# Is our Government working on starving us?



## RevWC (Mar 28, 2011)

Starving: Is our Government working towards starving its citizens?

*Stalin:* He organised the dislocation of 10 million independent farmers in a bid to create a communist collective farm . When they would not cooperate he organised troops to kill them. When bullets proved too expensive to do this he managed to remove almost all sources of food from the market and starve to death those that would not cooperate. It resulted in the death of 7 million people.

*California Central Valley:* Nov. 11-14, 2002 -- California is home to the greatest garden in the world. The 400-mile-long Central Valley supplies fully one-quarter of the food America eats. It's a long, mostly flat and incredibly fertile pocket of land nestled between the coastal mountains and the Sierra Nevada range.

*California Dust Bowl 2008:* In California's Central Valley, for decades one of the world's most productive agricultural regions, an estimated 250,000 acres of prime farm land are lying fallow or dying. The parched area bears all the signs of a prolonged drought, but the acute water shortage confronting farmers is manmade, the result of the Interior Department's enforcement of the ESA to save the Delta smelt by diverting more that 150 billion gallons of water from the Central Valley. George Bush signed this legislation in 2008.

*World Food Supplies:* The bank says in a new report that global food prices have jumped 29 percent in the past year, and are just 3 percent below the all-time peak hit in 2008. According to its Food Price Watch, the World Bank's food price index was up by 15 percent between October 2010 and January 2011, is 29 percent above its level from just a year earlier, and only 3 percent below its 2008 peak.Wheat prices have been hit the hardest, doubling between June last year and January 2011, while maize prices were up 73 percent.

*Corn:* U.S. reserves of corn have hit their lowest level in more than 15 years, reflecting tighter supplies that will lead to higher food prices in 2011. Increasing demand for corn from the ethanol industry is a major reason for the decline. The U.S. Department of Agriculture reported Wednesday that the ethanol industries projected orders this year rose 8.4 percent, to 13.01 billion bushels, after record-high production in December and January. The price of corn affects most food products in supermarkets. It's used to feed the cattle, hogs and chickens that fill the meat case, and turned into corn syrup, it sweetens most soft drinks. The decline in reserves caused corn futures to surge, with prices rising 2.4 percent to $6.9025 during morning trading. Corn prices have already doubled in the last six months, rising from $3.50 a bushel to nearly $7 a bushel. Analysts expect the price increases to continue in coming months.

*Ethanol: * Automakers such as "Government Motors" are increasing their inventories of flex-fueled vehicles. General Motors announced Friday that it will offer 18 E85-capable vehicles in model year 2009 The subsidized conversion of crops into fuel was supposed to promote energy independence and help limit global warming. But this promise was, as Time magazine bluntly put it, a 'scam.' This is especially true of corn ethanol: even on optimistic estimates, producing a gallon of ethanol from corn uses most of the energy the gallon contains. But it turns out that even seemingly 'good' biofuel policies, like Brazil's use of ethanol from sugar cane, accelerate the pace of climate change by promoting deforestation. And meanwhile, land used to grow biofuel feedstock is land not available to grow food, so subsidies to biofuels are a major factor in the food crisis. You might put it this way: people are starving in Africa so that American politicians can court votes in farm states.


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## kejmack (May 17, 2011)

I don't know that the government has an organized plan to starve people. I think it is more the "unintentional consequence" of bad agriculture policy based on the false science of global warming and the politics of ethanol.


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## Meerkat (May 31, 2011)

From what I read it takes 2 gallons of oil fuel to produce 1 gal of ethonol.Plus it causes problems with engine and parts.Some only buy gas without ehtonol,but its getting harder to find.

We may be killing africa with the help of islam,but soon it will hit us too.We will soon reap what we sow,pun intended.

The corn used for fuel is not suppose to get into our food,but it has.This bio engineered crapola is not good for man nor beast.

The whole world is under some kind of spell or it would cease to support these few elitist.

Invasion of the Body Snatchers,will soon become Solvent Green and Logans Run.

I past Logans Run now,hehe,but Solvent Green is another story.


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## eddiedc (Dec 10, 2010)

kejmack said:


> I don't know that the government has an organized plan to starve people. I think it is more the "unintentional consequence" of bad agriculture policy based on the false science of global warming and the politics of ethanol.


i think its more that they don't care what the consequences are than it being unintentional. I believe that its more about power and control


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## PamsPride (Dec 21, 2010)

This is why I am working harder and harder to produce more and more of our own food!


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## JayJay (Nov 23, 2010)

eddiedc said:


> i think its more that they don't care what the consequences are than it being unintentional. I believe that its more about power and control


I'll say again...the effort/plan to bring in the NWO by the elitists--a very small faction--isn't possible with 200 million gun owners in America.
How to alleviate that?? Destroy farmland and farmers using bioengineered weather modification and other evil techniques.
When there is limited food, when those not preparing are destitute and hungry...there will be a plan almost as bad as the trains taking us to a camp for warm meals and beds....swap food for guns.
And those hungry may get extra provisions for ratting out their neighbors/families.

Prep like this is the real deal...I don't wish to swap guns for rice...do you??


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## BadgeBunny (Nov 2, 2010)

kejmack said:


> I don't know that the government has an organized plan to starve people. *I think it is more the "unintentional consequence" of bad agriculture policy* based on the false science of global warming and the politics of ethanol.


I lean this way also but think it is less about global warming and the politics of ethanol and more about the fact that acceptable farming and ranching practices in the 60s and 70s (using chemicals and selective breeding to maximizing profits) have backed us into a corner. The land is stripped of nutrients, food plants are so selectively propogated for production that there are no nutrients left in them and the livestock is pumped full of growth hormones. We are now reaping what we have sowed all those years.

Of course "global warming" and the politics of ethanol aren't exactly helping us out of the mess we are in ...


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## JayJay (Nov 23, 2010)

BadgeBunny said:


> I lean this way also but think it is less about global warming and the politics of ethanol and more about the fact that acceptable farming and ranching practices in the 60s and 70s (using chemicals and selective breeding to maximizing profits) have backed us into a corner. The land is stripped of nutrients, food plants are so selectively propogated for production that there are no nutrients left in them and the livestock is pumped full of growth hormones. We are now reaping what we have sowed all those years.
> 
> Of course "global warming" and the politics of ethanol aren't exactly helping us out of the mess we are in ...


So true.....


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## RevWC (Mar 28, 2011)

*Well Stated!*



JayJay said:


> I'll say again...the effort/plan to bring in the NWO by the elitists--a very small faction--isn't possible with 200 million gun owners in America.
> How to alleviate that?? Destroy farmland and farmers using bioengineered weather modification and other evil techniques.
> When there is limited food, when those not preparing are destitute and hungry...there will be a plan almost as bad as the trains taking us to a camp for warm meals and beds....swap food for guns.
> And those hungry may get extra provisions for ratting out their neighbors/families.
> ...


No Guns for Rice!:surrender:


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## lotsoflead (Jul 25, 2010)

Our government wouldn't do anything to starve the people. The biggest problem is our government is made up of lifers who don't have a clue about what's happening on the other side of the country, they're only interested in their own district and the people who grease their hand the most.
the president can only serve 2 terms but we let the people who make all the decessions stay there til they want to leave even if they commit crimes while there.

If we had term limits of just 6 yrs and no benifits when they leave, you would see a big change in the country.they should also pay into SS and take the same med benifits that they're trying to cram down our throuts.
Also make it illegal for lobbists or any group to give or take any money.


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## power (May 7, 2011)

lotsoflead said:


> Our government wouldn't do anything to starve the people. The biggest problem is our government is made up of lifers who don't have a clue about what's happening on the other side of the country, they're only interested in their own district and the people who grease their hand the most.
> the president can only serve 2 terms but we let the people who make all the decessions stay there til they want to leave even if they commit crimes while there.
> 
> If we had term limits of just 6 yrs and no benifits when they leave, you would see a big change in the country.they should also pay into SS and take the same med benifits that they're trying to cram down our throuts.
> Also make it illegal for lobbists or any group to give or take any money.


Did you forget, the people who you are complaining about are the ones who make and enforce the laws. Do you actually think they would do something like that to themselves? Would you in their place?


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## BillM (Dec 29, 2010)

*Do I*

Do I believe the Federal government would deliberately starve us? Of course not ! If that incompetent pack of Jackals were intentionally trying to starve us, we would all weigh so much they would have to wheel us around in wheelbarrows. It is what they do unintentionally that I worry about.

:dunno:


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## petedewd (Jun 23, 2011)

Uh no. But they make some really bad decisions. And self-interested decisions - see Food Inc. if you have not. 

Corn ethanol is a terrifically horrible idea. Drill, drill drill and get to nat gas over the next 15 years!


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## Clarice (Aug 19, 2010)

Not so much to starve us, but to control us. If you are truly hungry, I mean truly hungry what would you do for food??????


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## Ridgerunner (Oct 27, 2008)

RevWC said:


> Starving: .
> 
> *California Dust Bowl 2008:* In California's Central Valley, for decades one of the world's most productive agricultural regions, an estimated 250,000 acres of prime farm land are lying fallow or dying. The parched area bears all the signs of a prolonged drought, but the acute water shortage confronting farmers is manmade, the result of the Interior Department's enforcement of the ESA to save the Delta smelt by diverting more that 150 billion gallons of water from the Central Valley. George Bush signed this legislation in 2008.
> .


Here is the problem with California water ( I used to live there)

first they Built southern cali in a desert. Then because they don't have enough water they pump it for the Northern Cali delta. And what also happens is that the farmers have water allotments and they take all of the water they are allowed and the excess they sell for a profit to Southern cali.

So the water in the San Joaquin River is flowing back wards away from the sea Causing salt water to come into where there was only fresh water before. plants don't like to grow in salt water :scratch

This also [email protected]#$s up the fisheries


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## TheAnt (Jun 7, 2011)

Clarice said:


> Not so much to starve us, but to control us. If you are truly hungry, I mean truly hungry what would you do for food??????


Agreed! Controlling the food supply is one of the keys to controlling the people. This is in my opinion one of the alterior motives behind the FDA, EPA, etc. Some of the other keys are to control access to health care (DHHS, universal health care, general health care legislation), control the ability of the people to take up arms (gun control), control and censor the media and access to information (net neutrality, net ID, Obamania), control the ability of the people to move anonymously (TSA, DHS, airline flight regulations, etc), there are others. The main key though is to get folks to abandon their faith in God - which ultimately is a personal decision but is 'preached' at every level from the Department of Education to the laws they pass which legislate health care.

All to control the people. A *truly free* people would never allow any of these things.

Oh, and almost all of this stuff is done in the name of 'security' -- but who are we secure from? Not the government!


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## RevWC (Mar 28, 2011)

TheAnt said:


> Agreed! Controlling the food supply is one of the keys to controlling the people. This is in my opinion one of the alterior motives behind the FDA, EPA, etc. Some of the other keys are to control access to health care (DHHS, universal health care, general health care legislation), control the ability of the people to take up arms (gun control), control and censor the media and access to information (net neutrality, net ID, Obamania), control the ability of the people to move anonymously (TSA, DHS, airline flight regulations, etc), there are others. The main key though is to get folks to abandon their faith in God - which ultimately is a personal decision but is 'preached' at every level from the Department of Education to the laws they pass which legislate health care.
> 
> All to control the people. A *truly free* people would never allow any of these things.
> 
> Oh, and almost all of this stuff is done in the name of 'security' -- but who are we secure from? Not the government!


Very well said my Friend! And oh so true!


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## RevWC (Mar 28, 2011)

Perhaps not our Government but the new World Order?

http://www.slowfoodusa.org/index.ph...create_food_democracy_occupy_our_food_supply/


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## ImNotCrazyRU (Oct 18, 2011)

*"If you control the food, you can control the people." - Henry Kissinger*


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## Davarm (Oct 22, 2011)

IMO, the government is setting the stage to control or eliminate the home gardener so that we will not be a wild card when the "food crisis" hits. They have Monsanto and other big Agra-Businesses controlling the seed, the federal govt. has laid claim to all water in the country and fuel will become so expensive our gardens will be limited only to what we can prepare with a shovel.

Yes, they are going to make sure we are all "screwed" equally when the food gets too expensive or too scarce to buy.

My answer to the question "Is The Government Trying To Starve Us", is "yes, if you dont march to the beat of their drum".


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## goshengirl (Dec 18, 2010)

Davarm said:


> IMO, the government is setting the stage to control or eliminate the home gardener so that we will not be a wild card when the "food crisis" hits.


I have been feeling such a strong drive to get native food-bearing plants in place (raspberries, pawpaws, etc.) - food sources that don't scream 'garden' - maybe this is why... :gaah:


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## Emerald (Jun 14, 2010)

goshengirl said:


> I have been feeling such a strong drive to get native food-bearing plants in place (raspberries, pawpaws, etc.) - food sources that don't scream 'garden' - maybe this is why... :gaah:


Don't forget nut trees. A handful of walnuts/pecan/almonds are super full of good fats and a fair amount of proteins. Hazelnuts demand a high price but grow in Mi and Ohio and are kind bushy and make a decent hedge.
Cranberries and currents and elderberries and honey berries are all plants and berries that folks will not readily recognize as edible.. start replacing your grass/yard with all types of herbs.. I have a lawn of mints and thyme and oregano and all types of spreading herbs.. if I don't mow it down then it can be harvested to add to teas or any types of foods to help make possible bland stuff much more 'edible' or palatable. I am thinking about pawpaws too.. I got seeds from a friend and planted them in containers and sunk the containers in the ground and some critter found them in the winter and just ate every one pot by pot on me..


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## goshengirl (Dec 18, 2010)

Emerald said:


> Don't forget nut trees.


Our nut trees are struggling (the babies I planted) - we had such a wet spring last year that over the summer we were overwhelmed with fungus problems, and lost a lot of things (whole sections of the garden, blueberries, flowering trees, etc). Of the nut trees, it looks like only two walnuts and one pecan pulled through.  We do have some well-established (and producing) black walnuts and hickories that didn't suffer.

I'm going to look into nut trees from the Arbor Day Foundation. They arrive as little twigs, but they're cheap - and after last year's fiasco we have to be cheap, too.

This year I have seed for elderberries, native plum and native apple, so we'll see how those go. Lost all our bush cherries and our blueberries last year, but will try again this year. Wish I knew of a use for the non-native hedge apple (osage orange) that we have all over the place - got TONS of those! 

I've also been working on converting our yard to a native Ohio prairie, keeping with native grasses and flowers - some of which are medicinal, such as purple cone flower. But I also have seeds for all sorts of other herbs to sneak in there. I figure I may not know how to use the herbs yet, but I'm going to go ahead and give them time to get established while I get caught up on herbal knowledge.

I have a great source for pawpaws - my friend grew up in Mennonite country in NE Ohio, and her uncle still has a native stand on his property. She brought some down here to southern Ohio, and they've multiplied like nobody's business. She lets me have whatever she thins out. Last summer lost all of them to that black fungus, but will try again this year in another location.


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## RevWC (Mar 28, 2011)

Monsanto's GMO Food and its Dark Connections to the "Military Industrial Complex"
By Steven MacMillan
Global Research, July 03, 2014
The Analyst Report
Region: Canada, Europe, USA
Theme: Biotechnology and GMO, Environment, Science and Medicine

http://www.globalresearch.ca/monsan...ns-to-the-military-industrial-complex/5389708

Monsanto, the world's largest genetically modified (GM/GMO) seed producer, has been at the centre of controversy for decades as evidence of the harmful effects on humans of GM foods continues to mount. Joined with the likes of DuPont's Pioneer Hi-Bred International and Syngenta, Monsanto and partners comprise the corporate nexus of Big-Agri, where the control over our food supply is increasingly transferred into the hands of private trans-national corporations as opposed to local farmers and governments.

A US peer-reviewed study conducted last year which was published in the scientific journal Entropy, linked Monsanto's herbicide Roundup - which is the most popular weed killer in the world - to infertility, cancers and Parkinsons Disease amongst other ailments. The authors of the study were Stephanie Seneff, a research scientist at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, and Anthony Samsel, a retired science consultant from Arthur D. Little, Inc. and a former private environmental government contractor. The main ingredient in Roundup is the "insidious" glyphosate, which the study found to be a deeply harmful chemical:

"Glyphosate enhances the damaging effects of other food borne chemical residues and environmental toxins. Negative impact on the body is insidious and manifests slowly over time as inflammation damages cellular systems throughout the body [...] Consequences are most of the diseases and conditions associated with a Western diet, which include gastrointestinal disorders, obesity, diabetes, heart disease, depression, autism, infertility, cancer and Alzheimer's disease" (Samsel and Seneff, 2013).

The Executive Director of the Institute for Responsible Technology (IRT) Jeffrey M. Smith has discovered a link between gluten disorders and GM foods in a study he conducted last year. Gluten disorders have sharply risen over the past 2 decades, which correlates with GM foods being introduced into the food supply. Smith asserts that GM foods - including soy and corn - are the possible "environmental triggers" that have contributed to the rapid increase of gluten disorders that effect close to 20 million American's today:

"Bt-toxin, glyphosate, and other components of GMOs, are linked to five conditions that may either initiate or exacerbate gluten-related disorders [...] If glyphosate activates retinoic acid, and retinoic acid activates gluten sensitivity, eating GMOs soaked with glyphosate may play a role in the onset of gluten-related disorders" (Smith, 2013).

One of the more damming studies on the safety of GM foods was led by biologist Dr. Gilles-Eric Seralini of the University of Caen, which was the first study to examine the long term affects on rats that had consumed Monsanto's GM corn and its Roundup herbicide. The study was conducted over a 2 year period - which is the average life-span of a rat - as opposed to Monsanto's usual period of 90 days. The peer-reviewed study found horrifying effects on the rats health, with a 200% to 300% increase in large tumours, severe organ damage to the kidney and liver and 70% of female participant rats suffered premature death. The first tumours only appeared 4 to 7 months into the research, highlighting the need for longer trials.

Initially the study was published in the September issue of Food and Chemical Toxicology, but was then later retracted after the publisher felt the study was "inconclusive", although there was no suspicion of fraud or intentional deceit. Dr. Seralini strongly protested the decision and believed "economic interests" were behind the decision as a former Monsanto employee had joined the journal. Monsanto is infamous for employing swaths oflobbyists to control the political, scientific and administrative decisions relating to the organisation, and this incident was a major whitewash by the GM producer to stop the barrage of negative media reports relating to the toxic effects of their products. The study led by Dr. Seralini was later published in a less well renowned journal, the Environmental Sciences Europe, which reignited the fears of GM foods safety.

France has recently implemented a ban on Monsanto produced maize (MON810) - a different variety of the Monsanto GM corn that was discussed in the study above (NK603) - citing environmental concerns as the reason for the ban. France joins a list of countries including Italy and Poland who have imposed bans on GM corn over the past few years. Additionally, Russian MPs have introduced a draft into parliament which could see GM producers punished as terrorists and criminally prosecuted if they are deemed to have harmed the environment or human health. In India, many of the GM seeds sold to Indian farmers under the pretext of greater harvests failed to deliver, which led to an estimated 200,000 Indian farmers committing suicide due to an inability to repay debts.

There is growing evidence to support the theory that bee colonies are collapsing due to GM crops being used in agriculture, with America seeing the largest fall in bee populations in recent years. Resistance to Monsanto and GM foods has been growing in recent years after the launch of the worldwide 'March Against Monsanto' in 2012, which organises global protests against the corporation and its toxic products within 52 countries. Monsanto was also voted the 'most evil corporation' of 2013 in a poll conducted by the website Natural News, beating the Federal Reserve and British Petroleum to take the top position.

Monsanto Produced and Supplied Toxic Agent Orange

Researching Monsanto's past reveals a very dark history that has been well documented for years. During the Vietnam War, Monsanto was contracted to produce and supply the US government with a malevolent chemical for military application. Along with other chemical giants at the time such as Dow Chemical, Monsanto produced the military herbicide Agent Orange which contained high quantities of the deadly chemical Dioxin. Between 1961 and 1971, the US Army sprayed between 50 and 80 million litres of Agent Orange across Vietnamese jungles, forests and strategically advantageous positions. It was deployed in order to destroy forests and fertile lands which provided cover and food for the opposing troops. The fallout was devastating, with Vietnam estimating that 400,000 people died or were maimed due to Agent Orange, as well as 500,000 children born with birth defects and up to 2 million people suffer from cancer or other diseases. Millions of US veterans were also exposed and many have developed similar illnesses. The consequences are still felt and are thought to continue for a century as cancer, birth defects and other diseases are exponential due to them being passed down through generations.

Today, deep connections exist between Monsanto, the 'Military Industrial Complex' and the US Government which have to be documented to understand the nature of the corporation. On Monsanto's Board of Directors sits the former Chairman of the Board and CEO of the giant war contractor Lockheed Martin, Robert J. Stevens, who was also appointed in 2012 by Barack Obama to the Advisory Committee for Trade Policy and Negotiations. As well as epitomising the revolving door that exists between the US Government and private trans-national corporations, Stevens is a member of the parallel government in the US, the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR). A second board member at Monsanto is Gwendolyn S. King, who also sits on the board of Lockheed Martin where she chairs the Orwellian 'Ethics and Sustainability Committee". Individuals who are veterans of the corporate war industry should not be allowed control over any populations food supply! Additionally, Monsanto board member Dr. George H. Poste is a former member of the Defense Science Board and the Health Board of the U.S. Department of Defense, as well as a Fellow of the Royal Society and a member of the CFR.

Bill Gates made headlines in 2010 when The Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation bought 500,000 Monsanto shares worth a total of $23 million, raising questions as to why his foundation would invest in such a malign corporation. William H. Gates Sr. - Bill's father - is the former head of Planned Parenthood and a strong advocate of eugenics- the philosophy that there are superior and inferior types of human beings, with the inferior type often sterilised or culled under the pretext of being a plague on society. During his 2010 TED speech, Bill Gates reveals his desire to reduce the population of the planet by "10 or 15 percent" in the coming years through such technologies as "vaccines":

"The world today has 6.8 billion people. That's heading up to about 9 billion. Now if we do a really good job on new vaccines, health care, reproductive health services, we could lower that by perhaps 10 or 15 percent" (4.37 into the video).

In 2006, Monsanto acquired a company that has developed - in partnership with the US Department of Agriculture - what is popularly termed terminator seeds, a future major trend in the GM industry. Terminator Seeds or suicide seeds are engineered to become sterile after the first harvest, destroying the ancient practice of saving seeds for future crops. This means farmers are forced to buy new seeds every year from Big-Agri, which produces high debts and a form of servitude for the farmers.


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## ARDon (Jun 28, 2014)

their alot we do not know about the United States Government, they truly have assembled a vast domestic intelligence apparatus to collect information about Americans, using the FBI, local police, state homeland security offices and military criminal investigators. The system is by far the largest and most technologically sophisticated in the nation's history, it collects, stores and analyzes information about a vast amount of U.S. citizens and residents, many of whom have not been accused of any wrong doing, BUT! they could. What worries me is a leader like Obama whom over steps the Constiution w/o missing a beat. I bet Obama is following something secertive that we(the American people) do not know anything about. Do we American's worry about especially the ones whom are against their opposing side, worries about warrantless searches, secret evidence, continual monitoring of it's citizens, possible droan sping or worst yet attacks. The question is..."How Many Rights Have Americans REALLY Lost?" I believe we are becoming a police state were control is the main objective in their plans. Get goes back to an article I read & posted on another preppers forum..........................................................

ATTENTION all state and local law enforcement personnel
You took an oath"... to preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution of the United States [and of your state] against all enemies, foreign or domestic."

But what does that oath really mean in your personal and professional life? More than you may realize. And that oath may, in the months and years ahead, be put to a test that you neither expect or want. This paper is to help you prepare for that test.

Who are the enemies?
Foreign enemies are easy to understand, and require little discussion. What about domestic? Spies? Terrorists? Criminals? How about corrupt political officials? Or overzealous officials who ride roughshod over the Constitution and the rights of citizens in pursuit of a mission they think outweighs all other concerns? What about corrupt or overzealous officials in your chain of command, who may try to use you for their criminal purposes? What about top civilian leaders, who may decide to overthrow the Constitution and establish a new regime in which there are no limits on governmental powers or guaranteed rights, and use you to carry out their plans?

At this point you may be thinking "Nonsense. Nothing like that will ever happen in the United States of America. The people running our government are nice guys who can be trusted to try to do the right thing. They would never try to do anything like that. This is just some kind of paranoid anti-government propaganda."

Don't be too sure. A lot of people thought the same thing a few years ago who became aware of evidence that is extremely alarming, evidence that would be incredible if it didn't come from people inside government who are extremely troubled by what they are seeing or being asked to do.

One of those things is making preparations for a general warrantless search of every site in the United States, using military and law enforcement personnel, to confiscate all firearms and shoot anyone who resists. A clear violation of almost all of the rights guaranteed in the Constitution. Don't rely on this flyer. Check it out for yourself through channels. Then think about what it means.

No more elections. Not for some time. The people would be outraged. They'd vote all the incumbents out if elections were held. The government might offer some justification for their action, something that might seem convincing to many, but not to everyone.

In the meantime citizens throughout the country are organizing independent local militias, to resist assaults on the Constitution. At some point, you may be called upon to choose sides.

Assaults on the Constitution
The Framers of the Constitution made it very clear: Government was not to exercise any power not delegated to it by the Constitution. But for many decades now, it has been assuming more and more powers for which there is no constitutional basis, often in response to demands from the public to "do something" about some problem or another, without bothering to adopt amendments that would make such powers legitimate. Courts have, for the most part, gone along with this, often resorting to imaginative sophistry to try to make it seem legitimate.

If this weren't bad enough, these new powers are increasingly being abused to serve purposes and interests that were never intended by the original legislation. The result is an increasing crisis of legitimacy, and increasing alienation from government on the part of an ever growing part of the population.

Illegal Orders
Any order which you may receive that is contrary to the Constitution of the U.S. or of your State, or to a constitutional law, is illegal. Compliance with such an order is not only not required of you, but may be and probably is illegal, and the issuance of such an order may be a crime, which obligates you to make an arrest of the person issuing it.

Under federal law, 18 USC 242, it is illegal for anyone under the color of law to deprive any person of the rights, privileges or immunities secured by the U.S. Constitution, and under 18 USC 241 it is illegal to conspire to violate such rights. It is a felony punishable by up to 10 years in prison. This could be applied to local, state, or federal law enforcement or military personnel who abuse the rights of citizens. Every state has a similar law.

The key point is this: You not only have the right to disobey an illegal order, but you may also have the duty to apprehend the parties issuing such an order if such issuance is part of the commission of a crime.

The Principle of Nuremberg
After World War II, Nazi war crimes were prosecuted at Nuremberg, and those trials established an important principle: that is the responsibility of every individual to make an independent determination of the legality of any law or official act. No one may delegate that duty to others, not to superiors, not to legal advisers, and not even to judges. It is no defense that you were "just following orders".

Some Constitutional Limitations
Be aware of what are the constitutional limits on federal powers. The Constitution allows criminal prosecution under federal laws on state territory only for (1) treason, (2) counterfeiting, (3) piracy or felonies on the high seas, (4) crimes against the laws of nations, or (5) violations of civil rights by officials. It does not allow criminal prosecution for violations of any regulations, such as those passed under the interstate commerce clause, or for failure to pay taxes. Therefore, most such federal criminal laws apply only to acts committed on federal territory, including the District of Columbia, Puerto Rico, the Virgin Islands, several other islands in the Pacific, land ceded to the federal government by a state legislature for military bases and public works, coastal waters, U.S. flag vessels on the high seas, and the grounds of U.S. embassies abroad.

Furthermore, the Framers intended that "interstate commerce" include only transactions that cross a state border, not all the things that it has been extended to cover, such as anything that has ever crossed a state border, or anything that ever might cross a state border, or anything done by someone who does business some of which crosses a state border, or anything that is "part of an aggregate" of activities that cross a state border, or anything that may "affect" interstate commerce.

During the last several decades Congress has been "federalizing" many crimes committed on State territory, and State and local authorities have been going along with this. But except for the four categories of offenses listed above, all of these extensions of federal authority are unconstitutional.

Now, any citizen may investigate and enforce the law, and that includes federal agents. Under our system of government, all citizens are policemen. You as a regular law enforcement officer may outrank ordinary civilians, but they have the same authority to enforce the law against felonies and more serious misdemeanors that you do, and that authority should be respected. When the offense is one of those four that the federal government has jurisdiction over on state territory, federal agents have the prior authority. However, in all other cases, your authority is superior to theirs. They may assist you, conduct investigations, and make arrests, with your consent, but then they are obligated to turn over the evidence and the suspect to you for prosecution under state or local law.

Lately several situations have arisen in which federal agents were seen by local or state law enforcement to be abusing the rights of citizens, and the federal officials attempted to prevent those local or state law enforcement officials from doing their duty to protect those citizens by "deputizing" them as "federal marshals", thus supposedly putting them under federal authority. This is illegal. First, you cannot be appointed to any office without your consent. Second, in most states it would be illegal to serve as both a federal and state or local officer at the same time. Check the law. If an attempt is made to "deputize" you, refuse.

Some law enforcement officers say that if they are put in the position of having to obey an illegal order or law, they will resign. That is wrong. Once you take an oath to uphold the law, you are obligated to resist all efforts to turn law enforcement organizations into criminal enterprises. Don't resign. Arrest the offender, just as you would arrest any other offender. Make him resign.

What you can do
Investigate what is going on within your organization and in other law enforcement and military organizations operating in your area, regarding violations of the Constitution and laws pursuant to it. Then contact local patriot groups. You can find them through gun shops, American Legion or VFW posts, radio talk show hosts, alternative newspapers and bookstores, or your local militia unit. If you find yourself in conflict with federal authorities on a matter of constitutional principle, you may have no alternative but to call up the militia in your area to assist you in upholding the Constitution. You have the authority to do that. Any citizen may call up the militia, including you. But they are not going to respond effectively unless they have been previously organized, armed, and trained. You need to work with them to get them into a high state of readiness.


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## Dakine (Sep 4, 2012)

RevWC said:


> In 2006, Monsanto acquired a company that has developed - in partnership with the US Department of Agriculture - what is popularly termed terminator seeds, a future major trend in the GM industry. Terminator Seeds or suicide seeds are engineered to become sterile after the first harvest, destroying the ancient practice of saving seeds for future crops. This means farmers are forced to buy new seeds every year from Big-Agri, which produces high debts and a form of servitude for the farmers.


While I'm not a fan in general of Big-Agri I can certainly understand the need for the terminator seeds. Yes, getting farmers to buy new seed every year is a revenue stream, but it also prevents things like GM plants getting into the wild and mutating or taking over the indigenous and heirloom plants. That's been happening, in fact seeds that they said had been destroyed somehow magically created mutated crops on farmers fields and they wanted to charge the farmers with having their product illegally.

The whole thing is getting out of hand, but as long as 3rd world countries continue to procreate like there's no reason not to have less than a dozen per 1 room shack it's going to take something to feed all those starving mouths. They're starting to run out of rain forest to slash and burn to build shantytowns in as well. meanwhile, we need to reduce our carbon footprint.


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## VoorTrekker (Oct 7, 2012)

Carbon footprint?  Whatever.

The "suicide gene" combines with any pollinating plant and can therefore annihilate any type of flora, not just similar genus food crops. This can bring about the ancient prophesy of the mass starvation when all farms fail to produce food and famine hits the world!

Iceland seed bank with the ultimate state of the art security and storage techniques. Curiosity?


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## crabapple (Jan 1, 2012)

ImNotCrazyRU said:


> *"If you control the food, you can control the people." - Henry Kissinger*


This why I garden, & vote according to what I think will help me continue to do so.


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## Dakine (Sep 4, 2012)

VoorTrekker said:


> Carbon footprint?  Whatever.
> 
> The "suicide gene" combines with any pollinating plant and can therefore annihilate any type of flora, not just similar genus food crops. This can bring about the ancient prophesy of the mass starvation when all farms fail to produce food and famine hits the world!
> 
> Iceland seed bank with the ultimate state of the art security and storage techniques. Curiosity?


If that's the case, then that is really really bad. :gaah: :brickwall:


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## Jimbo777 (Jun 21, 2014)

Is our Government working on starving us?

Yes of course!

The Feds are buying up cans of freeze dried foods by the tons.

Once they have most of the ammo and most of the emergency food then we
will be eating out of their hands.

I know where to get #10 cans of Mountain House Spaghetti for only $16.99 a can with free shipping on orders over $100

Next year these cans could go for $30 to $40 a can who knows!

Anybody not storing up #10 cans of freeze dried food better rethink their prepping strategy.

My 2 cents...


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## Zanazaz (Feb 14, 2012)

Davarm said:


> IMO, the government is setting the stage to control or eliminate the home gardener so that we will not be a wild card when the "food crisis" hits. They have Monsanto and other big Agra-Businesses controlling the seed, the federal govt. has laid claim to all water in the country and fuel will become so expensive our gardens will be limited only to what we can prepare with a shovel.
> 
> Yes, they are going to make sure we are all "screwed" equally when the food gets too expensive or too scarce to buy.
> 
> My answer to the question "Is The Government Trying To Starve Us", is "yes, if you dont march to the beat of their drum".


Heirloom seeds should be in everyone's stock of supplies. If not put it on your list. Then learn how to harvest seeds from a crop to use to plant the next years garden, because eventually you will run out of your stock of seeds.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

goshengirl said:


> Wish I knew of a use for the non-native hedge apple (osage orange) that we have all over the place - got TONS of those!


The wood is very hard, and has many uses besides firewood


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## crabapple (Jan 1, 2012)

LincTex said:


> The wood is very hard, and has many uses besides firewood


I agree & it sands & finishes very well,too.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

VoorTrekker said:


> Iceland seed bank with the ultimate state of the art security and storage techniques. Curiosity?


I think it is a good intention, but I can see multiple modes of failure when the theory is put into practice


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## goshengirl (Dec 18, 2010)

LincTex said:


> The wood is very hard, and has many uses besides firewood


I've gotten so that now when an osage comes down, I cut it up in slices 2" thick - I'm saving them to use as pavers for a patio/outdoor kitchen.


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

BillM said:


> Do I believe the Federal government would deliberately starve us? Of course not ! If that incompetent pack of Jackals were intentionally trying to starve us, we would all weigh so much they would have to wheel us around in wheelbarrows. It is what they do unintentionally that I worry about.
> 
> :dunno:


Uh, . . . we do have an obesity problem.


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## crabapple (Jan 1, 2012)

Geek999 said:


> Uh, . . . we do have an obesity problem.


I am with BILLM
Yes, we do have an obesity problem , but I think that the gov. has little to do with it.
When we were told we could grow up to be anything we wanted.
Some of us grew up to be Fat!
It is that simple.
If you are never hunger & always have more then you need, then you think it is you right to eat as much junk food as you want.

Children raised on fatty food like hamburger & fries...SUPER SIZED!:surrender:
We do not need the GOV. help on being fat.


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## ras1219como (Jan 15, 2013)

crabapple said:


> .
> 
> Children raised on fatty food like hamburger & fries...SUPER SIZED!:surrender:
> 
> We do not need the GOV. help on being fat.


That coupled with the fact that none of these kids play outside or do anything active means they get fat and stay that way.

I played outside for hours as a kid, I never sat inside unless it was too dark or the weather was too bad to play in the yard. Kids today spend hours sitting on their behinds in front of the TV instead of playing tag and riding bikes.

Adults do less manual labor and more paperwork/desk work than ever before.

It's a recipe for obesity.

Sent from my iPhone using Survival Forum. Please forgive typos.


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## Caribou (Aug 18, 2012)

I drove through the central valley of CA a couple weeks ago. I saw many fields that were fallow. Worse than that I saw many orchards that were dead and many more that were dying. These orchards take years to become productive. 

I also saw one billboard after another decrying the drought caused by the government letting water run into the ocean. These billboards were seemingly on every farm. My guess is that some farms had multiple billboards.


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## RevWC (Mar 28, 2011)

Caribou said:


> I drove through the central valley of CA a couple weeks ago. I saw many fields that were fallow. Worse than that I saw many orchards that were dead and many more that were dying. These orchards take years to become productive.
> 
> I also saw one billboard after another decrying the drought caused by the government letting water run into the ocean. These billboards were seemingly on every farm. My guess is that some farms had multiple billboards.


I would like to say I like this post. Just to sad to say.


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## lazydaisy67 (Nov 24, 2011)

I don't think it's productive enough to kill us outright by starvation. They can put all kinds of crap in our food to make us sick and then pharma can make money off of the drugs we need to survive. There are more pharma lobbyists than there are members of congress so, I'm thinking they have a little pull....
It's illegal in several states for people to choose to drink raw milk. This happens to be something that sticks in my craw because I have people calling me all the time asking me if I can sell them some milk. I have to reply 'no, because it's illegal in our state'. That makes me very, very angry that somebody else is able to tell Joe Q. Public that they may not, in fact, make a choice about what they put in their mouth. That doesn't even begin to touch on all the studies showing serious damage from GMO's and pesticides. I generally can't even talk about it without seeing red.


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## VoorTrekker (Oct 7, 2012)

Caribou said:


> ...I drove through the central valley of CA a couple weeks ago. I saw many fields that were fallow. Worse than that I saw many orchards that were dead and many more that were dying. These orchards take years to become productive...


Had to be I-5. Those billboards have been there since 2009. Largely ignored by the public and our legislature, elected by the people who ignored the billboards.


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## rugster (Mar 2, 2014)

They don't have to work on starving us we are doing a good job ourselves!

There are plethora of issues converging at the same time.....

-Global aquifer depletion and NO.. this isn't driven by global warming or even drought. 
It's simple food demand and population increases driving overuse with every major crop growing area the USA, China, India, 
are facing future critical issues

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...e-the-worlds-running-out-of-water-in-one-map/

-The demand for food, fuel, minerals, and other resources is set to explode beyond any possible way to be meet.
By 2030 China's middle class will be 4X that of the entire USA population (365 million 2030 est.)and India's will be 2X that of the USA and that's just two countries. The middle class in the world today is about 2 billion by 2030 it will be over 5 billion. All competing for the same modern consumer/consumption lifestyle food/meat, cars, electronics,

http://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapo...middle-class-four-times-larger-than-americas/

-Global population will continue to grow particularly in the poorest countries the African continent will go from 1.1 billion to 1.6 billion

http://www.blatantworld.com/feature/africa/total_continent_population_1950_to_2050.html

None of this accounts for famine, war & pestilence which I believe is inevitable it's simple a lineal assumption of where
we are and will be in the near future.

God help us!


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## Norse (Jan 30, 2010)

I would not say it was a "Government Conspiracy" but what the government allows the corporations and commodities brokers to do.

Just 40 years ago the United States could feed the entire world......But the advent of several factors....the one that stands out is the practice of food futures manipulation on the global stock market.

When you can build international wealth that can influence the direction of national political policy by manipulation of stock prices and making the "Right People" unimaginably wealthy....people starving somewhere are of no concern.


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

Norse said:


> I would not say it was a "Government Conspiracy" but what the government allows the corporations and commodities brokers to do.
> 
> Just 40 years ago the United States could feed the entire world......But the advent of several factors....the one that stands out is the practice of food futures manipulation on the global stock market.
> 
> When you can build international wealth that can influence the direction of national political policy by manipulation of stock prices and making the "Right People" unimaginably wealthy....people starving somewhere are of no concern.


a) There is no global stock market. There are numerous individual markets. b) Commodities in the US trade on a commodities futures market, not the stock market. It is a completely separate market. c) Manipulation on either the stock market, or the commodities market, is illegal. If you have any evidence that manipulation is taking place you have a responsibility to report it immediately to the appropriate regulator.


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## Norse (Jan 30, 2010)

Geek999 said:


> a) There is no global stock market. There are numerous individual markets. b) Commodities in the US trade on a commodities futures market, not the stock market. It is a completely separate market. c) Manipulation on either the stock market, or the commodities market, is illegal. If you have any evidence that manipulation is taking place you have a responsibility to report it immediately to the appropriate regulator.


No manipulation? LMFAO have you been living under a rock?

No global stock market? LOL yes that is why a insurgency in Iraq affects the stock market all over the world~!

All stock markets all over the world are linked to one another in every measurable way. If you do not consider that a "Global Stock Market" you are being ridiculously naive.

You do realize no US Representative or Senate member can be prosecuted for insider trading do you not? Why do you think that is?


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

Norse said:


> No manipulation? LMFAO have you been living under a rock?
> 
> No global stock market? LOL yes that is why a insurgency in Iraq affects the stock market all over the world~!
> 
> ...


No I have not been living under a rock. A bit of review of the forum would let you know I am very familiar with the workings of our financial markets. If you have any knowledge of actual manipulation, as opposed to some hallucination that manipulation is going on, IT IS YOUR OBLIGATION TO REPORT IT TO THE APPROPRIATE REGULATOR.

If you have not done so, then you are making false accusations, with absolutely no basis in reality.

I am familiar with the loophole Congress has given themselves. Insider trading does not constitute manipulation. It is another thing entirely.


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## kappydell (Nov 27, 2011)

Controlling food is a heck of a way of controlling people....very effective. Don't know if they would consciously do it though


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## rugster (Mar 2, 2014)

Geek999 said:


> a) There is no global stock market. There are numerous individual markets. b) Commodities in the US trade on a commodities futures market, not the stock market. It is a completely separate market. c) Manipulation on either the stock market, or the commodities market, is illegal. If you have any evidence that manipulation is taking place you have a responsibility to report it immediately to the appropriate regulator.


I agree regarding the stock market.

However, various markets... stock, commodities, FX trend each other and for a variety of reasons. For example, We actually get very little of our oil from the middle east but political pressure, manipulation pulls the price of oil up or down of all oil even domestic, Canada, Mexico, venezuela.

OPEC exists to manipulation oil production with it's members specifically to support price levels. Go ahead and report OPEC to the proper authorities or regulator and see what that gets you!

I agree with the OP that the markets all of them are manipulated


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## rugster (Mar 2, 2014)

kappydell said:


> Controlling food is a heck of a way of controlling people....very effective. Don't know if they would consciously do it though


No need to bother with food just control energy.

Oh wait it is!


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## BillS (May 30, 2011)

Yes, the federal government is working on starving us. Ethanol helps people around the world starve by forcing up world food prices. They're destroying the economy. Getting more and more people dependent on government. They're not requiring work searches in order to get food stamp cards.


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