your ignore list?


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Geek999 said:


> Nothing was said about video games. Committing crimes? More jumping to conclusions. Tactical clothing is widely sold in surplus stores, over the Internet, etc. There is nothing illegal about buying such clothing.
> 
> I also disagree about teenagers having common sense. Some have it and some don't, just like adults. Let's face it, any one of us could list a few of the current "adult" members who are "out there", albeit we might not all have the same list. I've got an ignore list full of people that I'd rather lose than teenprepper.
> 
> If you see someone you don't think you want to converse with why not just put them on your ignore list?


Generalized statements to make a point. Thanks for being so literal. 

Anyway, thanks for reminding me why I had a few people on my ignore list. Now I need to go put them back on it. So much for offering the benefit of the doubt and second chances.


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## Cabowabo (Nov 6, 2012)

BlueShoe said:


> I didn't read the whole thread but noticed two things.
> 
> The OP gave me the impression that this was an experiment to gauge reaction from the members. Secondly I noticed that one of the members started off being an aid, but then changed horses in mid stream to take a very vocal opposing position complete with name calling of an assumed teen. Interesting. :nuts:


I'm am the poster you're talking about, and I'll address it.

The Later reaction was after I had hopped on face book, got onto youtube and watched video after video of people claiming awards and decorations and titles that they DID NOT EARN. Then I got to thinking, why would someone want to look like a soldier, sailor, airman, or Marine after a serious collapse but 1, he has never responded to this thread, and 2, it seems has no desire to actually join the military. Why, why would you want to look like something you're not, when you never did the time to earn it?

As soon as I get to my truck, I take my work gear throw it in the bed. I take my uniform top off and I'm done. And you'll see a lot of people who are like me that have done time in the military. When they get off of work, they immediately strip it off of 'em. I've done 4 years, and I have 2 left. I spent that whole 4 years outside of training overseas and I hadn't been home in almost 2 years in one stretch. I never went to Afghinstan, or Iraq, but I did time in Korea and it got very interesting for a little while, when I was there. I don't like the idea of someone who it seems will never sacrifice years of their life, and years of holidays so they can pretend after shit hits the fan.

Take or leave that explanation.

When I initially helped him, I personally wouldn't suggest anyone wear military uniforms. When I travel unless I'm under orders to go somewhere on a military sponsored aircraft and their is no chance of being around civilians I will then and only then wear a uniform. Other then that when I travel I grow a beard, don't get a hair cut, and put any military identifiers far far away. I prefer to travel as the gray man, I don't even usually go to the USO.

In a SHTF scenario, I would still prefer to travel the same way no uniforms etc. When you look like you can fight, or have any amount of skills people will come at you differently then if they think your a sheep ready to be taken.

Now I personally do have gear set aside that closely mimicks what I have access to in the military. Its the life jacket. I originally came onto prepared society because I wanted to learn homesteading stuff and I have, and that is what keeps me coming back. I don't have land, and or the ability to homestead right now so I listen and learn on those areas.

This O.P. has two threads I believe. The first one where he mocks people who want to bug out using big trucks which I believe he meant to be F-25os etc. And this one, where he ask about military gear. As far as I can tell their are no other post concerning Teenprepper.

I would also challenge whether he is truly a "teen prepper" or someone who merely picked that monicker.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Cabowabo said:


> I'm am the poster you're talking about, and I'll address it.
> 
> The Later reaction was after I had hopped on face book, got onto youtube and watched video after video of people claiming awards and decorations and titles that they DID NOT EARN. Then I got to thinking, why would someone want to look like a soldier, sailor, airman, or Marine after a serious collapse but 1, he has never responded to this thread, and 2, it seems has no desire to actually join the military. Why, why would you want to look like something you're not, when you never did the time to earn it?
> 
> ...


Actually, BS (BlueShoe) is a pot stirrer and is referring to me. He always finds a way to make digs at me because he has some personal grudge. I chose to ignore his post and put him back on my ignore list because he isn't worth my time.

Personally, I don't think any one would make a dig at you, Cabo, with out actually addressing you.


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## Cabowabo (Nov 6, 2012)

Grimm said:


> Actually, BS (BlueShoe) is a pot stirrer and is referring to me. He always finds a way to make digs at me because he has some personal grudge. I chose to ignore his post and put him back on my ignore list because he isn't worth my time.
> 
> Personally, I don't think any one would make a dig at you, Cabo, with out actually addressing you.


I assumed he meant me because I did make that jump. Honestly Grimm I'm to scared to take a dig at you


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Cabowabo said:


> I assumed he meant me because I did make that jump. Honestly Grimm I'm to scared to take a dig at you


Why is everyone so afraid of me...?!?


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## Cabowabo (Nov 6, 2012)

Grimm said:


> Why is everyone so afraid of me...?!?


look at your profile picture....


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

Cabowabo said:


> I'm am the poster you're talking about, and I'll address it.
> 
> The Later reaction was after I had hopped on face book, got onto youtube and watched video after video of people claiming awards and decorations and titles that they DID NOT EARN. Then I got to thinking, why would someone want to look like a soldier, sailor, airman, or Marine after a serious collapse but 1, he has never responded to this thread, and 2, it seems has no desire to actually join the military. Why, why would you want to look like something you're not, when you never did the time to earn it?
> 
> ...


This post fully explains your position and I think it is more in line with what you should have posted earlier. I don't know what teenprepper might want with the clothing he was seeking, but I think discussions of the pros and cons of such clothing can be had without animosity.

I'm familiar with the other post and I did not take it as mocking of people with big trucks. I think that one may also be plagued with more confusion as people jump to conclusions instead of just asking him what he means.


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## BlueShoe (Aug 7, 2010)

And without resorting to calling him vulgar names.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Cabowabo said:


> look at your profile picture....


It goes with the signature line. 

The other picture was a bunch of cats driving a tank.


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## cqp33 (Apr 2, 2012)

Caribou said:


> Camo is not a uniform until you start adding patches and emblems of rank.
> 
> Upon separation I was told that I could legally wear my uniform for thirty days to allow me time to get home in uniform. If you want to get down to legalities nobody, except those on active duty, has a right to wear the uniform. After removing the patches I continued to wear parts of my "uniform" till it wore out. These were great work clothes.
> 
> ...


Directed at the statement above, "nobody, except those on active duty, has a right to wear the uniform."

INCORRECT, not being a prickly but if speaking about legalities lets be right on this one. I don't know all the legalities other than that I am authorized to wear mine, that I earned of course! I am a retired US Navy Senior Chief Petty Officer and still have the right to wear my uniform that I earned the right to wear! Of course that would mean I have to cut my hippie hair, shave my goatee that I am now fond of and walk tall and straight again! LOL Not something I would do for kicks but under the right circumstance I would. Such as if a current serving military member who I served with or a family member asked me to attend an official military function and wear my uniform, I would!

I did however tell my youngest son that if he does pursue his dream of becoming a Navy SEAL that I would wear my full dress to his graduation ceremony! That is worthy of shaving my hair off, losing the goatee and walking tall and proud again I think!


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## labotomi (Feb 14, 2010)

cqp33 said:


> Directed at the statement above, "nobody, except those on active duty, has a right to wear the uniform."
> 
> INCORRECT, not being a prickly but if speaking about legalities lets be right on this one. I don't know all the legalities other than that I am authorized to wear mine, that I earned of course! I am a retired US Navy Senior Chief Petty Officer and still have the right to wear my uniform that I earned the right to wear!


If you're retired it means you're in an inactive reserve status and thus you're technically still a member of the US Navy.


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## ZoomZoom (Dec 18, 2009)

labotomi said:


> If you're retired it means you're in an inactive reserve status and thus you're technically still a member of the US Navy.


I don't remember as it's been a long but how about my situation? I was in the USMC for 4 years back in the early 80's.

Not that I could even put the uniforms back on (_I've put on a few pounds_) but when could I ever wear my uniforms again? The only time I'd consider doing it is for an American Legion formal ceremonies (funerals, color guard duties and parades).


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## cqp33 (Apr 2, 2012)

labotomi said:


> If you're retired it means you're in an inactive reserve status and thus you're technically still a member of the US Navy.


Correct for 10 more years since I "Transferred to the Fleet Reserve" which is a term for retired at 20 years. Military members aren't legally considered "retired" until the 30 year mark and receive "retainer pay" from the 20-30 year mark until retirement. During that time you are considered an inactive reservist in the "Fleet Reserve".

The quote I posted stated that only "active duty" were authorized to wear a uniform. Which is incorrect.


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

If teenprepper can't wear certain clothing then one can just say so. It isn't necessary to accuse hm of anything.

BTW: I'm still keeping Dad's retired miitary decal in the rear window of his old car no matter what anyone says.


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## Cabowabo (Nov 6, 2012)

BlueShoe said:


> And without resorting to calling him vulgar names.


I called it the way I see it, and I won't apologize for it.


Geek999 said:


> If teenprepper can't wear certain clothing then one can just say so. It isn't necessary to accuse hm of anything.
> 
> BTW: I'm still keeping Dad's retired miitary decal in the rear window of his old car no matter what anyone says.


Their is british camo, German camo etc. If you're in America and didn't serve don't wear modern camo. Their is nothing good about the ABU, ACU, and Blue Navy pattern of uniform. They don't blend in to anything.


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

Cabowabo said:


> I called it the way I see it, and I won't apologize for it.
> 
> Their is british camo, German camo etc. If you're in America and didn't serve don't wear modern camo. Their is nothing good about the ABU, ACU, and Blue Navy pattern of uniform. They don't blend in to anything.


The modern military camo is ineffective. It is stupid for even the military to wear. The older military camo styles, or even WWII fatigues, were better. Plus you never see military in anything else these days. It's like the modern soldier doesn't own a dress uniform or even a set of khakis. Maybe the problem isn't mall ninjas trying to look like military, but the military trying to look like mall ninjas.


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## Padre (Oct 7, 2011)

When'd y'all become grumpy old folks. Give the kid a break.

When I was a teenager, a prepper before the term existed, I thought that the first thing I needed was the right clothing... In my case jungle camo. I meam after all Rambo wore it, why shouldn't I. Forget the fact that I don't live anywhere near the jungle! Dumb, yes, but no disrespect meant to those who had earned the right to wear the uniform. 

As I understand it the DOD tries to prevent current uniforms from making it to the open market but uniforms can be legally owned and worn by non-soldiers so long as they do not try to impersonate a soldier, officer, etc.

That being said as many others have I am sure intimated already why wear ACUs? First of all Camo is meant to help you blend into your surroundings and in a forested area without people then ACUs MIGHT make sense, however in an urban/suburban area where people are the rule not the exception to camouflage yourself you need to blend in, looking like everyone else, not too rich, or too weak, or too pretty. So while subdued colors that might help you blend into shadows or shurbs might be good, not looking like GI joe in the middle of a suburban mob, is a good idea. This might be tough the better equipped and armed you are but there are ways to have stuff and still look like you don't...think a hobo or bag woman. Covering expensive back backs with trash bag or burlap rain covers, wearing old dirty coat over tactical quality clothing, smearing dirt on your face and clothes, etc. are all effective ways to blend in to the vast unwash masses. 

Its called the grey man protocol, and its all about not being seen, and when you are seen looking so average that no one remembers you or gives you a second look.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Padre said:


> When'd y'all become grumpy old folks. Give the kid a break.
> 
> When I was a teenager, a prepper before the term existed, I thought that the first thing I needed was the right clothing... In my case jungle camo. I meam after all Rambo wore it, why shouldn't I. Forget the fact that I don't live anywhere near the jungle! Dumb, yes, but no disrespect meant to those who had earned the right to wear the uniform.
> 
> ...


grump grump grump...


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## Padre (Oct 7, 2011)

As far as scenarios, I like prepper porn as much as the next guy, but after years of thinking about scenarios I have realized that the baseline, the fundamental threats to human lives, are almost always the same. If you get caught in the caldera of a super-volcano, the epicenter of a plague, or the blast zone of a nuke, you are likely dead. Usually it is going to be the break down of the systems that keep us safe, warm and fed that will kill you. So think about it this way 

People need Air (3 min), shelter/warmth (3hrs), water (3 days), food (3 weeks), and hope.

Sure extraordinary scenarios like an NBC event may require specialized shelter/clothing, or even air to survive, but for most of us, unable to afford a bunker with an NBC filter, O2 tanks, NBC suits and decon units, if bug-in doesn't provide sufficient breathable air and sufficiently isolating shelter then the only options left are bug out or die.

Floods and fires might need special preps, but in reality if you live in areas where these are possible you would want to have these items for all scenarios! In a flood area a boat makes sense not just in case of flood but also for transport if and when the roads get clogged and if public services break down then you will need a way to fight fires, because no one else is coming to help!

Think about those core areas of survival and prep, as you can, for the most likely threats, and when you have done that move on to the less likely ones.

a) Air (3 min)--N-95 Masks cost little, HEPA air filters more, for most people O2 cans and respirators are cost prohibitive, however not having breathable air is probably the least likely scenario, as sheltering in places in a sealed off house usually suffices. Here N-95 masks and plastic sheeting for doors and windows are minimal preps and very doable on a budget. IMHO NBC suits and masks are probably not necessary for most preppers.

B) Shelter/warmth (3hrs)--here most of us are lucky enough to live in a shelter and so, CHECK, we have a place to shelter in place. You might think about ways to harden your shelter (think: sand bags, plywood, barbed wire, booby traps, and the plastic sheeting mentioned above). 

Also it is key to think about how you would stay warm in the event that utilities like electricity and natural gas were interupted. Short term oil or propane are possibilities but long term, the only real answer is wood, and lots of it!

Sadly the greatest threat to your shelter, and your survival in general, probably comes from other people and so weapons and security systems are a priority, and sadly costly (but fun) prep. Depending on your age and parent's predisposition this prep may have to be put on hold. 

Alternatively, if you can't hold your house because of natural or man made disaster, having the tools to bug out, is essential. You probably can't BUY a house, but you could scout out a family members property where you might be able to go with your family in case of a SHTF. Also having things like tents, campers, good sleeping bags, tarps, and the knowledge to make makeshift shelters is key!!!

c) Water (3 days)--this one is easy, and hard. If your family drinks milk then you can wash out the gallon jugs, fill them with water, and treat them with bleach (unscented) from your laundry room--then you just have to find a place to stash them that doesn't raise your parents concerns. Remember 1 gal per person. If you live in a rain area you could buy some barrels, and think about building a rain catchment system. Also buying a good quality water filter, potable water tabs, and/or powdered form pool shock to make bleach with are good, do'able preps. Everyone needs 1 gallon of water a day and so this is a high priority prep.

d) Food (3 weeks)--like water food is essential to survival and a little does not go a long way! This is less important than shelter, warmth, security, and water, but still hugely important and likely the most expensive prep. Two things to keep in mind here, don't get overwhelmed, it takes a long time to build up a one year supply of food for even just one person, but if you buy long term food, little by little you will build up a stash. WHICH you should not keep in one place, think caches, bug out locations, your locker at school, etc. Secondly, remember that most people who die of starvation, die with all sorts of food sources all around them. Thinking about what you COULD eat, and perhaps even sampling it to get over normalcy bias, is key to survival. For instance, if you have lots of snails and slugs available, maybe you might try storing long term butter and garlic, which can make these VERY tasty.

e) Hope--finally as things get hard you need to have hope. Faith is key to this, as are family, friends, a plan, and a can do mentality!


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## ETXgal (Jul 12, 2014)

I am an USN veteran. I don't care if some teenager wants to wear camo, and go play air soft or whatever. There is a difference between that, and trying to impersonate military, for less than honorable reasons. When I was a kid, I played Army. We played in the woods. We even had some old Army gear. We thought it was cool, and it WAS. We had forts, and all kinds of neat stuff. Young folks now only seem to know about video games, and electronic devices. If they want to get involved in the outdoors, and have some good honest fun, let them. Don't freak out. It is a good thing. 

Now if SHTF and some teen thinks he/she will be cool wearing a uniform, and trying to impersonate active duty military, that is an entirely different scenario. This young person never even responded that I'm aware of, after he caught the flack. Keep cool. If you find out that he is up to no good, then set him straight. At this point we have no idea what this person wanted the gear for. We may never know after some of these posts either. I come from a long line of military service, in my family. My son is active duty as we speak. He played air soft, and wore camo all the time. I was just glad he was off the computer, and getting fresh air, and exercise. He has turned out to be a fine young man. I am very proud of him too.

This young prepper guy could be the same way, as my son. My son didn't try to wear rank or rating insignia, or anything like that. He wanted to look cool, and be hidden in the woods, to have the element of surprise. If you were seen, you WERE HIT. Some of those air soft bullets get embedded in the skin. So just wearing earth tones isn't good enough, for air soft here. My son also went to air soft competitions. They all wore camo. (or tactical camo) Camo is worn here in Texas all the time, by men, and women. Granted most of it is woodland camo, but that is because I live in the piney woods area of TX. 

Now I have seen You Tube videos of young men trying to present themselves as active duty military, or vets. They might even try to make people think they are in Special Forces, the Navy Seals, or some other elite unit. When they catch hell from current military, or vets, I applaud it. They have no right to wear a uniform they didn't earn.


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## labotomi (Feb 14, 2010)

Geek999 said:


> The modern military camo is ineffective. It is stupid for even the military to wear. The older military camo styles, or even WWII fatigues, were better. Plus you never see military in anything else these days. It's like the modern soldier doesn't own a dress uniform or even a set of khakis. Maybe the problem isn't mall ninjas trying to look like military, but the military trying to look like mall ninjas.


Would you like to wear khakis to work then change into a working uniform just to change back into khakis again to go home? Something similar was required in the Navy not too long ago and it was a pain in the ass for everyone.

Also you must not be looking if you don't see military in anything else. I see a lot of military and most are not wearing working uniforms.


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## Dakine (Sep 4, 2012)

while I rarely see anyone in anything BUT bdu/cammie/"working" uniforms, I can also recall that it's just clothing until certain things are applied.

If there's a name tag or a flag or rank insignia, I think it becomes a uniform, until then, it's just... clothing.


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

labotomi said:


> Would you like to wear khakis to work then change into a working uniform just to change back into khakis again to go home? Something similar was required in the Navy not too long ago and it was a pain in the ass for everyone.
> 
> Also you must not be looking if you don't see military in anything else. I see a lot of military and most are not wearing working uniforms.


I get your point about changing clothes but I see military folks in transit facilities, e.g. Airports, hotels, etc. And they look like mall ninjas. Same with the cops. If I never see another pair of pants with cargo pockets, I'll thank God for the passing of that particular fashion mistake.


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## AdmiralD7S (Dec 6, 2012)

Just so it doesn't get forgotten, there are times civilians ARE allowed to wear military uniforms. For work, I've been doing flight testing on NASA-Glenn's Twin Otter and S-3B Viking, and just got back last night from the USAF Test Pilot School playing with their F-16 (briefly). When I'm flying, I wear my military flight suit that has the flag, my MAJCOM patch, my unit patch, and my name tag. However, my name tag just has "My Name, USAF," and I wear no rank. If folks weren't sure I was a civilian, I think my beard might be a give-away (although that will temporarily get shaved when I'm in the F-16).

Do I wear my flight suit off base? Yep - on the way to/from work and during lunch during flight test days. Other than that, it's business casual for me.

So far, every civilian has assumed I'm military and hasn't bothered me when I'm wearing it. The military folks see the lack of rank and a beard and thus know I'm an exception to the general rule. Now, the military would absolutely jump on me if I was wearing anything but a flight suit because a flight suit is about the only thing a civilian would be required to wear.


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## Ozarker (Jul 29, 2014)

Gees, I lost a long post!!!!

"Full tactical" to me means uniform, web gear, helmet and usually a weapon, it includes the uniform.

I wore BDUs as a little kid, so did my kids, they sell them in children's sizes.

Reservists can not wear a uniform any time they feel like it. Your uniform of the day is directed by the commander. During drills or active status you wear the uniform as directed, look at the training schedule and you'll see what the required uniform is.

Dress uniforms for members in transit.

You may wear the uniform of the day during duty hours in civilian communities while going to and from duty, breakfast, lunch, or dinner depending on your duty hours, you can stop and get gas, or have side trips that are reasonably within or about the time of your duty hours. If your duty day is from 7 to 4, you can't run out to the local bar at 10pm or decide to go to the movies. 

You may not wear the battle dress uniform in public when off duty, you may wear the dress uniform on leave or liberty on active duty. 

You may not wear any uniform in certain places or circumstances, at political rallies or meetings, for any commercial purpose or in any news or other television set or in any setting where the wearing of the uniform may imply an endorsement by the military of what you are saying or doing unless you have command authorization to wear the uniform. It's giving the appearance of speaking or acting in an official capacity.

The wearing of any uniform may be authorized by proper command for any service member or civilian. Examples of uniforms for civilians are in flight training, aircraft repair, avionics technicians, maintenance, supply, food service, medical, covert ops, military police duties, research and development, I'm sure there are more, these being on the Army side I've been associated with. DOD civilians and reserves are subject to command directives, there are many instances where civilians are to wear a uniform. Those instances only apply to that employee wearing the uniform during the duty periods, they aren't to wear it in unofficial activities.

The only members authorized to wear any uniform at any time or even a combination of uniform items with or without other items are 07 and above in command appointments of as they deem appropriate, that's a General for the Army types. Might remember Patton and his pearl handled cowboy side arm, or Eisenhower's jacket which became an issue jacket. The General's Uniform is what he/she says it is.  

As an NCO and a commissioned officer I had to chew tail when members were out of uniform or wearing it improperly including the wearing in inappropriate places, times or circumstances.

As to our poor Teenprepper, my comments were mild I believe, I certainly wasn't scolding, just informing, sorry for any other implication as that wasn't my intent. He can go "full tactical" so long as he doesn't wear the service, name and rank that would then identify him as being a service member, was my point. 

What's the penalty out in the woods(?), maybe a dirty look from a deer, maybe a comment at a gas station by a prior service type, unless you go in an airport the MPs won't be chasing you down. However, my point was showing up in some emergency situation, like at a natural disaster and walking past a tape line entering an unauthorized area, like the guy in Joplin, then you may get nailed. It was an assumption of the intended use that set some of us on that path.


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## nightwing (Jul 26, 2014)

AdmiralD7S said:


> Just so it doesn't get forgotten, there are times civilians ARE allowed to wear military uniforms. For work, I've been doing flight testing on NASA-Glenn's Twin Otter and S-3B Viking, and just got back last night from the USAF Test Pilot School playing with their F-16 (briefly). When I'm flying, I wear my military flight suit that has the flag, my MAJCOM patch, my unit patch, and my name tag. However, my name tag just has "My Name, USAF," and I wear no rank. If folks weren't sure I was a civilian, I think my beard might be a give-away (although that will temporarily get shaved when I'm in the F-16).
> 
> Do I wear my flight suit off base? Yep - on the way to/from work and during lunch during flight test days. Other than that, it's business casual for me.
> 
> So far, every civilian has assumed I'm military and hasn't bothered me when I'm wearing it. The military folks see the lack of rank and a beard and thus know I'm an exception to the general rule. Now, the military would absolutely jump on me if I was wearing anything but a flight suit because a flight suit is about the only thing a civilian would be required to wear.


Friend had a Vlecro name badge it was upside down he said if I have to 
feel the breeze between my knees after I regain consciousness I can look down and tell who I am, of course he corrected the matter right there.


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

Ozarker said:


> Gees, I lost a long post!!!!
> 
> "Full tactical" to me means uniform, web gear, helmet and usually a weapon, it includes the uniform.
> 
> ...


How much of that would you expect a 14 year old to know? To non-military "full tactical" means shirt, pants, hat, boots.


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## Ozarker (Jul 29, 2014)

LOL, yep! I hear ya! Don't forget the eye protection, those paint balls could hurt. Now they know more than any one else in their class! More than they wanted to know I'd bet.


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## ETXgal (Jul 12, 2014)

Yes, my son always wore eye protection while playing air soft. He also played paint ball, but prefers air soft. He even had cardboard plates, and a water hydration system. In the warmest months, that is when you have less clothes on, and the potential for more injuries. They also use camo paint for their faces, quite often.


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## zookeeper (Mar 6, 2011)

I know he specifically mentioned military outfits, but that may be all he could think of. If you want to wear camo and not stand out, try hunting outfits, like Real Tree or Mossy Oak. The patterns are excellent for concealment, and you won't draw attention to yourself like some wannabe Rambo.
Driving around out in the country or passing through a small town you'll blend right in without raising any suspicions.


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## BlueShoe (Aug 7, 2010)

Teenprepper, when it all comes down, don't look for military to be running the show across America, unless you live in a town with a huge base that dominates the local economy. The show will be run by guys in blue/black who live in your area (police) and are possibly accompanied by Nat Guard in spots.


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## Dakine (Sep 4, 2012)

zookeeper said:


> I know he specifically mentioned military outfits, but that may be all he could think of. If you want to wear camo and not stand out, try hunting outfits, like Real Tree or Mossy Oak. The patterns are excellent for concealment, and you won't draw attention to yourself like some wannabe Rambo.
> Driving around out in the country or passing through a small town you'll blend right in without raising any suspicions.


Hmmm... non-urban camouflage! I tend not to put any bumper stickers or decals on my vehicles at all ever because jerks are too willing to key a truck because it's got some political or sports team sticker on it, however, a folder full of NRA, Hoyt, Remington, Spiderwire etc decals might not be a bad idea if I end up using one of these trucks to get out of Commiefornia. :laugh:


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## nightwing (Jul 26, 2014)

Eye protection is the singular most important item but even more 
important is that is is has polycarbonate lenses and some are better 
quality than others so do a bit of research.

an officer was on patrol and was fired on by a vehicle he was behind 
the bullet was stopped by the lens and frame he ended up with a cut 
but was not permanently injured.

Should you think that you may have more of a chance to fight for your life because you live in the city or suburbs.
shin guards knee pads a cup and forearm / elbow pads and a helmet 
even if it is only a bicycle helmet to looking like a normal geek.
even spine and chest protector street brawling is gritty business 
and it does not take much to slow you or your opponents reaction 
time, and that is key to winning.


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