# Drought USA



## rugster (Mar 2, 2014)

How bad is the water issue in the USA.

-33.5 % of the USA is in drought status 
-82% of California is experiencing "extreme" or "exceptional" drought
-Groundwater losses from the Colorado River basin is beyond replenishing 
-The Ogallala is being used at irreplaceable rates as are many small aquifers

Food price spikes and shortages just around the corner ?

-Colorado basin 
http://gizmodo.com/nasa-made-an-underground-water-map-to-see-just-how-bad-1610315490

http://news.yahoo.com/satellites-show-major-southwest-groundwater-105431089.html

-California's the Central Valley aquifer and it's primary agricultural region

http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news.php?release=2009-194

The Ogallala

http://www.livescience.com/39186-kansas-aquifer-water-depletion.html

http://www.motherearthnews.com/natu...llala-aquifer-ze0z1305zwar.aspx#axzz38UfOB8Pg


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## readytogo (Apr 6, 2013)

U.S. meat, seafood prices rising on drought and disease: USDA
http://news.msn.com/us/us-meat-seafood-prices-rising-on-drought-and-disease-usda:gaah:


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## JayJay (Nov 23, 2010)

And this:
http://www.thedailysheeple.com/parc...lications-for-western-u-s-water-supply_072014


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## Davarm (Oct 22, 2011)

About all we can do is to adapt and keep on trucken.


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

I wonder if all the water that has been pumped out of the ground there through the years anything to do with all the small earthquakes in Oklahoma?


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

The amount of water on earth remains constant. We dont have a water shortage we have an overpopulation problem. The only thing that changes with the amount of water on earth is where the water resides.


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## machinist (Jul 4, 2012)

Yeah! The big problem out west is that people settled an area that is, and always has been, too arid to support very many people. Kind of like we settled a lot of people in New Orleans BELOW sea level. Like we settled over 27,700 people per square mile in New York City. 

This will not end well.


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

We are quickly outstripping our resources. We keep beating back mother natures corrections with our meds and tech. The only problem is the people aware enough and intelligent enough to realise this are the people we would benefit most from breeding. Ever seen Idiocracy? Underrated movie. When we run out of water we can just use gatorade. It has electrolytes


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## Tweto (Nov 26, 2011)

The city of Phoenix is working on a program to encourage people to move out, because of the water shortage.

The rest of us will really feel this fresh water shortage starting this fall due to increases in food prices. The increases that we are seeing now is scratching the surface.


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

> The city of Phoenix is working on a program to encourage people to move out, because of the water shortage.


First I have heard of that. Most of its water comes from in-state surface water. I think across the west (and everywhere) the biggest problem is those using water from deep underground which can not be replaced.


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## Tweto (Nov 26, 2011)

hiwall said:


> First I have heard of that. Most of its water comes from in-state surface water. I think across the west (and everywhere) the biggest problem is those using water from deep underground which can not be replaced.


There have been several articles the last week about how depleted the under ground water supply is. They said that it is 4 times worse then they thought.


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## nightwing (Jul 26, 2014)

Rain fall here has been good this year and spotty in some previous years.
The problem with the patterns is we have not been tracking it long enough 
to know the real levels.
I know that successful native tribes moved with the herds of buffalo.
tribes that built with stone and took up residence have disappeared and or
may have integrated with other tribes.
Their impact on the land was low because there were so few of them concentrated for very long in a given area.

I can see where concentrated population and transportation system have
created a false sense of plenty in areas that will never be able to sustain 
dense populations with water or locally grown foods.

New York is like many other cities they exist off of most every thing they did not grow as a port city they can funnel off enough to sustain the population.
each city will eventually face it's mortality from many issues like Water, 
sewage treatment, garbage, clean air and a real limiting factor disease.
immunologist and Big pharma realize that we hit a wall and new more 
virulent strains will face us.
I think they can eventually overcome each problem but dense populations 
could be severely impacted because lack of water or expensive water.
breeds a lack of sanitary cleaning and disposal of waste.

What may happen in some areas will be, the use of treated sea water 
our technology could make that possible in cities like New York 
They are dead zones anyway (no farming little vegetation) 
it could be used for cleaning and waste disposal freeing up and 
shifting the burden of fresh water treatment.

One problem water like any other needed element is limited, while the 
source is bountiful the populations grow if that bounty is diminished
an immediate effect will occur.
We can see from Africa the food that many other countries provided 
added into their own food sources increased the population.
Drought and use has changed some regions in to a desert the populations leave to the cities that could barley sustain themselves are inundated
with refuges from impacted areas.
This puts a strain on the local infrastructure including water supply.
and then the whole thing starts again.

There are deep water resources the problem will be like oil the cost to 
reach and treat them extract by condensation or desalinate each has its own inherit dangers to the land here is where GMO may come in handy to 
alter food crops to tolerate a high saline environment.

but for each solution another problem sewage and garbage from 
a new found increase in water would increase populations and each would need 
larger and more facilities to treat and recycle.
Even that will only forestall the problems even if there are no disease, wars 
or natural disasters the amount of refuse alone will crush us.
I would give an example of the disney movie Wally or Walle.
Ii may seem distant but vegetable scraps in a city the size of New York
if used by farmers for fertilizer would like their garbage have to be trucked 
many miles and it takes time to break down into usable loamy soil.
now more fuel used & more impact and road degradation added to an already
herculean amount of money and resources to fix our failing roads and bridges.
OMG just thinking about all this gives me a headache.

There is one positive I will have lived the good life and be long dead 
but if the younger generation wants any possibility of living the good life 
they better hit the ground running looking for real long term solutions.
like living on the moon LOL.


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## Woody (Nov 11, 2008)

I've done some thinking on this, over the years, as one 'drought crisis' after another makes the news. I don't believe the problem is lack of water, or lack of distribution. It is lack of availability of water for the proper use. Of course, lack of CLEAN unpolluted water is rapidly becoming a problem.

Think back a few hundred years, in the U. S. or longer for more arid regions of the world. Small farming communities sprang up around the rivers. The cities followed but were farther away from the river. Yes, flooding was one reason why. The high water use activities were close to the source.

I know folks are now thinking that small farms cannot feed the world, as the large farms do today. That is correct, they can't. BUT! They can feed the areas around them by planting diverse, area intended crops. They can even feed large cities! The area around New York; NJ, Conn, NY, Mass... Farmed and sent products to NY. Then... The city expanded, taking farmland for cities. Farms were moved farther away to more unsuitable areas. Crops had to be trucked farther and farther to market. More water needed to be found to support those farms.....

Bottom line, it is not a drought, but a water use distribution problem. Land that should be used for farming, is used for cities. Land that should be used for cities, is used for farming. Land that should still be desert, is used for farming and cities. There really is no solution at this point, it is done. The only thing we can do is to move and live in an area that can supply our water needs. There are still plenty of prime area left too!!!


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## ETXgal (Jul 12, 2014)

Don't forget not all of that bottled water. Companies like Nestle take our water, and it goes into ships bound for China etc... This needs to be stopped. Our population is too high as it is. (for the eastern half of the country especially) Look up T. Boone Pickens and water. It will be an eye opener.


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## vidarr (Jun 25, 2013)

ETXgal, you're absolutely correct. Water wouldn't be an issue if it wasn't being shipped to China en mass. It is obviously only part of the problem, and other large factors such as overpopulation, and the inefficient distribution system contribute greatly. 

I find it funny that many places make rain collection illegal claiming the water can't go back into the ecosystem to support it, but companies like Nestle(cola cola) are allowed to own and ship the water out of country. 

Of course the government won't stop this due to overwhelming debt to China. 

The only thing that might is WW3... 


Sent from my iPhone using Survival Forum


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## nightwing (Jul 26, 2014)

Close to 7 billion people on the planet I figure if you squeezed out all 
the water in them we would find what we think is lost after all matter 
cannot be created or destroyed only altered.

You know one of dog gone irritating laws of physics.


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## rugster (Mar 2, 2014)

CrackbottomLouis said:


> The amount of water on earth remains constant. We don't have a water shortage we have an overpopulation problem. The only thing that changes with the amount of water on earth is where the water resides.


Yes, on population specifically our modern lifestyle with agriculture being the biggest consumer of fresh water resources. 
Many issues converge with this our modern agro systems are not efficient.

Where can we go from here ? To sustain these crops and food systems we are depleting ground water much like peak oil we 
face peak aquifer not just here but globally....for how long?

Relative to history food is cheap, how cheap?

Looking at Europe 15-17th century one learns that grains where more expensive than meat
people spent 30% or more of monthly income on bread Imagine 30% of your income going to bread. 
Modern agriculture with machines, irrigation, pesticides, fertilizers, made this once expensive commodity dirt cheap

http://www.johnhearfield.com/History/Breadt.htm


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## ContinualHarvest (Feb 19, 2012)

We deplete our forests, meadows and destroy our wetlands. We pump carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases, accelerating the warming trend, the glacier melt is no longer stable. We pump thousands of gallons of contaminates into the ground poisoning our wells. We allow coal ash to pour into our rivers, making them unsafe. Then we wonder why we have less drinkable water...


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## Hooch (Jul 22, 2011)

I heard last weekend some small towns south of me like scotia, rio dell have put residents on a water ration to 50 gallons per house per day. 

Here in this county, last weekend our town is starting to talk about water saving measures but not really doing anything yet. So far we are in pretty good shape compared to anyone south of us. I went for a hike up a few creeks last weekend that are normally flowing in summer still. I just wanted to look around... well..and gold pan  . Anyways, It is dryer definately. One creek only had pools. 

I have family and friends sorta by the sierra foothills area and the last 2 years Ive been riding them to have water storage set up. One friend saw the wisdom in that when they started having well issues. Last year she got her well drilled deeper AND got a huge water tank to boot to water her ranch livestock and garden. She is real happy she did it..it's scortching hot and bone dry. My brother I started him with one 55 gal barrel for about a year n half ago..to ease him into the idea. Last year he picked 2 more when it was still real hot and dry. Now he's wishing he had room for my 500 gallon rain barrel system. Its getting ugly down south...If we dont get enough rain this winter again..yikes!


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## airdrop (Jan 6, 2012)

Everyone thinks water will always be there but California steals water for their desert to flower and the farmer pumps from the ogalala reserve thinking it's to big to fail. Well the farmer keeps going down with bigger pumping systems and they're about down to salt water. It took a very long time to put that water there and it's not coming back so we're about out of time. The farmer will be back to dry land farming and it produces less food so we may see less food in the future. As for California they built a house on sand and it's coming back to bite them. Denver is the same population out stripping the supply they take from everyone else .


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## rugster (Mar 2, 2014)

ContinualHarvest said:


> We deplete our forests, meadows and destroy our wetlands. We pump carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases, accelerating the warming trend, the glacier melt is no longer stable. We pump thousands of gallons of contaminates into the ground poisoning our wells. We allow coal ash to pour into our rivers, making them unsafe. Then we wonder why we have less drinkable water...


I agree for the most part. However, the issue isn't one of polluted water it's one of unsustainable use.

We are using water at irreplaceable rates with regard to aquifers


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## Gians (Nov 8, 2012)

This little lake sits just below Folsom Lake, they keep it fairly full because of rowing competition. There is some water, just not enough for the central valley farmers to do business as usual. They've had to adjust, as we all have. Heard talk on the radio a few weeks back about putting meters on wells. The more people we add the less wiggle room we have when things go bad, or in this case dry. Haven't heard of California stealing water :hmmm: they do take it out of the Colorado River which borders the State. Looking forward to a wet winter, as long as it doesn't all come at once.


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## VoorTrekker (Oct 7, 2012)

The Oglala aquifer...in ancient days when a good well was established, the ancients built the towns over the well and aquifers. In time as the water was depleted the weight of the town and the hollowed out subsoils gave way to the weight and the town would fall into the geo-cavity. (The town was "swallowed up" by the earth.) 

Could this happen to the Oglala aquifer?


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## bigg777 (Mar 18, 2013)

I think this says a lot, it's satellite images of Lake Mead. It is from yale.edu, not some bogus bs site.


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## airdrop (Jan 6, 2012)

*Taking*



Gians said:


> This little lake sits just below Folsom Lake, they keep it fairly full because of rowing competition. There is some water, just not enough for the central valley farmers to do business as usual. They've had to adjust, as we all have. Heard talk on the radio a few weeks back about putting meters on wells. The more people we add the less wiggle room we have when things go bad, or in this case dry. Haven't heard of California stealing water :hmmm: they do take it out of the Colorado River which borders the State. Looking forward to a wet winter, as long as it doesn't all come at once.


When you take water from another eco system and do harm it's not good. Denver takes from the Plate River an now it's a small creek plugged with sand bars because there isn't enough flow anymore. If you all run out don't plan on coming to the great lakes for your share , won't happen.


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## JayJay (Nov 23, 2010)

Hooch said:


> I heard last weekend some small towns south of me like scotia, rio dell have put residents on a water ration to 50 gallons per house per day.
> 
> Here in this county, last weekend our town is starting to talk about water saving measures but not really doing anything yet. So far we are in pretty good shape compared to anyone south of us. I went for a hike up a few creeks last weekend that are normally flowing in summer still. I just wanted to look around... well..and gold pan  . Anyways, It is dryer definately. One creek only had pools.
> 
> I have family and friends sorta by the sierra foothills area and the last 2 years Ive been riding them to have water storage set up. One friend saw the wisdom in that when they started having well issues. Last year she got her well drilled deeper AND got a huge water tank to boot to water her ranch livestock and garden. She is real happy she did it..it's scortching hot and bone dry. My brother I started him with one 55 gal barrel for about a year n half ago..to ease him into the idea. Last year he picked 2 more when it was still real hot and dry. Now he's wishing he had room for my 500 gallon rain barrel system. Its getting ugly down south...If we dont get enough rain this winter again..yikes!


I do things to help here while neighbors water their yards??
Defeated attitude, not yet.
1)In the shower, wet your body, turn off the water running, shampoo, lather, turn water on and rinse.
2)Waiting for that water to get hot in the sink and running down the drain when doing dishes??
Why not run that cool water into the sink for your rinse water while waiting for the hot water?
There are lots of ways to save water.
3)Use your bath water to flush--yes, it is a little more time intensive, but when you have to do this, being used to it and practice may make it easier.

4)Do you really need to wash a load every day that isn't a full load?? Do you really need to wash clean towels? Dry them on the porch or line and re-use--they are clean--unless you are drying a dirty body or hair??

I stopped watering my old plants/potted plants that are dying. Why waste water--except for my new raspberry plants.

Not conserving water is irresponsible--you know who you are.:gaah:


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## JayJay (Nov 23, 2010)

*We deplete our forests, meadows and destroy our wetlands*

Gene has been logging for over 40 years.

His big pet peeve is watching landowners clear a huge group of trees for planting corn...gonna eat it or feed livestock??
Great. 
Gonna make ethanol?
Not smart.


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## VoorTrekker (Oct 7, 2012)

airdrop said:


> ...If you all run out don't plan on coming to the great lakes for your share , won't happen....


Don't underestimate the power of corruption. If California wants the Great Lakes Congress will give it to them. They have Nancy Pelossi, Barbara Boxer, Diane Feinstein and allies Harry Reid and the Senators from Washington and Utah.


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## Iafrate (Oct 9, 2013)

So, in any climate classification method what two variables are what defines an area's climatic classification? Temperature and precipitation. What happens in a drought? The moisture profile changes, ergo climate changes.


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## cowboyhermit (Nov 10, 2012)

Most Canadians are already convinced that it is only a matter of time before the U.S comes for our water (and that NAFTA will ensure it is allowed) :dunno: We do have a LOT.

Agriculture is responsible for a huge amount of water use but many of the figures are ridiculous. We don't use any irrigation on our farms up here but many will still say cows use X amount of water (some ridiculously high number). First of all, the water our cows drink is not going to be used by people, it just isn't going to happen. They drink out of the sloughs and I'll bet you can guess where it goes

If I needed irrigation for farming, gardening, or even a lawn I would be concerned. If my drinking water came from a diminishing source I would be making plans to change my situation.


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## rugster (Mar 2, 2014)

cowboyhermit said:


> Most Canadians are already convinced that it is only a matter of time before the U.S comes for our water (and that NAFTA will ensure it is allowed) :dunno:


We're not that smart probably rape your horses and ride off on your women :rofl:


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## musketjim (Dec 7, 2011)

CrackbottomLouis said:


> The amount of water on earth remains constant. We dont have a water shortage we have an overpopulation problem. The only thing that changes with the amount of water on earth is where the water resides.


It just makes sense, I agree. Water evaporates over here and rains somewhere else and these areas can and do change. It doesn't disappear into space it stays on planet. We've had high rainfall years the last 2 years with this year pushing hard to be the wettest summer in recorded history up here, while Calif. and the Pacific Northwest suffer through engineered droughts. Alaska isn't the only place that has a HAARP array.

"Take care of your neighbor now, you might have to eat him later"


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## JayJay (Nov 23, 2010)

rugster said:


> We're not that smart probably rape your horses and ride off on your women :rofl:


And Canadians, we can prove it. Most of those in Connecticut suffering water scarcity last year?? and those in Ohio/Michigan experiencing the lack of right now will still not have water stored in the future!!!

See?? I told you I could prove we're not THAT smart!:brickwall::brickwall::brickwall:


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