# Post-EMP (Microchip-free) Motorcycles...some questions



## Tacitus

First, let me say that I know nothing about motorcycles.

I'm looking for a post-EMP motorcycle. That means it must be a motorcycle without any semiconductor chips/microprocessors/integrated circuits ("chips") for controlling the engine/fuel injection/whatever. Put another way, I want the thing to work just as well as a two-stroke lawnmower--after an EMP, it starts like nothing happened.

Maybe this is all motorcycles...I don't know. I just figured that the higher end motorcycles have chips in them now. Anyone know where the cutoff is?

I'm assuming that the cheaper I go, and the less street worthy I go, the more likely the motorbike will be chip free...but maybe I need not be worried about this at all. Any motorcycle experts know how common chips are in motorcycles?


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## cowboyhermit

For true EMP proof gasoline engine it would pretty well have to be points, but even small engines, heck even chainsaws use electronic ignition these days.

I am sure someone will make some suggestions but I will just say that you could consider just picking up a spare (or two) ignition modules, they are really small for small engines.


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## Marcus

Pre-80s from what I understand.


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## LincTex

I thought it was funny in the book "Lights Out", he made the observation that Harley's must have a simple and easy to repair ignition system. (post-SHTF biker gang).

You can buy a points conversion kit for about $40 (or so) that will convert any carbureted Harley Davidson from 1939-1999 to points. So, there is that.... and also there are still some magneto options available.

My Yamaha XS650's all use points, even up to 1982. 

However, both of the bikes mentioned use electronic voltage regulators to recharge the battery. In both cases, it is external and can be changed very easily. It is a relatively small item, and a spare could be wrapped in tin foil for later if needed.

I have a Crane Hi-4 ignition in my newer Harley and a Dyna ignition in my older one, both are pretty bulletproof. A spare ignition system is even SMALLER than a spare voltage regulator! I think I might have a points conversion lying around somewhere.

I kind of have my doubts whether all of this would be necessary. I have seen bikes get hit by lightning that damaged a lot of stuff, but had no problems starting after.


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## Tacitus

I probably should have also said that I know nothing about engines. Guess I should buy some engine maintenance manuals.

From the comments above, I note that I probably need a bike that does not have electronic ignition. Does that mean a kick starter?...I've seen those on TV.  (Remember, I'm totally clueless. I've never ridden a motorcycle. This will be a first time purchase for me.)

I understand that cars these days have tens of microprocessors in them, so the older the better for cars (pre-80's). But I was _hoping_ that motorcycles lagged in introducing microprocessor controls, and therefore I could buy newer, post-80's motorcycles which will still have older engine technology (akin to pre-80's car technology). I'm guessing that the big touring bikes have modern microprocessors, but maybe standard dirt bikes do not?

I suppose microchips are used to control the carburetor? That is why I need "points"?

Interesting that this is the ad I get on this page:


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## cowboyhermit

The "ignition" that we are talking about is simply how the engine sends the juice to the spark plug, can be kick start or not. This was done with "points" a lot in the past, they are simply a mechanical device that makes and breaks contact, I have found them fairly reliable but others hate them. Either way they have been replaced by an electronic means of control that tends to be more efficient and requires no maintenance (replacing is all that is possible). Like mentioned this "ignition control module" or whatever you want to call it is a pretty small and inexpensive part for a small engine so it might be easier to just get a spare. If you want a true emp proof I think you will need to look to older models or a conversion, either way someone with more knowledge of motorcycles should have suggestions.


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## LincTex

Don't look at cheap Chinese bikes. They are all electronic, and *not* good stuff at at that.

I put 70,000 miles on a 1993 Harley Sportster with no major repairs... and I was HARD on that bike (I spent almost as much time on one wheel as I did on two, LOL!). I did do a "top-end" overhaul on it because the buyer asked me to do it and he paid for it, but it didn't really "need" it done.

If you are 5'10" or smaller, I would seriously consider this bike to own. They can be found for $3000 or less, are dead reliable, have cheap insurance, and my 883 (converted to 1200cc) got an honest 65MPG. The ignition and charging components can be changed in about 15-20 minutes, each. If you want a kickstart, you need to go back to the 80's models. I loved my Sportster, but it was really too small for me.

The only Japanese bike I would consider for the role you are implying is the late 70's to early 80's XS650's. I have three and none are for sale. These were a German designed 500cc engine originally, and were upgraded over the years. The aftermarket support for these is substantial. Power, reliability, comfort and good mileage are all good reasons to own one.

If you want to stay with H-D and are over 5'7", look at the Dyna line (FXD) of bikes. I have seen really nice Dyna's in the low $4000 range with low mileage. These bikes are smooth and comfortable. If you find a late 80's FXR you will have a FANTASTIC bike from a comfort and handling standpoint, and for little money.

I am 6'3" and ride a late 80's Softail. It has been the "most favorite" (LOL!) of any of the 46 motorcycles I have owned.


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## Tirediron

while you can convert hall effect electronic ignition back to points the points system will not work as efficiently and requires a lot more maintainance. a carbureted engine with electronic ignition and a few sets of spare components would be a good idea IMO,


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## LincTex

"In a Nutshell"



Tacitus said:


> I'm looking for a post-EMP motorcycle.


OK - this is pretty easily obtainable. However.....



Tacitus said:


> That means it must be a motorcycle without any semiconductor chips/microprocessors/integrated circuits ("chips")


OK, Ouch!! 
Yeah, that is pretty tough to do, really - - at least nothing modern at all. Many Japanese bikes may have still had points up until late, but went to solid state charging circuits long beforehand. Ignition modules are pretty small and easy to store. Same with voltage regulators.



Tacitus said:


> Put another way, I want the thing to work just as well as a two-stroke lawnmower--after an EMP, it starts like nothing happened.


Well, there is no guarantee that lawnmower will work, either!!

You may end up being limited to a "dirt bike" only, where the only thing electrical is the ignition system. If you want any lights or electric starting at all, you will need spare parts enough to keep the charging system working.


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## ddowell73

As far as motorcycles go, I always thought that the Kawasaki KLR650 would be a good choice because it uses a carburetor and is highly customizable. Instead of going through the pain and expense of converting it, I figured I would just get a spare ignition system and keep it in a faraday cage in the garage, along with other sensitive electronics.


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## ddowell73

*Injuries*

I always wondered if a motorcycle would be the way to go. I think that the liklihood of getting a serious injuty while riding it would be greatly enhanced, and would be a problem. Especially if the scenario would be that there is limited or no medical care. These will be times that extreme care would be needed in order to avoid serious injury or illness.


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## Tirediron

riding a motorcycle post SHTF would be dangerous if the rider was inexperienced and lacked the muscle memory required for good reaction, it would probably be safer than it is now because people would be more aware of their surroundings


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## Geek999

Whether you are talking a car or a motorcycle there are 2 ways to go that have effectively been discussed. 1) Spare electronic parts, 2) something that pre-dates all the electronics today. To go the latter route pretty much takes you into vehicles that are quite old, but probably not too pricey. Restorations are a possibility and wouldn't be too difficult on a motorcycle. You can take a 1970s or earlier motorcycle apart with hand tools. Another approach might be to ask what parts do I need to have backups for in the event of an EMP. On a car or truck that is probably going to be a couple dozen parts minimum, but on a motorcycle it might be 3 or 4.

Note there is some debate on what would be affected by an EMP. One school of thought is modern vehicles would stall but need to be restarted. Another school says all the modern electronics are fried.

In either case if the grid goes down you are going to have a fuel problem.


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## Bathouse

Tacitus said:


> Remember, I'm totally clueless. I've never ridden a motorcycle. This will be a first time purchase for me.


Without basic riding skills a motorcycle is useless.. You really should start with a beginner MSF class that will teach you the basics before buying anything. Many classes will provide a bike for you to learn on.

You might be better off storing electronic components for one of your cars. (store them in the trunk in a good faraday cage)
Cars generally have a longer range than bikes and can carry more. My Ranger PU can go 400 miles on a 20 gal tank, (and if I add a 5 gal gas can it will go 500 miles) most motorcycles dont have that kind of range. (the military's diesel KLR650 being one exception...) I'm sure the military has shielded electronics in its fleet, maybe thats an option?


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## Geek999

If you are comfortable on a bicycle, I think you would do best on a smaller motorcycle at first. Riding is a skill just like driving is. You'll want a good helmet, boots and protective clothing.

If you don't have tools, buy a good set of rachets and open ended wrenches. You can then add specialty tools as needed. Back in the day I used to carry a few spare parts, particularly cable by taking off the seat and gas tank and taping them along the backbone of the frame.

You might want to check out Rokon motorcycles if this is primarily a prepper thing. If you are truly interested in riding day to day, then start with a small Japanese model (Honda, Yamaha, Kawasaki, Suzuki). Parts are easy to get, but learn to do your own maintenance.

One other possibility if you are uncomfortable about learning to ride is a Can-Am, which is a trike with two wheels in the front.


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## Boomy

I have a 1966 Suzuki "Hillbilly" that I bought back in 1986 for $100. Not gonna find many at a garage sale and with a little 80cc engine you wouldn't get anywhere fast...... but it survived my jr high and highschool years so I'm going to guess that they are fairly bulletproof?


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## Boomy

Bathouse said:


> Cars generally have a longer range than bikes and can carry more. My Ranger PU can go 400 miles on a 20 gal tank,


Ever try to "white line" a Ford Ranger?


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## Bathouse

Boomy said:


> Ever try to "white line" a Ford Ranger?


Like "lane splitting"?
I've been riding bikes for 20 yrs. (dirt and street) I do understand the advantages a bike has in gridlocked traffic, but I also understand the dangers and skills required to ride a bike in traffic. 
Here's a couple videos that demonstrate the advantages/risks of riding in traffic. This is normal CA traffic, imagine how much worse it would be in a SHTF situation. (and would anyone be desperate enough to take your bike from you?)










I am not saying the OP should not get a bike, just that without good motorcycle skills, a bike would be a poor BOV. 
With enough experience however, a bike has many advantages.. (not range or payload..)


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## piglett

i myself would not want a hog with straight pipes for a 
"get the hell out of dodge vehicle"
but maybe something more quiet could work
maybe only run late at night....?
i myself would stay off all roads if i had to move from 1 area to another if it was post SHTF 
finding water while walking through the woods may not be all that tough in some areas. & you can go many days with 1/2 rations if you pace yourself.
but staying off the radar of groups of bad guys might be hard 
so i say stay off all roads!


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## Tirediron

I really can't believe that nobody helped the rice rocket pilot with his balance especially with the engine revving crap


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## Caribou

I always wanted the DI BLASI folding moped. You're not going to win any races but it folds up and is a skookum little bike.

http://www.diblasi.us/Folding_Scooters.asp?Prd=Mopeds&Pag=Gruppo&Lng=en


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## Bathouse

Caribou said:


> You're not going to win any races but it folds up and is a skookum little bike.


That is pretty cool... my kid wants one now... Really lousy BOV tho..


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## Caribou

Bathouse said:


> That is pretty cool... my kid wants one now... Really lousy BOV tho..


Like so many other things it really depends on your situation. If I was in Florida and my BOL was in Montana then this would be a poor choice. If I needed to get home after my car broke down or got stuck in a gridlock this might just be the ticket.

I've used a hammer to drive a screw but it is not the right tool. Some cruisers have these on their boats. They are light and fold up to take little space. This is perfect for their need. They will haul you with a back pack and another small container. They are not right for everything.

They also get points for the fun factor.


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## hitman3872

Check out the rural motorcycle with side car it is pretty inexpensive made in Russia and styled after our ww2 Harley's it's loud but stable.


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## Boomy

These are starting to gnaw on me. Not as a BOV but as a post-SHTF grocery getter.
Honda Ruckus


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## MI-preps

Depending on what you want a bike for, consider looking at a Rokon. They are slow, but can tow/carry a crazy amount of weight. They are 2 wheel drive also so they can go over anything. Many have hollow wheels that can carry water or fuel. And a sidecar attaches with 1 bolt. Pretty bullet proof.


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## piglett

this is what i ride when seeing the in-laws in the Philippines
http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad117/piglett2195/100_0343.jpg
it's a 125cc honda 4stroke

or is all else fails i could ride a water buffalo 
http://i927.photobucket.com/albums/ad117/piglett2195/100_0315.jpg:
:2thumb:
they are slow but have plenty of pulling power


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## LincTex

Boomy said:


> These are starting to gnaw on me. Not as a BOV but as a post-SHTF grocery getter.
> Honda Ruckus


I like those too. A scooter with a little tiny pinch of "macho" added.

The first time I saw one I immediately thought of the old Cushmans. I had one; they are built WELL:


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## LincTex

Oh, those (Airborne model) have no rear swing-arm or front springs, just solid frame. 

Mine (civilian version) had a rear swing-arm and front springs; it rode well - 2 speed trans (some could be had with three) and three gallons would go about 200 miles at 45 mph.


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## RoadRash

73 Suzuki DT185 also has a kick start, I have 3 gallons of battery acid 
79 HD low rider, kick start n points looking at adding a magneto 
72 Honda Chopper kick start only with points 
Means the wife n I n daughter can ride to BOL with stepdaughter n grandson in a worse case. 
Have a couple of sets of spare points kicking around, emery cloth to clean up feeler gage to set.first indication that the points need attention is when the bike displays a decrease in performance, including poor starting and poor acceleration


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## HamiltonFelix

A Rokon bears the same relationship to a motorcycle that a 4WD Kubota tractor does to an automobile. 

Bikes can fit where cars and even Jeeps can't. But they can't carry much. Everything is a compromise. If your needs are 100% OFFroad, then a Rokon is cool. A better compromise might be my 1976 Honda CT90 (if I ever get off my a** and get it back on the road) or a Ural with driven wheel sidecar. A "Swiss Army Knife" of bikes would be my 2007 Suzuki DL650. Not a "trail" bike, but it does old logging roads just fine. And it's comfortable on the highway, has detachable luggage and can carry two if needed. But it does have electronics, all the recent ones do. 

If you're really set on "EMP-proof," then it will be old. Make sure you know how to maintain it and you have the parts you will need.


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## Jimthewagontraveler

I would think any vehicle locked inside a well grounded shipping container would be emp safe????


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## HamiltonFelix

You know, the official gummint report on EMP is still on my Amazon wish list. 

I've seen a few YouTube unofficial tests, guy enclosing the "protected" item and seeing if a cell phone signal could still get through. It got through a lot of things. I am no expert on the science of an effective Faraday cage, but if there's a gap bigger than the wavelength of the FR you are protecting against (and with cell phones it's microwaves) the signal can still get through. 

Also, there are two different components to an EMP. The Carrington event of 1859 was a biggie, but nobody worried about the spike that fries electronics because there were none to fry. However, the component that generates high voltages and currents in long lines really raised H*** with the telegraph. 

I would expect a good tight metal shipping container to be pretty good protection from just about anything. 

Maybe some of the HAM guys here can chime in and add to this.


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## LincTex

Jimthewagontraveler said:


> I would think any vehicle locked inside a well grounded shipping container would be emp safe????


Take all the connections loose on the wiring and ground all of them to the frame with jumper wires. Take the battery out. That should do it.


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## piglett

Tacitus said:


> First, let me say that I know nothing about motorcycles.
> 
> I'm looking for a post-EMP motorcycle. That means it must be a motorcycle without any semiconductor chips/microprocessors/integrated circuits ("chips") for controlling the engine/fuel injection/whatever. Put another way, I want the thing to work just as well as a two-stroke lawnmower--after an EMP, it starts like nothing happened.
> 
> Maybe this is all motorcycles...I don't know. I just figured that the higher end motorcycles have chips in them now. Anyone know where the cutoff is?
> 
> I'm assuming that the cheaper I go, and the less street worthy I go, the more likely the motorbike will be chip free...but maybe I need not be worried about this at all. Any motorcycle experts know how common chips are in motorcycles?


can i ask everyone here a dumb question???
if everyone else is on foot 
some are armed to the teeth
how on earth do you think you can get away with riding around on a motorcycle?
will doing so make you a huge target?vract:
crazy people who are in bad shape will tend to do whatever it takes to survive......correct?
if i had a car/truck/bike that still ran i would be sure to hide it & guard it with my life if needed.
i would not be out riding around waiting for some clown to pop a cap in me


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## LincTex

piglett said:


> how on earth do you think you can get away with riding around on a motorcycle?
> will doing so make you a huge target?
> 
> if i had a car/truck/bike that still ran i would be sure to hide it & guard it with my life if needed.


Assume you won't be the only person on the planet that still has a running vehicle.

Use your BEST discretion to determine the times and places it would be safe to ride. At first, it my need to be used as vital transportation. If thing progressed to where it really was the last motorized vehicle running on earth, it would be exceedingly valuable. At that point, trade it for something you need more.


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## helicopter5472

People would sure know you are coming with the noise braking the silence, Does anyone know if the condenser or coil would be effected by EMP.. These are still used in the "old systems" On the other hand the military EMP's proofs most of their equipment and many other vehicles and equipment. 
It seems there have been several threads on EMP many ideas and thoughts but from what I have read so far we will have to wait till it happens to find out, especially the area you live verses where the bomb went off. What if your in an all metal garage? For what I can afford a metal trash can or old microwave is the best so far...


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## Tirediron

From what I can figure out the condenser would charge up, maybe causing the ignition to stop working until the voltage dissipated, they are capable of holding a lot of voltage an anyone who has ever been a recipient of the catch the condenser game knows. the coil should be ok depending on how much antenna wire there is and how well the opposite pole is grounded. the trouble is this hasn't really been tested in actual operating conditions, from the reports of how the.gov tests were conducted that result pool may be inaccurate. 

Spark ignition was invented in the late 1800, by people who had theoretical information for the most part, I don't think it would take very long for people who KNOW that it can work to figure out how to get things to run after a fry off. Food production without machines would be very labour intensive. The old "well if you have a working engine it will just attract bad guys" line might get turned into lets make some noise to see if we can scare up some bad guys, the Homer Simpson: "tragitunity" thing


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## LincTex

helicopter5472 said:


> Does anyone know if the condenser or coil would be effected by EMP.. These are still used in the "old systems"


Ground EVERY single circuit to the bike frame. Even the plug wires/leads.

If everything is grounded/shorted, what damage can happen?



Tirediron said:


> they are capable of holding a lot of voltage an anyone who has ever been a recipient of the *"catch the condenser game" *knows. the coil should be ok depending on how much antenna wire there is and how well the opposite pole is grounded.


Hahahahaha!! Oh, yes - what fun that is!! 

The big electrolytic "start" capacitors are especially fun!


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## NSAdataCollector

I think EMP is near the bottom of the list of likely scenarios. Not impossible just much less likely than say energy blackout, food shortage, local riots, state secession... etc. A dirty bomb wouldn't cause an EMP. It would have to be a nuclear air burst @ the right height... essentially WW3 with Russia or China. You will have bigger problems than EMP. Even the military has had little interest in EMP shielding in the last 10-20 years.


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## Geek999

NSAdataCollector said:


> I think EMP is near the bottom of the list of likely scenarios. Not impossible just much less likely than say energy blackout, food shortage, local riots, state secession... etc. A dirty bomb wouldn't cause an EMP. It would have to be a nuclear air burst @ the right height... essentially WW3 with Russia or China. You will have bigger problems than EMP. Even the military has had little interest in EMP shielding in the last 10-20 years.


I'd say it is unlikely to happen tomorrow, but it would not surprise me if EMPs were part of any nuclear exchange. While a nuclear exchange may seem unlikely now, the odds start climbing as more countries, e.g. Iran join the nuclear club. There is also the issue of a terrorist organization getting control of nuclear weapons.

What that boils down to is the odds are currently low but climbing.


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## LincTex

I think everyone should restore an older vintage motorcycle... just because it is!! 

The ability to run post-EMP is just a nice side benefit


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## helicopter5472

LincTex said:


> I think everyone should restore an older vintage motorcycle... just because it is!!
> 
> The ability to run post-EMP is just a nice side benefit


I've done my fair share of the 4 H's (Harleys, Hondas, Hogs) but the ones I miss most were the old Britt bikes My BSA, Matchless, and Arieal square 4


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## Geek999

LincTex said:


> I think everyone should restore an older vintage motorcycle... just because it is!!
> 
> The ability to run post-EMP is just a nice side benefit


If I was younger I would agree. You can rebuild one with simple hand tools. You don't need a lift or anything that takes up much space to do it. However with my thoroughly trashed lower back I wouldn't be riding it, so I'm moving on to the mid-80s diesel Suburban mentioned elsewhere.

Despite the talk of Rokons, etc. I think I'd look around for an old BMW. With the driveshaft they will pretty much run forever once you get it running right.


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## LincTex

helicopter5472 said:


> the ones I miss most were the old Britt bikes My BSA, Matchless, and Arieal square 4


Perish the Thought! "B.S." Tools and parts are both equally difficult to find. I hate Lucas electronics!!!

I did actually enjoy my '72 BSA 650 for what it was, but I would still take an early 70's Honda 750 over the BSA any day.



Geek999 said:


> I think I'd look around for an old BMW.


I'd second that. They are hardy machines for sure.


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## Geek999

LincTex said:


> Perish the Thought! "B.S." Tools and parts are both equally difficult to find. I hate Lucas electronics!!!
> 
> I did actually enjoy my '72 BSA 650 for what it was, but I would still take an early 70's Honda 750 over the BSA any day.
> 
> I'd second that. They are hardy machines for sure.


Tools for a BSA? All you need is a hammer. LOL


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## helicopter5472

Well I agree with GEEK 999 , Those old 30 plus year old bikes were fun to play with, ride, and easy to fix in their day. Those days are over, even though I still ride a little in the summer I think I'll stick with the Suburban type. 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"I think everyone should restore an older vintage motorcycle... just because it is!! 

The ability to run post-EMP is just a nice side benefit."
This is what I was responding too....


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## Geek999

helicopter5472 said:


> Well I agree with GEEK 999 , Those old 30 plus year old bikes were fun to play with, ride, and easy to fix in their day. Those days are over, even though I still ride a little in the summer I think I'll stick with the Suburban type.
> 
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> "I think everyone should restore an older vintage motorcycle... just because it is!!
> 
> The ability to run post-EMP is just a nice side benefit."
> This is what I was responding too....


I really enjoyed it back in the day when what now passes for a "vintage" bike was new.


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## LincTex

When working on a Harley: "OK, the way they did that is a little weird, but I see why they did it"

When working on a Jap bike: "OK, the way they did that is a little weird, but I see why they did it"

When working on a German bike: "OK, the way they did that is a _really_ weird and makes things a bit more complicated, but I can see why they did it"

When working on a Brit bike (or car): "WTF?!? The way they did that makes no sense to me at all, why didn't they just copy the way the American and European bikes did??!?! "


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## helicopter5472

LincTex said:


> When working on a Harley: "OK, the way they did that is a little weird, but I see why they did it"
> 
> When working on a Jap bike: "OK, the way they did that is a little weird, but I see why they did it"
> 
> When working on a German bike: "OK, the way they did that is a _really_ weird and makes things a bit more complicated, but I can see why they did it"
> 
> When working on a Brit bike (or car): "WTF?!? The way they did that makes no sense to me at all, why didn't they just copy the way the American and European bikes did??!?! "


Isn't that the reason they are over there and we are over here!!! :2thumb:


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## RoadRash

If ur going out go out in style.... lol


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## LincTex

RoadRash said:


> If ur going out go out in style.... lol


I used to have one very similar, with an XS650 engine in it 

My current ride (except mine is blue with V&H exhaust):


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## The_Fix_Is_In

*Working Motorcycle After an EMP*

I had the same question as the original poster. I have more questions now than I did before reading the thread.

Allow me to ask some of his/her questions another way.

Scenario: The Mother Load of EMP blasts hits the U.S. from D.C. area. I'm in Raleigh, N.C. It's 3:30pm

I'm alone. I live in suburbia, about 2000 homes around me. My plan is to grab my B.O.B., head to my garage, and jump on my motorcycle and get the hell out of dodge before the SHTF. My destination is 30 miles south to my cabin, rural roads 99% of the way. There are no vehicles moving that I can see.

My only goal is to get this flipping motorcycle started and head south. Will this motorcycle start?? I hope so....

My thoughts are as the poster's, it seems like a kick start dirt bike made in 1969 would fit the bill. (Assuming it was tuned, gassed, and in perfect working order 20 minutes ago.) It's 3:35pm, same day.

Assume I have no spare parts
Assume I have and will not modify the motorcycle
Assume I have mastered riding motorcross
Assume I have no Faraday cage

My questions still are:

Would a 1969 kick start dirt bike...start? If not,_* is there a factory motorcycle made today or in the previous 75 years that you're pretty certain would start?*_ (Again, without modification) *If so, what is it? What are its specs that allow this motorcycle to start after an EMP while "that one", won't. *

It seems that no one really knows. Lots of conjecture though.

But, I have additional questions.

Many have suggested just having "spare parts". Wouldn't the EMP "fry" both the part _on_ your motorcycle as well as the spare part sitting _next_ to your motorcycle?

Would spark plugs work after an EMP?

Doesn't a kick start assume the role of a spark plug on a kick start motorcycle?

Many say it would have to have points. How are points related to a kick start motorcycle and or spark plugs?

If there were such a motorcycle that would definitely start after a pretty significant EMP, how would I search for it on Craiglist?

Wanted: EMP ready motorcycle!?
Motorcycle with points wanted!?

Thanks!!

PS Keep in mind, I only care about this motorcycle and it starting after an EMP. I don't care about cars or lawn mowers or how I'm going to kill myself on it. I just want to hop on this bike and go.


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## cowboyhermit

Asking for a simple answer to a complex problems often leads to misunderstandings. I don't have time right now to give an in-depth answer and I am sure someone will come along with more details, particularly models and years.



The_Fix_Is_In said:


> My thoughts are as the poster's, it seems like a kick start dirt bike made in 1969 would fit the bill. (Assuming it was tuned, gassed, and in perfect working order 20 minutes ago.) It's 3:35pm, same day.
> 
> Probably, nothing in life is guaranteed
> 
> It seems that no one really knows.
> 
> But, I have additional questions.
> 
> Many have suggested just having "spare parts". Wouldn't the EMP "fry" both the part _on_ your motorcycle as well as the spare part sitting _next_ to your motorcycle?
> 
> Having parts that are not connected to anything makes them less likely to be damaged, protecting them with anything makes them even safer.
> 
> Would spark plugs work after an EMP?
> 
> Yes.
> 
> Doesn't a kick start assume the role of a spark plug on a kick start motorcycle?
> 
> NO.
> 
> Many say it would have to have points. How are points related to a kick start motorcycle and or spark plugs?
> 
> I think points were already discussed, the motor either has points or electronic ignition.


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## Tirediron

Points and condenser ignition operate the ignition coil which fires the spark plug which ignites the burn (often misnamed explosion) that converts gasoline into motion. 
The weak link in a point ignition system would in my opinion be the condenser which could in certain circumstances become over charged and effect dwell.
Electronic ignition contains transistors which may fail. 

the chances are slim but it is possible, better yet know the location of a EMP naysayer and harness them to your mode of transportation and encourage them Roman style 

I would word my wanted add to read : wanted pre electronic ignition motor cycle, prefer kick start. and what ever size requirements


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## Caribou

Why would you not have spare parts? A couple changes of plugs is a bare minimum. I never rode bikes much but I never took my snow machine anywhere without spare plugs. Your spare condenser will come in a small cardboard box. Wrap that box in tin foil, you have your faraday cage. Place your plugs, condenser, and points in a ziplock to protect them from the far more likely moisture and you are set.

Find a class, or someone to teach you basic bike maintenance. You might not need to know how to rebuild the engine but you need to know what parts do what and how to do basic stuff like tighten a chain and adjust points.


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## LincTex

I believe that even if it is electronic ignition, as long as you use good ground wires and ground straps on all the circuits, that should be enough protection.

Spark plugs will not be affected in anyway. They "live the life" of EMP's by their very nature!!!!!

A kick starter is only a form of getting the engine turned over. I think you meant to say will it replace a starter, which it will. 

Drain all fuel, and store only stabilized gasoline.


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## Shammua

So tonight I'm not patient enough to read all the way through. However for a bike, I'd recommend the KLR650 and there even still kits out there to make it a kick start. Great bike, averages about 50+ mpg, can add lots to it, does great offroad, and is cheap. You could buy two or three KLRs for the price of one Harley.


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## rhrobert

hitman3872 said:


> Check out the rural motorcycle with side car it is pretty inexpensive made in Russia and styled after our ww2 Harley's it's loud but stable.


It's Ural, not rural. They are are pretty indestructible. I lived next to a guy who sold them in Mosinee, WI. Rode many of them, wish i would have bought one.
Now, I'll take a Rokon


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## MI-preps

If "top speed" is not a big issue, and the machines ability to traverse literally all terrain, consider. Rokon. All wheel drive.... Poses, front and rear wheels chain driven. Has fat boy tires on it. With the solid wheels, you can carry fuel or potable water in the wheels. If the wheels are empty, the machine will float! It will go up a 60% incline. And has a pull start.. I got a side cart for mine so I can take a fer more people.. But be advised,,,not built for speed


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## LincTex

MI-preps said:


> Rokon. And has a pull start..


You failed to address the NUMBER ONE reason for this thread - an *EMP!*

Last I checked, 
Rokon uses engines that I wouldn't trust to start again after an EMP.

Pull all you want on that rope - - - - if you have no ignition, your Rokon isn't taking you anywhere.


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## TimB

Haven't had a bike since Dec. '09 when I sold my '08 Kawasaki KLR650. I was about to have both knees replaced in Jan. '10 and wasn't sure how I would come through it (of course everything went super-good and I have regretted selling that bike to this day). Last week a friend of mine called and asked if I was still interested in his Honda (thought it was an XL250). Went by to look at it and he told me to just take them. THEM? He also had a '73 CB350 in the shed with the 250. Finally talked him into taking $100 for both as they were worth something if nothing but scrap. Haven't had a chance to mess with them other than to confirm the engines aren't locked up and the 250 is an Elsinore.
Fresh from 10 yrs. in a storage shed-


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## FrankW

I am a big believer in limiting my responses to a thread to just answering the question asked.

I think that's proper netiquette.

BUT there are exceptions.

One such exception is when the question to be solved implies something that simply isnt true.
I dont want newbies to get ruined and fall into this group think about buying old vehicles being good for a prepper because they are "good against EMP".

It's nonsense and such a thread "teaches" that nonsense to newbs, which is how it had percolated to begin with.

Modern ECUs are quite good at resisting even nearby lightning strikes
Those are much more powerful "EMP" than an EMP "attack" ever could be.

So please pleeaaase dont waste any money that could go into food , ammo or silver into "EMP proof" vehicles.

I know there are some closed minds here about the "prepper lore" of EMP fried ECUs so those I am not addressing, but it is the newbies:

_Worry about what an EMP does to the grid (and therefore your fuel supply) not your vehicle!_


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## LincTex

TimB said:


> ... 250 is an Elsinore.


I had a '74 MT250 Elsinore. 
It was a beast... and I was far too young to ride it! In the middle of North Dakota parts were scarce, but thanks to the internet I see parts available everywhere now. Mine was troublesome, but only because it hadn't been taken very well care of before I got it.


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## LincTex

BlueZ said:


> I dont want newbies to get ruined and fall into this group think about buying old vehicles being good for a prepper because they are "good against EMP".
> 
> So please pleeaaase dont waste any money that could go into food , ammo or silver into "EMP proof" vehicles.
> 
> _Worry about what an EMP does to the grid (and therefore your fuel supply) not your vehicle!_


I suppose that's true, but we'll never REALLY know for sure.

I did the Cummins diesel 4BT swap into my F-250 for fuel mileage reasons when gas was over $4 a gallon and the 400M between the fenders got 10 MPG... 11 on a good day! The fact that it'll run without any electricity was just a nice side bonus. The only thing "solid state" on the truck is the alternator internal voltage regulator, and I have spares (they are sooo cheap). The radio is a really cheap "Audiovox" and I don't care if it craps out.

Spare ignition modules for Harley-Davidsons are really VERY cheap and takes 5 whole minutes to replace. Same with the Voltage regulator/rectifier. Now, I don't keep spares with me on the bike (though I'm sure I could find space for them) but at least I have some stored in case they are needed - for very cheap.


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## Tirediron

BlueZ said:


> I am a big believer in limiting my responses to a thread to just answering the question asked.
> 
> I think that's proper netiquette.
> 
> BUT there are exceptions.
> 
> One such exception is when the question to be solved implies something that simply isnt true.
> I dont want newbies to get ruined and fall into this group think about buying old vehicles being good for a prepper because they are "good against EMP".
> 
> It's nonsense and such a thread "teaches" that nonsense to newbs, which is how it had percolated to begin with.
> 
> Modern ECUs are quite good at resisting even nearby lightning strikes
> Those are much more powerful "EMP" than an EMP "attack" ever could be.
> 
> So please pleeaaase dont waste any money that could go into food , ammo or silver into "EMP proof" vehicles.
> 
> I know there are some closed minds here about the "prepper lore" of EMP fried ECUs so those I am not addressing, but it is the newbies:
> 
> _Worry about what an EMP does to the grid (and therefore your fuel supply) not your vehicle!_


And this is based on a report that you read?? or do you have actual empirical experience in the infallibility of ECU s ??.


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## Shammua

If I was going along these lines here is what I personally would do
Buy an older KLR 650 Gen I, convert to points (if it doesn't have them already) and then get the kickstart conversion. 
I think this would be helpful not only for EMP type but points and kickstarts are easier to "recreate" in a world where exact parts may not be readily available. Then again your creativity and ingenuity have to be pretty high too.


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