# Not sure which wheat to store? Input please



## neldarez (Apr 10, 2011)

Here's my dilema.....we have started putting away whole wheat and then as I read recipes they say you can't just cook with wheat flour you also need white flour. hmmm , so, I can't grind and make white flour so we started buying bags of white flour. Grain lasts much much longer than flour, we have bought our mill........this is really confusing to me actually. We want to store what we will need for down the road..so, to all of you who grind and use your own grains, could you please give me advice. Should we store dry corn also? oat groats? but what about the white flour, mine in the bag is bleached, enriched, ( the dust that is left over after they're done processing!) Help please


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## Genevieve (Sep 21, 2009)

I store hard red wheat and hard white wheat. Those are the two used for everything but cakes and pastries. Soft white wheat is used for cakes and pastries.
I use a one to one mix of red and white wheat for grinding to make my breads and biscuits and such. When using the whole wheat, you'll have to add some vital wheat gluten to the flour to get a good rise when baking breads. I also like adding some dough enhancer. Gives it a nice texture.

Some folks like a little more red wheat for the slightly more "tangy" flavor it has. We like the one to one mix. *shrugs*

I store 50# bags of popcorn. It grinds up to make a terrific cornmeal ( who'da thunk it huh?)
Oatgroats are the whole version of rolled oats. You can either gind them slightly to use for cereals or get a "flaker" to roll them flat. You can also roll wheat I think for mixing cereals. But grinding some on a course setting and adding the grinded oats makes a very hearty hot cereal for in the winter.


I've read where if you put the flour in mylar and O2's it'll last for about 5 years if kept cool. I'm using up a bucket of flour I stored back in '09' just to get it gone so I can continue with the whole wheat and grinding.


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## weedygarden (Apr 27, 2011)

I totally agree that this is confusing.

One thing though, are you using any wheat currently? The recommendation is to store what you eat and eat what you store. When we live busy lives, it is easier to buy readymade goods. It is a test for when times could require this.

Wheat: Red vs White; Spring vs Winter | The Fresh Loaf

According to this article, and I concur, the preference is individual.

I think getting set up to grind enough wheat and making at least a loaf of bread once a week would give you some practice. If you have to dig everything out, that in and of itself is work.

I started, 37 years ago, grinding wheat in a neighbors basement where they had their electric grinder set up. Several neighbors used their grinder and they had a great set up. My electric grinder is not light and I do not want to carry it around. I set it up so that it is plugged in. All I have to do is pour in some wheat, turn it on, set the catch pan underneath it and I am good to go. For a long time, I didn't have it set up like this, and guess what? I never ground wheat and never made bread.

I like to make bread from scratch, but it is work! I was given a breadmaker and although I prefer bread that is made by hand, the breadmaker sure does make bread making easier. It takes so little time and energy for a busy person like me.

As far as whether you need white flour or not, I think it is a good idea to keep trying and testing. I use a whole wheat recipe that calls for 4 cups of wheat flour. I use 3 cups of wheat flour and 1 cup of white purchased flour.

I have had a couple loaves of bread flop. It was just bread, I tried again. I also like to try different recipes.

There is a yahoo group for breadmakers you can join to get ideas. You have to have a yahoo account (free and easy) to join and request membership to the group.

bread-machine : Bread Machine Club

Good luck!


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## neldarez (Apr 10, 2011)

thanks guys, I didn't know about the vital gluten stuff........if I use 1/2 hard white and 1/2 hard red do I still have to use the vital gluten stuff? Aren't the white and red the same thing except different color wheat? I have ground red wheat and mixed it with store bought white flour to make bread....tastes great. BUT...I want to grind as much stuff as I can so the grinder investment is worth while....ya know what I mean? I have never made anything from cornmeal either ( use jiffy cornbread mix in a box) so I just bought me a bag of cornmeal to try out..... My biggest question though is if I have to buy storebought white wheat...... I loved the input about the popcorn! I've been looking at the oat flaker that goes with the machine, it is $84. more dollars to buy that.........is it cheaper to just put away tons of oatmeal? From what I read, grain stores much much longer than after ground, crushed, or whatever. Thanks so much for the input and all that is still to come!!! :flower:


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## Genevieve (Sep 21, 2009)

Yea. You need the vital wheat gluten. Now if you don't use it, your bread will just be denser and not as light and airy as say a white flour bread. But, I mean bread is bread. Just cut it thinner lol Thats what I've done before when it didn't rise as much as usual. LOL

Yes the whole grain will last/store longer. The ground oat groats are more like Irish steel cut oats for cereals. More chewier and heartier. Takes a little more time to cook than something rolled flat.

I didn't bother with a flaker. I just plan on grinding my oat groats. I did buy a 15# bag of rolled oats that I keep in a food grade bucket right now, but I use them all the time in the cooler months. I use it for the hubby's fruit crisps that make him for his breaks at work right now, so I go thru alot of them. They get rotated out alot around here, so I don't worry about them going "bad" lol


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## Moose33 (Jan 1, 2011)

Genevieve: I use a one to one mix of red and white wheat for grinding to make my breads and biscuits and such. When using the whole wheat, you'll have to add some vital wheat gluten to the flour to get a good rise when baking breads.

Hi Genevieve,
I've made a bit of bread over the years but never with flour I've ground myself. I take it from your comment that if I mix the hard red and hard white about 50-50 I don't need to add gluten. If I use hard red only the gluten helps it rise. Do I have that right?
Thank you !
Moose


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## Genevieve (Sep 21, 2009)

I still add the vital wheat gluten to get a good rise. You don't have to add it all, I just do. I also add a dough enhancer. Gives it a good texture.


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## kejmack (May 17, 2011)

I use mostly hard red wheat. An important thing that is often overlooked is your grinder. You need a really good quality grinder to grind flour fine enough for cakes and the like.


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## efbjr (Oct 20, 2008)

*Alternative...*



Genevieve said:


> I still add the vital wheat gluten to get a good rise. You don't have to add it all, I just do. I also add a dough enhancer. Gives it a good texture.


I read this tip in a bread machine cookbook. Add about 1 tablespoon of lemon juice (Orange juice works too) for every 2 cups of flour, to stimulate the production of wheat gluten. I have tried this with white flour bread and whole wheat/rye breads (1 cup of whole wheat/rye flour to 3 cups white) mixtures.

It seems to work, you cant taste the juice in the finished product, and the loaves really fluff up! :2thumb: I suspect the acidity of the juice has something to do with it, maybe vinegar would work too, but I haven't worked up the nerve to try using it yet! :gaah:


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## boomer (Jul 13, 2011)

I have been using all red spring wheat ground in a VitaMix and then add 'no additive' unbleached flour. And, I use vinegar as a dough enhancer, works fine.

As far as the wheat is concerned perhaps the best bet is the stuff that is produced the closest. For us it is spring red. That way 2 years worth is all that is needed and if necessary it can be used as seed to grow your own.


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## catsraven (Jan 25, 2010)

I use hard red and soft white. If the recipe calls for 4 cups white flour I use 4 cups soft white. Never had a problem with it.


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## neldarez (Apr 10, 2011)

Boomer, what kind of vinegar and how much? what does that even mean, dough enhancer? Thanks a lot.......I appreciate so much when you guys share your knowledge.


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## boomer (Jul 13, 2011)

neldarez said:


> Boomer, what kind of vinegar and how much? what does that even mean, dough enhancer? Thanks a lot.......I appreciate so much when you guys share your knowledge.


Dough enhancers are a number of things and if you are wondering which ones do what then find the ingredients on a bag of flour at the store and then google them. Apparently some of them are made from ingredients and processes that some of us find gross and are not willing to eat.

Vinegar or lemon juice etc are simply acidifying agents that appear to assist the yeast with rising the dough. The books say about a tablespoon per cup of flour. I just dump some in when I am making bread, pizza crust, burrito shells; whatever, and I use whichever is the handiest. If you know the relative pH to lemon juice of what you keep in stock you can roughly adjust volume to get the pH within the desired range.

I also use a slow raise method (overnight on the kitchen counter) for at least the first raise and much less yeast (traditional) at approximately 1 teaspoon per loaf.

Yeasted breads are very forgiving once you have had some practice so you know the tactile feel of what you are aiming for.


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## Meerkat (May 31, 2011)

neldarez said:


> Boomer, what kind of vinegar and how much? what does that even mean, dough enhancer? Thanks a lot.......I appreciate so much when you guys share your knowledge.


 I wish I could help but I know nothing about wheat.So I'll just bump you up.
When my flour is gone,I'll just grind up squash or something for bread,that is usually a big crop.I do try to buy baking powder,soda and store it.Maybe soem yeast too.


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## neldarez (Apr 10, 2011)

Meerkat said:


> I wish I could help but I know nothing about wheat.So I'll just bump you up.
> When my flour is gone,I'll just grind up squash or something for bread,that is usually a big crop.I do try to buy baking powder,soda and store it.Maybe soem yeast too.


hey there Meerkat........well, I bet ya this same time next year I'll know quite a bit about wheat............don't ya think.?? squash bread huh? I make zucchini bread a lot but I also have flour....I think I need to just keep this simple........I do good with simple.:2thumb:


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