# Snake Bite



## Cotton (Oct 12, 2013)

I've had a busy few weeks and didn't have time to post this. I've often thought about a copperhead or pit viper bite in a shtf situation, no higher level of care available. What could I do? Not much&#8230; I bought a herb book last fall that covered the subject but it was just theory, no case studies. At best there are written records of what native peoples used to do with one exception. A man by the name of Dr. H.C. Myers, from whom, ironically, we get the term "snake oil", in a round about way.

A week ago Tuesday my shepherd got snake bit. I'm pretty sure it was a copperhead. Dogs rarely die from viper bites but they swell up for several days and are pretty sick. I was leaving in 48hrs on a 5 day trip and didn't want to saddle someone else with a dog that was feeling poorly.

I knew my upcoming class on wilderness medicine would cover snake bites and herbs traditionally used to treat them. I messaged the instructor and he sent me the list of plants. As it happens I had two plants on his list in tincture form, Turmeric and Heal-All. Turmeric has constituents that inhibit "phospholipase A2" which is an enzyme commonly found in snake venom. Heal-all promotes capillary and endotelial tissue repair and stimulates NO and eNOS in the case of anti-coagulation proteins. (as best I understand it lol )

I added yarrow for its ability to move stagnate blood, especially in the case of severe swelling. I also added monarda as I had read of its use in a case of rattlesnake bite on the Sioux reservation in SD (Mathew Wood). Then there is the old country remedy of bacon grease internally which I've read stimulates the liver.

I noticed something was wrong with the dog about 6:30am. I bathed his leg in an activated charcoal slurry while waiting on messages. I gave a round of tinctures at 7:00, put in hot water first to let alcohol evaporate (dogs are sensitive). The swelling increased another 20% over the next couple of hours then leveled off. At 1pm I gave another round. At 2pm I noticed the swelling was decreasing. By 5:30pm his paw was completely normal with just a little noticeable swelling below his knee. He was starting to put weight on it while walking&#8230; The next morning he was completely normal, even played "chase the ball" at full speed with out any sign of a limp, amazing!

When I'm out gathering medicinal plants my dog feels he has to be involved. If I'm processing plants and drop a leaf he gobbles it up. I've seen him chew up or eat all the above plants with no adverse effects. In fact he seems to like turmeric on my table scraps when I cook with it. So I wasn't really taking a risk. Just check my avatar... I've seen him chew up mullein.

The pic is a joined file. On the left is his right rear leg at 7am, swollen, on the right is the same leg at 5:30pm. 10.5 hours later. I was astonished by what I witnessed over the course of a day.

If me or mine are bitten by a pit viper in a shtf situation, I know exactly what I'm going to do! I've seen it work!

One last thing&#8230; There is a book that covers snake bites and the herbs. I posted it here&#8230; http://www.preparedsociety.com/forum/f49/book-herbal-medic-26468/ the snake bite section starts on page 80.


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## Marcus (May 13, 2012)

From what I recall, dogs were used years ago for the production of anti-venom since, as you mentioned, they rarely die from a bite. I can still vividly recall the picture of the German Shepard dog with its neck swollen to double its normal size that was included in the informational pamphlet that came with the anti-venom manufactured by a major drug company. When we had the farm, we had a collie mix get bit once and it too was not fatal though it did swell quite a bit. I just wonder if the differences in sensitivity to the venom between certain animals and humans makes a big difference in treatment and dosages.


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## Cotton (Oct 12, 2013)

Great point… I’m sure there is differences but there is no measuring stick, no case studies to compare using big pharma vs herbs or between species.

I’ve been reading the “eclectics” of late. This was medicinal movement in the US and Europe before the advent of pharmaceuticals. I disagree with much of what I read but thank them for their detailed records! These records include first hand accounts of what our native peoples did and the plants they used.

Again, when considering the options in a shtf situation I would rely on what native peoples did… they had millennia to work out the kinks… This is why I like the writings of Matthew Wood, a modern native american who grew up on a rez, but understands native medicine. He’s written many great books.

At the end of the day when there is no “higher care” what do you do?


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## *Andi (Nov 8, 2009)

I'm going to give this a pass ... 

What can I say...


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## tsrwivey (Dec 31, 2010)

Snake bite is a concern for us as well & could very well be fatal if you couldn't get the victim to a hospital. I have that book so I need to look & make sure I have the necessary herbs. I also need to research the modern medicine treatment of snake bite, see if I can acquire any of those meds, then make a kit & instructions for it's use. Thanks for posting!


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## Country Living (Dec 15, 2009)

Our dogs get snake bit every year or so. I usually shove a couple of Benadryl down their throat and keep an eye on the dog for the rest of the day. A copperhead bit one of my dogs on the nose last year and she did get a trip to the vet because her face swelled to the size of a pumpkin. He gave her some more Benadryl, a steroid shot, and kept her overnight (she's a blastomycosis survivor so she gets a bit more oversight than the other dog).

The other dog has been bitten by a cottonmouth and a copperhead. She's fine with a couple of Benadryl.

I wish the solution would be so simple for people.

We took a Celtic Lands cruise several years ago and one of the passengers was an old country vet from either Alabama or Georgia. He's told all of his friends if he ever gets snake bit to take him home to get DMSO and a gun. The DMSO was to put on the snake bite and the gun was to shoot anyone who wanted to wash it off.


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## Cotton (Oct 12, 2013)

tsrwivey said:


> Snake bite is a concern for us as well & could very well be fatal if you couldn't get the victim to a hospital. I have that book so I need to look & make sure I have the necessary herbs. I also need to research the modern medicine treatment of snake bite, see if I can acquire any of those meds, then make a kit & instructions for it's use. Thanks for posting!


Yes indeed, a very serious subject and a great risk in a grid down situation.

Here is a report by the National Institute of Health on herbal treatment of snake bites... Its global in aspect but interesting...
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3388772/

One herb I didn't have the other week was Echinacea, long used by our native peoples for snake bite. I'm working to remedy this situation. Here are a couple of write ups on echinacea if anyone is interested.
http://www.hawthornehillherbs.com/node/192
http://vitalanimal.com/rattlesnake-vaccine/


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

Living where I do with many rattlesnakes and hiking as much as I do I did buy one of these Sawyer Extractor Pumps. They supposedly help but need to be used immediately or they are ineffective. Snake bite with injection would likely be fatal for humans when no hospital was readily available. Even now with the best care humans often need skin grafts and other care after they survive the venom itself.
Best answer is do not play with snakes, don't walk at night, watch where you put your feet and hands.

http://www.amazon.com/Sawyer-Extractor-Pump-Bite-Sting/dp/B00D454AWC


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## bogey (Aug 10, 2015)

Country Living said:


> We took a Celtic Lands cruise several years ago and one of the passengers was an old country vet from either Alabama or Georgia. He's told all of his friends if he ever gets snake bit to take him home to get DMSO and a gun. The DMSO was to put on the snake bite and the gun was to shoot anyone who wanted to wash it off.


Interesting stuff DMSO. Did some cursory research years ago about it. Forgot most of what I read and I need to read it again. Have some personal experiences with it that are pretty impressive IMHO. Has been used for years on animals, especially racehorses, for strains and sprains.

Have had it used on me for a sprained ankle years ago. Have also had it used for burns. Really amazing results. Much care must be taken that no chemicals or meds are on the area or the material applying it as it is an excellent carrier. Gives you an awful taste in the mouth for hours. Almost immediately. But totally worth the taste.


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## txcatlady (Sep 26, 2013)

My daughter was bitten by a copperhead on her great toe. The local ER didn't know what to do because she swelled so badly up to the hip and vomiting. He called for life flight to Texas Children's. That crew popped another IV and loaded her up. They pushed the fluids in pediatric intensive care for 3 1/2 days. No other meds. Pulled first IV and the next day the other and sent her home. She was 11 years old at the time. She wears shoes outside now at 33. My grandmothers copperhead bite was iced for 6 hours inER and sent home. Not familiar with what to do on other bites. See coral snakes but just move them on across road. Few Rattlesnakes. Have been chased by a coachwhip before.


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## txcatlady (Sep 26, 2013)

Daughter 3 copperhead bite was at night at a friends house. Daughter 4 was bitten by a hog nosed snake at the age of 4 1/2 in our yard requiring getting a tetanus shot and another at the age of 5 because of school requirements. No worries, just watch for infection.


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