# Gun/Rifle Questions from a Virgin



## PeachesBackwards (Sep 8, 2015)

As I know nothing about Guns/Rifles what legal gun/rifle would you get that holds and shoots the most bullets? The sole purpose of me having this gun/rifle would be in a TEOTAWKI situation to protect my resources. What I am super not clear is, for the purpose of using it strictly for defense/protection, is the distance it can reliably shoot important or not? Also I'm looking for one where its relatively easy to hit the target if you are absolutely inexperienced with Firearms. Thank You for Your Advice. PS Do you recommend against getting a used firearm/gun? PS In the future, what is the proper term that includes gins and rifles? Is it firearms?


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## Caribou (Aug 18, 2012)

Guns (firearms) are tools. Like any tool you pick the right one for the job. I've used a straight bladed screw driver to remove a phillips screw but it was my only option and I cussed the whole time. Actually I think the screw was laughing so hard it vibrated itself out. I don't know where you live so I can't tell you about the maximum magazine capacity. Some places limit magazines to a capacity as little as seven while most have no limits. 

Generally what I would suggest is a rifle with a removable magazine. The AR15 is a good general all around rifle good to about 350 yards after some practice. Standard capacity magazines are 30 rounders but you can get them with up to 100 rounds. I would suggest that six spare magazines for each firearm is a minimum. They have a light recoil and ammo is available. This is also a good choice for home defense as it has a lower ability to penetrate than most. That means that if you miss the bad guy it will go through fewer walls before it is stopped. This will please your neighbors. Our military uses this round so if you hit your target it will get the job done.

There are may other good rifles available. I can't over emphasize the importance of training.


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

Though I don't care for shotguns that might be the best for you. Maybe a mossberg 590.

Asking what gun to get is like asking what car to get. There are a lot of choices. And many correct answers.


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## PeachesBackwards (Sep 8, 2015)

Thanks Will check those out I thought AR15's were illegal. Shows you how much I know. I'd only use this for if there was no Law and Order left in a TEOTWAWKI situation where my home would be invaded to take my food, water, etc. resources. Have no desire to use this in a non-TEOTAWKI situation unless someone has literally broken into my home and my life is at risk.


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## Dakine (Sep 4, 2012)

Firearm discussions are limited to hunting questions, not defense as the forums are under contractual obligations with service providers. there is a special section for forum supporters that you can discuss a variety of things that would be locked here.

With that said, the shotgun is one the most versatile firearms you can buy. They are also very affordable and even during ammo droughts you can usually find ammo for shotguns.

depending on your size and strength the two most common and popular choices for shotties are 12g and 20g the "g" stands for gauge. when someone discusses a 9mm pistol or 7mm magnum rifle round, it's pretty clear that the mm is millimeters and that's the diameter of the barrel. When someone says .22 or .45 thats for firearms that are chambered and measuring in 100ths of an inch, so a .45 pistol bullet is for all intents and purposes nearly a half inch across... shotgun gauges are completely opposite the bigger the gauge number, the "weaker" or smaller the shell they use is.

I'm a pretty big guy, and honestly after shooting clays all day with my 12g I feel a little bit beat up, after 100-150 shots I'll have a nice big yellow bruise. if you're smaller of frame then you may want to consider a 20g shotgun.

Shotguns let you hunt large game animals out to about 100 yards reliably with slugs, which is 1 big projectile per shell. you can also hunt large game and varmints with buckshot, which is several small ball bearing type projectiles per shell there's a goofy numbering scheme there too, and I don't have the info on 20g pellets/shot per shell so you should consider that some research you should do on your part.

finally you can hunt small game, rabbits, game birds and the like with birdshot, which is smallish little pellets smaller than a bb from a bb gun. They can be copper, steel or lead and its important to know whats legal to use in your area, especially if in commiefornia where we have a no lead zone which is going state wide in a few years.

If you needed to for some reason to go hunting inside your house, lets say a coyote or a bear or a zombie were in your house    you can see on youtube videos that bird shot generally will not penetrate both layers of drywall, this means if you were shooting at a dove flying around in your living room, you wouldn't accidentally give your family a face full of birdshot on the other side of the wall... probably.. if you're really close to the wall it might penetrate.

standard defensive... oops hunting, like for zombies in your living room... loadouts in a shotgun might include a mix of both buckshot and slugs. Slugs will absolutely penetrate walls. even brick walls. be very careful of your target and what's beyond. 

A brand new GOOD name brand shotgun such as the Remington 870 or Mossberg 500 are anywhere from around $350 to 500 depending on what model and configuration you get. There are a LOT of good brands to choose from, and used is definitely an option. You could check pawn shops, the for sale section at local gun clubs, there's online auction sites like gunbroker.com and of course your LGS Local Gun Store.

I think a shotgun would be a wise choice for you based on the brief description you gave, however if you want "spray an pray" you may want to stick to a handgun and large magazine capacity 

ETA: what the heck was I thinking, I'm sorry... the Remmy 700 is a nice bolt action rifle, the Remmy 870 is the very ubiquitous shotgun they make. 

and to echo others thoughts, having a gun doesn't make you safe, having one without having any training may actually be more of a danger than not having it at all. I strongly encourage you to become both a gun owner, and a trained gun owner. There are public firing ranges, private club/ranges, and there's all kinds of programs available that even open to the public. I'm a member of a nice private range and we host a LOT of NRA training courses that are available to the public without being a range member, there's often a small nominal cost associated with it, but it's worth it.

IF you decide to get a gun, that decision MUST be coupled with the decision become competent at using it, and you should also become cognizant of your local and state laws regarding using it.


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## weedygarden (Apr 27, 2011)

*Take a Gun Safety Class First!*

If you know nothing about guns, you probably have never touched, held or shot a gun.

Please take a gun safety class before you do anything else. Give yourself a chance to learn from someone who has experience and knowledge. Consider a concealed carry class. I took once recently. My class was given by a retired policeman. We are invited to shoot with him regularly at a range. You might get a chance to have someone who is not only knowledgeable about guns, but someone who has good sense to understand who you are and what you need.


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## jeff47041 (Jan 5, 2013)

PeachesBackwards said:


> Thanks Will check those out I thought AR15's were illegal. Shows you how much I know. I'd only use this for if there was no Law and Order left in a TEOTWAWKI situation where my home would be invaded to take my food, water, etc. resources. Have no desire to use this in a non-TEOTAWKI situation unless someone has literally broken into my home and my life is at risk.


But if you do get a gun, you really do have to go to a range and get used to shooting it. Don't just store it until you need it, then have no idea how. Also, even if you're just storing it, you should get it out occasionally and admire it, talk to it, & clean it


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## Cabowabo (Nov 6, 2012)

*Options*

You have options. I think far to many people get wrapped up in this Doomsday Prepper B.S. We need to narrow this down quiet a bit.

You need to go find whatever religious book that you read, grab it hold your hand up. And Swear that you are going to get training in how to use the weapon, and that you are prepared if necessary to shoot someone or something to stop the threat. If you aren't prepared to do that, then don't get a gun.

You are more then likely going to be attacked in day to day life outside your home, where the number 1 choice will be a handgun. The Three Main calibers are 9mm, .40 and .45 ACP. I prefer the 9mm, as its cheaper to shoot and I understand what it will do to the human body should I need to use it. I would get a Medium to Compact handgun, with a serious look at the Glock 19, Sig 226/229/228, CZ, their are to many to really list. Expect to spend $500 or more

Now if you are home when something happens, I prefer using a Rifle for Home Defense. I'm running a 5.56 IWI Tavor, with an Aimpoint Comp M2, and a flashlight, and when I pay the Fine I'll get a Suppressor. AR-15's are cheap, easy to come by in the starter variety, mags, ammo etc are easy to come by. AK's are depending on the manufacture pretty solid. Expect to spend $700 + on just the rifle. My main rifle cost me $1600 + 500 for the optic this isn't an area I wanted to go cheap.

Lastly a 12/20 gauge shotgun. Buck or Slug for self defense. I'd stick to Pump and they can be had for $300 roughly. Mossberg or Remington.

If you are a Doomsday Prepper, stick to NATO calibers as thats the standard for well NATO. WARSAW Calibers 9mm mak, 7.62X39, 7.62X54R are cheap and easier to buy in bulk. NATO calibers are going to cost more.

Hope this helps. I'd look at starting with a handgun, I prefer the Glock 19, and get training in how to use it. AS far as Used Handguns, depending I prefer them. I like doing deals in cash for firearms, and hate filling out the paperwork associated with going through an FFL.

I forgot to mention, and I'm sorry.
DO NOT GET A GUN, IF YOU ARE GOING TO BUY IT, AND LEAVE IT IN THE BOX. Their is a Triad for Gun ownership, and gun operating. The Gun, the Ammo are both knowns. You are the unknown and you need to find good reliable training to become proficient.
My Experience, Active Duty Military, Firearm instructor. Been carrying a gun for over 5 years professionally.


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## oldasrocks (Jun 30, 2012)

Peaches, before you go out and buy a weapon find a friend that shoots. Shoot a few different weapons and find one that fits you.

I make all beginners shoot a single shot. Do not buy an AR-15. Too complicated for a beginner.

I bought my wife, a novice, a Circuit Judge. 5 shot rifle/shotgun that all you have to do is pull the trigger. I started her out on a Cricket-single shot .22.

Come on down to Missouri and spend the weekend. I'll teach you the ropes.


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## Balls004 (Feb 28, 2015)

I'm just going to stay out of this one...


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## Cabowabo (Nov 6, 2012)

^^^^^^^^ Please tell me you are joking on the AR-15 being to advanced of a weapon for a beginner to use.

The First Rifle my Wife ever shot was a Mosin Nagant M91/30, and then a Colt M4 and she shoots pretty dang good. Its not a complicated weapon system, to use, granted its not as simple as an AK-47. 

It doesn't matter what Weapon I'm getting behind to shoot (machine guns, and shotguns being the exception) the fundamentals will stay the same. Breathing, Aiming, Trigger squeeze, follow though, how you support the weapon will still the same. The sight alignment on my AK is the same as it is on my AR because the fundamentals do not change ever period. I teach kids that maybe touched a weapon once in their life in a 4 hour class how to take the M16 apart, and put it back together and how to shoot it accurately. If they pay attention they do pretty good on the qualification. So I'm confused how its to advanced for a beginner. 

Now if you had said I'd rather start you off on a .22LR because of COST, I would of said, that makes sense as the .22LR is 9 cents a round and a 5.56X45 Nato round is around .35 cents a round. But complicated, their is nothing complicated about Iron sights, and their is less complication to optics such as the Aimpoint, and the Trijicon ACOG.


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## PeachesBackwards (Sep 8, 2015)

weedygarden said:


> If you know nothing about guns, you probably have never touched, held or shot a gun.
> 
> Please take a gun safety class before you do anything else. Give yourself a chance to learn from someone who has experience and knowledge. Consider a concealed carry class. I took once recently. My class was given by a retired policeman. We are invited to shoot with him regularly at a range. You might get a chance to have someone who is not only knowledgeable about guns, but someone who has good sense to understand who you are and what you need.


I haven't! Honestly and people got upset at me here for stating so, I don't want to be around a gun while we still have a civilized society, before TEOTWAWKI, because I don't ever want to take the chance of using one out of anger. Wouldn't bother me so much about hurting someone but I can't do the time as I don't want to be anyone's bitch. That's just for me. If the rest of you have self control, great. I do recognize that at TEOTWAWKI that not having Firearms is asking to die.


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## PeachesBackwards (Sep 8, 2015)

*Thank You*



jeff47041 said:


> But if you do get a gun, you really do have to go to a range and get used to shooting it. Don't just store it until you need it, then have no idea how. Also, even if you're just storing it, you should get it out occasionally and admire it, talk to it, & clean it


Thank You Will Do THis actually does make the most sense


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## VoorTrekker (Oct 7, 2012)

PeachesBackwards said:


> ...I don't want to be around a gun while we still have a civilized society, before TEOTWAWKI, because I don't ever want to take the chance of *using one out of anger*...


I hear a liberal in the background whispering into your ear. That's nonsense. If you are so prone to violence out of anger you need to get some old school counselling on proper conduct. Emotional motivated violence is just basic savagery, so you should forget about any firearms for now.


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## weedygarden (Apr 27, 2011)

PeachesBackwards said:


> I haven't! Honestly and people got upset at me here for stating so, I don't want to be around a gun while we still have a civilized society, before TEOTWAWKI, because I don't ever want to take the chance of using one out of anger. Wouldn't bother me so much about hurting someone but I can't do the time as I don't want to be anyone's bitch. That's just for me. If the rest of you have self control, great. I do recognize that at TEOTWAWKI that not having Firearms is asking to die.


I think the time is coming when we will either defend ourselves, or be taken advantage of, one way or another. I believe we should have guns and ammo to protect ourselves and our family.

I grew up knowing there were guns in the house, but they were not kept out in sight. They were usually in the back of closets, hidden, in rooms I did not spend much time in. My grandfather had guns that he used to shoot and kill rattlesnakes and pigs or cattle that were hurt and going to be butchered. He hunted when I wasn't around. I never touched, held or shot any of his guns. My brothers may have. I wasn't that interested in guns when I was young and am not that interested now, except to have them for protection and to target practice. I am not scared of them or scared of having them.

I think we have to get our heads on straight about guns. If SHTF, we will not have time to practice. We need to know how to use guns now and will need to then. Consider it a hobby or interest that you want to get good at. It takes 10,000 hours to be good at or a pro at something like golf, no matter your talent. I do not think we need 10,000 hours of time shooting, but every experience we have will help us to be more competent at using them. I am not concerned about getting in trouble for shooting someone who is violating my home or me.

I know people will try to take advantage of people they think wouldn't shoot them or defend themselves.

I had company this summer, someone who is greatly opposed to gun ownership. It seemed irrational to me. She does not want concealed carry and does not want to be around someone who MIGHT have a gun. She really does not get that someone with a CC makes her safer. I do not argue with people. I will explain my point once, but then I am done. She couldn't hear any of it. I think for me, it is good to know the kind of fear and concern that people have when I heard what she said. It is so not me, but how many others are this afraid and terrified of a gun being present?

Do you live in a situation where having a gun will not be discouraged? I suggest getting a locking cabinet or using something to secure any guns or ammo that you might procure in the future. Young people tend to want to play with a gun when they see them. Keep it locked up and do not talk about it with young people or others who might not have good background, experience or judgment about it. Do not play show and tell with it. Have it be your secret with those not equipped to deal with it.


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## Dakine (Sep 4, 2012)

VoorTrekker said:


> I hear a liberal in the background whispering into your ear. That's nonsense. If you are so prone to violence out of anger you need to get some old school counselling on proper conduct. Emotional motivated violence is just basic savagery, so you should forget about any firearms for now.


great point!

sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me!

who knows WTF happens if there's a SHTF scenario, they haven't gone great so far, Katrina, Sandy, CA fires (we don't give them global names, there's usually 4-9 cooking at any one time)

"i'm in a hissy fit" is not an appropriate reason to reach for a gun... if that's you and what you meant with your original question then I'm sorry I even offered advice.

You'll hurt or kill someone, you'll go to prison or be killed by responding police and you'll accomplish NOTHING.


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## cowboyhermit (Nov 10, 2012)

I will absolutely agree that if you believe that your emotions and anger are so out of control that you might shoot someone *DO NOT BUY A FIREARM!*

Then, get yourself away from other people, preferably in a room devoid of knives and sharp objects, any object that can be swung, thrown, or used as a weapon in a similar way. DO NOT DRIVE A MOTOR VEHICLE. Then, call the police and get some mental help immediately.

That last paragraph was largely exaggeration of course but it is also true. If you have mental issues that lead you to be concerned about shooting someone in anger there is nothing more important for you to do in your life than to get that dealt with ASAP. Unless maybe you are extremely physically disabled then there are endless ways for you to seriously wound or kill someone in anger, without a gun.


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## bigg777 (Mar 18, 2013)

I am going to take a slightly different tack on the "I might hurt someone" if I get a gun thing.

Firearms are only one type of device that is available to us to harm others and/or protect ourselves and loved ones. Cars, knives, electricity, water, bludgeons, cordage, scissors, etc. can all be used to protect ourselves and/or cause harm or death to others. Even our own bare hands and feet can inflict pain and death.

There is no reason to have an unreasonable fear of firearms, firearms are tools, much like a hammer, in good hands, tools do good works and in evil hands, tools do evil works. It is the wielder, not the tool that determines the outcome.

Having said that, a hammer makes a poor screwdriver and a broom makes a poor shovel. Knowing which tool to use in the appropriate situation and how to wield the tool properly is the most important choice for progressing in life. No one is born with the innate knowledge of how to use all of the tools necessary to achieve success but, there are many out there who can teach us. Choose your tools wisely and master them and you will go far in life.

I hope this helps you.


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## biobacon (Aug 20, 2012)

I suggest picking this up.

http://www.amazon.com/Guide-People-...48284555&sr=1-4&keywords=low+budget+homestead

The author is a forum member and he and his wife are the real deal.

If your not sure about guns he also has a book out about alternate weapons.

My own $.02 is that in a major crises the best self defence is knowing and having a good relationship with the people around you. But then again all the people I live around have guns. LOL


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## Country Living (Dec 15, 2009)

I bet there are few people on this forum that didn't start out with a .22 rifle. Lightweight. Simple. Easy. Ammo is not that expensive and in reasonable supply. You just have to make sure you (1) either hit the target that has a backdrop to stop the bullet or (2) have a berm, hill, or something behind the target to stop the bullet. 

The young grandkids have to master the .22 before we'll move them to a higher caliber rifle. Having said that, target shooting with the .45 Kimber is a whole lot easier for them than the .22 handgun. The Kimber has more balance and is easier to stop the "jerking" than the .22 for their smaller hands. 

When they move up to shotguns we'll start them on the 20 gauge and then, if they want, the 12 gauge. 

This is just our personal preference on getting the young 'uns used to firearms. They actually started out target practicing with bb guns. Of course, it does help to live out in the country to we have plenty of room for target practice. And it definitely helps to live in the Great State of Texas where guns are considered tools and not hazmat.


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## Cabowabo (Nov 6, 2012)

*Reality Check*

Do you have a Crystal Ball? If Not, then you will not know when the big one happens in time to stock up on guns, ammo, and training. If you do have a crystal ball, what stocks are the winners so I can make some extra money this year.

You need to Read; On Combat and the next book On Killing by COL. Grossman. I watched a video the other day on a cop shooting, from the time they saw the other guys gun to the time he hit the floor dead was 8 seconds. Their is this thing called the OODA Loop. Observe, Orient, Decide, Act. We condition this OODA loop to bypass thinking in training. So that way we can clear jams in our sleep, we can by pass the thought process that is slow and will get you killed.

FACT: Guns and Ammo are the first thing that dries up in a disaster scenario. Those without training, will quickly lose their weapons for lack of need of them any longer to those with training. Fact 50 rounds of ammo isn't enough for anything. Between my carry and back up, and my wives carry gun we use in excess of 50-75 rounds just for EDC.

Look at your Wife, and kids. And think about what will happen to them if you don't and a disaster does happen. Being a Man is about taking care of your family.


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## jnrdesertrats (Jul 3, 2010)

God bless those willing to continue talking him thru this. If a person is not mentally tough now the world is just going to use them for traction in a disaster. Who knows maybe one of us will find his rifle with the instruction manual laying next to it.


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## TheLazyL (Jun 5, 2012)

When a potential first time firearm Owner asks me, "What should I get for protection?" I answer with another question. "What is your intent for using the firearm?"

If their intent is use the firearm to scare off ,fire a warning shot or "I HAVE A GUN!", I advise them not to purchase a firearm.

If they express a mental fortitude to take a life defending themselves or family I'll make recommendations.

1. I'm a believer that a larger caliber weapon is better then a smaller caliber weapon. Why shoot someone(s) multiple times with a small caliber if one shot with a larger caliber will suffice.

2. Purchase the largest caliber and type of weapon that you can operate and shoot comfortably.

3. Carry the largest caliber firearm that you can carry comfortably and your body type will allow for concealment of the firearm.

4. Practice live fire and practice dry fire. Carry concealed every time you leave your house.

5. Your end goal is to shock, awe, overwhelm and neutralize your adversary before they realize they made a bad choice.

Now that you are prepped for SHTF, lets work on TEOTWAWKI. Here is what I believe will work for my situation.

1. Primary carry handgun is 45 ACP. Secondary handguns in 9mm (9 mm popular with military and police. Ammo, hopefully, easy to find during TEOTWAWKI).

2. In my Get home bag a Henry AR-7. Barrel is removable and stored in the stock along with extra 22 LR magazines. Fair rifle for hunting and defense. 22 LR ammo should be easier to find.

3. Bug Out Location, extended perimeter. Because our Bug Out Location is wooded, hilly and rural, a shot beyond 1/2 of a Kilometer would be rare. We picked the AR platform with a caliber of 5.56. And again part of our decision was based on the popularity with the military, ammo replenishment and parts availability.

4. Bug Out Location, close in perimeter. Mossberg 930 SPX, 12 gauge shotgun. I really wanted the Keltec KSG, selectable dual tube magazine. But reliability and availability ruled the Keltec out.

5. Smith & Wesson M&P15-22 for those that are too young or unable to comfortably use handgun, AR 5.56 or a 12 gauge shotgun. Tear down, operating controls and the size of the magazines are the same as a AR-15. Some parts are interchangeable with the AR 5.56 as well. Transition between the M&P15-22 to an AR 5.56 is made simpler. A bit picky on ammo until broken in.

Above are the basics that we believe will work for us. If funds become available scoped 30-06 or .308 "reach out and touch" rifles.


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## weedygarden (Apr 27, 2011)

jnrdesertrats said:


> God bless those willing to continue talking him thru this. If a person is not mentally tough now the world is just going to use them for traction in a disaster. Who knows maybe one of us will find his rifle with the instruction manual laying next to it.


I agree, but he has to start somewhere. I have come a long way from where I used to be. Many of us probably have. I had a man break into my home in the middle of the night and I confronted him. Yes me, a single woman with a then 12 year old daughter. If I had had a gun, I probably would have shot him. I bought a gun shortly after that incident. That man broke into another home 2 or 3 blocks from me 3 weeks later and sexually assaulted a 12 year old girl. Imagine the possibilities if I had not gotten up and been on my feet, being confrontational! A few years later, he broke into an apartment, killed the woman who lived there, and was caught while out driving her car that he stole after he killed her.

I think education is one way to help people grow, and we can get him moving in that direction, since he is asking. He has probably never even talked about guns before, and is now at least talking about what he should do. It will take a while to assimilate the idea in his brain before he actually moves to anything, if he ever does. It is baby steps, but it is steps.

My friend who is so closed off is not able to even hear it because she is so hysterical about it. I have heard her yell 1 time in my 25 + years of knowing her, and it was about guns. Imagine how many others are like this in America! I know too many of them! Usually, women are worse about this than men. Most of my women friends, who I have met through work, are so stereotypically incompetent about many things: changing tires, using tools, working on their homes, guns, and living alone. It has to do with how we were raised along with stereotypes.


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## ras1219como (Jan 15, 2013)

Skills (safe weapons handling, accurate shooting, combat tactics, weapons cleaning, etc), can all be taught. Knowledge about firearms can be taught. 

What cannot be taught is mindset. In order to truly be successful in a deadly force encounter a person must have a warrior mindset. A never give up, an "if I die it will be in a pile of brass" attitude.

Before you do anything, search within yourself and figure out if you have that. If you dont, then don't bother buying a gun, it will just get taken from you by a bad guy. And as others have said if you really truly don't trust yourself to be around a gun, then you've either been brainwashed by anti gun nuts or you've got things to work out before you become a gun owner.


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## PeachesBackwards (Sep 8, 2015)

I've been fortunate that I've never really been in a situation where I would have needed to use a gun and that's with living in a large City all my life. It probably helps that I spent the first 21 years in my life growing up in New York City where one develops a "sixth sense" about danger. Basically and I'll be totally blunt here, you don't go to high crime areas, you don't go to bars, you don't hang around with low lifes, you don't get into any confrontations whatever with blacks and other minorities and you hang out with other white collar professionals, etc. So yes I am letting others and the social climate dictate my life style. I do however realize that in a TEOTWAWKI situation, not having a gun is practically suicide and I want to be prepared in case TEOTWAWKI happens. I'm not anti gun at all but for myself, personally, I don't want to "lose it" in a situation where someone provokes me and use a gun out of a gut reaction and then face the likelihood I'll be "someones bitch in prison".



weedygarden said:


> I think the time is coming when we will either defend ourselves, or be taken advantage of, one way or another. I believe we should have guns and ammo to protect ourselves and our family.
> 
> I grew up knowing there were guns in the house, but they were not kept out in sight. They were usually in the back of closets, hidden, in rooms I did not spend much time in. My grandfather had guns that he used to shoot and kill rattlesnakes and pigs or cattle that were hurt and going to be butchered. He hunted when I wasn't around. I never touched, held or shot any of his guns. My brothers may have. I wasn't that interested in guns when I was young and am not that interested now, except to have them for protection and to target practice. I am not scared of them or scared of having them.
> 
> ...


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## weedygarden (Apr 27, 2011)

PeachesBackwards said:


> I've been fortunate that I've never really been in a situation where I would have needed to use a gun and that's with living in a large City all my life. It probably helps that I spent the first 21 years in my life growing up in New York City where one develops a "sixth sense" about danger. Basically and I'll be totally blunt here, you don't go to high crime areas, you don't go to bars, you don't hang around with low lifes, you don't get into any confrontations whatever with blacks and other minorities and you hang out with other white collar professionals, etc. So yes I am letting others and the social climate dictate my life style. I do however realize that in a TEOTWAWKI situation, not having a gun is practically suicide and I want to be prepared in case TEOTWAWKI happens. I'm not anti gun at all but for myself, personally, I don't want to "lose it" in a situation where someone provokes me and use a gun out of a gut reaction and then face the likelihood I'll be "someones bitch in prison".


I get having situational awareness and not over reacting to your own detriment.

My dad served 5 missions in Europe in WW II. It was probably one of the highlights of his life. He was in reconnaissance and drove for Patton. Whenever news about wars (Vietnam) came on television, we had to be quiet so he could listen and watch. I could not stand the idea of fighting and killing.

However, as I have matured, I have seen stuff and experienced stuff that has helped me to understand and to lose some of my naivety. Living in the inner city and being lied to and taken advantage of woke me up. The man in my house in the middle of the night also woke me up.

I like to watch movies and television shows that help me learn about what the future might bring and to understand what I will need to think about for the sake of survival. Some of my favorites include Jericho (t.v. series), The Road, Swiss Family Robinson, Castaway, Into the Wild, Kon-Tiki, Life of Pi. I am sure there are more. I do not like movies where you are always waiting for something horrible to happen. I have walked out of the theater due to some of them. These kinds of movies, and books along the same line have helped me to understand what we might be up against.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Balls004 said:


> I'm just going to stay out of this one...


So am I.

I have a whole book of snarky comments I could post but I'm just going to stand over here and watch...


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

PeachesBackwards said:


> I haven't! Honestly and people got upset at me here for stating so, I don't want to be around a gun while we still have a civilized society, before TEOTWAWKI, because I don't ever want to take the chance of using one out of anger.


You claim to live in Los Angeles, California. That being made clear the state law says you have to have a gun safe to store your firearms in BEFORE you even buy the first firearm. So if you store the gun as you are required by law you should be fine.

In anger are you really going to go to your safe and unlock it then shoot someone without at least calming down a bit?!? The time it takes to retrieve a firearm (if stored according to the law) will give you a moment to think before pulling a trigger.


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## dademoss (Aug 6, 2011)

As a resident of the state of California, you will want to become familiar with the laws regarding firearm ownership in the state:

http://oag.ca.gov/firearms/pubfaqs#1

Also check for county/city laws or regulations that may impact your choices.

The website calguns may be useful also:

www.calgunlaws.com


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## Balls004 (Feb 28, 2015)

Grimm said:


> So am I.
> 
> I have a whole book of snarky comments I could post but I'm just going to stand over here and watch...


:2thumb: LMAO Grimm... You made it all of one post!!!

:groupwave:


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Balls004 said:


> :2thumb: LMAO Grimm... You made it all of one post!!!
> 
> :groupwave:


HEY! I didn't let the snark out! I could have written a mile long post about how the OP is a 12 year old troll just baiting everyone for his own masturbatory pleasures. Or worse... a CMG employee trying to boost post counts for higher advertising revenue based on page/ad views.


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## Balls004 (Feb 28, 2015)

Grimm said:


> HEY! I didn't let the snark out! I could have written a mile long post about how the OP is a 12 year old troll just baiting everyone for his own masturbatory pleasures. Or worse... a CMG employee trying to boost post counts for higher advertising revenue based on page/ad views.


I like it when you let the snark out!


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## jnrdesertrats (Jul 3, 2010)

Peaches you have mentioned the fear of being someone's bitch frequently. Maybe it is like the fear of drowning, once you learn to swim it ain't so bad.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

jnrdesertrats said:


> Peaches you have mentioned the fear of being someone's bitch frequently. Maybe it is like the fear of drowning, once you learn to swim it ain't so bad.


So are you saying he should try being someone's bitch?


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Balls004 said:


> I like it when you let the snark out!


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## Dakine (Sep 4, 2012)

Grimm said:


> You claim to live in Los Angeles, California. That being made clear the state law says you have to have a gun safe to store your firearms in BEFORE you even buy the first firearm. So if you store the gun as you are required by law you should be fine.
> 
> In anger are you really going to go to your safe and unlock it then shoot someone without at least calming down a bit?!? The time it takes to retrieve a firearm (if stored according to the law) will give you a moment to think before pulling a trigger.


the point may be moot because with the thread being moved to top of the world, many of the posters can no longer see replies but I did want to clear one thing up...

CA gun owners do not have to own a safe, although I would strongly encourage anyone to do so, and I do mean anyone! if you don't have firearms to secure, maybe it's cameras, or PM's, or a silver service that's been in the family since who knows how long... how about birth certificates and social security cards, extra CC's, your deed, medical records, etc...

so back to guns and commiefornia... before you can leave the LGS with your new/used firearm you must either buy a BRAND NEW weapon lock (if the firearm doesn't come with one from the factory) or complete the safe waiver form where you specify make and model of the safe you have, that form is then turned over somewhere to CA DOinJ.

Furthermore, at least in here Kommiefornia if not other places, the burden is on you as the gun owner to make sure that it does not accidentally fall into the hands of a minor/prohibited gun owner (criminal, mentally unstable, etc)... so a safe is a really good thing, but my understanding from the last time I looked at the wording of that law, it does NOT include minors that gain access to the firearm illegally; so if they've broken into your house and stolen the gun, you're not liable for the actions they take with it.

I strongly advise everyone to take that with a grain of salt.
the US is probably the most litigious society on earth. (we sue people a lot)
CA is the probably the capital of the US in lawsuits per capita
BUY A SAFE

I even store my 80's in there after I've milled them out, because technically that's the firearm, and I don't need that kind of hassle, best to just keep them locked up.

There's no home inspection to make sure you didn't lie (or have but do not use) about having safe, but I've seen poorly written laws from LA and SF which suggest exactly that, to my knowledge none of those were signed.

How'd you like to be the officer ordered to knock on *that* door? Disturbing a law abiding citizen that you know to be armed for a violation of their 2nd and 4th (and possibly 5th) amendments... wouldn't be my first choice lol

anyway, in closing... BUY A SAFE! (and use it!)


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

Peaches Backwards, have you contacted any professional firearms instructors in your area? You really should get some "Basic Firearms" training to push the "myths" out of your mind & replace them with facts.

I also second buying the book by Steve Gregersen, "The Gun Guide for People Who Know Nothing About Firearms". It's a wealth if info and only $8 (paper, Kindle is $4)

Once you learn more facts about firearms use, many of the fears and doubts will disappear. It will then become just "another tool" .... one to keep you safe. Not an object of fear.


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