# What to wear to the Apocalypses



## HozayBuck

*This is a subject I think we have all kind of slipped on, or maybe we just don't talk about it so I'm going to pretend it's all my idea :2thumb:

What to wear to the Apocalypses ? I think I'm pretty OK in a lot of the prep stuff but I'm really not.. when we have to start living rough then we need rough clothing... I have a young friend who's Special Forces in the Stans , and I have a picture of him in his gear, and he's all decked out with great gear but he's wearing gray Carhart bibs ! now I hunt in the same bibs except in tan but his gray ones really blended into the rocky background !!

This photo made me start thinking about what we wear.. as I said I hunt in bibs mine are insulated and I've worn them every winter in MT for the last 25 years !! the same set!!.. they are a tad bit tight in the gut  but they are still in good shape.. which brings the point of this..

I'm of the opinion that levies just won't cut it and that Carhart's will and bibs are much better then coveralls simply because they are easier to get into and out of..

When hunting in MT I wear sweat pants under them , if you spend the day in them doing nasty work you can just take them off at the door and stand them in the corner , you can work in dirty cloths and still be clean when you take them off... they are very tough and not easy to tear, they protect from briers and with padding in the knee just make things better ..

Carhart makes pants also and jackets and hip length coats.. they will keep you warm and protect your hide.. they come with or without insulation .. also your shirt stays tucked in lol..

I've mentioned having a pair of lace up boots since 73 I do, and they are still in very good shape, they are on the 3rd set of vibram heels and soles , the day I bought them in Alaska I set them on the open door of the oven and after getting them hot I rubbed mink oil into them and repeated it every once in a while.. the leather is still soft and while not water proof still keeps my feet dry unless I have to wade thru a creek..

Most of us will buy a gun or ammo and never think about covering our hide.. and how long it may be before somebody can make clothing again.. or boots...

I couldn't knit a wool cap if my life depended on it..which it may!!..

I won't go on with this but hope others will jump in.. it's a weak place in my preps and maybe yours... *


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## TheAnt

Very good post!

We all need good boots and tough clothes if you believe you are going to have to go any time without Wally World or Targei (Target?).

Ive never worn a "bib" since I was a wee lad though.... I absolutely LOVE my Cabelas boots though and mine usually last at least 5 years and I wear them EVERY DAY. A little soap and water, dry them, then apply mink oil and they are as good as new!


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## SixGunsRattlesnake

I keep a set of warm weather clothes, and cold weather clothes. Both pants, one is thicker and looser to make room for a set of thermals. Three layers is important. Thermals layer one.
Loose fitting cargo pants and shirt layer two
Then a set of carhart overalls and jacket. 
Cold weather waterproof boots and thick wool socks.

It's a pain to carry but I keep the lot in my BOV.

I fear no weather


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## JustCliff

I have to admit, I have way more clothes then my wife or daughter. Massive amounts of socks, underware and tshirts, all from holidays. Maybe 20 some pants that are put back. Many of those are in smaller sizes. I know I will loose weight. 
I have 3 new pair of boots, still in the box in the closet. My feet havn't changed in years. I have snagged all of my wife and daughters old work boots. They are still in good shape, they just get new ones every year or 6 months. 
I buy close out and end of season specials for winter things like thermals. My size is tough to get but, my wife and daughter wear very small so I buy the boys sizes. 
I think the only thing we really lack is gloves. Good gloves never seem to go on sale.


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## md1911

Good thought I have military issue fatigues. Their tough and u can get tjem cheap


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## mdprepper

:gaah: That was an eye opening post HozayBuck! Thank you for bringing it up!:beercheer:

I must say that this is an area I am truly lacking in! Time to start checking Goodwill and the thrift store!


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## Emerald

I just got hubby a pair of insulated carharts for the holidays(with my swagbucks thanks Pam!) and they only cost $67 thru Amazon.. he likes them so much that I may get myself a pair and my son and son in law and daughter.. that way we all have a pair of really nice outdoor clothes. 
I do have some nice hiking boots that are well made and about 10 years old and other than replacing the shoe strings and rubbing them with mink oil they still almost look new.. Now there is a thought.. freaking shoe strings will be a hot ticket item for the stash!)
I do know how to make moccasins and while I know the basics of hide tanning.. I have not done it.*yet*
Plus I have tubs of jeans that we have either out grown or the style went out or I just can't fit into and I do make quilts from them but with having that many in storage.. I think that I will probably lose weight and be able to fit back into many of them again.. see everything does have a silver lining.. :2thumb:


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## GaryS

Guess I'll have to get by in military chic. I still have three pairs of woodland BDUs, starched and ready for inspection. Two new pairs of Air Force boots, one pair sage green, lightweight Danners with GoreTex uppers, and a pair of standard issue desert tan. Still have two lined field jackets...one OD, and a waterproofed woodland pattern. Throw in the web belts, boonie hats and OD underwear, and I could almost pass for active duty! I even have several sets of OD fatigues left.

Cold weather wouldn't be a problem, as I still have my hiking gear from years ago...good Raichle boots, wool pants, down parka, and lots of layer stuff, but I'm too old to do much tromping around in the woods, so hunting gear isn't required. Also have several pairs of moccasins, shoes and lightweight boots, including a couple of new pairs of crosstrainers still in the box. Ditto for underwear and socks. If it seriously hits the fan, my clothing supply will be around long after I'm gone...but while I'm still around, I won't win any fashion shows.


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## Emerald

GaryS said:


> Guess I'll have to get by in military chic. I still have three pairs of woodland BDUs, starched and ready for inspection. Two new pairs of Air Force boots, one pair sage green, lightweight Danners with GoreTex uppers, and a pair of standard issue desert tan. Still have two lined field jackets...one OD, and a waterproofed woodland pattern. Throw in the web belts, boonie hats and OD underwear, and I could almost pass for active duty! I even have several sets of OD fatigues left.
> 
> Cold weather wouldn't be a problem, as I still have my hiking gear from years ago...good Raichle boots, wool pants, down parka, and lots of layer stuff, but I'm too old to do much tromping around in the woods, so hunting gear isn't required. Also have several pairs of moccasins, shoes and lightweight boots, including a couple of new pairs of crosstrainers still in the box. Ditto for underwear and socks. If it seriously hits the fan, my clothing supply will be around long after I'm gone...but while I'm still around, I won't win any fashion shows.


Your post made me remember that my hubby has two foot lockers of his old military uniforms and such..sure he is gonna have to lose some weight but the boy can fit in them and so can I.. haha.


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## DJgang

My bikini, it will make the zombies turn the other way.

In seriousness, I did get a good pair of winter hiking boots this year.


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## Genevieve

Yea, I or I should we ( hubby and I), have all sorts of different clothes. We have the heavy duck bibs, and also the non rip military clothes. We also have the different kinds of camo. We also have some CC Filson's clothes. Talk about heavy duty wear and tear clothes. They're the best. I love the chaps for walking through briars. It's what they're made for and they work like a charm.
Hubby has always worn earth tone clothes, but I've been working on replacing my more colorful things with the greens,gray and browns and darker reds.
I've been working on finding boots for different things.Also gloves.

We've been collecting socks and underwear for a couple of years now. Same with coats of different weights.
I've found a couple of linen shirts, long sleeve that work well at keeping me warm but dry fast when I sweat.

Of course folks down south wouldn't need all the winter gear that those of us more north would. But it just makes sense to have extra clothes and boots put back.


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## Jason

I prefer jeans from the thrift shops for day to day wear. Either a tshirt or button down shirt. I like the button down shirts for the extra pockets that they provide. I do have a pair of Carhartt bibs and a coat that were provided to me through work (read: free for me) and my own Carhartt coat. As far as boots, I like Timberland Pro boots but I have a pair of RedWings that has held up fairly well. When we hunt we'll sometimes wear Polypropylene underlayers, which are really hot and do a good job of keeping you dry.


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## TimB

Excellent point, HB. :2thumb: Being a hunter, I'm pretty well set but the wife could stand some cold weather gear (thermals and some bibs- she has several heavy coats w/ one being an AF parka). 

Tim


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## katfish

I don't want to sound like a salesman so I try not to plug specific brands. I must admit though that the "firehose" jeans Duluth Trading Co. sells are probably the toughest jeans I've ever had. They may not be the prettiest but they can take some abuse!


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## goshengirl

DJgang said:


> My bikini, it will make the zombies turn the other way.


:lolsmash: :lolsmash: :lolsmash:

Diet Dr. Pepper up my nose, thank you! lol 
(and I'm right with you - previously had not thought of a bikini for security purposes, but now I think I might....  )


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## Jezcruzen

Considering my age and location, I was thinking Speedo, lizard-skin cowboy boots, and a beanie with a propeller on top.

Agree with you, HB. While I wear cargo shorts seven months of the year, and jeans mostly at the other times, I do have Carrhartt canvas work pants and five pairs of boots. I watch for when durable work clothes goes on sale, usually as seasons change, and buy then. I was at Tractor Supply buying feed the other week and noticed they put most of their winter hats and stocking hats on sale. Bought four insulated stocking hats for $3 ea.  Same with boot socks, gloves, etc.

I shy away from the military stuff. Remember, it was low bid! Besides, I would rather blend in, and in my location jeans, cargo shorts, and Carrhartts do that. Oh... a NASCAR cap helps, too.


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## BillM

*I believe*

I believe I and my wife will dress down for that event!


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## DoubleXL

If there is anyone who cant afford the Carhartt jeans. C.E. Schmidt "sold at TSC" makes some that IMOH are just as good and cheaper. The only problem is finding ones in my size. It seems most jean company's have stopped carrying 44 waist by 36 inseam.
Looks like i will be adding the Duluth Co. to my new list of suppliers lol


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## Freyadog

One problem that I have is boots, well shoes in general but boots I need. I have neuropathy in my feet and have not been able to find a decent pair of good walking/hiking boots that I can stand to wear for more than just a few minutes. Anybody have the same problem and has found a good pair?


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## Emerald

DoubleXL said:


> If there is anyone who cant afford the Carhartt jeans. C.E. Schmidt "sold at TSC" makes some that IMOH are just as good and cheaper. The only problem is finding ones in my size. It seems most jean company's have stopped carrying 44 waist by 36 inseam.
> Looks like i will be adding the Duluth Co. to my new list of suppliers lol


Our TSC has a brand called "wolf" too and it is like the carharts.. I was wondering if your store carried them and what your take on them was?


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## NaeKid

HozayBuck said:


> *This is a subject I think we have all kind of slipped on, or maybe we just don't talk about it so I'm going to pretend it's all my idea :2thumb:
> 
> What to wear to the Apocalypses ? I think I'm pretty OK in a lot of the prep stuff but I'm really not.. when we have to start living rough then we need rough clothing... I have a young friend who's Special Forces in the Stans , and I have a picture of him in his gear, and he's all decked out with great gear but he's wearing gray Carhart bibs ! now I hunt in the same bibs except in tan but his gray ones really blended into the rocky background !!
> 
> This photo made me start thinking about what we wear.. as I said I hunt in bibs mine are insulated and I've worn them every winter in MT for the last 25 years !! the same set!!.. they are a tad bit tight in the gut  but they are still in good shape.. which brings the point of this..
> 
> I'm of the opinion that levies just won't cut it and that Carhart's will and bibs are much better then coveralls simply because they are easier to get into and out of..
> 
> When hunting in MT I wear sweat pants under them , if you spend the day in them doing nasty work you can just take them off at the door and stand them in the corner , you can work in dirty cloths and still be clean when you take them off... they are very tough and not easy to tear, they protect from briers and with padding in the knee just make things better ..
> 
> Carhart makes pants also and jackets and hip length coats.. they will keep you warm and protect your hide.. they come with or without insulation .. also your shirt stays tucked in lol..
> 
> I've mentioned having a pair of lace up boots since 73 I do, and they are still in very good shape, they are on the 3rd set of vibram heels and soles , the day I bought them in Alaska I set them on the open door of the oven and after getting them hot I rubbed mink oil into them and repeated it every once in a while.. the leather is still soft and while not water proof still keeps my feet dry unless I have to wade thru a creek..
> 
> Most of us will buy a gun or ammo and never think about covering our hide.. and how long it may be before somebody can make clothing again.. or boots...
> 
> I couldn't knit a wool cap if my life depended on it..which it may!!..
> 
> I won't go on with this but hope others will jump in.. it's a weak place in my preps and maybe yours... *


I still prefer to wear my god-given-clothing ... it was designed to last a life-time :kiss:


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## kappydell

i originally wanted the military look, but now I am doing the carhart outdoor work clothes thing - they are tougher and do not advertise that I am a 'survivalist'. After a little study of the commercial clothing with  concealed holsters, I added extra hidden 'pockets' for weaponry and other gear.
As for repairs, hand sewing is tedious but not hard, and most repair work uses only a straight stitch. You guys should learn to knit well enough to do a scarf, a cap of some type, and some mittens. I read that sailors back in the sailing fleets learned to make 'bump' caps (watch caps) to pass the time between ports doing something profiterable, and some made pocket money selling extras. I loathe knitting, but I did learn that much. Sweaters that are holey and torn can be unraveled and the yarn re-used, esp if it is wool. Poly yarn will re-knit too. Now I am working on learning to do socks.


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## DJgang

goshengirl said:


> :lolsmash: :lolsmash: :lolsmash:
> 
> Diet Dr. Pepper up my nose, thank you! lol
> (and I'm right with you - previously had not thought of a bikini for security purposes, but now I think I might....  )


Sawry :wave:


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## DoubleXL

Emerald said:


> Our TSC has a brand called "wolf" too and it is like the carharts.. I was wondering if your store carried them and what your take on them was?


I have never seen the "Wolf" brand. I was told by a worker that Schmidt is made by Carhartt. I've looked it up and cant seem to find anything confirming that. My take on the Schmidt brand is the jeans are good and have lasted just as long as my Carhartt jeans. That being said the coats and bibs and other insulated Schmidt clothes I have had a few problems with the zippers. And the insulation seems to lose its thickness. So i stick with Carhartt for my outer wear but buy Schmidt for jeans and shirts.
I hope this helped.


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## Jason

Our local TSC's all carry Schmitt but I've never noticed Wolf brand clothing. Definately something to watch for.


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## Hooch

Since I've spent many years on a local SAR team Im always on the lookout for tough outdoor clothes..
Places I've found good deals at are 2nd hand stores and garage sales. I've been lucky to find some great pieces, even some brand new for dirt cheap. Other clothing I've found are BDU's & 5'11 pants, used but still good. 
Something else to consider put probably be more under "gear" especially if you live around water is a wetsuit and PFD. Possible water engagement for either buggin in, out, or just for hunting/fishing will be usefull is one lives around lots of water.


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## HozayBuck

*I knew I could count on yawl to jump in !! I got to thinking about my old bibs and remembered they are Hall's not carhart , Halls is sold by WM.. so I've gotten a lot of years out of a cheaper set..

My issue with BDU's is they are too thin to last a long time in harsh use.. yea they work in combat but there is a constant resupply option..

I believe if my friend in the Stan thought the BDU's were tough enough he would be wearing them.. I know from my days in the Corps that normal issue don't cut it..

I have 5 pair of good broke in boots all broken in and while I won't live long enough to wear them out I know they will work for somebody years after I'm gone..

As for shopping at the Goodwill type stores... in my size? they never have a thing outside of the usual triple X Lime Green Leisure suits 

OH ! one last hint, you can spray your rough clothing with Scotch Gard for added protection..*


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## wildcat

HozayBuck,

You'd probably look pretty Snazzy rockin' the lime green leisure suit!

MZB's would probably leave you alone, too, thinking if that's all you got to wear, you probably don't have anything they want!

LOL! Ok, I'm done now. Just wanted a chuckle!


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## BillM

Maybe, I'll just wear the pink suit I got for my birthday, the one with the fur trim !


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## HozayBuck

*Both of you!!....:lolsmash::lolsmash:*


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## kappydell

The water gear did remind me of one of my best finds for being outdoors for long term....icefishing (neoprene) gloves. I can shoot and work in them without awkwardness, and they are so warm it is amazing! Learned it at icefishing protests way back in the day...i was the only warm person working the boat landings for 12 hrs shift in 5 degree (wind chill lower) weather. I recommend them highly.


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## ContinualHarvest

I was in the high country in North Carolina on my honeymoon and bought a Carhart sweat jacket. The zipper and cloth are excellent quality. Paid a lot more than what I'd pay for a Wal Mart knockoff but so far it's worth it. That led me to purchases a Carhart work style jacket. That thing is tough and warm. 
I want to have quality gear but not mark myself as "prepared" and therefore a target to less savory folks. I live in a farming community and all of the farmers back home in MD wear carhart so I'll fit in.


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## gypsysue

Here's some other suggestions and ideas on the subject:
http://www.preparedsociety.com/forum/f2/survival-clothing-what-get-716/

I knew I'd seen other threads about it!


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## HoppeEL4

> I still prefer to wear my god-given-clothing ... it was designed to last a life-time


Thanks for the warning Naekid, so when SHTF and we find ourselves passing the border, we'll cover our eyes!LOL

Sigh...I'll never get my husband to wear Carharts, he thinks they are too heavy and stiff, he wants to wear khakis all the time (even at work unloading containers). Guess that will be his fashion statement in event of an emergency, along with a holey t-shirt. Hey, I try.

Me, well I am a woman in the Pacific Northwest and brought up practical so, my clothing is already all toned down. However, most womens jeans now are made with the new "fashion denim" and it is nothing more than thin stretchy denim, not really tough, so I will keep looking for stuff in thrift stores of older styles of tougher material. I am unsure if Carhart makes anything in womens other than shirts, cutie jackets and sweatshirts.

I could wear some camo stuff, it would be fine if I can get hold of some. Lots of Cali yuppy types moved to our town in past decade, it would be fun to get some and go shopping in them and see the reactions.


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## mdprepper

HoppeEL4, Tractor Supply had Carhartt for women. Including pink bib overalls!


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## tccuba

Hey, can anyone tell what are the benefits of being a supporting, my guess being part of a community that want to change, and support for one another's preparedness

Todd

PS just installed this app yesterday


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## tccuba

Cont. I meant to say supporting member of this organization


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## gypsysue

I'm not afraid to put on a pair of men's Carhartt pants. In fact, most of the men's Carhartts fit better than the women's. The sleeves are always too short on the jackets, and the shoulders too tight. 

tccuba, welcome to being a "supporting member"! The main perk is getting those cool letters for your user name! lol Everyone else just has to become a supporting member in order to find out what other perks we get! Mwahahahaha! 

One of my favorites is the PM inbox that holds 25,000 PMs! I was tired of deleting PMs all the time so people could send me messages! 

Oh, and tcc, you can click "edit" after you post, and go back in and fix any typos or unfinished sentences, or whatever you want. You have about 24 hours before the 'edit' button disappears. Very handy. It's on the bottom right of your posts. Then after you make your changes, click "save".


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## HoppeEL4

mdprepper, we don't have a Tractor Supply here, only Coastal Farm and Ranch and their Carhart section for women in limited. I would not be against a mans coat, or sweatshirt, I just do not see how pants would fit the hips!! Mens pants are made straight, so I'd need to buy them larger, and hem, not sure I am going to try to hem that heavy of fabric, my machine barely does lightweight denim. I'll focus on good sturdy jeans, maybe use "Dye Out" and then dye them a natural shade. Voila', some cammo jeans.


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## LargoMike

Genevieve said:


> I've been working on finding boots for different things.


I gave my family steel-toed work boots as well as steel-toed jump bootd. I would like to also add biker or engineers boots as well one day.


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## headhunter

I insisted that the wife get a camo, insulated , hooded parka with a waterproof membrane. Last winter I couldn't get her to wear anything else. She liked being warm. The water proof membrane blocks the wind. She also got a pair of Cabelas kangroo insulated boots and poly pro underware. I couldn't get her to make the jump to wool socks, "They make me itch!" I tried to explain about virgin wool and marino wool, she is a little stubborn. She does own leather chopper mittens and a pair od Sorel pacs. I've been after her to increase the number of brasseres and underware she has put aside. (Buying winter parks for the grown daughters didn't use to be a problem- Colimbia, attached hoods, and 200 gram thinsulate insulation- some things were simple. Boots were from Sorel.)

An added advantage of a two piece winter suit is that if mother nature should call your jacket stays on should you answer and this is really nice in rain, snow, or low temps.. If you are so incline- so does your shoulder rig.


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## backlash

This guy looks like he's dressed for anything.


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## BillS

I'm bugging in so it's going to be casual day for the duration for me.


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## UncleJoe

backlash said:


> This guy looks like he's dressed for anything.


IT'S Naekid when he was a kid!!! Some things never change do they Naekid.


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## menehuni509

One thing that's available to Veteras only are the Stand Downs. All you need to be able to do is prove you are a Vet and you can get in. They have military surpluss there in the form of camo clothing, some cold-weather gear, sleeping bags and mats, packs and frames, boots, wool socks, an many other things. It's all free to Vets. 

There's a Stand Down coming up in Sandpoint, ID on June 16.

A couple of years ago (the last one I went to), dependants were also allowed to get stuff, but I've heard that is not the case anymore.

The best way to find out when and where the Stand Downs are is either looking it up on the Internet or asking at your local VA or Veterans Outreach.

Be aware that you cannot pick up stuff for yourself and another Vet who didn't choose to attend. My husband, who is also a vet, wasn't feeling well so he didn't attend and, even though I had his VA card with me, I couldn't get stuff for him. He plans on going this year.


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## Redtail

Many of you are probably a little too busy or too old for it, but my younger brother and I used to play this computer game called STALKER: Shadow of Chernobyl. It was a Russian-made game focusing on a group of illegal occupants of the Chernobyl exclusion zone decades after a second, fictitious explosion rocked the zone. Loosely based on the old Strugatsky bros novel, "Roadside Picnic". 

ANyway, while it was hard to simulate such in what was generally considered an action-horror game, it was implied that many of these so-called Stalkers (an acronym for Survivor, Thief, Adventurer, Loner, Killer, Explorer, Robber) spent much of their day-to-day existence simply trying to weather the Zone's harsh and often bizarre conditions, often aided specifically by components and modifications made to the clothing and equipment they wore. 

THat got us thinking. 

How hard would it be to make a "uniform" for the apocalypse? One outfit containing a couple layers designed to afford an individual with comfortable protection from the elements, particularly rain, mud, and cold (as one could always peel it down and wear less if it gets too hot), and perhaps work in some level of protection against both combat and environmental hazards?

My plan is to try to make something like this and try it out. The plan is to manufacture a bodysuit out of Simpatex or Gore-Tex, reinforce wear areas with a heavy-denier Nylon or Cordura, protect important arteries and vital body parts from animal bites, slashes and sharp objects with soft armor made from aramid or ballistic Cordura, waterproof all of the seams, add in a hood, then manufacture an outer layer containing a light anti-shrapnel/light anti-ballistic protective vest and general purpose load bearing harness designed to distribute survival gear's load across the hips, legs, back and shoulders evenly and comfortably. 
You could theoretically trade the breathable Gore-Tex or Simpatex with a siliconized synthetic cloth and wear a cotton under-layer if you wanted to trade comfort for chemical protection, but the idea was to have a suit that you could wear for an extended period as opposed to having to take it off after fifteen minutes because you're dying in your portable sauna.


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## Ration-AL

Redtail said:


> My plan is to try to make something like this and try it out.


sounds cool, but you could never market it, you're talking about $$$$$ in materials alone , a finished ready to sell product would be a jacket in the 2-3k range, sure some gucci stuff goes for that much but i don't buy that either.

that said, if you go through with this make sure you post up some pics, i would love to see this, i would add though that you should throw a wool poncho type thing over the top of it all, as being seen walking around with a jacket like that could easily get you killed , also let us know if you come up with a uniform that's not made from space age materials that we can put together in our own homes.

All of my gear right now is mountaineering gear so bright colors so people can find your corpse if needed, i'm currently looking to pick up a full set-up of either black or green gear, my bright blue and red jackets/packs and such isn't going to do me any good as far as trying to hide goes!


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## Turtle

Regarding the armored uniform idea, it occurs to me that you could fairly easily retrofit nearly any style of clothing by sewing pockets on the inside to hold protective panels. My inspiration for this is the design of ballistics vests carriers, which have zippered or velcro pouches to hold the panels in place.

Since ballistic-grade Kevlar is tough to come by (and not rated for puncture resistance, in any case), it may even make sense to use a dense plastic to protect sensitive areas, as mentioned above. These could even be molded with a heat gun, would not be as heavy as metal, and would provide protection from slashing attacks and animal bites.

However, before you go crazy with armor, remember Ned Kelly.


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## paguy

I was thinking if the shtf that I would wear a jock strap and shower shoes.


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## Redtail

Ration-AL, I agree. I wasn't really planning to market this, it would be a short-run product made for myself, my brother, and a small handful of close buddies, each one tailored to the specifics of their survival loadout. 
It would also be fun to make! Creating things like that is so much fun, especially when you can actually *use* the finished product. 
THere would probably be an extra weather layer over the top, likely a shelter-half poncho. This would simultaneously look ratty and cheap, and very effectively hide the shape of any equipment underneath.
As far as space-age materials? Gore-Tex is waterproof and breathable, and can be had cheap in bolts from time to time. I was planning to "disassemble" an inexpensive surplus flight suit that fit comfortably and use the fabric panels to make my pattern. COrdura and Nylon aren't too difficult to come by, but expensive in bulk. 

ANd yeah, Turtle, I agree about the protective inserts. A hard plastic or aluminum alloy plate might work well, especially very lightly padded with neoprene on the inside. 
What I was thinking of trying out, was an aramid blend encased in an epoxy-base resin. Vacuum bagged, multi-layer, to minimize the resin and maximize the aramid fiber. I'm hypothesizing that multiple layers of a thinner fabric in the resin matrix would improve resistance to flex damage and improve ablative strength. 
ANd yes, Ned Kelley. That's why I was only aiming to protect vital and vulnerable areas. Soft armor on the inside of the thighs and underarms, POSSIBLY a lightweight gorget plate to protect the throat, light armor for the wrists, torso and pelvis. Plastics and aramid composites would be cool for that, as metal affords more protection than I anticipate needing at the expense of more weight than I anticipate wanting to carry.
If I have to engage a target carrying a gun, I'm in trouble anyway, and my survival is more likely going to depend on my ability to hide, to evade, or to get the first shot off in worst-case. 
Knives are often scarier, as are sharp pieces of debris. 
TO that end though, polyacrylic or plexiglass could be an effective lightweight anti-slash plate. ANd acrylic-type plastics are thermoplastic!

Ooh, this is getting exciting. I think I'm gonna start working on this once summer projects are out of the way. This is going to be fun!


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## Turtle

I feel as though I have mentioned this before, but I will say it again:

Never underestimate the wisdom of the ancients. Yes, space-age materiels are great, but don't discount the utility of a good wool cloak. Use natural vegetable dyes and it will help to approximate the coloring of the landscape around you, and if you leave the natural oils in the wool, it will remain naturally water repellent.


----------



## LdMorgan

I banished blue from my post-apoc wardrobe because it is such an eye magnet in the woods. 

My basic plan is to dress like an underpaid lumberjack in grubby greys and tans and avoid the military/well prepped/tactical look as much as possible.

For my emergency camo needs, I sewed up a baggy jumpsuit & hoodie out of salvaged nylon tent material. I used a medium-green ripstop for the base layer, and then patched it over with 3" leaf cutouts in several shades. Some dyed, some not. The leaves don't do 100% coverage, and are strongly sewn at only one attachment point, so they fluff & bush out nicely when I crouch. They break up my shape rather well.

I think of it as a poor man's Ghillie, without all the hours of work necessary for a real one.

It's all flimsy nylon so it won't last forever, but it was cheap to make, it's quick & easy to put on, and it packs down smaller than a loaf of city bread.

For entertaining, I prefer something off-the-shoulder in a chic .308.


----------



## alwaysready

LdMorgan said:


> I banished blue from my post-apoc wardrobe because it is such an eye magnet in the woods.
> 
> My basic plan is to dress like an underpaid lumberjack in grubby greys and tans and avoid the military/well prepped/tactical look as much as possible.
> 
> For my emergency camo needs, I sewed up a baggy jumpsuit & hoodie out of salvaged nylon tent material. I used a medium-green ripstop for the base layer, and then patched it over with 3" leaf cutouts in several shades. Some dyed, some not. The leaves don't do 100% coverage, and are strongly sewn at only one attachment point, so they fluff & bush out nicely when I crouch. They break up my shape rather well.
> 
> I think of it as a poor man's Ghillie, without all the hours of work necessary for a real one.
> 
> It's all flimsy nylon so it won't last forever, but it was cheap to make, it's quick & easy to put on, and it packs down smaller than a loaf of city bread.
> 
> For entertaining, I prefer something off-the-shoulder in a chic .308.


What the well dressed sniper will be wearing post SHTF.:2thumb:


----------



## headhunter

The archer, Chuck Adams, before he became famous recommended blue jeans and a plad shirt/ jacket to disappear in the woods.. he liked plads ability to disrupt the human form. When he became famous and was sought after for endorsements he too begsn with the camo.


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## BillM

Daniel Boone hunted in hostle indian territory and prefered black buckskins and a black felt hat.

If you take a good look at the forrest you will see a lot of black shadow areas.

His hint for spoting indians was not to look for the indian but to look for the straight shape of the indian's gun barrel.


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## hiwall

I hike alot. If things go bad I could never own enough shoes/boots. Yes they do wear out.


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## Ration-AL

Turtle said:


> but don't discount the utility of a good wool cloak.


^ i was planning on making a wool poncho to go over the top of everything, i can have my sweet duds on underneath and still look ratty on the outside, plus i just loooveeee me some wool, lol



BillM said:


> If you take a good look at the forrest you will see a lot of black shadow areas.


yeah and this is why i was thinking i should go all black, you can grab and attach some local brush around you to get the greens and tans but finding black is much harder to do and add.

did someone already mention making gaiters from garbage bags to go over your nice hiking boots as well?


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## TheLazyL

Underwear? Really? 

Seriously. Y'all think underwear is a necessity and are stocking up on it?


----------



## Turtle

headhunter said:


> The archer, Chuck Adams, before he became famous recommended blue jeans and a plad shirt/ jacket to disappear in the woods.. he liked plads ability to disrupt the human form. When he became famous and was sought after for endorsements he too begsn with the camo.


That's how tartan (plaid) first started out; this modern misconception that each family or clan has it's own particular tartan only dates to the 18th century.

The Scot's kilt was originally not an article of clothing, but a piece of equipment. At 9 yards long (hence the term, "the whole 9 yards"), it was big enough to wrap around yourself like a tent/sleeping bag. During he day, it was wrapped around the body, and the folds of materiel used like "cargo pockets" to help carry gear and distribute the weight. While scouting or hunting, the excess materiel could be pulled up over the head to act like a ghillie (incidentally a Scots word) suit and break up the human outline. The coloring came from whatever natural vegetable dyes were available in the region. In this way, the dyed thread better matched the surrounding landscape.

Once again, we need only look back to the wisdom of the ancients!


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## BillS

I'm bugging in. I'll wear what I wear now. T-shirt and shorts in the summer. T-shirt and sweat pants or jeans the rest of the year. I don't plan on being outside much. When I do I expect it to be dark outside.


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## PrepN4Good

Turtle said:


> The Scot's kilt was originally not an article of clothing, but a piece of equipment. At 9 yards long (hence the term, "the whole 9 yards"), it was big enough to wrap around yourself like a tent/sleeping bag. During he day, it was wrapped around the body, and the folds of materiel used like "cargo pockets" to help carry gear and distribute the weight. While scouting or hunting, the excess materiel could be pulled up over the head to act like a ghillie (incidentally a Scots word) suit and break up the human outline.


Thanks Turtle, very edu-ma-cational!


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## headhunter

The two grandchildren and I were "up north" for a couple of weeks and it was one of the worst years for bugs-mosquitos, deer flies. and horse flies. Their solution was "bug dope" mine was long pants and boots with a long sleeved light shirt; coupled with some bug dope. Yes, they will bite through the clothing where it is firmly pressed against the body. It is possible to cut down on the number of bites. Living in the country the boots/ long pants thing works well, perhaps not as cool as shorts and sandals; but you are pretty much good to good no matter what chore pops up next.
Underwear, it the summer-optional. In the winter-no cotton. When the thermometer dips below 50 degrees make mine long, please; polypro, thermax, any synthetic you bet. Machine wash and onto the drying rack. From the discount box stores for every day wear. When it gets a mite colder the heavy weight military, fleece, or the more expensive stuff from Cabelas. When it is below zero cover it with heavy wt. wool, or bibs with a water proof membrane and thinsulate insulation. If it's colder than that, I think I should find shelter, unless it's deer season.
"---the best way to insure the peace is to prepare for war," George Washington= 2nd inaugural address


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## LongRider

Same thing I have on today. Maybe I am missing something but why is anyone considering special TEOTWAWKI apparel. Will something change that will require special clothing uniforms?


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## kejmack

I'm getting all dressed up.... black dress, heels, etc. I mean, how many apocalypses do you get to go to in one lifetime.


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## LongRider

kejmack said:


> I'm getting all dressed up.... black dress, heels, etc. I mean, how many apocalypses do you get to go to in one lifetime.


I want pics. With an AR hanging off of the shoulder, that would be hot. Maybe add lil back up piece strapped around the ankle

Now of course kejmack will tell us they are a 350lb retired bull rider :gaah:


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## LongRider

Deleted to many posts


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## LongRider

Freyadog said:


> One problem that I have is boots, well shoes in general but boots I need. I have neuropathy in my feet and have not been able to find a decent pair of good walking/hiking boots that I can stand to wear for more than just a few minutes. Anybody have the same problem and has found a good pair?


Try Whites boots custom handmade from a mold (called a last) of your foot. 100% absolute no questions asked satisfaction guarantee. I have some seriously messed up feet, with broken bones that were not set properly and these things are nothing short of a miracle. One of the features of their boots is their Patented Arch Ease™ Support, feels like you are standing on a row of quarters when you first get them and will hurt like hell if you wear the boots for to long at first. Break them in as directed, takes about a week and my bet is you will be amazed as I was how long I can be on my feet on any terrain without any leg foot fatigue or pain. Fit my feet like a glove and are more comfortable than being bare foot.

Bought my first pair fifteen years ago and have them on right now. I have worn them most every day for the past fifteen years, and they are as good as the day I bought them. When they say built to last a life time they mean from the day you buy them until they day you are buried.

Whites Smoke Jumpers and Whites Loggers have been the number one choice for loggers and forest fire fighters here in the Pacific Northwest for over a 100 years.

I am not associated or affiliated with Whites Boots in any way. Just a very satisfied customer. I think quality boots are an essential piece of survival gear. Whites makes boots you can stake your life on as thousands of loggers and firefighters do every day


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## Turtle

LongRider said:


> Same thing I have on today. Maybe I am missing something but why is anyone considering special TEOTWAWKI apparel. Will something change that will require special clothing uniforms?


I think it is really just a question of form following function; there are any number of things that I would carry/wear in a crash situation that are unnecessary/unrealistic currently. My aforementioned wool cloak being a perfect example: I don't need one now, but it would be on my short list of things to grab before hitting the road.


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## kejmack

LongRider said:


> I want pics. With an AR hanging off of the shoulder, that would be hot. Maybe add lil back up piece strapped around the ankle
> 
> Now of course kejmack will tell us they are a 350lb retired bull rider :gaah:


Nay, I keep my backup piece in my garter! :2thumb:


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## lefty

kejmack said:


> I'm getting all dressed up.... black dress, heels, etc. I mean, how many apocalypses do you get to go to in one lifetime.


a good pointed heel is a dangerous weapon.


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## lefty

kejmack said:


> Nay, I keep my backup piece in my garter! :2thumb:


a walther PPK I trust


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## BillM

I'm wearing my pink suit, (the one with the fur trim), I got it for my birthday and I ain't leaving it behind !


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## lefty

BillM said:


> I'm wearing my pink suit, (the one with the fur trim), I got it for my birthday and I ain't leaving it behind !


zombie pimp camo I like it.


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## LongRider

Turtle said:


> I think it is really just a question of form following function; there are any number of things that I would carry/wear in a crash situation that are unnecessary/unrealistic currently. My aforementioned wool cloak being a perfect example: I don't need one now, but it would be on my short list of things to grab before hitting the road.


Point taken, as we are becoming self sustaining life will continue as usual for us. Which is why I was wondering



kejmack said:


> Nay, I keep my backup piece in my garter! :2thumb:


:beercheer: Excellent. Glad you my posts as intended


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## TragicNancy

JustCliff said:


> I have 3 new pair of boots, still in the box in the closet. My feet havn't changed in years. I have snagged all of my wife and daughters old work boots. They are still in good shape, they just get new ones every year or 6 months.


I'm thinking you need to get those boots out of the closet and break them in. I have read several articles in which they suggest doing this. This may not have occurred to me had I not read the suggestions in the articles, but they pointed out that you don't want to be breaking in brand new boots during shtf. Oh just imagine the blisters!


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## Jimmy24

Well I have all my old FR shirtrs, long and short seleved. Button and pull over. Also have a FR coverall. I actually had planned on tossing them when I retired, but glad I didn't. Also have 4 GOOD pairs of boots; climbing, hiking and dielectric. Not that they will be needed, but I still have 'em...

I have many pairs of cargo shorts and pants along with blue jeans. 

Clothes wise, I could go 10-15 years without buying....

Jimmy


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## LongRider

TragicNancy said:


> I'm thinking you need to get those boots out of the closet and break them in. I have read several articles in which they suggest doing this. This may not have occurred to me had I not read the suggestions in the articles, but they pointed out that you don't want to be breaking in brand new boots during shtf. Oh just imagine the blisters!


The boots I have on now are the same boots I have worn every single day for the past fifteen years and are as good as the day I bought them. I reasonably expect them to last another fifteen years with an occasional sole replacement. They take awhile to break in but have never ever given me blisters and fits as comfortable as a glove. They are in fact often more comfortable to wear than being bare foot. 
Buying cheap off the shelf boots is one of the biggest wastes of money I can think of and what happens when you can no longer replace the of the shelf boots? As an example a $100 pair of boots that last one or two years will have cost me $750 to $1,500 over the last fifteen years. That is a lot more than what you pay for a top quality hand made custom boot.
IMO investing in quality boots hand made to fit your feet will save you lots of money and serve you far better than cheap off the shelf $100 boots
That said I do agree I have a spare pair that I too have broken in just n case the ones I am wearing get cut or damaged in some way


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## Sentry18

I have enough 5.11 clothing to get me through the-event and well into the recovery (if there is one). I like the stuff and it wears well. Most of it is in coyote brown or OD green, colors that blend well into the local countryside. Of course if I am on duty when "it" happens then I will be wearing basic black and kevlar. I will also have a lot more Class III weapon related options. 

My brand of choice when it comes to boots is Original Swat. I really like them and their durability is well above average.


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## BillM

I have plenty of clothes in my present size and plenty more that will fit me when I lose thirty pounds .


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## machinist

I need to weed the trash out of my clothing collection, so I can find what I want when I need it. Got plenty of stuff and more, but if I can't find it, might as well not have it... 

We shop a lot at the milsurp store, Goodwill, and Tractor Supply. Not much formal wear in my things, but I ain't a formal kinda guy.


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## 101airborne

katfish said:


> I don't want to sound like a salesman so I try not to plug specific brands. I must admit though that the "firehose" jeans Duluth Trading Co. sells are probably the toughest jeans I've ever had. They may not be the prettiest but they can take some abuse!


As far a "jeans" I agree they are ugly as mud but very tough. I've got a couple pair. Otherwise I've got several options. Several sets of ACU both urban and woodland military sets, some old woodland BDU's, some carhartt bib's and coveralls, along with some sub artic military stuff. But mainly I have military issue footware.


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## boomer

I totally agree with a number of pairs of well broken in sturdy shoes/boots, closed toed and temperature appropriate. Real leather also as they wear well and protect feet.

The one thing I have not seen mentioned is wash/dryability of clothing. I find that in any potential SHTF senario I will not likely have my hot water heater or automatic washer/dryer. Clean clothing is a signifcant health factor when dealing with contageons and parasites. Hot water wash is also necessary if there is any potential parasitic problems (lice, bed bugs, etc). 

Even with a child or children in school it is occasionally a good idea to quarantine outerwear and have them change thier clothing immediately upon returning home. There is also the oiled hair routine that minimizes the likelyhood of head lice.

Finally there is the likelihood of cooking and heating being done with wood or other solid fuel fires. Natural material clothing stands up best to hot sparks, and is generally the easiest to repair.


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## LongRider

I too am a big fan of natural fibers and up until recently preferred silk over all other fabrics for my base layer but the past few years I have become a big fan of synthetic base layers that use silver fibers like Medalist SilverMax, Under Armour, X Scent, Silver Shield, Scent-A-Way Tech 4 clothing and others that make their garments with silver fibers. The silver fiber clothing is quite effective at killing bacteria, viruses and fungi and reducing odors, when worn next to the skin. The stuff is amazing and when you are away from a shower or clean cloths for days an absolute life saver.


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## pandamonium

For pants I like the Dickies canvas work wear. Heavy duty, wears well and lasts a long time. I have 2 pair in an olive drab color and 2 black. I wore each pair for a bit to break them in, (them dickies are stiff!! :congrat
Boots, I have about 4 pair, work, hunting, hiking, muck, the muck are 2400 gram of thinsulate. About 12 pair merlino wool socks. A bunch of baselayer stuff, mixed synthetic and natural. Gloves, 3 pair cold weather, need some more. And a butt-load of t-shirts. Insulated coveralls, carhart jacket, 4 heavy winter coats (mostly bright colors though). I'm sure there is more that I can't think of right now. My arse is draggin tonight. Oh, wool sweaters, a couple.


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## greigbosh

As far as i know, the best way to suit up when it strikes is to have a emergency survival bags. Because of this, we should also have a survival techniques for us to be aware and survival food is very important.


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## dannyboy721

*An additional note........*

Hi all,
Reading through this thread, I've seen some similar notes reflected throughout >>> That being the idea to not look "Too Military" with your Survival/prep clothing & I DO so agree, but in that light I would add that there some really awesome Heavy duty camouflage Hunting clothes & gear out there that will provide great weather protection, be very durable & considering the "camo-patterns" that are available today - provide plenty of 'you can't see me' clothing = without looking overly _Military_. I have quite a lot of various stuff, from actual military issue - to 5.11 Tac clothing - Hunting gear & footwear, and I know I'll still probably need more. Another comment though (I've heard it mentioned...) doOOOon't forget the importance of good quality SOCKS! Now, does anyone happen to know if Carhart makes anything in a hunting Camo pattern?!?


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## Friknnewguy

They don't have any cano pattern socks on their website that I could find.


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## RoadRash

In the Great White North we have 4 seasons of clothes plus our rainwear and coldweather gear for motorcycles, Good sturdy boots kodiak also rain boots hiking boots and Jesus footwear sandals , I have my oil skin jackets very good wanter and wind proof, assorted mits n gloves battery operated and a couple pairs battery heated socks. Leather MC goods no offshore crap all canadian made. Extra hats sunglasses n scarves. Scary thing is clothes for kids n grandbabies as they are still growing. 
My favorite item a true. Canadian East Coast fishermans hat and its not yellow buy black, I most likely love it cause wife hates it .......


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## Diego2112

The clothing aspect is one that I'm working on at current. I DO like BDUs, just because of how durable they are. By the same token, my Dickie work pants are (at least in my experience) just as durable.

Never thought of bibs before I saw this thread-although it DOES make good sense.

Boots all 'round for the family are a must, and if you've little ones, you may want to get larger sizes for them to "Grow into," as it were.

Right now, though, I'm not nearly as clothing prepared as I would like.


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## musketjim

Because I spend a large amount of time outside up here clothing is crucial because I think you could freeze to death before you die of thirst or hunger. I love my Filson wool bibs they are heavy when wet but keep me warm. Wiggy's makes an excellent parka, pulled my fat out of the fire on Denali (Mt. McKinley for non-alaskans). I like silk base layers but poly-pro seems ok as long as you don't stink them up seems like they never wash clean. I seem to be able to go with fairly light Columbia boots because I keep pretty mobile. I change my clothing requirements depending on if I'm competing in a snowshoe race or skiing where a energy output is high, or slowly sledging a big load into my BOL because sweat kills. No cotton in the winter. Boots and sock combinations are always a hassle:gaah: Seems like I never get them quite right winter or summer, always experimenting. Bunny boots are the best winter boots IMO though. Make sure you have spare clothes with you, going through the ice makes you real cold real quick. Then you have your significant others, young and old who are not normally out in the conditions you are used to (they have half a brain) so many opinions and excellent thots kind of like firearms. Get out and try whatever you can and buy what works. Good thread.


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## FrankW

I dont understand the obession about not looking too military.

The underlying arguement thats _sometimes _implies "you dont want to look to well armed "others want to take your guns" is straight out of the mainstream liberals narrative and living in this society we cant help but sometimes buy into those myths as well.

The liberal narrative "teaches" us, that when you have a gun your more likely to be killed by it or that sometone will take it away form you.

But if someon has overwhelemd me so much that he can use my own gun on me then I lost an dlost badly anyway. But being well armed makes you less likely to get into that postion in the first places.
And looking threating by aggrissive clothing is not a bad thing.

Most folks will make a wide berth around a couple of dangerous looking men, and NOT be provoked into attacking in the hope of getting their stuff as mainstream culture would have us believe.

So I will wear my most pracical clothing. 
probably ACU pants with a leather jacket ( which also serve as light armor against a attmped cut or a hit with a blunt object.
Military boots probably my old black ones.


----------



## Diego2112

BlueZ said:


> I dont understand the obession about not looking too military.
> 
> The underlying arguement thats _sometimes _implies "you dont want to look to well armed "others want to take your guns" is straight out of the mainstream liberals narrative and living in this society we cant help but sometimes buy into those myths as well.
> 
> The liberal narrative "teaches" us, that when you have a gun your more likely to be killed by it or that sometone will take it away form you.
> 
> But if someon has overwhelemd me so much that he can use my own gun on me then I lost an dlost badly anyway. But being well armed makes you less likely to get into that postion in the first places.
> And looking threating by aggrissive clothing is not a bad thing.
> 
> Most folks will make a wide berth around a couple of dangerous looking men, and NOT be provoked into attacking in the hope of getting their stuff as mainstream culture would have us believe.
> 
> So I will wear my most pracical clothing.
> probably ACU pants with a leather jacket ( which also serve as light armor against a attmped cut or a hit with a blunt object.
> Military boots probably my old black ones.


There is much truth to this-I actually used the "Looking tougher than I am" tactic quite successfully in high school-my first day in a public school (11th Grade, for them what care) went rather poorly-got quite beat up.

Next day, trench coat.

Never had another problem.

...

Then again, I was also voted several superlatives that didn't make it into the year book-but that's not the point...

Point is, if you LOOK like the man to beat, often times people will just assume that you ARE, and therefore leave you alone.

If you LOOK like easy prey, they're going to THINK you're easy prey, and therefore attack you.

Of course, you've always got that one random arsehat who thinks the man to beat is the man he HAS to beat, so yeah...


----------



## FrankW

I think you used a key phrase here:

Dont look like prey .


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## Diego2112

BlueZ said:


> I think you used a key phrase here:
> 
> Dont look like prey .


That is quite true-I did say that (or something very like it). And that's the main thing.

The Rule of a World Without Rule of Law will be the strong take from the weak.

Don't look weak.


----------



## invision

Diego2112 said:


> That is quite true-I did say that (or something very like it). And that's the main thing.
> 
> The Rule of a World Without Rule of Law will be the strong take from the weak.
> 
> Don't look weak.


I think that is true even today... If you look like a victim or an easy target, then you are an easy target.

I was in a very bad area of Memphis on Labor Day Weekend, had to go to Walmart while I was up there on Beele St one night getting away from the casino for a while. Anyway, rough rough area... Didn't think anything about it cause I won't be a victim.


----------



## LongRider

BlueZ said:


> I dont understand the obession about not looking too military.


I believe the reasoning is two fold. Some of it comes from Selco's war time SHTF experience. Those that looked well equipped and or well armed were targeted by snipers. Rather than being a deterrent appearing well equipped and/or well armed was a bullet magnet. Second is simply the grey man theory, the concept that blending in, going unnoticed, being invisible as possible is a sound defensive strategy. In fact isn't that what cameo/OD greens or tans is all about? To make yourself blend in, go unnoticed and as invisible as possible? The problem arises because in an urban environment instead of blending they make you stand out like a neon sign especially to those looking for high value targets.


----------



## Tweto

LongRider said:


> I believe the reasoning is two fold. Some of it comes from Selco's war time SHTF experience. Those that looked well equipped and or well armed were targeted by snipers. Rather than being a deterrent appearing well equipped and/or well armed was a bullet magnet. Second is simply the grey man theory, the concept that blending in, going unnoticed, being invisible as possible is a sound defensive strategy. In fact isn't that what cameo/OD greens or tans is all about? To make yourself blend in, go unnoticed and as invisible as possible? The problem arises because in an urban environment instead of blending they make you stand out like a neon sign especially to those looking for high value targets.


Being the "gray man", means being the "gray man" in your surroundings, thus the term "gray man". So if you are in a urban environment and dress like every one else, how does that make you stand out?

The mistake could be thinking that the "gray man" has a standard uniform. In a previous life i had to wear a suit to work. If I wore blue jeans to a business meeting I would have 100's staring at me. When I made field trips to dangerous locations the local business associates would always recommend how to dress to fade in. We had some areas where we would not drive my rental car, but we would trade for one of the older local service vans. We even had quarterly crime reports from trouble areas including foreign country reports on what to bring and carry on your person, and yes there were areas that we never went to.

Sorry for being a little wordy.


----------



## LongRider

Tweto said:


> Being the "gray man", means being the "gray man" in your surroundings, thus the term "gray man". So if you are in a urban environment and dress like every one else, how does that make you stand out?


Your definition of grey man is spot on. What I was saying is that since military attire and cameo is not typical urban attire, wearing it would make you stand out. You should instead dress like the vast majority of people in your area, IMO.


----------



## BillM

Carlos Hathcock said, You can always tell the General from his troops because he loves to point.

You go here , go there , ect.


----------



## Redtail

Being invisible is best, whether you're better suited to doing that by looking indistinguishable from the multitudes, or by literally disappearing into an otherwise uninhabited environment with good camouflage and good fieldcraft skills. I think it depends on where you are at the given time, as to what precisely you do. 

A good all-around would be gray or neutral khakis and a neutral flannel top. Good enough to disappear in the woods if your fieldcraft is good, and good enough to disappear in a mob in most circumstances. 

There's no "best" way to go, otherqwise we'd have figured it out and would all be doing it.


----------



## musketjim

Unlike many, I have spent more time and money experimenting with clothing than any other area of my preps. I am always searching for cold weather items that WORK and I will always use an unlimited amount of my budget to find it. I am outdoors constantly in all conditions racing or training for races as well as hiking into BOL which can turn into an all day and night grind at -30 just to see what works and what I can tolerate. In summer I raft, bike, climb, and hike many times in the same trip so it has to work. My Wiggy's parka pulled my fat out of the fire on Denali (Mt. Mckinley) several times. For normal winter operations I start with my tried and true polypro union bibs with a drop bottom. I prefer sleeveless. Got them from Guide Gear. If skiing throw some light windblocker type pants and jacket over top and I'm good. If icefishing I like my Filson wool bibs over top. For gloves I prefer system type setups where you have a liner that you can remove from the shell, gives you a lot of options. Smart Wool system gloves work well and Mountain Hardware Conduit mitts work well also, experiment with various liners until you get it right. Boots and sock combos, constant experimentation for me. Hi-Tec seems to work the best they have some mesh areas that seem fit in the right spots. Boots that are all leather such as some Danners and Rockys have torn my feet up so bad over the years that I really hate to try anymore. For BOL trips and winter bike trips I love NEO overboots. I wear larger sneakers with different sock combos and the unlined overboots and I'm good to go. One of the best investments I've made. BUY THEM! I've got clothing scattered all over the house, no one setup works for everything. Experiment and then buy a lot of what works.


----------



## FrankW

LongRider said:


> I believe the reasoning is two fold. Some of it comes from Selco's war time SHTF experience. Those that looked well equipped and or well armed were targeted by snipers. Rather than being a deterrent appearing well equipped and/or well armed was a bullet magnet.
> .


1) wartime conflict is simply not a comparison. There your job is to kill the most enemy as possible the highest rankign as possible.

in a SHTF situation you do NOT make a habit out of randomly attackign the dangeour speople around you. Thios who do wont last last..

I feel even in our community a bit of the liberal narrative that all maericans have internalized shines thru a bit with this.

Walk through a very tough neighborhood looking like a helpless person (old or female) and then do the same looking like abuilt tough guy.

There WILL be a difference.

The reason many folks here dont realize it because movies and our current "culture" dont support reality.

2) The "grey man theory" is nice for secret agents but has nothing to do with a TEOTWAWKI environment or even a pre SHTF atmosphere.

Go to the "communites" near the mexican border which I consider a pre-apocalytpic environment. And walk around dressed as a 150 lbs latte sipping birken stock and glasses wearing person.
And then try it as a 220 lb weight lifter wearing boots and a skull cap.

Option 2 will be a lot easier trip.


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## FrankW

LongRider said:


> Your definition of grey man is spot on. What I was saying is that since military attire and cameo is not typical urban attire, wearing it would make you stand out. You should instead dress like the vast majority of people in your area, IMO.


What you are talkign about is a non SHTF enviroenment. in a SHTF environement everybody dresses practical with the msot practical gear they cna find.. often thats military boots etc.

No one is talking about wearing a soldiers uniform with camo paint to starbucks.


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## headhunter

Last summer the SIL's guard unit invited families for an open house. In the tall trees the new urban camo sticks out like a sore thumb. Really good target definition for evil doers. 
Foot gear has changer from last falls leather boots and ultra thin polypro socks and midweight wool to the Sorrel packs and thermax socks topped by heavier wool. Little brother is different. After years of trying to keep warm in heavy wool socks and pack boots, he claims to be plenty warm in leather boots and lighter wool socks. Perhaps working long hours on his feet and always on the move have something to do with it. By reducing the amount of sweating , he stays warmer.


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## TheLazyL

I lean heavily towards German flecktarn camo shirts and faded blue jeans. Blends in almost anywhere except winter, then a white Pancho would come into play.


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## machinist

I don't plan to change what I wear every day. In a farm community, that is jeans, work shirt of some sort, work coat and thermals in cold weather, tough boots of some kind, and a ball cap. A bandana is handy for many things along with a lighter in your pocket, and something to eat in a jacket pocket. Vary according to the season and your habitat. The idea is to be comfortable, to blend in with both people and surroundings, and have durable clothing. Fashion statements and expensive brand names are for wannabes. 

A multitool on your belt is expected, or, a lockback knife and a pair of Vise Grips in a belt holster. Cellphones are optional. Tough work gloves stuffed in a pocket somewhere are sensible. Also having your hands toughened by working in the outdoors is even better.


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## Grimm

LOL! This was some of the first prepping I did for our family. As a costume designer clothes are my passion. I always make sure my DH has more than double the needed amount of clothes for work. He lives in his work boots and his Carhartt jacket. Since he is in construction he wears outdoor tough clothing that just takes a beating. The only think I need to work on for him is his welding leathers.

I am lacking in this area for my self. I have a set of good boots and a Carhartt vest but my clothing is more fashion based because of my job. As Carhartt starts their spring sales I'll gather more outdoor and winter wear.

Now, Roo has winter clothing, play clothing and tough outdoor clothing in various sizes for growing. I am lacking a good set of snow boots for her but we live by the beach so they can wait til the spring sales.


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## LongRider

My response to you was a polite answer your question. Your snide condescending know it all cracks are unwarranted, but if that is how you like to play, so be it. If you are going to play mister internet know it all tough guy consider, learning proper grammar and how to spell or at least use a spell checker. Mr internet know it all expert does not play very well when your post appears to be written by the affirmative action graduate from the special needs class. We all make typos and grammatical errors and misspell a few words but over a dozen misspelling is a bit over the top for a know it all.


BlueZ said:


> 1) wartime conflict is simply not a comparison. There your job is to kill the most enemy as possible the highest rankign as possible.


Consider having at least some clue about what you are talking about. If you do not understand or are unfamiliar with a reference perhaps you should ask rather than pollute the topic with your flatulent ASS-Umptions *Selco's war time SHTF experience*, is about his experience as a regular civilian citizen in Bosnia surviving in a city AFTER it had been annihilated and isolated from the world by war. Its infrastructure destroyed without any significant resources. There were no longer any police or military in the city. There was no military engagements as you erroneously assume. It is based upon his real life, real world, day to day experience. What do you base your asinine expert assumptions on? 
Selco discussed the importance of being a grey man. Being as invisible as possible. One example he gave was of a mild mannered pudgy CPA neighbor who became a sniper. Killing anyone who stood out appearing they had anything of value, nice clothes, good boots or shoes, weapon, pack, or what ever he wanted.


BlueZ said:


> 1)in a SHTF situation you do NOT make a habit out of randomly attackign the dangeour speople around you. Thios who do wont last last..


Contrary to your assumption, that pudgy little CPA and others like him survived stripping many "tough guys" of their belongings and lived to prosper


BlueZ said:


> Walk through a very tough neighborhood looking like a helpless person (old or female) and then do the same looking like abuilt tough guy.


Walk through? I grew up on Army bases and hard neighborhoods on the wrong side of the tracks all around the world. Since 1973 I have ridden with all kinds of clubs from outlaw 1% clubs to the Blue Angles (a national LEO motorcycle club). For twenty years I volunteered with our states most violent offenders in our maximum and super max prisons. I was one of the few civilians that walked the yard alone unescorted. Worked security from midnight to dawn on the Hill Top (a notorious gang infested area of Washington) walking through packs of bangers nightly. Not because I am a tough guy or bad ass. I have never been either but because bad ass tough guys knew to leave me alone. As you repeatedly suggest being or acting like some kind of tough guy. I have to disagree, my experience is that big buff weight lifter tough guys that acted as if they were bad asses tended to have their anal passages used as involuntary semen receptacles. While the truly hard dangerous men I have known tend to be grey men. Dressed to blend in, quiet, polite, soft spoken, confidant even gentle when appropriate, invisible until it was time for them to act. They are not flamboyant strutting tough guy target bad asses with sore asses you advocate being.

Do you even have a clue what a Grey Man is? In your ignorance, you make my point for me. Why blending in, being a Grey Man is advantageous. While standing out or looking like a victim makes you a target.


BlueZ said:


> Walk through a very tough neighborhood looking like a helpless person (old or female)


Exactly standing out looking out of place makes you a target. Being a greyman blending in appearing as if you belong or go unnoticed helps prevent you from being target.



BlueZ said:


> Go to the "communites" near the mexican border which I consider a pre-apocalytpic environment. And walk around dressed as a 150 lbs latte sipping birken stock and glasses wearing person.
> And then try it as a 220 lb weight lifter wearing boots and a skull cap.


Again perfect example of not fitting in. Your appearance drawing attention to yourself making you a target. Wearing attire that says you have something of value, or that you do not belong makes you a target. 
That you imagine that some unaffiliated lone white boy strutting through an economically depressed hispanic border community, would do so with impunity because he imagines himself to be some kind of bad ass speaks volumes about your lack of real world experience. But you know it all. PLEASE bet your life on that assumption. Do it. My bet is that the 12 year old with his Mac10 and Vatos behind every door in the hood gives a rats ass how buff tough or bad you think you are



BlueZ said:


> The "grey man theory" is nice for secret agents but has nothing to do with a TEOTWAWKI environment or even a pre SHTF atmosphere..


Granted you are the buff tough internet know it all expert. I suggest and hope that you follow your own advice should SHTF. Strut down the road being the big bad buff tough guy with your high end tactical attire and gear.

I will defer to my personal experience, reputable self defense trainers like Jeff Cooper, Clint Smith, Massad Ayoob and those like Selco who have actually survived real world, real life SHTF scenarios. Who all suggest that being low key blending in being a grey man avoiding being identified as a target or threat is a critical part of self defense. Unlike what you pretend being, most of us are not 220 pound buff bad ass tough guys. We find it prudent to avoid trouble, knowing the battles we avoid are the only ones we really win.

When SHTF I will be wearing exactly what I am wearing now, jeans, thermal, T-shirt, flannel/pendelton, Whites boots, decent jacket, UnderArmour socks and thermals underneath when called for. What works for me year round out here in the sticks on the homestead and allows me to blend in on the occasional trip to town. No tacti cool bad ass tough guy gear here.


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## headhunter

Long Rider, it is quite apparent that some have not grown where some a little older have. 
At times, I wonder if some contributers have been in an environment where their eye lids have frozen shut, if they've worked past the midnight hour 'cause the weatherman says you aren't going to get in the field tomorrow and the holding bin needs filling. I wonder if they've been 10+ miles down a two track road with snow and wind and you start to wonder how many trees are down between you and the main road or the temperature drops into the minus 20 somethin's and neither vehicle starts so ya throw the batteries in the camper and hunt , hoping they'll thaw out enough you can use the two to start one vehicle. Have they ever "daisy chained" two 4X4s to pull out a third?
Have you ever wondered if the have actually killed anything with their expensive toys?
I thank you again, I'm just old and cranky.


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## swjohnsey

LongRider is a badass, just ask him.


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## FrankW

LR: 


As for the typos: guilty as charged, maybe I'll even go back and edit them so they are easier to interpret properly which we evidently have a problem with.

If you actually took some care reading my posts "acting like a tough guy" was no where in there as a recommendation,... but "not looking like a victim" is,..... also I have no clue where your ethnic references are coming from either.

Maybe if I improve on my typos it will be easier 

I find its very amusing you accuse me of attacking you when I merely made counter point to the prevailing "conventional wisdom" and then you write a post thats just dripping with name calling. 

But a lot of internet tough guys feel personally attacked when someone disagrees and feel the need to act out like you just did, so I guess I just chalk it up to the nature of the internet, and I am sure you are a lot nicer in person than your previous post makes it seem.

I guess we have to just agree to disagree and I wish you the best of prepping.


Cheers,


PS: 
if you read my posts avoiding sniper fire by a military organization was nowhere addresed if it had been I would have made a point of specifying it.
I personally knew people who had lived in Bosnia during that time as I grew up not too far from there and don't get my info from internet heros but real world experience (how many countries have u been to? I been to 15) and a little common sense analysis.


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## FrankW

Sentry18 said:


> I have enough 5.11 clothing to get me through the-event and well into the recovery (if there is one). I like the stuff and it wears well. Most of it is in coyote brown or OD green, colors that blend well into the local countryside. Of course if I am on duty when "it" happens then I will be wearing basic black and kevlar. I will also have a lot more Class III weapon related options.
> 
> My brand of choice when it comes to boots is Original Swat. I really like them and their durability is well above average.


I also have some 5.11 gear and I enjoy it.

During a true SHTF though I might exchange my 5.11 shoes for my duty boots.
I just got the 2nd most expensive on the PX had, the Belleville Sabre.

I think it was worth it...they fit so well, even when I dont use orthop. inserts my foot (from a previous injury) doesnt act up much.

I also use the "trick" ( if you want to call it that) to buy my boots a little snug.
Often I feel the sizes that are recommended are too generous and I prefer my boots fitting like a glove.

This gives me less overhang and better "dexterity" with my feet.
I hate the disconnected feel that the current oversize guidance gives.

I dont mind a little discomfort the 1st 2 weeks breaking them in if the result has them nicely molded to my feet.

People nowadays often seems afraid of the discomfort in breaking in properly fitted boots and salesgirls seem to recommend larger sizes (I suspect) partially for this reason.


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## PackerBacker

BlueZ said:


> People nowadays often seems afraid of the discomfort in breaking in properly fitted boots and salesgirls seem to recommend larger sizes (I suspect) partially for this reason.


I learned that when I started going to a real shoe store instead of buying boots at the farm and barn store.


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## Grimm

PackerBacker said:


> I learned that when I started going to a real shoe store instead of buying boots at the farm and barn store.


Another reason sales people will recommend a larger size is that you may have a wide foot and they want the sale rather then send you to a store that has the wide size. My husband has very wide feet. Sales people were telling him he wore an 8 instead of a 7EE. While the 8s fit the width the first time he wore a 7EE he said the boots required less breaking in.


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## majmill

kappydell said:


> i originally wanted the military look, but now I am doing the carhart outdoor work clothes thing - they are tougher and do not advertise that I am a 'survivalist'. After a little study of the commercial clothing with concealed holsters, I added extra hidden 'pockets' for weaponry and other gear.
> As for repairs, hand sewing is tedious but not hard, and most repair work uses only a straight stitch. You guys should learn to knit well enough to do a scarf, a cap of some type, and some mittens. I read that sailors back in the sailing fleets learned to make 'bump' caps (watch caps) to pass the time between ports doing something profiterable, and some made pocket money selling extras. I loathe knitting, but I did learn that much. Sweaters that are holey and torn can be unraveled and the yarn re-used, esp if it is wool. Poly yarn will re-knit too. Now I am working on learning to do socks.


Likewise, I loathe knitting so I am now in the process of learning to crochet socks. I find it marginally easier. Since I plan to be bugging in I will continue to wear the clothes I have, and at my age they are all geared for comfort!


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## helicopter5472

Little off the subject but I found that those plastic vaccum seal bags work great for storing stuff not only does it save space but keeps it all clean...I also used to store dried food in them like rice and noodles makes the life span longer and keeps bugs out...just sayin..


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## MDsapper

i like the heavy duty blackhawk tactical pants, with my combat boots that are nice and broken in from my deployment to afghanistan


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## Grimm

helicopter5472 said:


> Little off the subject but I found that those plastic vaccum seal bags work great for storing stuff not only does it save space but keeps it all clean...I also used to store dried food in them like rice and noodles makes the life span longer and keeps bugs out...just sayin..


Be aware over time the 'vacuum seal' on those bags will fail. We use them to store our winter quilts and by fall the seals on the bags have popped.


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## Tank_Girl

What to wear to the Zombie Apocalypse?

Why a little black dress and my highest heels of course!

If I'm going to be slaughtering zombies in their droves I may as well look fabulous while doing it.

:rofl:

By the way.......does this .50cal anti-material rifle make my bum look fat?:laugh:


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## RevWC

Tank_Girl said:


> What to wear to the Zombie Apocalypse?
> 
> Why a little black dress and my highest heels of course!
> 
> If I'm going to be slaughtering zombies in their droves I may as well look fabulous while doing it.
> 
> :rofl:
> 
> By the way.......does this .50cal anti-material rifle make my bum look fat?:laugh:


Not at all you are looking Hot! :eyebulge:


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## mojo4

Tank_Girl said:


> What to wear to the Zombie Apocalypse?
> 
> Why a little black dress and my highest heels of course!
> 
> If I'm going to be slaughtering zombies in their droves I may as well look fabulous while doing it.
> 
> :rofl:
> 
> By the way.......does this .50cal anti-material rifle make my bum look fat?:laugh:


Ummm we need pics. Purely for scientific reasons. Yeah, science and stuff!


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## zookeeper

I'm not sure what to wear, but I know what not to wear...an orange jacket.


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## headhunter

But, if you did wear your blaze orange they'd have soo much less ammo when they rolled by here. (Just kidding!) 
After all, some say they'll have on pretty blue helmets. We wouldn't want to be underdressed.
Attempts at humor aside, how does one tell a "Oath Keeper" from a government stooge.


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## Mortblanc

headhunter said:


> Attempts at humor aside, how does one tell a "Oath Keeper" from a government stooge.


The Oath Keeper is the one that parks the truck of ammo where you can find it and leaves the keys in and the lojack off.


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## headhunter

Dang, maybe that would be a good excuse to by a .40 cal, please don't tell the wife all I need is a new barrel and a couple of mags. I could squeeze a .308 in the safe, maybe.
This darn preppin' is gettin' expensive, from bein' happy with revolvers and bolts ta ugly rifles snd short guns. I tell ya it's got me down on my hands and knees- crawlin' around lookin' fur the empty cases.
The wife's been puttin' by a couple of packages of underware an' socks, both wool and cotton.
Firearms Safety this week we did the section on survival. Hypothermia, we were reminded occurs more frequently between 30 an' 50 degrees. Beautiful day fur it. Misting with occasional rain drops, an' the temp is about 40+degrees with a slight wind, I walked the granddaughter to the county road where she gets on the bus at 7:00. She was wearin' her new Columbia insulated waterproof jacket and mud boots. I had thrown on my Carhartt canvas jacket. By the time I returned to the house the outside was darn damp. It was not a good choice fur stayin' outside all day with. The Thermax long ones and the heavy fleece shirt-jac felt good.


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## LongRider

headhunter said:


> Have you ever wondered if the have actually killed anything with their expensive toys?


Been my experience that those that have are not concerned about looking like tactical tough guys. A funny story about one of my clients in prison with the nick name "HeadHunter", that kind of goes along with what I have been trying to say on this thread
In the receiving unit where it is determined what prison each felon will be sent to, a convict heard a old lifer call a new smooth cheeked inmate "HeadHunter". Upon arriving at Walla Wall the states dead end prison the convict eventually cornered "Headhunter" in the library giving him a pat on the butt. To his dismay and regret he learned "Headhunter" was given that nick name because he was convicted for cutting two guys heads off, not the sexual predilection as he had assumed. 


headhunter said:


> I thank you again, I'm just old and cranky.


You're welcome and thank you, me too BTW



headhunter said:


> Attempts at humor aside, how does one tell a "Oath Keeper" from a government stooge.


That would be the guy who *IS NOT* breaking down your door saying we are from the government give us your guns...


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## LongRider

swjohnsey said:


> LongRider is a badass, just ask him.


Why would you post that? Do you go out of your way to prove you are an absolute moron? Or are you really that stupid?
I had just posted


LongRider said:


> Not because I am a tough guy or bad ass. I have never been either


My entire point on this thread has been that walking around looking like some kind of tacti-cool tough guy bad ass is likely to make you a target. So the point of your asinine post completely escapes me.


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## LongRider

BlueZ said:


> I find its very amusing you accuse me of attacking you when I merely made counter point to the prevailing "conventional wisdom" and then you write a post thats just dripping with name calling.


As I already said


LongRider said:


> My response to you was a polite answer your question. Your snide condescending know it all cracks are unwarranted, but if that is how you like to play, so be it.


You set the tone, and now want to snivel because you got back what you put out. Grow up, put your big girl panties on and deal with it. If you want civil discourse and debate. Than be civil and polite when responding to my posts, without your snide condescending cracks.


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## headhunter

There is a gentleman that goes by the handle, Chuck Adams. Before he became famous as a bow hunter and found there was money in endorsements he recommended blue jeans and a plaid shirt. FYI, apparently it works in two worlds.


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## BillM

I'm wearing the same old ratty clothes I wear now !


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## boomer

Learning to spin and weave and knit is on the list along with whatever tools are required. I do know how to grow sheep and flax for wool and linnen, but am not sure I want to take on learning these new skills. Maybe I will just set it up with books etc and hope I never need to actually use it.


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## Freyadog

What to wear to the Apocalypses!!!

At my age not a dad-burn-thang---and hope the zombies catch a glimpse and run in the opposite direction.


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## FrankW

Some recent practical and comfortable gear I bought:


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## boomer

I do not want to be trying to find good shoes if there are problems.


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## Wellrounded

My wardrobe consists of denim jeans, denim or heavy cotton shirts, thick socks and work boots. Don't see any reason to change that.



machinist said:


> Tough work gloves stuffed in a pocket somewhere are sensible. Also having your hands toughened by working in the outdoors is even better.


Agree. My DH has work gloves with him 24/7. I wear gloves a few times a year, to handle glass etc. My hands are tough, REALLY tough. Haven't had a blister since I was in my teens. I've had them described as mini bulldozers when working in the garden or about the farm. Same with my feet, I spend a lot of time barefoot, I can walk on just about anything, no problem if I've gotta move without shoes.



BlueZ said:


> I also have some 5.11 gear and I enjoy it.
> 
> During a true SHTF though I might exchange my 5.11 shoes for my duty boots.
> I just got the 2nd most expensive on the PX had, the Belleville Sabre.
> 
> I think it was worth it...they fit so well, even when I dont use orthop. inserts my foot (from a previous injury) doesnt act up much.
> 
> I also use the "trick" ( if you want to call it that) to buy my boots a little snug.
> Often I feel the sizes that are recommended are too generous and I prefer my boots fitting like a glove.
> 
> This gives me less overhang and better "dexterity" with my feet.
> I hate the disconnected feel that the current oversize guidance gives.
> 
> I dont mind a little discomfort the 1st 2 weeks breaking them in if the result has them nicely molded to my feet.
> 
> People nowadays often seems afraid of the discomfort in breaking in properly fitted boots and salesgirls seem to recommend larger sizes (I suspect) partially for this reason.


I buy boots as tight as possible, they stretch so quickly and I hate loose footwear, dangerous too. I break in a new pair starting at a few hours per day until I can wear them all day.


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## headhunter

Retreat, awoke to 15.5" of fluffy (?) white. About 3" on the ground last eve. Heavy, wet, nasty stuff all over and me only three days into summer short undies. On with the long handles and wool socks, throw on the waterproof micro fleece insulated bibs , fleece shirt and waterproof hooded insulated jacket. Topped off with Sorrel packs , knit hat, and 200 gram insulated gloves.
Remind me how smart I was taking the blower off the tractor already. Plug the tractor in, and by 9:00 we, the tractor and I, are back in business. Readjusted the spout so there was less of an angle and still plugged up 4 times. Sometimes the bucket, sometimes the blower, its good to hace a choice. Unbelievably heavy snow. Done at 2:30 just in time for the wife to announce electric power down. Should I hook up the generator or bring in the kerosene heater? Naw, lets wait a spell.
NSP (excellent power company shows up at 5:00) and power is restored. Lineman comments the county has just cleared the road. Back to normal except for the chainsaw work- lost two 50+ foot oak trees and numerous large branches.
A nice day spent in the nasty, wet snow, 15 mph wind, with hunks of ice and snow falling from the trees. We may have an idea what we expect to wear, but Mother Nature lets us know what we need to wear.


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## BillM

I thinking about having a FEMA exicutive directors jacket made with my very own name tag.

Then when they come knocking on my door , I can just fire the whole entry team .


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## LongRider

Wellrounded said:


> I buy boots as tight as possible, they stretch so quickly and I hate loose footwear, dangerous too. I break in a new pair starting at a few hours per day until I can wear them all day.


You may want to consider Whites. Whites has been making work boots for over a hundred and fifty years. Starting before the Civil War and moving to the Pacific Northwest 111 years ago, where they have become the standard for professional loggers. While they may seem spendy at first, over time they cost far less than off the shelf boots. I have a pair of Packers I have worn almost every day for fifteen years that are as good as the day I bought them. While they are custom made to your feet for the perfect fit they do require a break in period. Half hour 1st day 1 hour the 2nd day, 2 hours the third and so on. They need it too brand new they feel like they are made of concrete and steel. But once they broken in they are as comfortable as bare foot or brain tan moose hide moccasins. It is amazing how much longer I am able to stand, walk, work, hike without leg or back pain when I am wearing my Packers.

If SHTF there will be no running to the store to get new boots, As I said mine are now a bit over 15 years old I expect that they will last at least that much longer. If not, or they get damaged I have a spare pair of new but broken in Packers and Smoke Jumpers stock piled.

I have also heard great things about Nicks Custom Boots from several Hotshotters aka SmokeJumpers (the guys who jump into the middle of forest fires). I have not bought any so I dunno but I can not think of a better recommendation for a boot than one from a Hotshot. Those guys put their boots through some serious abuse.


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## Wellrounded

LongRider said:


> You may want to consider Whites. Whites has been making work boots for over a hundred and fifty years. Starting before the Civil War and moving to the Pacific Northwest 111 years ago, where they have become the standard for professional loggers. While they may seem spendy at first, over time they cost far less than off the shelf boots. I have a pair of Packers I have worn almost every day for fifteen years that are as good as the day I bought them. While they are custom made to your feet for the perfect fit they do require a break in period. Half hour 1st day 1 hour the 2nd day, 2 hours the third and so on. They need it too brand new they feel like they are made of concrete and steel. But once they broken in they are as comfortable as bare foot or brain tan moose hide moccasins. It is amazing how much longer I am able to stand, walk, work, hike without leg or back pain when I am wearing my Packers.
> 
> If SHTF there will be no running to the store to get new boots, As I said mine are now a bit over 15 years old I expect that they will last at least that much longer. If not, or they get damaged I have a spare pair of new but broken in Packers and Smoke Jumpers stock piled.
> 
> I have also heard great things about Nicks Custom Boots from several Hotshotters aka SmokeJumpers (the guys who jump into the middle of forest fires). I have not bought any so I dunno but I can not think of a better recommendation for a boot than one from a Hotshot. Those guys put their boots through some serious abuse.


Thanks, I sent a catalogue request to Whites.


----------

