# Producing Jobs...



## iForgeDesigns (May 15, 2013)

I have had a hard time getting a job since out of high school, and i live in a town that allows me to be able to be self sustaining due to gardening or "mini-farming". But because of my experience with this problem, ive had a goal to create a community that can provide jobs while also being self-sustaining. Ive wanted to buy land and use part to grow crops; enough to live off of and sell. And use the rest for "tiny houses", and other places that will manufacture things like clothing, blacksmiths, carpentry, etc. 

So is this possible and how hard would it be? Hypothetically, if i bought say... 50 acres of land, and spent half of it for farming; could anyone give me a "in-the-ballpark" estimate of what it would cost?


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## cowboyhermit (Nov 10, 2012)

First of all, I find the fact that you are considering taking the initiative yourself to be very encouraging

There are so many factors in what you are saying though.

First, about the tiny houses etc, sounds great but I am assuming there will be zoning issues, most likely you would have to create some sort of "rv park" on the books to make it legal. 

What are agricultural land prices in your area and how is that affected by parcel size? In the area I am in anything under a full quarter (160acres) will have some degree of premium attached to it, the smaller the worse that is. Occasionally a back 40 or 80 will come up at a reasonable price but anything "acreage" like will be priced MUCH higher, if that means it comes will things like grid connections, well, etc it might still be reasonable. So without knowing if land is available at say $1000/acre it is hard to even start, this info should be easy to find for your area.

The next factor would be what your land is actually capable of producing and whether or not you need irrigation to do so. This of course ties into what there is a market for in your area. Vegetables and fruits can have the highest return in $/acre but you need an accessible, steady market, there are countless stories of producers having crops of veggies without buyers and it makes for expensive compost Other things MAY produce less $/acre but are much easier to market and/or easy to store until the market is best. For instance cattle (and other livestock depending on the area) can usually just be taken to the local auction and you will get a cheque whereas others require more marketing and risk (for a potentially greater return) grain is similarly easy to sell.

I absolutely think that a project like you are proposing is doable, the details are where the devil is though.


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## iForgeDesigns (May 15, 2013)

cowboyhermit said:


> First of all, I find the fact that you are considering taking the initiative yourself to be very encouraging
> 
> There are so many factors in what you are saying though.
> 
> ...


Well im only 21, but hopefully i can learn as much as possible about these matters so as to know what im getting myself into.

Actually i could buy land outside of city limits and have the freedom to do pretty much anything i would like, due to the fact that there would be no zoning issues. But i understand what you mean in reference to an rv park.

Im not sure what you mean as far as parcel size when referring to the land. And i understand what youre talking about as far as grid connections; however when buying land i usually look for rent to own first if i can. With these property details it is a plus if i can find land with power, water source, etc. but on the off chance it doesnt; i am prepared to create this myself. I am under the impression that it is possible to create wells or a similar water source on your own anywhere you'd like; although it may not be easy. Is this true? If not i could always just have water tank(s) - cisterns - i believe they're called. But ive havent really looked for a straight up price for land, probably due to the large asking prices; so im not experienced in this area. And I'm located in Texas; but am willing to buy land just about anywhere, practically speaking; for example not in nevada or arizona.

As far as produce and the market for each, where would i find out more about this? And i would like to be able to grow just about anything, such as wheat, fruit, vegetables, and still raise some cattle or livestock. Maybe even keep some forested land or land with trees for wild game and maybe even a river or pond. "This is all off the cuff" at the moment.So from an educated guess, what would you suggest?

GOAL = Self Sustaining


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## cowboyhermit (Nov 10, 2012)

In regards to the parcel size, land in much of North America was divided in a standard system, the smallest size being a "quarter" of 160acres. Typically this will be the cheapest per acre agricultural land available, the smaller the plot the more of a premium you will pay, though sometimes there are exceptions. For example, there are places here where a quarter of land could be bought for $1000/acre but you would never be able to purchase a single acre for $1000, this is one way property developers have made fortunes.

About what you might produce, it really depends? Are there large or active farmers markets nearby or a demand for csa (basically you sell shares in your produce and then deliver as it is ready), if so then vegetables might provide a good return.

Right now cattle are providing us a great income source and they require little in the way of infrastructure (IMO), other animals are easier to handle if you are inexperienced. If I had a bare plot of land first thing I would do is have it in a grass/legume mixture to improve the soil. Perimeter of property would be fenced and cattle would be allowed everywhere by default. Then I would determine how much vegetables I wanted to handle, fence off that with electric fencing and start working it. Then start rotating the livestock daily (mob stocking). Next would probably come laying hens, broiler chickens, hogs, etc.

I would recommend looking into some successful small scale producers. Joel Salatin has done some really interesting stuff, same for many in the permaculture community.


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## cqp33 (Apr 2, 2012)

In regard to water you may be able to do it by hand but have you ever tried drilling through rock by hand? How deep is the water on the 'land you don't own yet'? In soil I believe to a certain depth it's possible, I am fortunate because I have constant free flowing springs I can tap for irrigation when/if needed. Septic is another issue, if the soil doesn't 'perk' properly then a mound type system can be used where soil is brought in to build up enough soil to 'perk', this is expensive unless you have access to good top soil and a way to move it by the truckload! I was looking at 12 acres that was selling for cheap in my area, when I walk a property I am interested in I use a 5 foot piece of 1/2" rebar as a walking stick and push it into the ground about every 15-20 steps as deep as I can, after a while you will be able to feel going from top soil to clay, rock is easy to tell by the thud and your hand raking across rebar rod! Anyways the property I was looking at was rock with about 6 inches of soil on top of it, $28,000 for a septic for 3 bedrooms! Not cool!

Developers plan to spend $1,000,000 to develop 50 acres for a subdivision in the Corpus Christi area, that's sewage, electrical, water, excavation, streets, sidewalks, etc....everything but the houses and the purchase price of the land! I know this because I am friends with a developer in that area, him and I talked on this topic! 
Hope this helps but I wish you luck in your endeavor!


Sent from my iPhone using Survival Forum


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## camo2460 (Feb 10, 2013)

iForgeDesigns said:


> I have had a hard time getting a job since out of high school, and i live in a town that allows me to be able to be self sustaining due to gardening or "mini-farming". But because of my experience with this problem, ive had a goal to create a community that can provide jobs while also being self-sustaining. Ive wanted to buy land and use part to grow crops; enough to live off of and sell. And use the rest for "tiny houses", and other places that will manufacture things like clothing, blacksmiths, carpentry, etc.
> 
> So is this possible and how hard would it be? Hypothetically, if i bought say... 50 acres of land, and spent half of it for farming; could anyone give me a "in-the-ballpark" estimate of what it would cost?


You might want to go to land watch.com and check out the land in Iron county, Missouri. I spotted one that was 80 acres and about $98,000.00. I didn't check any other of the southern Missouri counties, but the word is that some of them can be had at around $500.00 per acre, and southern Missouri has excellent farm and grazing land.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

camo2460 said:


> I didn't check any other of the southern Missouri counties, but the word is that some of them can be had at around $500.00 per acre, and southern Missouri has excellent farm and grazing land.


Roger That; I would forget Texas and seriously consider Salem, Missouri or Mountain Home, Arkansas - both places I know well (but don't have a job there for me  )


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## cowboyhermit (Nov 10, 2012)

Wow, historically land in our area has been on the cheap side but $500 an acre for any kind of grazing land besides desert would seem to be a steal afaik. Landowners are having no problem getting $50/acre/year around here these days, wouldn't take long to pay for it at that price, of course taxes vary widely too but still. Under $1000/acre for good land that doesn't require irrigation (of course if you have it that's great) is a great investment imo. I have seen people have good success buying a quarter of farmland, building a house and yard, and renting out the majority of the land for a decent cheque instead of buying just an acreage.


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## camo2460 (Feb 10, 2013)

cowboyhermit said:


> Wow, historically land in our area has been on the cheap side but $500 an acre for any kind of grazing land besides desert would seem to be a steal afaik. Landowners are having no problem getting $50/acre/year around here these days, wouldn't take long to pay for it at that price, of course taxes vary widely too but still. Under $1000/acre for good land that doesn't require irrigation (of course if you have it that's great) is a great investment imo. I have seen people have good success buying a quarter of farmland, building a house and yard, and renting out the majority of the land for a decent cheque instead of buying just an acreage.


I understand your amazement, I was the same way. The thing is that, there are some counties in southern Missouri that are so under populated, the state is trying to bring people in. But again, to be completely honest, this is what I have been "told" by a person that lives in that area, I have not witnessed it myself.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

camo2460 said:


> But again, to be completely honest, this is what I have been "told" by a person that lives in that area, I have not witnessed it myself.


The beauty of the 'net is anyone can browse real estate in any area online


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