# Thoughts on savings/401K and predictions of economic collapse...



## TimB

Seems like everday there are stories of folks predicting dire times coming, and very soon.  When would you consider withdrawing your savings/401K? And how would you keep it? Cash? Gold? Just something that has been on my mind lately...

Tim


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## NaeKid

I have been thinking of talking with my "financial advisor" about taking my RRSP (kind of like the US's 401K from my understanding) one of which is based in stocks right now, the other two are cash/interest accounts and converting them to gold-based - where I can "cash-in" at anytime and have them produce the gold within days, no questions asked.

I don't know if my banks will do that for me - so - that is where I am sitting.

I don't have the means to "stash" gold or gold-coins in a safe way, so, for now, I am at the mercy of others.


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## ZoomZoom

I've been pondering the same for the last several months.

I did cash out one of my small 401K's that hasn't been performing very well for this exact reason.

For now, I've kept it as cash and am still in the period where I can roll it over _but doubt I'm going to do so._

Since I still have a bit of a mortgage, if SHTF, my plan is to apply it to that as a couple years worth of payments. Even if the dollar collapses, the contract with the lender stands and they have to accept it as payment.

If I have a week or 2 before SHTF, I'll cash out other 401K's and get rid of the mortgage completely. The extra would be used to do final-minute purchases for being prepared. I'll also keep enough cash available for paying property taxes, insurances and other bills for a year. If a bad crash occurs, there's a possibility I wouldn't be working so I'll need to retain a cache to cover bills.

The process is pretty quick. You need to fill out a form and get it back to them. _I faxed it so it was there the same day._ I got my money within a week (as a check).

I would consider talking to your plan administrators to discuss the process, timing (_duration before you get payment_) and such now so it will be a quick transaction if/when you do it.


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## TimB

I froze my 401K several months back when everything was in the toilet and I had lost several thousand $s.  My concern would be getting it out when TSHTF.  I would hate to wait too long and lose it completely.

Oh, and however I kept it, it would be in a very secure place. 

Tim


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## Sourdough

I got out of ALL investments, including savings accounts, everything.....in the early fall of 2008. Man do I sleep well, NO worries.


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## Littlebit

I also got out of eveything, except my checking account. Need it to pay the bills. Bought a nice little fire prof safe that hold what I need and I can carry it or hide it any where. I plan on turning my paper cash into gold and silver coins soon, looking for the best dealer. I want to see the coins in person before I hand over any cash. To many Banks say you have this and that, but it all on computers now and they seldom keep enough cash to pay every who wants their money if there is a run on the bank.:sssh:


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## longtime

*Going Against the Tide*

While, I have prepared for the worst, I don't believe it will happen in my life time. I have food, own my remote home (along with the taxman). I can easily live for over 2 years without outside assistance. I have 3 years income in FDIC accounts and some money (if it gets bad it wont be worth much anyway)at home. However, I have most of my money invested in stocks, bonds, MM, annuities etc. The one thing people need to be prepared for is, what if nothing ever happens. Unless your real rich or real old that money in the mattress won't last as long as you will (retire and enjoying it).

Littlebit, 
I had some money in a "good" fireproof safe. My house burned down and the safe was not that fireproof. Insurance only covered $200 cash and I did not have enough evidence to get it replaced by the treasury. Better make sure it is fireproof. And yes I have had to go to many different branches to get all my cash before. They don't keep much cash on hand.


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## Littlebit

Longtime- Thanks for your concern I do have one of best fire safes you can get and I never keep all my eggs in one basket. 

I hope nothing happens in my life time or the generations to come. I consider preparing for any event an investment my family can benefit from in the future or next week.


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## GatorDude

Withdrawing my 401K money when I was younger was easily the biggest mistake of my financial life. You think you can wipe out some debts and quickly rebuild your nest egg, but that isn't so easy. No matter what, you'll have to have something to retire on. 

If you are feeling shaky about the markets, I'd recommend gradually switching to more conservative investments and investing a portion of your money in things like gold. Perhaps 5 to 10% of your portfolio could be in "end of the world" investments (land, gold, etc.)? Also, make sure you have a diversified portfolio of investments.

If you can, try to at least put in a % of your salary required to get your employers' 401K match. Yes, the world could financially collapse. But, billions of people including all of us are doing our best to ensure that does not happen.

It's one thing to go off the grid and live in a garden shed sized cabin because you want to. It's quite another to go off the grid and live in a garden shed because you have to.


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## Jeani

Tim,

I heard a Christian financial counselor recommend buying 'oil' as stock...

Sounds good to me...

He says, 'gold will be hard to get rid of',and 'our government might come after the gold' if our US economy falls.

The problem for most Americans that still have employment is that they can't withdraw their 401Ks from their company..

We steer clear of 'stocks',but I don't feel safe even with the safest retirement the company offers..

Most of the retirement plans are the big banks that got bailed out....

Thanks,
~Jeani


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## Judygranny

*IRA rollovers, etc.*

Vanguard has a fund devoted to US Treasuries. While not fail-safe, it's much safer than stocks and doing quite well for now. It's vfiix. If you can't cash out, changing to that option might be the next-best thing. Canadians are in better shape, but we here in the US are a big drag on all the other countries.

As for silver and gold, I keep some, but prefer to stock on things that will be needed. Insulation in our house, some light bulbs, some propane for the lamps, some herbs for healing and seasoning, small bags and a scale for bartering same. Also oils and alcohol to prepare tinctures, etc for use. Think about what you know and invest in that: skills, tools, supplies, etc.


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## sailaway

Judygranny said:


> Vanguard has a fund devoted to US Treasuries. While not fail-safe, it's much safer than stocks and doing quite well for now. It's vfiix. If you can't cash out, changing to that option might be the next-best thing. Canadians are in better shape, but we here in the US are a big drag on all the other countries.
> 
> As for silver and gold, I keep some, but prefer to stock on things that will be needed. Insulation in our house, some light bulbs, some propane for the lamps, some herbs for healing and seasoning, small bags and a scale for bartering same. Also oils and alcohol to prepare tinctures, etc for use. Think about what you know and invest in that: skills, tools, supplies, etc.


Judygranny, well put definately doing what you know is the best investment you can make. I think investing in the stock market with your excess money is a great way to get rid of it.


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## GroovyMike

I woudl not draw down a 401k or other retirement plan - that will cost you a lot in penalty and taxes unless you are over 55. Instead I'd let those balances grow and "invest" in paying off your debts so that you don't have to pay interest of lose your house in case you lose your job etc. After that I agree with stocking TANGIBLES that have real value - like FOOD. If you know guns and ammo they can be good investments, but so too can almost anything that you really KNOW. Buy cheap for cash, stack it deep, and only sell for gain.


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## UncleJoe

GroovyMike said:


> I woudl not draw down a 401k or other retirement plan - that will cost you a lot in penalty and taxes unless you are over 55..


While there is a cost to early withdrawal, think of what you could lose through 30%, 40%, or 50% inflation. The penalties would be more than offset by investing in "stuff" before inflation kicks in. 
I'm no economist but the U.S. government really only has 2 options in regards to the massive debt it has incurred over the last 40 years; default on it's obligations or inflate it's way out. IMHO inflation will be the option they chose. But who really knows what will happen. :dunno:


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## gypsysue

I don't think I'd spend every last dime, but I'd buy food and essential supplies with the rest of my dimes! 

It's remotely possible that we could have "deflation" but I believe inflation is a real possibility.


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## GroovyMike

UncleJoe said:


> I'm no economist but the U.S. government really only has 2 options in regards to the massive debt it has incurred over the last 40 years; default on it's obligations or inflate it's way out.


Those are indeed two of the options but I think the third - to keep lying to the world- is more likely. Our government has never dealt with the debt and I doubt anyone can force them to now. I am not a prophet but I strongly suspect that the US will NOT default, and while inflation will continue as it has for most of our lifetime, I do not see hyper inflation as more likely than continued ever growing debt. I think the US will borrow more long term debt to meet any present obligations and continue business as usual, simultaneously raising taxes and handing out unemployment benefits.


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## Genevieve

We rolled over hubby's 401 into a CD years back. He just recently said that we should maybe take the money and build a "root cellar" and get some other things. I told him to stop making my heart go "piddy-patter" LOL
I told him the more we were able to be self sufficient the less we would have to worry in case he loses his job.That what money we did make would be able to go to taxes and such.It's so hard to know what to do. We've worked so hard to get where we are,and having idiots who have their butts covered destroying it for us, is very disheartening to say the least.Sometimes makes me want to just throw up my hands and say the hell with it! But I don't.


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## skip

UncleJoe said:


> While there is a cost to early withdrawal, think of what you could lose through 30%, 40%, or 50% inflation. The penalties would be more than offset by investing in "stuff" before inflation kicks in.
> I'm no economist but the U.S. government really only has 2 options in regards to the massive debt it has incurred over the last 40 years; default on it's obligations or inflate it's way out. IMHO inflation will be the option they chose. But who really knows what will happen. :dunno:


I happen to agree. That is why I am planning on drawing mine out. Even with the penalties, I have enough to pay all my bills and taxes, and still have money left to do some work around the homestead. And I would feel better being out of debt


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## ZoomZoom

skip said:


> I happen to agree. That is why I am planning on drawing mine out. Even with the penalties, I have enough to pay all my bills and taxes, and still have money left to do some work around the homestead. And I would feel better being out of debt


I'll pile on and say that I've taken some out as well. I keep seeing prices going up on things but my salary remains the same. I'd like to have no debt and the provisions I need whereby I can go without having to spend much should there be a collapse of the dollar or the known/upcoming tax increase.

Yea, I'll pay a 10% penalty now but that's still less than the 20%+ tax hike we'll all be seeing in the near future.


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## GroovyMike

I have to agree that getting out of debt is a great idea. While I am leaving my retirement investments alone and continue to contribute 6% of my salary to buy more, I am dumping every dime not needed for living expenses into paying off debt. By God's grace we have killed the credit cards and car loans and I'm now paying extra on the mortgage. Only after all debt is gone and the price of the next car is in the bank would I even consider upping my retirement contribution. I am also a big believer in a deep larder of tangible goods including food. If I had to choose, I would say buy a few months worth of food and meds first, then pay down debt, then save for the long term. I'm just choosing to cash flow the purchases and debt reduction without taking the 45% hit on the retirement savings. Remember it is not just the 10% penalty, you also have to pay income tax on it, so add 28% for the feds and in my case about 7% for state. It just doesn't make sense to give the government nearly half of my savings.


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## pdx210

I’m one that believes there’s a strong possibility of a currency collapse and subsequent high inflation. if you are planning on cashing out a 401K I would use the money to pay off any liabilities you can house, car, credit cards or use the money to replacer that old appliance. 

As for gold; in 1933 President Roosevelt enacted Executive Order 6102 restricting the sale, possession and hording of gold this could happen again this was enforce until the 1960's


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## longtime

I have been reading all the gloom and doom with people withdrawing from the world and just wanted to say.

I have been alive for almost 60 years and I have seen the world come to an end so many times, I've lost count. 

Russia is going to blow us up (I guess now they will help over run us from the south)
China is going to blow us up (I guess now they are going to buy us like Japan did in the 70’s)
The next Ice Age has started.
The world is going to end due to man made global warming.
Yellowstone in going to blow.
All the computers are going to crash in 2000 and the world as we know it will end.
Planet X is going to destroy the Earth.
An Asteroid is going to wipe all life out.
Gamma Ray Burst is going to end all life on Earth.
2012 the Earth will be destroyed (we will see soon on this one).
The Bees are dying and all food production will fail.
Peak oil production has accrued.
North Korea is going to Nuke us.
Bill Clinton is going to refuse to leave office (I really liked that one) 
and many more 

I've seen 
Black Monday
Black Tuesday
Black Wednesday
Black Thursday
Black Friday
Black Saturday (ops they don't trade on Saturday).

I am here because I do believe in being prepared. I have a well stocked remote home, energy and water independent, few year’s cash and the ability and tools to repair most of my own equipment. I also buy insurance, health, auto, homeowners and some life (old enough now that I don't need much).

But I also think people should enjoy life. Come on people, the world is not ending tomorrow (I hope).

If shtf while on vacation, oh-well. I travel on vacation 2 or 3 months out of the year and enjoy myself. (I still do this after being completely burned out by kids looking for a trill while on vacation; State Farm is a great insurance company) 

I have made money after every black day so far including the last one. If the next one is the one that I don't, oh-well, by taking advantage of other peoples fears in the past I will likely still be ahead.

I have seen super inflation (not hyper). When I became financially aware all I needed was $100,000 to be set for life. That figure is now over $3,000,000 (only about 40 years). 

Yes, some day they will be right. But I am betting that it will not be in my life time. Enjoy life and take advantage of any situation, including a market crash. (Of course you should be prepared just in case it is tomorrow, just don’t forget to live today)


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## set2survive

I've been alive for over 60 years and I can tell that sometimes the Gloom & Doom crowd gets it right. Economically things have fundamentally changed and we may never have the affluence we once had and the reason is simple. We don't make anything here any more and we provide no services that the rest of the world can't get elsewhere cheaper and even better, so why buy from us. We have been coasting for a decade or two just on the perception that the dollar was invincible and everybody would take dollars for whatever they sold. Now they are stuffed with dollars and we have nothing to offer them in exchange except debt. We are so bloated with debt that soon they won't want any of that either and they are already talking about ways to get out of their dollar holdings.

We need to stop this insane deifcit spending and find ways of producing goods and services the rest of the world needs and wants.


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## longtime

I don't disagree with what you said, but we have heard that before also.

What I am getting at, is sure the world *might* end tomorrow. It might not. I know people(wifes brother and his family) that are afraid to do anything, including living, but prepare for the end of the world. I really feel bad for the ones that do that and wake up one morning and say I have done nothing with my life.

I have prepared for the end of the world, but if it does not end, I'll have no regrets (I'll be that crazy old man that died with a storm shealter full of food, clothes etc.) .


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## Woody

longtime said:


> (I'll be that crazy old man that died with a storm shealter full of food, clothes etc.) .


Hey Longtime, there will be two of us!


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## bunkerbob

Woody said:


> Hey Longtime, there will be two of us!


 Hey, don't forget me three!!!


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## kingmidas

Hey, don't forget this is a surivivalist group! So, preparation is for what again?


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## Woody

My preps are for any situation where I will not be able to go outside of my little world and purchase or obtain something I need for an extended period of time, regardless of the cause. Also to protect what I have from those that think they want it more than I do.

And Bob, looks like Longtime is going to have plenty of good company!


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## UncleJoe

Guess you might as well count me in too.


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## Jeani

_I think the difference today is that our country HAS NEVER been in this kind of debt....

We are not allowed to DRILL OIL anymore,and our government is making us more dependent upon foreign oil...

It's hard to say exactly what is the best decisions to make in life today....:scratch

No doubt, we can see, this government is out to get all of our money so they can just 'spend' even more....

Buying gold is a good thought,but I also realize, the government most probably will come after what little gold we do possess..

Buying guns for protection is good, but they will come after them, too...

I guess, preparing in the best way we know how, is the only answer...

That's why I am here....:wave:_


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## Anne72

It's generally a good idea to choose to participate in the program. A 401k plan is an employer-sponsored retirement plan that enables employees to take advantage of tax benefits while planning for their retirement years. In the United States, a 401k retirement savings plan allows a worker to save for retirement, and have the savings invested while deferring current income taxes on the saved money and earnings until withdrawal. This type of plan is also known as a "traditional" 401k.


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## The_Blob

Anne72 said:


> It's generally a good idea to choose to participate in the program. A 401k plan is an employer-sponsored retirement plan that enables employees to take advantage of tax benefits while planning for their retirement years. In the United States, a 401k retirement savings plan allows a worker to save for retirement, and have the savings invested while deferring current income taxes on the saved money and earnings until withdrawal. This type of plan is also known as a "traditional" 401k.


:ranton: :soapboxrant:

Section 401(k) of the tax code was enacted in 1981 as a way for people to save money for retirement outside of the traditional pension retirement plan. Your employer deducts money from your paycheck, pre-tax, and the money is placed into some sort of investment vehicle (usually a mutual fund). Because 401k contributions are pre-tax, and there is no tax on interest or capital gains (for now), there is a significant tax advantage to participating in a 401k plan. When you change jobs, then you can rollover your 401k into your own IRA account, which is something (pretty much the only thing) I *highly* recommend. When you turn 59 1/2, you can start withdrawing money from your 401k or IRA account without incurring withdrawal penalties, but you *do* have to pay tax on the money you withdraw. (Fair enough, it was put in there tax free.)

401k plans are almost as revered as much as Mom, apple pie, and baseball. But there is an insidious evil lurking behind them. So I'm being quite bold by going against the conventional wisdom and pointing out the dark underbelly of the 401k. The problem I have with 401k plans is that they essentially are _*investing on autopilot*_. Almost everyone with a good job contributes to them, but they have absolutely *no idea* what they are doing. At every company I've worked at, it has always been the same story: the employee is presented with a huge buffet of mutual funds... one of them is a conservative money market fund that invests in safe short term government securities. Almost all the other funds are equity funds (that would be _stock market funds_, for those unfamiliar with the word "equity"). The conventional 'wisdom' from Wall Street is that the mutual fund is 'much safer than investing on your own'...  I have some _*strong*_ doubts about that, all you have to do is look at the huge losses taken by high flying funds when the market crashed. It was a running joke that 401ks had turned into 101ks... Har-de-friggin'-har, John Q. Public is laughing all the way to *The Cardboard Box* he has to move into. When it comes down to it, the typical 401k 'investor' has *no* idea how to select a mutual fund to invest in (the CFO giving advice, only *slightly* more so); he is completely and utterly clueless. Faced with a bewildering array of funds, he often follows one of the following strategies: (1) invest a little bit into each fund; (2) invest in the fund with the biggest returns; (3) invest in a couple of funds with the biggest returns (a combination strategy). All of the strategies above have the effect of encouraging the 401k investor to pursue a risky investing strategy. With the first option, the most conservative, the 401k investor still winds up mostly investing in stocks, because the typical 401k plan offers one safe money market fund, and then a whole bunch of stock funds, so the invest evenly strategy results in most of the money being invested in the stock market,raw, anyway. The second and third strategies are far worse, because the 401k investor puts his money into the sector with the most momentum that is usually the most overpriced... thus it becomes even _*more*_ overpriced, but investments don't go up forever. The market finally reaches a point where it can go no higher, and then it crashes (sound familiar?). IMHO people who don't know how to select individual stocks are equally unqualified to select mutual funds, but that's *not* what the mutual fund industry wants people to think  (and we know what a bunch of scumbags, eeerrrr uuuhhhhmm Upstanding Citizens _*they*_ are).

It's just _one more *control* mechanism_ on you, a carrot, keeping you there, *in your place* (oooh oooh oooh I broke *even* vs inflation after 30 years!  , I feel SO good!... :gaah: ) sorry, most 401ks are a joke (a bad one) in the *best* of times, in a Bear Market... pfaaaaghh!

:rantoff: :soapboxzipper:


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## UncleJoe

Come on Blob. Tell us how you really feel.  :2thumb:


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## nj_m715

There are some who think that tax rates will be going up (to cover the debt). I've been banged up with a back injury and I have very little taxed income this year. I moved some money into a roth account and took the hit this year at a low tax rate. 

The idea of the tax deferred plan is to pay a lower rate on the money when you need to spend it than you would pay on it now. I made the move because there's just no telling what the rate will be when I am ready to withdrawl the money, but I am willing to bet it's going up. 

I just wanted to mention it because someone else might be in the same boat.


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## kyfarmer

My 401K, 4 mason jars with a thousand dollars each of silver or gold, buried in the dang woods. Repeat until the SHTF. Sounds better than what my bro got he lost over 36 grand during the little crash thingy. That be my 401 katie didie thingy. Sorry i do not trust paper wealth period, and yes that means our inflated worthless use to be great greenbacks. Hyper inflation is on it's way soon. Beans and bullets baby that's real world currency. You can eat paper but ya get bad heartburn.


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## nj_m715

Loosing 36k isn't the way to look at it, as long as you don't need it soon. 

My wife does the same thing when her statements come. She doesn't understand that she still has the same amount of shares. 100 shares of Disney is still 100 shares of Disney. A pound of gold is still a pound of gold, even if the price goes up or down. You only gain or loose money when you sell. Right now my Roth funds are not in the market, but if (ok, WHEN) the market drops back down, I will move a good chunk into it. Sooner or later one of these printer, shoe or underwear knuckleheads will slip through security and the bottom will fall out of the market again. When it does, I'll buy in.


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## longtime

My family is the perfect example of this post. 

My brother saw his 401K fall almost 60% in 2008. He converted everything to "cash" dispite my recomendation that it's to late and to stay in the market. Well he is still in cash and blaming everyone from his employer to obama for his loss.

My sister on the other hand listened. She even moved some of her "cash" into the market. Well she recovered and currently stands 5% up and has moved some of her profits out of the market.

I have not made a lot of money being in the market, but over the last 30 years I have managed to return around 10%. That is well above inflation.


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## SurviveNthrive

Anyone in it for the long term, and still having years to go who cashed out when it crashed is a fool...that sort of poor decision making in such an important area as financial planning indicates the person isn't reliable in other areas. I'd not trust that person in a survivalism based group.


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## nj_m715

LT said it pretty well. You only loose when you sell. 
It's always been the same simple plan. Buy low, sell high not get scared and sell low. 

If I were in, I'd be thinking about selling right now. But what do I know. I'm just sitting here wishing a put a few more dollars into war nickels over the last summer


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## longtime

nj_m715 said:


> If I were in, I'd be thinking about selling right now. But what do I know. I'm just sitting here wishing a put a few more dollars into war nickels over the last summer


I have already pulled about 10% out to replace cash I used to buy in at around 7,000 (DJIA). Anouther 10% out @ 12,000 (if we ever get there). Never get greedy.


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## nj_m715

longtime said:


> Never get greedy.


great advice. With my buddy's help we made 5X our money with Kmart back when it was bankrupt. 
Make your money and move one if you're day trading, if not buckle down and hold on for the ride.


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## invision

NaeKid said:


> I don't have the means to "stash" gold or gold-coins in a safe way, so, for now, I am at the mercy of others.


NaeKid - do you have a gun safe? or get a decent one? I store our gold coins and silver on one of the shelves in the safe. No one is walking out with a 800+ lb safe... and I don't think anyone would have time to break into it when we aren't home...

I would buy Gold on hand, never "certificates of ownership" that you have to cash in... Worst case - after every deposit into that account, I would be pulling out all but a few dollars and converting it on the spot...


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## invision

nj_m715 said:


> Loosing 36k isn't the way to look at it, as long as you don't need it soon.
> 
> My wife does the same thing when her statements come. She doesn't understand that she still has the same amount of shares. 100 shares of Disney is still 100 shares of Disney. A pound of gold is still a pound of gold, even if the price goes up or down. You only gain or loose money when you sell. Right now my Roth funds are not in the market, but if (ok, WHEN) the market drops back down, I will move a good chunk into it. Sooner or later one of these printer, shoe or underwear knuckleheads will slip through security and the bottom will fall out of the market again. When it does, I'll buy in.


Absolutely correct there - in 2007 right before the real plunge in the market, I had my wife move 100% of her 401K from stocks to bonds... then I kept her in when the market hit 9000 and started a slight rebound - I told her hang on its going down to 6500 or so and you need to put it in at 7000... at 7000 she did just that moved it from bonds back into stocks...

Now the stocks backup hitting 14,000 so I am wondering how soon to advice her on moving over to bonds again...


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## mtexplorer

TimB said:


> Seems like everday there are stories of folks predicting dire times coming, and very soon.  When would you consider withdrawing your savings/401K? And how would you keep it? Cash? Gold? Just something that has been on my mind lately...
> 
> Tim


Ask yourself 2 questions. 1st Question: If OB acts on the executive orders he has already written and your money/investments were gone tomorrow, could you still survive without the dividends or the possible cash out option?

Second question: If you pull all your investments out and nothing ever happens, will you have lost the retirement dreams you planned on having?

If you leave it and the economy crashes, your investments will be worthless anyway. Remember, you don't really have any investments or real money, your money is nothing more than a data number in some brokers computer. If you can't hold it in your hand, then it doesn't exist. It doesn't matter what your brokerage Co tells you that you are invested in, it really doesn't exist. Your money, your investments are nothing more than numbers on a piece of paper, a report you receive from your investment/brokerage Co.

I 'm not saying you shouldn't invest. But be wise. Paying off your home/prop is the best investment you can make. Eliminating as much debt as possible is fiscally responsible.

Keep some of your brokerage investments, but use some to buy tangibles. If you buy canned foods now, three years from now the value of those canned foods will most likely provide you with a better return for you investment and you will have something that you can use. Buy firearms, not necessarily because the feds are working to ban them, but I have yet to seen any firearm not increase in value. If nothing happens to the economy, upon retirement, you will be able to sell them and your return on your investment will be better than a brokerage account. And if things do fall apart, the value would be greater than you can imagine for bartering for things you need.

Buy food, buy firearms, buy medical supplies. Buy silver coins. Doesn't matter which way the economy goes, silver and gold will still hold it's value. And don't buy it on paper, buy it and stash it.

And if you want to invest with a guaranteed return, buy land. Buy another house. At least these things are something you can use to your advantage at retirement or if SHTF, you can barter for the living space. Buy empty land that can be used for farming or for future homes/expansion. Again, doesn't matter which way the economy goes, it will give you a return.

These are only my thoughts. You will have to do what is best for your situation and your income and prepping level. This is my plan.

I might not leave this world with a lot of money, but I will leave it wealthy, just from the experience


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