# Hand Pump 300-800 feet from static level



## Waterboy (Sep 20, 2011)

Windmills can pump from 1,200 feet plus. Regular hand pumps max out around 300 feet and it takes tremendous effort at that depth to pump water by hand. And, at that depth, the pump won't last long.

So I have a question: Surely after all these years, you would think someone would have come up with some type of pump that works by hand that can match the depths of a windmill. If so, where is it? Was it forgotten about when the electric pump came on the scene?

Does anyone know of a non-electric way to get water from great depths without a windmill and without a well bucket?

Being in the water-related business, I am concerned for those who have such deep wells.

Three years ago, I discovered that my well was clogged with rocks 175 feet bellow the surface, leaving me with only 7 feet of water. More info at http://wellwaterboy.com/id1.html

Pump professionals, well drillers and Department of Natural Resources agents all told me that I would have to drill a new well or have that one bored out.

I thought, if they could build pyramids thousands of years ago without any electrical means, then, surely, I could get those rocks out of my well. It took me three prototypes, but I did it.

The generosity of a neighbor with a garden hose got me through that crisis. After that, I decided I was never going to face a water shortage again.

Is there already such a hand pump out there or am I wasting my time with this project? I believe if a windmill can do it, then I can make a pump strong enough to do the same and easy to use.

Has one been made and/or forgotten about?


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## SierraM37 (Nov 2, 2008)

I have two wells, one at about 300' and one at about 80'. I'd love to have a windmill but they aren't cheap. So I am also interested in a hand pump solution in the deeper range. Let me know what you find and I'll continue my research as well.


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## Waterboy (Sep 20, 2011)

SierraM37 said:


> I have two wells, one at about 300' and one at about 80'. I'd love to have a windmill but they aren't cheap. So I am also interested in a hand pump solution in the deeper range. Let me know what you find and I'll continue my research as well.


Thanks for the reply and will do.


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## lefty (Sep 29, 2011)

I wish I had a deep well. I have one about 80 feet or so that is hooked to our sprinkler system. I want to get a hand pump for it to add to the back up water supply, we have a creek that runs along the back of our land that can serve in a longer term emergancy


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## elder (Oct 25, 2008)

The reason it is such hard work is that you are actually lifting the water by hand. Here is a link to how it's done:


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## J-stets (Jul 2, 2012)

RE: Deep well hand pumping

Using basic vertical hydraulic lift there is no theoretical limit to hand pumping depth, but there is a practical limit. IE: in a 1" pipe with a 300' head there's about 100 lbs of water in it being lifted, so with a 5 to 1 mechanical leverage, it requires 20 lbs of downward force. With 8 to 1 leverage, then about 12.5 lbs of down ward force. Say, with a 36" lever handle both doable, but not for long periods. A longer 48" lever handle with a 10-1 advantage would be better. So when you get to like 1200 feet of head, while it could be done with a lever handle, the handle would have to be around 10 feet long etc and then to complete a full piston stroke the handle would have to have like a 8' up/down travel range. So past around 300 feet it practically dictates using another means like block/pulley or other.

For the up to 300' depth range, there's the brand name Simple Pump and also Bison Hand Pumps, however these retail brands will cost about $2000 - $2500 or more to hand pump from 300'. You can find these all over the internet.

The only other company I've found that kick's these guys butt in my opinion, from a mechanical and engineering perspective, is a company called Renewable Power Systems & Services. They deal in more custom stuff including with solar power, and they have a deep well hand pump that's worth looking at. It's also less costly than the others, and they have some good information. Anyone interested might want to check it out. http://www.protectmypower.com/hand-water-pump.html

But for 1000 or so feet of head, likely no one's ever developed it because it isn't practical to hand pump. It really requires like a reversible motor, or the strength of a windmill etc.


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## Waterboy (Sep 20, 2011)

J-stets said:


> RE: Deep well hand pumping
> 
> Using basic vertical hydraulic lift there is no theoretical limit to hand pumping depth, but there is a practical limit. IE: in a 1" pipe with a 300' head there's about 100 lbs of water in it being lifted, so with a 5 to 1 mechanical leverage, it requires 20 lbs of downward force. With 8 to 1 leverage, then about 12.5 lbs of down ward force. Say, with a 36" lever handle both doable, but not for long periods. A longer 48" lever handle with a 10-1 advantage would be better. So when you get to like 1200 feet of head, while it could be done with a lever handle, the handle would have to be around 10 feet long etc and then to complete a full piston stroke the handle would have to have like a 8' up/down travel range. So past around 300 feet it practically dictates using another means like block/pulley or other.


If one can match the mechanical advantage of a windmill and use the same windmill pump system, it can be done!

http://www.motherearthnews.com/the-happy-homesteader/living-off-grid-a-home-made-deep-well-pump.aspx


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## forluvofsmoke (Jan 27, 2012)

If you don't want the expense and size of a wind mill (or for OPSEC - the tower standing out like a sore thumb, inadvertently inviting unwelcome guests, btw), and need the additional mechanical advantage for a deep well, why not just use a wind mill type gear-box with it's change of direction on a sturdy mount with the vanes of the rotor replaced by a hand crank to rotate the mechanism for the pump jack?

Sure, lots of turns on the crank to make a single stroke, but mechanical advantage requires more motion with less torque input to achieve the same results simply because one horse-power, for example, cannot be duplicated by one man-power. By utilizing the same type of rotary mechanism you can't use your body weight to your advantage in the same manner as you would to pull a simple lever operated pump downward, so you will use more muscles and joints to turn the crank (shoulders, arms, back, legs)...probably not the best for someone with arthritis, but otherwise, do-able, no?

Think of the possibilities here...you just by-pass the wind power and use human power input for the same (albeit slower) results with a few less components (tower & rotor). You wouldn't have the advantage of the tower as a derrick for well servicing, but a temporary derrick can be assembled for that purpose...it's been done that way since electric sub-pumps were invented.


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## cnsper (Sep 20, 2012)

Well people generally settled their homes near surface water or where water was close to the surface so a bucket or handpump could be used. Windmills were generally used to keep livestock watered on the range, not provide water for the home. I know that hollywierd like to have a windmill in the yard because it looked cool and it provided an measure of excitement in the middle of Nebraska because there were no trees to fall over and hurt one of the characters.. LOL

Now in order to find a solution to your problem you need to combine some technologies and adapt them to fit your needs. If you had a large wheel that you turned and that in turn spun a smaller wheel on the pump.

Think pony ride at the fairs or horse mills....


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## Waterboy (Sep 20, 2011)

forluvofsmoke said:


> If you don't want the expense and size of a wind mill (or for OPSEC - the tower standing out like a sore thumb, inadvertently inviting unwelcome guests, btw), and need the additional mechanical advantage for a deep well, why not just use a wind mill type gear-box with it's change of direction on a sturdy mount with the vanes of the rotor replaced by a hand crank to rotate the mechanism for the pump jack?
> 
> Sure, lots of turns on the crank to make a single stroke, but mechanical advantage requires more motion with less torque input to achieve the same results simply because one horse-power, for example, cannot be duplicated by one man-power. By utilizing the same type of rotary mechanism you can't use your body weight to your advantage in the same manner as you would to pull a simple lever operated pump downward, so you will use more muscles and joints to turn the crank (shoulders, arms, back, legs)...probably not the best for someone with arthritis, but otherwise, do-able, no?
> 
> Think of the possibilities here...you just by-pass the wind power and use human power input for the same (albeit slower) results with a few less components (tower & rotor). You wouldn't have the advantage of the tower as a derrick for well servicing, but a temporary derrick can be assembled for that purpose...it's been done that way since electric sub-pumps were invented.


That is a good idea and and I am sure it could be done. If there is a will the is a way!

.....

I had some friends over to be a part of the next video to show the easy operation of the hand pump machine. I was shocked and amazed how much water was pumped in 1 minute.

The Grandmother pumped 5 gallons a minute. Her daughter pumped 10 gallons a minute and her 8 year old son pumped 5 gallons in 3 minutes. I will be posting the video soon.

Amazing to see!


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## Tribal Warlord Thug (Jan 27, 2009)

if ya git it figured out Waterboy, come on over and see what ya can do to make a hand pump fer our well.....it's 290 feet deep........and in a well house to boot....








...............if yer ever here in the LotO area look us up.......then you can give me an idea of what we need for a hand pump


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## Waterboy (Sep 20, 2011)

Waterboy said:


> That is a good idea and and I am sure it could be done. If there is a will the is a way!
> 
> .....
> 
> ...


Here is the amazing video!


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## forluvofsmoke (Jan 27, 2012)

Waterboy, looks like you may have counter-weights and/or springs working in your favor. Nice work!


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## Waterboy (Sep 20, 2011)

rabidcoyote666 said:


> if ya git it figured out Waterboy, come on over and see what ya can do to make a hand pump fer our well.....it's 290 feet deep........and in a well house to boot....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


As soon as I fine tune the machine and go into production, I will get in touch with you.


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## Waterboy (Sep 20, 2011)

forluvofsmoke said:


> Waterboy, looks like you may have counter-weights and/or springs working in your favor. Nice work!


I was totally shocked that the mom in the video pumped ten gallons in a minute also, that's why I ran over there to set the other 5 gallon pail, LOL!

Thanks for the nice post!


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## Waterboy (Sep 20, 2011)

rabidcoyote666

Are you going to have room in the pump house for the machine? Its about 6 feet tall and weighs over 200 pounds. Your going to need some rockin room!


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## Tribal Warlord Thug (Jan 27, 2009)

probably have to redesign the one end of the well house......
this is lookin' thru the door.......








i'll figure somethin' out though..........


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## Waterboy (Sep 20, 2011)

Looks like the well casing is far back enough. And it looks like you can move things over to the right. Windmills also have a set up where an electric pump is installed on the bottom of the pump cylinder, so you could do the same and have your backup ready.

Is that an 8 inch casing?


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## Waterboy (Sep 20, 2011)

Posted in the wrong thread.


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## Waterboy (Sep 20, 2011)

http://www.motherearthnews.com/the-happy-homesteader/living-off-grid-a-home-made-deep-well-pump.aspx


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## Waterboy (Sep 20, 2011)

Double post


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## Waterboy (Sep 20, 2011)

Waterboy said:


> Looks like the well casing is far back enough. And it looks like you can move things over to the right. Windmills also have a set up where an electric pump is installed on the bottom of the pump cylinder, so you could do the same and have your backup ready.
> 
> Is that an 8 inch casing?


Correction:

A windmill pump cylinder* "can"* be installed in a six inch casing above the existing electric pump.


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## coyotech (Dec 26, 2012)

I'm interested in that too. Our house well is about 200' and the yard well about 20'. Never mind disasters, if the power goes out we're out of water in a few minutes! I checked out hand pumps for the house well. but the price was too high. Something like that horizontal wheel seems like it could be practical. Or a generator that runs on tallow


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## Waterboy (Sep 20, 2011)

coyotech said:


> I'm interested in that too. Our house well is about 200' and the yard well about 20'. Never mind disasters, if the power goes out we're out of water in a few minutes! I checked out hand pumps for the house well. but the price was too high. Something like that horizontal wheel seems like it could be practical. Or a generator that runs on tallow


Kinda like this?

http://www.playpumps.co.za/


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## Waterboy (Sep 20, 2011)

My wife and I take turns filling this 55-gallon barrel. In less than 10 minutes of moderate pumping, the barrel is overflowing, with enough water for our small trees, greenhouses and raised beds.

In another 10 minutes, we have enough fresh well water for a day's needs for drinking, washing dishes and flushing toilets.










The hand pump machine set up for our well (80-foot static water level)


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