# Could use advice and thoughts



## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

This topics covers several so I'm just gonna put it in this forum.

As most of you know I got married this year. It's been amazing and I have never been happier. So my wife and I are discussing the life we would like to lead and what that looks like for us. My wife is completely on board with prepping but moving to the country and homesteading not so much. I certainly care about my wife's happiness and want her to be as happy as possible no matter how we choose to build our life together. She has exactly zero experience with country living and I think the thought of country living to her means isolation, hard work, and boredom. Also, all of both of our families (including 2 sets of parents at the age of 70) live within a 20 mile radius so moving is a tough sell for both of us. We believe that my folks will eventually live with us and her folks would need to be close if not on the same property which means access to amenities like good medical care will be very important. 

Our current property is your typical suburban way too much house on an oddly shaped lot less than a half acre that is unusable due to an HOA. We could have a garden but we would have to spend a good deal of money to avoid HOA attacks and at any point in the future a new HOA leadership could require us to cease and desist. We could never have animals besides normal pets. We also live north of Atlanta and close enough to the northern exfill route to be concerning. However we do not have bottlenecks that would make a bug out unfeasible. The property values in our area prohibit finding a somewhat hidden 3-5 acres in our are with a house that would work for us and would still have to bug out if we did and something happened. If we could get most of the family to move with us moving may be an easier proposition but that does seem unlikely. 

My ideal scenario would be to move to the country and operate a small farm (by small i mean more of a hobby farm of a 2-10 acres) while I continue with my real estate career. Being a half hour from a population center with good medical infrastructure would be important but I would like to live in a low population density area and off the beaten path for obvious reasons.
We have considered a couple areas in the southeast that we like for later in life but that doesn't solve the shorter term concerns as being able to do that is some years off. 

Due to our family concerns and my wife's reluctance to make the big jump to moving we are considering moving locally and putting an emphasis on prepping, a bug out scenario with my hunting leases as a bol, and having a property that we can garden and raise chickens, rabbits and bees to practice skills we we may need to apply in the future. Being a small scale "suburban homesteader" is a lame band aid at best in my opinion. This really makes me nervous because obviously the best case scenario is to live and build for long term self sufficiency. My wife has health concerns that make too much physical exertion and stress a factor to avoid and she also has diet concerns that are important. Therefore, being on the move in difficult situations would be undesirable. On the other hand I've always considered it important to prepare for nothing happening as a part of prepping for all eventualities so quality of life is important. We are also approaching 40 so how long do I really want to put off moving? Considering our age and the state of the country sooner is better than later in my opinion.

I could write for far longer but I think that's enough for now. Any thoughts or advice is appreciated and maybe a discussion on this will bring to light something I hadn't thought of and help me solidify a course of action my wife and I can be comfortable with. If we get a good one going I'll try and get my wife on here to add any of her perspective I may have missed or glossed over.


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## Caribou (Aug 18, 2012)

Tough one. With family in their seventies you are unlikely to move them from their home with a pry bar. We recently moved and being close to medical attention was a factor in that decision. I can see where moving away could be a problem with medical conditions and it will only get worse.

Two ideas come to mind. First, a BOL. It may be called the lake house, or the cabin, or a number of other names. Primarily a weekend getaway.

Second, find a local home with an oversized lot, and more importantly, NO HOA. I walked away from more than one place when we found out that there was an HOA. This place had originally been set up with an HOA but it had been dissolved.


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

A bol would be great but as of right now cost prohibitive. I don't think we can downsize enough to an acceptable home and property and free up that much cash. No HOA and an oversized lot will certainly be my preference if we move. My wife owned this home before we were married. It's not something we would have chosen now. The bug out plan is along the lines of a travel trailer and a hunting lease that has farmland and a well.


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## ZoomZoom (Dec 18, 2009)

Do you have a particular direction (from Atlanta) that you want to go?

It's been awhile but as I recall, I liked the area towards Gainesville and Lake Lanier. Gainesville would offer you the medical, shopping and other needs but you can get pretty rural pretty quickly.

I'd consider something that's as close to "turnkey" as you can. You don't want to overwhelm yourself or the Mrs. with everything. Get used to the idea that it's going to take time to get everything you want up and running (gardens, animals...).


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

We prefer the northwest route of Atlanta. Gainesville and lake Lanier is booming like the rest of Metro atlanta. Even if we did find a few acres 30 minutes north or west from our current location odds are we would find ourselves smack in the middle of suburbia 5 years from now. Good point about taking it slow. We definitely want the chance to "grow into" whatever we find.


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## Caribou (Aug 18, 2012)

How does the wife feel about selling her home? The recent marriage, the house being hers prior to the marriage, medical problems that are complicated by stress, you have some issues to deal with here.


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## Meerkat (May 31, 2011)

Most of my family lives in North Central Ga.. Not far from where you are now.

I'm from Atlanta and the truth is many areas are getting less safe with time. So where ever you go be sure and check out the area both day and night to se whats going on. I don't see this changign in a possitive way. :surrender:

Lots of problems with newly arriving immigrants from legal and illegal immigrants. Many Somalians have moved into the areas. Gangs and crime types. NOT being negative just know what I see when we visit.

Last stay at upscale n-hood where daughter lives they have lots of problems with hispanic robbing and casing the hoods. Hubby was in our bus in her driveway last July havign bad pain night at 4am. Here comes this hispanic man who didn't see him trying to break into daughters Lexus. This thug is still on the run.

Month prior 4 were males were breaking in homes in her subdivivsion and were caught. Knowing the insanity probably let go.

I still think this is one of the safer areas in Ga right now. I loved downtown Atlanta but it no longer exist.

Go to census and see what areas in N. Georgia have the lowest population of minority. This is not racist or prejudice its just common sense survival.

[Sometimes doom and gllom can be healthy.]


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## Meerkat (May 31, 2011)

Not all minority are thugs but we have the most divided nation now. And even the good ones have families who may not be so good. 

We thought of rentign but considered we won't just be dealing with tenants, but their families too. And their are also bad whites like a couple in my own family who will rob you blind given a chance. But the majority of crime is still minority.


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

Caribou said:


> How does the wife feel about selling her home? The recent marriage, the house being hers prior to the marriage, medical problems that are complicated by stress, you have some issues to deal with here.


The wife is on board for moving locally. She is pretty excited about being able to explore the prepper related hobbies we have developed and get into some new ones. She may not be down for homesteading in the country but I am fortunate to have a wife that is on board and supportive with everything but that.


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

Meerkat said:


> Most of my family lives in North Central Ga.. Not far from where you are now.
> 
> I'm from Atlanta and the truth is many areas are getting less safe with time. So where ever you go be sure and check out the area both day and night to se whats going on. I don't see this changign in a possitive way. :surrender:
> 
> ...


We have considered some areas to the north of us. We like Chatsworth and ellijay. The problem with that is amenities. Not a strong medical structure out there. While there is a hospital here and there they are pretty limited so anytime anyone in the family needed anything but basic care we would be driving into atlanta anyway. Also, due to my wife's health she doesn't drive on the highway or really any longer car drives. So be8ng anywhere but local makes no difference to her. The 4 hours from Asheville would be no different in isolation than the hour and a half from ellijay (much to my frustration) for her. That area and the cohutta are my fishing and camping stomping grounds though


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## backlash (Nov 11, 2008)

My wife's sister and her husband move a couple of hours away from everyone.
They are now in their 70s.
Now they both have serious medical problems, can't drive long distances and have nobody close.
It is a nightmare for them and others.
They are now looking to move back close to family but it will be difficult.

You can plan for a SHTF or TEOTWAWKI and that may or may not happen, probably not.
What will happen guaranteed is you will get old and need medical care.
My Aunt and Uncle sold their farm and moved into town.
I thought that was crazy. They had a really nice place that they had built themselves.
Now I can see the wisdom in their decision.
My only advice is to plan for the future you know will have.
You are only in your 30s now but in a short time you will wake up and ask yourself how did I get so old so fast. I ask myself that all the time.
Good luck.


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

backlash said:


> My wife's sister and her husband move a couple of hours away from everyone.
> They are now in their 70s.
> Now they both have serious medical problems, can't drive long distances and have nobody close.
> It is a nightmare for them and others.
> ...


That is great perspective and a lot of what we are discussing as we work through these decisions. The medical care and also amenities that improve quality of life (we like to go to a nice restaurant from time to time) are important not only for family but us as well.


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## Caribou (Aug 18, 2012)

In my forties I sold my ranch style house and bought a two story. In our sixties we bought another ranch. It is a whole lot nicer today and ten years from now it will be a necessity. 

I do wish we had a basement. Much of our preps are in the garage and I would like a more private area.


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## Meerkat (May 31, 2011)

CrackbottomLouis said:


> We have considered some areas to the north of us. We like Chatsworth and ellijay. The problem with that is amenities. Not a strong medical structure out there. While there is a hospital here and there they are pretty limited so anytime anyone in the family needed anything but basic care we would be driving into atlanta anyway. Also, due to my wife's health she doesn't drive on the highway or really any longer car drives. So be8ng anywhere but local makes no difference to her. The 4 hours from Asheville would be no different in isolation than the hour and a half from ellijay (much to my frustration) for her. That area and the cohutta are my fishing and camping stomping grounds though


 We went to a mule and donkey show in Chatsworth 20 yr.s ago. Nice area then.

yes its hard to live in the woods when you have health problems. Many times I thought I'd die before we made it to town. We used the fire department a couple times, they have emergency techs. MY BP was high and hubby rushed me to fire dept instead of tryign to make it to the hospital.

I hope you find a great place soon. I have moved into some places that I later regreted. Once bought a house and found out it was in hell. Kids got attacked on bus and walking to and from school everyday. Moved out lost $5,000 in a couple months back in the 70s when forced bussing started.

Now if we moved we'd case the place.


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## Genevieve (Sep 21, 2009)

First of all hon get out and away from the HOA. geesh I have never heard of any HOA not flooded with self important idiots in it lol

There should be something with a couple of acres you can find. We live 20 mins( depending on who you get behind driving) from a major town with a new medical center ( cath lab, good cancer center, nicu,etc) and we're quite "rural" but this is WV and I have no idea what its like there were you are.

No HOA and you can have a couple of chickens and some extra critters ( depending on county codes). That way the wife could be eased into "country" living

One step at a time


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## TheLazyL (Jun 5, 2012)

CrackbottomLouis said:


> ...both of our families (including 2 sets of parents at the age of 70) live within a 20 mile radius so moving is a tough sell ...a half hour from ... good medical infrastructure ...My wife has health concerns that make too much physical exertion and stress a factor to avoid and she also has diet concerns that are important....We are also approaching 40 so how long do I really want to put off moving?...
> 
> ...Any thoughts or advice is appreciated and maybe a discussion on this will bring to light something I hadn't thought of and help me solidify a course of action my wife and I can be comfortable with.....


Can we agree in an ideal situation:

1. We have a week's notice before a SHTF/TEOTWAWKI/End of Rule of Law event?

2. The ideal location would be isolated, well secured and protected in a secret location with all the amenities needed for 100 plus years?

Unless we know a reliable Prophet #1 isn't going to happen.

Unless we have unlimited resources #2 isn't going to happen either.

Throw into the mix aged parents, health concerns and ain't getting any younger.

My advise is this;  Do the best you can with the cards life has dealt to you.

In my situation, we both have aged parents and the wife can not accept moving. My viable solution (for the cards dealt to me) is we will be a half way stocking up point for our children. The odds are against my survival but I'll do what I can to help my children to survive!

HOA. There is a way to deal with them. Takes time and you can't be too vocal about it. Get elected as a HOA Official. The gradually get like mind residents elected too. Then relax or change the laws! If you can't beat them from outside, join them and beat them from within!


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## Meerkat (May 31, 2011)

Genevieve said:


> First of all hon get out and away from the HOA. geesh I have never heard of any HOA not flooded with self important idiots in it lol
> 
> There should be something with a couple of acres you can find. We live 20 mins( depending on who you get behind driving) from a major town with a new medical center ( cath lab, good cancer center, nicu,etc) and we're quite "rural" but this is WV and I have no idea what its like there were you are.
> 
> ...


 So true! This was HOA when we moved here we all turned into dictators! 

Covenants went out and we closed that sucker down. We now are all being friendly again. Even had a n-hood watch meeeting last year.

Even the county now has some really bad restrictions in code enforcemnet laws.

All the solar we bought now they are trying to stop civilians from using it ,have to use corporations to install. Ammendment will be passed in Nov.2016.

BLM, UN and others now control most of our land. :surrender:


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## Meerkat (May 31, 2011)

TheLazyL said:


> Can we agree in an ideal situation:
> 
> 1. We have a week's notice before a SHTF/TEOTWAWKI/End of Rule of Law event?
> 
> ...


 To a certain degree I agree. We can run but we can't hide. May as well live where your happy long as you can.

Just be careful when choosing the best under circumstances.


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

It seems for me the ideal situation is a different property in my area with no hoa and the space to garden and have a couple critters with a bol I think I can get to in a bad situation if I pay attention enough to leave in a timely manner. As the bol isn't possible now changing property and focusing on a mobile bug out plan with a hunting lease i know well that no one will kick me off of with farmland and a well, a travel trailer(because I guarantee my wife won't stay in our rather smelly and small hunting cabin), seeds and a bunch of goods is probably a good interim plan till I can get a bol. That plan is within our resources and something my wife is comfortable with. Finding the right property will be key but as I'm a realtor I think I have a good shot at getting close. I'll see what I can find. I've already been looking and prices are high around here. Gonna be hard to stick to the budget. I just hope the day doesn't come that I'm kicking myself for not insisting we get out of dodge now. Oh well. No crystal ball. I'm sure my wife and I aren't the only ones that find themselves with these dilemmas. Only problem with my hunting lease is its in South GA and it is unbelievably hot there with no ac. Good growing season though and a lot of it is working farmland. At least I know several ways to get there that avoids population centers.


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## Starcreek (Feb 4, 2015)

My 2 cents.....

Your parents probably have another 10-20 years ahead of them, granted with declining health as they go. You are young enough to start over anywhere.

Living in a small-town/rural area is not NEARLY as isolated as most people think. It's a smaller scale of social activity, but you can have as much or as little as you want. Plus, most small town/rural areas are within an hour's drive of a large metro area where you would have first-class medical care and all the amenities.

I don't know if you've visited Chattanooga, Athens, Rome, or Lagrange, but all those are within 1-2 hours of Atlanta.

I highly recommend getting moved to a new location now, while you're still young enough to make an easy transition. Start having family gatherings at your new place as soon as you get settled in. When your parents see the peace and quiet, the beautiful scenery.....and their children in the new place, they might consider relocating. I know several older people who have done that very thing.

While I grew up in Atlanta, I would never live there now -- too crowded, too much crime, too easily trapped within the perimeter if a shtf incident happens.

Chattanooga is a truly beautiful city, with museums, medical centers (Erlanger is the big one), a baseball team, one of the most beautiful aquariums I've ever seen, and the Tennessee River running right through the downtown area.

Good luck. But I wouldn't wait too long to move.


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## shawn_c2000 (Jul 18, 2016)

Up near Calhoun isn't bad if you can save money by cutting living expenses that more for prepping"I mean her shopping at the outlet mall in Calhoun) just let her know less expenses = happier life plus it's not terribly far from atl


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## Viking (Mar 16, 2009)

I highly recommend making a move while you are still young. I'll be 74 in a few days and still in good health, strength and of a clear mind, but I doubt very much if we'd want to start from square one by moving to an even more secure property than where we are now, too much sweat equity in what we already have and we aren't willing to go through all that it would take to get to where we are now. Yes I know that family is important to the both of you, but in the long run, so is your security and survivability.


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## Sentry18 (Aug 5, 2012)

I am in a similar situation, living in a small city with an established BOL and a respite half way between here and there. It is not ideal, but it is a good compromise. And a happy marriage often relies on compromise. I have found ways to make it work and she has found ways to be part of the solution. Plus it definitely falls into my belief that I will never need any of my preps or plans, but that they are in place for the same reason I have a fire extinguisher in the garage. Just in case.


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## readytogo (Apr 6, 2013)

Many have already express their thought's on the subject and is a good one ,moving is a big responsibility especially at an old age; health ,without family or close friends to count on , and in my point of view medical attention is primal ,in my case I would need a VA facility near ,my driving days are limited and then family issues ,I`m still watching over my two daughters ,they are not quite ready to be alone and to be honest I like my neighborhood and I`m to old to start a new life or change .I may buy something else for a weekend get away or wintering but is a big undertaking .


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## Meerkat (May 31, 2011)

shawn_c2000 said:


> Up near Calhoun isn't bad if you can save money by cutting living expenses that more for prepping"I mean her shopping at the outlet mall in Calhoun) just let her know less expenses = happier life plus it's not terribly far from atl


 I haven't been to Calhoun in decades. I do miss Atlanta area so. To me Peachtree Street was he most beautiful city in the nation.

And The Varsity was the best restaurant. 6 generations of my family ate at that downtown restaurant. Its still open today. Many presidents have visited it and their pictures are on the wall. Its been 2 years since I went there. The servers are not as nice as they use to be, curb or inside.


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## Caribou (Aug 18, 2012)

When we started looking for this house the wife set the parameter of an hour from the airport. This was to make her trips home to visit family easier. It also placed us less that an hour from the two major hospitals in the State. As it turned out one of these hospitals has a smaller campus fifteen minutes from here.

Here is one way to narrow your search. Figure out how far you are willing to drive from the furthest parents home. Draw two circle on a map representing that distance with one parents home at the center of each circle. Figure out how far you are willing to be from your doctor or a hospital of your required quality and draw another circle. Anything in or very near all three circles is your primary target area. It was easy for us as we only had one parameter and one road so we just drove out for an hour and started looking for places closer or not too much further. Rumor has it that Saudi Arabia shut down two wells when we quit looking and bought this place.


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

Starcreek and Viking brought up the other side of the coin though. Part of my nagging doubt that leads me to believe that there will never be a better time to move farther out and build up a property than now. I'll never be younger, never have as much energy, never have as much time ahead of me etc. If I could get the wife on board I would. I don't think the family will move. If something does go down everyone will be willing to move out to the country right when it's too late. Guess I'll just work on the plan and try and sell enough houses to get that bol. Would be nice to make the jump from prepping to homesteading though.


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## BillS (May 30, 2011)

It's hard when someone has a specialized medical condition and they're 100 miles from adequate medical care. My late first wife was a former kidney transplant patient on dialysis. It was impossible to get good care locally. I don't know how many times we drove the 100 miles over country roads to Madison and back. 

I remember one time I was driving back from there on a Friday night. I don't know how else to describe it except to say that I had fallen asleep and then woke up not knowing where we were. I'd driven past our normal turnoff without knowing it and ended up going to the next city. Having to drive when you're exhausted is something you experience when you have to drive far in pursuit of medical care. Especially when you have to leave when you're already past your normal bedtime.


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## Tirediron (Jul 12, 2010)

The homestead life come with a lot of extra work and a lot less free time, I think that if a person can find a location that is close enough to the place that you need to go to often, and if possible has room for a kitchen garden. The rural life includes a lot of un seen extra things to look after all of the time. the well, the septic what ever live stock. 

Skills in my opinion are more important, because unless things work out right you may not be at your homestead or BOL when SHTF and be unable to get there. 
I never thought that "civilization" would last this long, who knows maybe it will continue to limp along for decades, Skills and simple tools to make a PAW world more comfortable without having to loose all of "civilization's" amenities seems to me like a better balance.


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## Meerkat (May 31, 2011)

Tirediron said:


> The homestead life come with a lot of extra work and a lot less free time, I think that if a person can find a location that is close enough to the place that you need to go to often, and if possible has room for a kitchen garden. The rural life includes a lot of un seen extra things to look after all of the time. the well, the septic what ever live stock.
> 
> Skills in my opinion are more important, because unless things work out right you may not be at your homestead or BOL when SHTF and be unable to get there.
> I never thought that "civilization" would last this long, who knows maybe it will continue to limp along for decades, Skills and simple tools to make a PAW world more comfortable without having to loose all of "civilization's" amenities seems to me like a better balance.


 You got that right!


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

BillS said:


> It's hard when someone has a specialized medical condition and they're 100 miles from adequate medical care. My late first wife was a former kidney transplant patient on dialysis. It was impossible to get good care locally. I don't know how many times we drove the 100 miles over country roads to Madison and back.
> 
> I remember one time I was driving back from there on a Friday night. I don't know how else to describe it except to say that I had fallen asleep and then woke up not knowing where we were. I'd driven past our normal turnoff without knowing it and ended up going to the next city. Having to drive when you're exhausted is something you experience when you have to drive far in pursuit of medical care. Especially when you have to leave when you're already past your normal bedtime.


That's the kind of thing that worries me with 2 sets of parents we are close with at the age of 70 that will need us.


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

Tirediron said:


> The homestead life come with a lot of extra work and a lot less free time, I think that if a person can find a location that is close enough to the place that you need to go to often, and if possible has room for a kitchen garden. The rural life includes a lot of un seen extra things to look after all of the time. the well, the septic what ever live stock.
> 
> Skills in my opinion are more important, because unless things work out right you may not be at your homestead or BOL when SHTF and be unable to get there.
> I never thought that "civilization" would last this long, who knows maybe it will continue to limp along for decades, Skills and simple tools to make a PAW world more comfortable without having to loose all of "civilization's" amenities seems to me like a better balance.


Yup. I have worked on farms for several years (about as rural as you can get as I was farming tobacco in Zimbabwe) and found I quite enjoyed the work and life. They don't allow much farm machinery in the country there because they have too many people that needs the jobs machinery replaces so hard labor was the order of the day. Im not sure it would be up my wife's alley though. I think going for the balance approach you mentioned would be more fair for her. I don't care where I live as long as she is happy and safe just trying to make the best decision towards that goal.


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