# rabbits and chicken for food.



## prepare_survive_thrive

Im about to either buy several rabbits of trade for them. Any advice ,tips and warnings will be much appreciated. Also about to build a chicken coop if you have any thoughts on them. which breeds have the higher production and which are best as far as meat.


----------



## The_Blob

best advice I can give is... make the hutches/coops easy to access for cleaning! 

if you raise them together you might want to consider 'silkies' for your chicken breed, less insects in the feathers problems as they scratch for treats in the 'fertilized' :teehee: soil under the rabbit hutches.


----------



## Jarhead0311

I butchered all of my rabbits and put them in the freezer. I tried several ways to feed as I would post SHTF and without commercial rabbit feed it was a monumental task. They don't do well on hay alone and the hay needs to be of a really good quality. Chickens are great. You can cut back to just a few hens in the winter to supply your eggs. Then in spring when there is plenty of feed hatch off enough eggs to have chickens to eat. My chickens get about 90% of their feed from free range.


----------



## Jimthewagontraveler

Chickens in chicken tractors are a real good bet before or after shtf.
Rabbits before sure after yea not so much.
The Romans used to use a concrete/rock wall around 1-2 acres and use their water source as a live trapping point males get eaten females not in milk get eaten.
Females in milk or to young got thrown back in the pen.
Rabbits are not a new idea, Rabbits in individual pens are a new idea and that is great for improving the breed.
You need 2 separate pens that are widely seperated, pile scrap branches in the pens.
The scrap branches serve 2 purposes rabbits can hide there and when you have a die off ( and you will) then burn the die off pen and reintroduce all needed plants and your best 3 mamas and 2 bucks.
Remember your raising meat NOT improving the breed


----------



## woodsman23




----------



## Johnnyfive

Rabbits IMHO are not worth the investment. I agree with Jarhead0311 and Jimthewagontraveler they are a pain to keep fed unless you had some kind of containment system and they could free range...

My chickens are caged in a high fence area for protection from my dogs who love to kill/hunt. My chickens can fly out and free range outside the backyard fence where there are no dogs ...then come home at night. Another option for feeding chickens and keeping them happy at home is keeping worm beds or hanging maggot making buckets.

As far as breeds go I think two of the best all around(egg production and meat) chickens are the Barred Rock and Orpington's They normally have a calm demeanor also...

Purina has a couple coupe plans on their website for free or you could check out www.backyardchickens.com


----------



## Jaspar

Don't worrry so much about keeping the chicken coop warm. Cold drafts that get inside aren't good, but chickens do a great job of keeping themselves warm, as long as they are out of the wind. Not sure how cold it gets in your part of Georgia.


----------



## kejmack

I would raise dual purpose birds like Speckled Sussex. If you live in a really hot part of Georgia, avoid heavy birds which have more trouble in the heat. I use chicken tractors. I move them to a new spot each day. By moving the chickens to a clean spot everyday, they avoid lice and parasites. I also made my chicken tractors sized to fit over my raised beds so that the chickens can till them if needed.


----------



## TheHangman

I must say I was a bit mystified to read that rabbits were a waste of time. We have bred rabbits for years (NZ and Californian) for meat and I must say....If I was allowed only one sort of livestock, it would be rabbits.
However.....where I live it never gets real cold, or real hot. We grow most of our rabbit food ourselves. Rabbits are clean, quiet and one rabbit feeds Mrs Hangman and me for 3/4 meals.
Chickens.....Well, I have just bought the sign in from the front gate as we have sold all our chickens (80) for the year and at $25.00 a chicken it was very profitable.
We breed "Light Sussex" and "Australorp", both are a dual purpose (egg and meat) chicken.
I guess living in the country with everything you need to feed your animals growing all around you helps.
Hope you work it all out.

Cheers......The Hangman


----------



## talob

No experience with rabbits here, but have chickens agree dual purpose birds, just butcherd off extra roosters (light bhramas here) they are pretty low maintence, biggest problem is chickens are not compatible with a garden if I let em free range gotta fence off the garden, keep em pennd up takes more feed.


----------



## Jarhead0311

TheHangman said:


> I must say I was a bit mystified to read that rabbits were a waste of time. We have bred rabbits for years (NZ and Californian) for meat and I must say....If I was allowed only one sort of livestock, it would be rabbits.
> However.....where I live it never gets real cold, or real hot. We grow most of our rabbit food ourselves. Rabbits are clean, quiet and one rabbit feeds Mrs Hangman and me for 3/4 meals.
> Chickens.....Well, I have just bought the sign in from the front gate as we have sold all our chickens (80) for the year and at $25.00 a chicken it was very profitable.
> We breed "Light Sussex" and "Australorp", both are a dual purpose (egg and meat) chicken.
> I guess living in the country with everything you need to feed your animals growing all around you helps.
> Hope you work it all out.
> 
> Cheers......The Hangman


What do you feed them, how do you harvest it and how do you store it?


----------



## TheHangman

What do you feed them, how do you harvest it and how do you store it?

.....What do we feed them ?, Huh, where to start, ok I guess the bulk of rabbit food is good quality dry hay.....kept in the hay shed.
We have a very large vegi patch and the main greens for rabbits would be silverbeet and kale with a goodly helping of carrot tops, Nasturtium leaves and flowers. 
All the above grow all year here. The rabbits also have auto feed systems that supply rabbit pellets, its amazing how little they eat considering we kill them at 3mths and 8lbs.
Like everyone they are living in good times and like everyone they will have to toughen up if TSHTF. Three years ago we did an experiment in which we fed one brood of kits on greens and hay only. The only difference was that they did not have the fat on them that the others did.
Chickens are fine they take off everyday and wander for miles, we have very few predators here, maybe the odd fox, dog takes care of that.
When they come home at night I feed them wheat but they usually go straight to bed. 

The Hangman


----------



## prepare_survive_thrive

Jaspar said:


> Don't worrry so much about keeping the chicken coop warm. Cold drafts that get inside aren't good, but chickens do a great job of keeping themselves warm, as long as they are out of the wind. Not sure how cold it gets in your part of Georgia.


Very rarely gets below freezing. Even when it does it only last 2-5 days. Its about 68 right now.


----------



## Jarhead0311

TheHangman said:


> What do you feed them, how do you harvest it and how do you store it?
> 
> .....What do we feed them ?, Huh, where to start, ok I guess the bulk of rabbit food is good quality dry hay.....kept in the hay shed.
> We have a very large vegi patch and the main greens for rabbits would be silverbeet and kale with a goodly helping of carrot tops, Nasturtium leaves and flowers.
> All the above grow all year here. The rabbits also have auto feed systems that supply rabbit pellets, its amazing how little they eat considering we kill them at 3mths and 8lbs.
> Like everyone they are living in good times and like everyone they will have to toughen up if TSHTF. Three years ago we did an experiment in which we fed one brood of kits on greens and hay only. The only difference was that they did not have the fat on them that the others did.
> Chickens are fine they take off everyday and wander for miles, we have very few predators here, maybe the odd fox, dog takes care of that.
> When they come home at night I feed them wheat but they usually go straight to bed.
> 
> The Hangman


My rabbits wasted much more hay than they consumed, plus it was a real PIA to cut, cure and stack the hay by hand. They ate pretty well from the garden but it had to be harvested fresh every day and there was little from the garden that could be saved for the winter. The hay and garden produce was a just supplement for their commercial feed. I still wonder how you harvest and store their feed.


----------



## Indiana_Jones

We have had chickens and rabbits on our little farm for over 20 years. We raise New Zealand Whites and Californians to sell and to eat. I must admit that we have enough land to plant for rabbit food crops and it works quite well. It only takes one acre to provide enough alfalfa, timothy, and other hay-making plants for the two bucks and 6 does we usually keep for breeding purposes. Our rabbits have been healthy and productive for all of the 20 years.

We usually have 15 to 20 chickens running around here at all times (I've never really counted them) and they pretty much take good care of themselves. I do have to supplement their diets with grains in the winter but not much. We collect somewhere 12 to 16 eggs a day - some we eat and some we sell. Twice a year my neighbor and I buy 2 dozen Cornish Cross chicks for meat. 12 for him and 12 for me. At around 12 weeks of age they become frozen food for us for the next 6 months. Thats two chickens per month all year 'round. Works for us.

After having lots of different livestock over the years I must say that chickens and rabbits are the easiest and most economical to have on our farm. But I must admit, I love our fresh pork an awful lot, too.


----------



## TheHangman

Hey Jarhead, Yeah look, we live in different worlds. We can have 500 x 300lb bales of hay at any one time so hay is never a problem. Rabbits waste a lot of hay ? yeah, I guess they do, but its only hay. My rabbits are in their own "Rabbitry" in suspended cages.
My wife and I are retired, (at 50), so the way we live is our lifestyle. Yes, my wife will spend half an hour every morning picking bits of this and bits of that to feed the bunnies, then she will spend another half hour cleaning, feeding and singing to them.
As far as storing food for the winter....Well, why, thats my point Jarhead, our vegies grow here all year round.
Oh by the way, i live in Australia. 

Hey Indiana, sounds a bit like our place, yep, home grown pork is pretty good, especially if you have a fruit orchard and throw all the dropped fruit to the pig.....ow yum.
We have just got a new breed of meat turkey....Oh wow, one half of a breast feeds the mrs and me for 3 meals and a bit left over for sandwiches.

Cheers......The Hangman


----------



## cowboyhermit

Hangman, they asked a simple question, why not just answer it? We have hundred of bales from 2000lb round to 50lb square but that has little to do with the question being asked. Hay will store quite well for a few years if kept dry but vitamins are vastly diminished after a year. If you don't have a plan for how to make hay without modern machinery why not be honest about it for the benefit of those trying to use this forum to learn.


----------



## TheHangman

"why not be honest about it"..........HONEST ABOUT IT !! Who the hell are you to doubt my honesty ??

Who are they ? I was talking to Jarhead.
Why tell us about YOUR hay ? whats that to do with ....anything ? Sounds like you may just be a braggart roaming the forums seeking to cause trouble.
Not that I need to explain myself to the likes of you but I answered Jarhead to the best of my ability, maybe you should learn to absorb what you read.
Oh Wow, the vitamins are vastly diminished after a year....yep, that will kill my rabbits for sure. (as an aside I bought 7 ton of wrapped hay rolls that were 7 yo with a certified test result) 
You want to talk to me COWBOY, get some respect, sounds like you may have a chip on your shoulder.....you can keep it.

The Hangman


----------



## cowboyhermit

Whoa, sounds like you are the one with a chip on your shoulder. Didn't realize you would be offended so easily. You have every right not to answer people's questions if you don't want to.

All that was asked was "how do you harvest it and how do you store it?"

I didn't question your honesty in the least, I said "IF" you don't have a plan.
As to the bragging, did you even read what I read? I was demonstrating that it was irrelevant to the question.


----------



## OldCootHillbilly

The old feller down the road got a few rabbits. In the summer he feeds em fresh cut field grass an greens from the garden. Winter time he feeds up some hay an some harvested cattail (don't ask me, cause I don't know!) along with some commercial feed. After a problem I ain't sure how the best way ta feed a rabbit would be. I thin it's gonna depend on where ya live an the resources ya would have. I know round here in the winter it would be tougher. 

Me I just trap mine fer food an a few pelts.


----------



## cowboyhermit

Cattail for rabbits, who'da thunk it?
When we cut sloughs we get cattail in there sometimes and the cows eat it up pretty well, never thought about it's actual feed value. Would be pretty easy to harvest a decent amount by hand if it works.
Between the "cottontails", jack rabbits and snowshoe hare it isn't ever too hard to find a rabbit around here


----------



## Sweeper

Our rabbits (three does/1 buck) go through only one 50lb. bail of hay over the winter, in spring, summer and fall they are all in a rabbit tractor, mowing the lawn for me, 50lbs. of hay would take only a couple hours with a scythe to produce in the spring, summer or fall, so feeding them post-SHTF would be no problem whatsoever. Also, keeping your breeding stock down to a minimum in the winter time will cut down on feed consumption.

Our four rabbits produce enough rabbit meat that we (family of 6) eat rabbit 2-3 times per week and still have a buildup of excess meat in the freezer. I have also just tilled up a large section in our backyard to plat Timothy Grass (hay) to feed them over the winter with, so the idea that sustaining a breeding population after shtf will be tough is ridiculous! BTW, we live in central Washington, up in the cold north, and this has proven to be a simple and viable system.


----------



## cowboyhermit

That makes sense, only wintering over a few and utilizing their ability to reproduce quickly

Putting up 50lbs of hay should indeed not be a problem for anyone if that is all you use.


----------



## cowboyhermit

By the way, we used to raise rabbits small scale/commercially but it has been years since we had more than a pet or two. The numbers I have seen is around 6oz of hay/dry doe or buck if hay is the main food source, at that rate 50lb would only last a month for 4 animals


----------



## Pixelphoto

for the person who said they let their chickens free range for food. That must be nice!!!!!
I live in Georgia and we have hawks, possums, raccoons, dogs, cats, bob cats, coyotes(lots of em), owls, and more. Unfortunately EVERYTHING likes to eat chicken.
I used to let mine free range and I found out quickly you loose them faster than you can grow them.
Then I made a coop and just locked them up at night. But still lost some during the day to hawks, and dogs people would drop off in the country. Even had a fox attack one during the day.
Then I built a coop with fence all around it. Still had ***** climb the fence and had hawks and owls swoop down and get the chickens.
So then I put bird netting and electrical fence around the base.
SO FAR (knock on wood) I havent lost a bird since. The problem is they cant free range for feed anymore so I must store food for them. Just like the rabbits yall are talking about. I could build a chicken tractor but you can do the same thing for rabbits. This is more work as now I have to move them around more often. Also I have heard of coyotes or dogs attacking them while in said chiccken tractors.
Just saying.


----------



## redhorse

Pixelphoto said:


> for the person who said they let their chickens free range for food. That must be nice!!!!!
> I live in Georgia and we have hawks, possums, raccoons, dogs, cats, bob cats, coyotes(lots of em), owls, and more. Unfortunately EVERYTHING likes to eat chicken.
> I used to let mine free range and I found out quickly you loose them faster than you can grow them.
> Then I made a coop and just locked them up at night. But still lost some during the day to hawks, and dogs people would drop off in the country. Even had a fox attack one during the day.
> Then I built a coop with fence all around it. Still had ***** climb the fence and had hawks and owls swoop down and get the chickens.
> So then I put bird netting and electrical fence around the base.
> SO FAR (knock on wood) I havent lost a bird since. The problem is they cant free range for feed anymore so I must store food for them. Just like the rabbits yall are talking about. I could build a chicken tractor but you can do the same thing for rabbits. This is more work as now I have to move them around more often. Also I have heard of coyotes or dogs attacking them while in said chiccken tractors.
> Just saying.


My birds are never locked up and are completely free range. They lay in the hay stack, and roost in the rafters at night. I have two donkies that keep the worst of the predators out of the barn and pastures. I would suggest getting a flighty rooster or some hens. Like a leghorn. They are very observant birds. Also, my chickens are never far from hiding places like the wood piles, under the porch, in the barn, blackberry patches, the junk pile etc. As soon as someone sounds the alarm, they vamoos. I haven't lost any birds in quite some time with the exception of peeps. Now I pull them off of their mothers as soon as they hatch and raise them in doors until they are fledged. Otherwise cats and such things pick them off.

We have a stray dog problem too. Everyone likes to dump the poor things on the back country roads  The donkey takes care of them on my property, but I think most of them end up either starving or getting shot by neighboring farmers.


----------



## cowboyhermit

People free range birds everywhere. We have all the predators you mentioned except possums but I would add skunks, lynx, wolves, bears, falcons, eagles, weasels, mink, ermine, you get the picture. There are many things you can do to help free range chickens survive, redhorse's suggestions are excellent. Another would be a livestock guardian dog, if raised with your chicks these can help protect from virtually everything you mentioned.

By the way, all of these things also LOVE to eat rabbits.


----------



## Jarhead0311

cowboyhermit said:


> By the way, we used to raise rabbits small scale/commercially but it has been years since we had more than a pet or two. The numbers I have seen is around 6oz of hay/dry doe or buck if hay is the main food source, at that rate 50lb would only last a month for 4 animals


That's true with no waste, but you can figure as much waste as consumption so a 50lb sg bale of hay will last four rabbits about two weeks. I had two bucks and five does, many times I would have as many as fifty rabbits at a time to feed out plus the six breeders. The feeders didn't gain well on hay and like I said the garden produce was a supplement at best. Once the SHTF commercial feed and baled hay will be nonexistent. Sure you can feed a couple of rabbits but even a small operation can produce a couple of hundred rabbits a year. That is a huge commitment to feed by hand.

I have two large dogs that keep predators away from my chickens, except for hawks, I did have a problem with them for a while. The chickens learned to run under cover (truck,tractor,bushes,etc) until I was able to shoot the hawks.

I raise goats,chickens,calves and hogs, when the SHTF I will butcher the calves and hogs. Hogs first then the calves. The goats and chickens can pretty well make a living on their own. Of the five animal types (including rabbits) that I raised, rabbits and hogs were the hardest to raise without grain or commercial feed. In my opinion neither will make good post SHTF livestock. If you feel different fine, I tried to duplicate a post SHTF feeding program and it just didn't work for me.


----------

