# Pump for water, solar or 110v



## cqp33 (Apr 2, 2012)

I am looking at 2 possibilities for water for my garden/raised beds.

1. Water collection off my barn and/of house
2. Pumping water from my pond

The end game is to build a water tower that will be filled from either the collection tanks at the house and/or barn or from the pond.

-I am looking at building a 12 foot tall tower to set a tote on so 475 gallons
-The pond is 30-35 feet beneath the end level of the tote (head 35') and probably 400' horizontally from where the tower will reside
-house where i could collect rainwater is roughly 175'' from tower with a 8-10 elevation change (20' head adding the 12' height of tower)
-barn is 120' from where i could collect water and same elevation change (roughly) as the house so figure a 20' head for that too.

-Advantages of house is that i already have a gutter across the front with 3 downspouts that i can collect from
-advantages of barn is that i will have power there shortly so 110v will be readily available but would need to install gutters across 50'
-advantages of pond - can't think of any so scrap the pond! to far to run water lines IMO but during the drought this year (east TN) my pond dropped 3" while others dried up completely. I have found 11 springs feeding my pond and typically there is always water running out the drain tile.

so my question here is, SOLAR for pumping or 110v. my intention is to have 3-4 totes in tandem to collect from, pump from those into the tower and let gravity do the rest. This would be feeding several (up to 40) raised beds eventually and possibly even fruit trees while they are young. I am looking at getting more totes for storage too. I like the barn because i can put the totes under a 'lean to' built off the barn (well i can build a 'lean to' for this purpose anyways, that would be fairly easy)
how much would a SOLAR set up be to push water with that head pressure for the distance? i could go 110v for now and purchase solar for backup when its in the budget. 

just want fellow smart peoples thoughts on this.
thanks


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## AmmoSgt (Apr 13, 2014)

Most pumps come in both 12 volt dc ( solar) or 110 AC ( household current)

I am prejudiced toward solar myself ..

here is a pump that would meet your needs http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200352044_200352044

Will do a 40 foot head and draws 15 amps @ 12 volts aka 180 watts .. 100 amp AGM solar battery will give you 4 hours of pumping or about 1200 gallons. You do not want to draw the battery down more than 60% for maximum battery life ... 2000 sq feet of roof produces 1200 gallons of water for each inch of rain fall

https://www.solar-electric.com/unba100amagm.html because of the way solar works.. you only get the rated watts when the sun is shining perpendicular to the panel and because of the way rain works you need a battery because generally it isn't sunny when it rains .. battery also insures you get full power when the sun is at a bad angle to the panels ..
Do this get a sheet of graph paper .. and a flashlight.. shine the flash light on the graph paper with the flash light held perpendicular count the squares .. now shine it on the graph paper at about 45 degrees and count the squares .. the energy of the light is a constant but the amount of that energy that each square gets will change as more squares get the light .. your solar panel is one square .. the more squares it has to share the light with, the less energy it gets. The battery will charge with more or less watts no matter just charge faster or slower so long as the volts are over 12 point something volts . a 12 volt solar panel actually puts out 14 point something volts regardless of the strength of the sunshine.. just the wattage changes .. electric motors go slower or faster if the voltage changes but must have the proper watts to work right a battery between the solar panels and the electric motor solves all sorts of issues

So go a little over sized on the panel https://www.amazon.com/Renogy-Watts-Volts-Monocrystalline-Bundle/dp/B01N5L3V9Y?th=1. Most places have what they call hours of isolation .. that means the panels will get so many hours equivalent of straight on sunshine as the sun goes across the sky.. most places in the US are 4.5 to 5.5 hours of isolation .. 200 watts ( the example I linked to ) x you location's hours of isolation equals daily output 1000 watts should fully recharge the battery in one day after 4 hours of pumping in the rain or keep everything fully charged if you are pumping in the sunshine .. can't actually see the point of pumping in the rain except to fill tanks .. moving rain barrel water to the tower on a sunny day.

The problem will be having enough rain barrels to catch what might come off the roof at 1000 sq feet and 1 inch of rain equals 600 gallons depends a lot on how it rains where you are at , does it normally come down in buckets or does it normally come down steady in a sensible rate and manner.

Most crops need an inch a week as a rule of thumb .. a thousand sq foot of garden needs 600 gallons a week give take rule of thumb some crops more some less .. but as a general average ..

people need about 10 gallons of water a day 15 gallons is better for planing purposes .. yeah I know.. everybody says 1 gallon of water a day.. but those people don't take showers or wash dished or clean anything or wash clothes .. I think their opinion of a gallon a day stinks ..

Don't know what running power to where you need it would cost for permits and installation

Most totes I have seen are about 275 gallons and hold 1 ton of water.. if you are going to have multiples up on a tower you need to keep that in mind. Whatever size tote you use 264 gallons of water is a ton.


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## TheLazyL (Jun 5, 2012)

The height of the column of water (12' + 35') / 2.31 = The pounds per square inch (static pressure) and the base of the column.

37 / 2.31 = 16 PSI


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## cqp33 (Apr 2, 2012)

AmmoSgt appreciate the quick education!

House is 70' x 30' with half draining off the front of the house, front porch adds another 10' of roof. so 70 x 20 is 1400, the roof is a little longer than this due to the pitch, roof pitch is 6/12. So i will plan on at least 1500 gallons of water storage and setup a drain for overflow.

The intent is to run the pump off a float switch in the tower, when the water level drops below 1/2 the tote level, the pump will kick in and fill the tote from the totes on the ground. So i need to plan for 1.5 ton load rating on the tower, that's easily doable.

And yes it is 275, i said 475 incorrectly. I might look around and see what other containers i can lay my hands on, if i can get a larger say 500 gallon container i may do that but totes seem readily available in my area on the cheap anyways.

Thanks again for the feedback, always appreciated!


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## cowboyhermit (Nov 10, 2012)

The style of pump AmmoSgt posted is useful to have around and will certainly get the job done. There are some smaller 12V pumps in that style (or submersible) that can get the job done a bit cheaper but will often be slower.

Any little diaphragm pump will do the job well and extremely efficiently, like RV pumps or the ones used on portable sprayers. You can find these for as little as $25 and they generally last quite well. If you were to use a float switch then time wouldn't be an issue, otherwise that might be a concern. I have setup systems like this, typically for watering livestock, for as little as $100, realistically spending a few more $ is the best bet, not more than $250 though.

Very random example from Amazon.com;https://www.amazon.com/Amarine-made-Water-Pressure-Diaphragm-Pump/dp/B00WYMC492/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&qid=1486167493&sr=8-8&keywords=12v+diaphragm+pump

Also lots of debris can cause issues with small pumps if you don't use any screen, so consider at least the ones that replace the washer in a garden hose.

It might be worth stating any 12V (solar) pump can be run in a myriad of ways, including just plugged into a 12V adapter and run of 110V, heck some RV pumps even come with an adapter in the box these days. A fully charged battery will run a little pump for quite a while as well.


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## bacpacker (Jul 15, 2011)

Not sure where you are in Tn, but I see a seller on craigslist, farm and garden section that sells totes from 275 to 330 gallons. He's located off I-75 north of Knoxville. all for under $75. The only thing I have saw larger is at Tractor Supply and other feed store. But they are considerably more expensive.

I like your options for water. Somewhat similar to my plans. I plan to catch water off both my shop and chicken coop, and could do the house if need be. My neighbor has a decent size pond with 3 springs feeding from below. We were in the drought this summer/fall as well. It dropped close to a foot, but no more. Have just been in discussion with the about putting a trash pump in to run drip lines to my garden spots.


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## Caribou (Aug 18, 2012)

Having lived with rain collection much of my life, you was as much catchment as possible so, put gutters on both the house and the barn. 

A metal roof works best and can add a surprising amount from a light rain or even a morning dew.

As far as storage goes, whatever you get you will want more. I would consider a five thousand gallon tank to start.

Another thing to consider is a pump to use for a fire hose. This can be used to fill your water storage from the pond and as a fire fighting asset.


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## cqp33 (Apr 2, 2012)

bacpacker said:


> Not sure where you are in Tn, but I see a seller on craigslist, farm and garden section that sells totes from 275 to 330 gallons. He's located off I-75 north of Knoxville. all for under $75. The only thing I have saw larger is at Tractor Supply and other feed store. But they are considerably more expensive.
> 
> I like your options for water. Somewhat similar to my plans. I plan to catch water off both my shop and chicken coop, and could do the house if need be. My neighbor has a decent size pond with 3 springs feeding from below. We were in the drought this summer/fall as well. It dropped close to a foot, but no more. Have just been in discussion with the about putting a trash pump in to run drip lines to my garden spots.


I buy from this guy, well have not yet but will be soon! He is off of Racoon Valley RD. Not but an hour or so away, I frequent that general area too! Thanks


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

A 12 volt ShurFlo (or similar pump) can be had for $30-$50 and will pump 100's of gallons of pond water every sunny day with a very simple solar set-up. A 500 foot roll of drip line tubing is only $60 from Lowe's. I don't see how this is not feasible?


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

cqp33 said:


> And yes it is 275, I said 475 incorrectly. I might look around and see what other containers I can lay my hands on, if I can get a larger say 500 gallon container I may do that but totes seem readily available in my area on the cheap anyways.


It is SOO hard to find anything cheaper. I buy IBC totes 16 at a time for $25 each. I can get 16 on my trailer stacked 2 layers (8ea) thick.

You can stack them on your water tower, too, but need to valve them separately so the upper doesn't flow into the lower one.

I did score a REALLY nice, HUGE 3000 gallon poly tank for about $500 (I traded a small utility trailer for it). Otherwise, IBC totes are a better deal. Keep them out of the sunlight, though.


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## Viking (Mar 16, 2009)

TheLazyL said:


> The height of the column of water (12' + 35') / 2.31 = The pounds per square inch (static pressure) and the base of the column.
> 
> 37 / 2.31 = 16 PSI


That put my cistern at around 58' above our home, thanks for the figures. Oh how I love having a gravity system, electricity free.


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