# Cement Block House



## horology

We have just begun construction on a concrete and steel reinforced cement block house. It's 20' by 24' with a 12' by 24' covered deck (for more living space). We are building this way because it will withstand extremely high winds.

Anything we should know about construction before we get too far into it?

Thanks.
Sheila


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## Turtle

I don't know if you have ever heard of this company before, but it might be worth your time to check out their website. It's actually for castle construction, but it may give you some ideas, as the concepts are similar.
http://www.castlemagic.com/color.html


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## horology

Turtle said:


> I don't know if you have ever heard of this company before, but it might be worth your time to check out their website. It's actually for castle construction, but it may give you some ideas, as the concepts are similar.
> CASTLEMAGIC Castle builders


Cool site! Thanks!


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## Meerkat

A house is as good as the foundation it is built on.The most important step is the first one.A good architech s worth his fees.We used a commercial one on our block house.Our contractors,called it 'OVERKILL".i SAID "GOOD THATS WHAT I WANT'.
Do your homework before you build.


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## horology

Meerkat said:


> A house is as good as the foundation it is built on.The most important step is the first one.A good architech s worth his fees.We used a commercial one on our block house.Our contractors,called it 'OVERKILL".i SAID "GOOD THATS WHAT I WANT'.
> Do your homework before you build.


Thanks for the input!


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## SageAdvicefarmgirl

Pie Towns a cool place, have visited many times...tried to buy land in Quemado once, couldn't work it out. Too bad, I had a general contracotr lic in NM at the time! I'd love to design/build your place! Good foundation is key, dig below the frost line, always go wider and deeper with a foundation than they recommend. If possible, slush blocks every 4 foot on center with rebar and concrete for strength.

My kids still joke with me about the fact I was so bummed that the locals call Datil "dattle" instead of da-TIL The joke is "dattle be the day" if I ever get to buy land around there! Its beautiful, tho!


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## Calebra

Insulation . How are you getting that done?


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## Dropy

I have seen in some block houses a foam type of insulation they blow into the tops of the walls once all the block is set and done. it fills the blocks with the foam and increases the insulation factor a great deal. this also increases the strength of the walls and security they provovide. 

just a thought


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## Rancher

This stuff is awesome!

https://www.sprayfoamdirect.com/


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## Calebra

Dropy said:


> I have seen in some block houses a foam type of insulation they blow into the tops of the walls once all the block is set and done. it fills the blocks with the foam and increases the insulation factor a great deal. this also increases the strength of the walls and security they provovide.
> 
> just a thought


THe walls of the blocks will become a bridging point for cold.Not the best idea.
I am seriously considering a 3/4 underground house with berm-ed difference.
I do timberframe for a living but for an isolated house I am seriously looking for a structure that can provide a better defensive position. So far bermed/underground block house with hardfoamon the outside seems one of the best ways to go. I wish there was a more natural approach to insulation on those but being mostly underground I don't see much else.


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## Turtle

Calebra said:


> THe walls of the blocks will become a bridging point for cold.Not the best idea.
> I am seriously considering a 3/4 underground house with berm-ed difference.
> I do timberframe for a living but for an isolated house I am seriously looking for a structure that can provide a better defensive position. So far bermed/underground block house with hardfoamon the outside seems one of the best ways to go. I wish there was a more natural approach to insulation on those but being mostly underground I don't see much else.


Only thing I can think of would be to build the walls of three or four-foot thick stone, like old castles, but that would take a while and get expensive.

What do you mean by a "bridging point"? Do you mean the differences in temperature transfer due to the thickness of the block's structure and the foam in between? I wouldn't have thought of that, but it's a good point.


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## VUnder

What about ICF instead of cinder blocks? They are much stronger and much more insulated than cinder. When you insulate cinder blocks, you lose the strength of putting in concrete. If you pour cinder blocks full of concrete, you lose the insulation. If you are already started on this, be sure to put some durawall in between the courses of blocks. Most only put them every other layer at most. I have torn down some block buildings with heavy equipment, and the durawall makes a drastic difference, and it is easy to get and use.


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## MichaelK

The cabin on our land is a lot like what you are describing. When we first bought the land for our retreat it had a partially finished 2 room concrete block building with a foundation, doors and windows, but no roof. When you walked in the door you could look up at the sky.

Our first major project was to roof the cabin. I decided on a simple gable rafter roof so we could have living space on the second floor. First I used a hammer drill to make holes for the sill bolts. Used 1/2 inch redheads. After mounting 2X8 on top of the blocks I build the second floor; first laying joists, then 1/2 plywood. After the floor was complete I prepared a 24 foot long ridgepole by splicing two 2X12's with plywood. Once the ridgepole was propped 9 feet above the second floor, I started cutting the rafters with a 9 over 12 slope. Plywood over the rafters, then felt, then metal sheathing. The whole project took a whole summer of weekends.

In your case, plan ahead as to where you will want openings and fixtures. Imbed bolts and places to insert screws before you start finishing. I would not put insulation in the blocks. If you want a really strong block structure, fill the blocks with rebar and concrete. Then insulate the outsides of the blocks. 

In my case I am anchoring 2X4's with a nail gun to the walls, then laying foam insulation. This will be covered with standard sheetrock. Around the woodstoves, I replaced the sheetrock with cement board. It was a pain to work with, but now the perimeter of my stoves are totally non-flammable.

Later, if I want, I can do a second layer of insulation on the outside walls of the cabin. I'll powder nail 2X4's again and lay insulation, but will cover it with metal sheathing instead of sheetrock.

Good luck to you,
Michael


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## partdeux

remember, water always wins... make sure you have ground water and rain water handled.


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## ducksnjeeps

Another option would be to lay a veneer (brick or 4" solid block or architectual 4" block) as well. If you did, it would allow you to apply dampproofing as well as install 2" syrofoam insulation board between the cmu & veneer. You will have to use extended masonry wall ties, but they sell them everyday.


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## Conscious

I don't mean to be a negative nancy here, but I know a wee bit of construction, and especially green building. one of the points of green building is "preparing" or "planning"... i.e. knowing what you want to do before you do it. 

If you're already (as of 2 months ago) breaking ground, you're a half step behind. I don't know waht your specific goals are, but you should always consider those first. any amount of a sustainable design (and by this i mean the the green building i'm familiar with) requires fore-thought. 

You want water independence: requires forethought. 
Adequate food storage: requires forethought.
defensible position : requires forethought.

I'd answer some questions if i can that might be able to get you back on your track. again, apologies for being a negative nancy here, but i'll help however i can.


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## VUnder

You know, really, most structures have a weakness in the roof area. I have thought about doing a concrete top also, because even a large hail storm could go through your roof to the floor. We had some softball size hail here, and it went inside peoples' homes. Killed deer and cattle. I patched a lot of hail holes around here. One guy just stood in his carport with his wife and looked at the storm shelter, but there was not a way they could get to it. He now has a covered walkway to the storm shelter. Weather can get bad also, with all the turmoil going on.


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## wheelsee

This is another way

Monolithic Dome homes, schools, churches, storages, gyms and more


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## turkeydog

*Poured vs. block*



horology said:


> We have just begun construction on a concrete and steel reinforced cement block house. It's 20' by 24' with a 12' by 24' covered deck (for more living space). We are building this way because it will withstand extremely high winds.
> 
> Anything we should know about construction before we get too far into it?
> 
> Thanks.
> Sheila


I would have liked to talked to you prior to start of constructions. Poured 8 inch concrete walls are much superior to concrete/cinder block. especially with the "fiber" concrete. once you factor in labor, they are not that much more expensive. stronger, more durable, less cracking, and definitely more resistant to bullets. large caliber rounds (if gun violence is your fear) will easily bust holes in blocks, allowing next rounds to follow them in. 8 inch oured fiber cement walls takes .50 cal or better to blow through. if you've ever tried to drill a hole through it, you'll know what I mean. you can pour inside the blocks with concrete, but if you can just put up a poured wall, why would you?


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## TechAdmin

This all makes my dream of owing a castle seem like I'm not crazy.


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## brucehylton

Castles are built with rocks aren't they?


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## dannyboy721

*Already mentioned....*

HIYA - Just to quickly cover a couple things mentioned with Links to more info...
IMHO " I C F "'s would be the way to go (see link below). Thats definitely what I'm planning on when I get to it ! Just not in NJ! : ( They're versatile, can be built with whatever design you have in mind, provide tremendous insulation & highly defensible strength. They have options for various wall thicknesses depending on just how "bunker'ish" you'd like your place to be. Consider: A structure built with ICF's to a thickness of 12" PLUS 3" of hard poly Insulation on either side, with a 'Brick face' for curb appeal (or perhaps a Log home facade @ 3" - 6" thick) would also provide EXTRA insulation and another layer to defense considerations. Also as someone mentioned earlier, this could be partially or completely underground - or just start with a nice basement. And when you get down to it, the Inside decor can be whatever your furry little heart desires - It can be finished anyway you'd like (i.e. completely normal looking dry-wall interior, Logs, Stone etc) and as above, the Outside is also completely customizable. Depending on your exact choices through the process, it can be a little more costly, but the over-all benefits FAR outweigh any additional cost. Also, the "Concrete Dome Home" has many of the same considerations, maybe not quite as thick or solid overall, but the general shape lends itself very well to being partially/completely underground and/or protecting from the weather. OK - off the soapbox now - somebody else's turn..... 

http://www.icfhomes.com/


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## TheLazyL

Dropy said:


> ...foam type of insulation ...increases the strength of the walls and security they provovide. ...t


Security? Only against a small fire....maybe.

Single shot






A determined Shooter with a 45ACP


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## EarlyPrepper

Yah, but ICF construction typically fills the blocks and they are usually double wide thickness when wall width is 12". The vid proves they are little defense alone, but filled with concrete or sand makes for an alternative ballistic profile. Beyond that the facade of insulation is often at least 3-4" on either side, prior to finish facing. All in all, a much more secure technique for building dwellings, not to mention efficient.


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## TheLazyL

EarlyPrepper said:


> Yah, but ICF construction typically fills the blocks and they are usually double wide thickness when wall width is 12". The vid proves they are little defense alone, but filled with concrete or sand makes for an alternative ballistic profile. Beyond that the facade of insulation is often at least 3-4" on either side, prior to finish facing. All in all, a much more secure technique for building dwellings, not to mention efficient.


So it will take 2 or 3 magazines to penatrate instead of one to crumble the wall?


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## kejmack

horology said:


> We have just begun construction on a concrete and steel reinforced cement block house. It's 20' by 24' with a 12' by 24' covered deck (for more living space). We are building this way because it will withstand extremely high winds.
> 
> Anything we should know about construction before we get too far into it?


I am a month late seeing your post, but I wanted to tell you that I live in a house built in 1945. My house is 20x40. It is brick over concrete block with a metal roof and it is wonderful. Here's what I recommend.... 
1) make sure your crawl space is well ventilated. 
2) make sure you get the attic well insulated and also vented. 
3) if you can afford it, get a metal roof. 
4) get the best windows you can afford. 
5) wood and tile floors--awesome!


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## kreativemuse

I want to do a basement with a saferoom, lower and upper floors above ground. I am also thinking concrete is the best. It is safer then wood, keeps heat and cool air in once the inside is heated. It is near bullet proof. I am thinking 6 in on the basement walls (8 on the joining safe room walls) and 6-8 on all above ground walls. it is a lot more then needed but it makes it safer and stronger. I want to build it in the hills of Washington state near the olympic pen.


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## Meerkat

Calebra said:


> THe walls of the blocks will become a bridging point for cold.Not the best idea.
> I am seriously considering a 3/4 underground house with berm-ed difference.
> I do timberframe for a living but for an isolated house I am seriously looking for a structure that can provide a better defensive position. So far bermed/underground block house with hardfoamon the outside seems one of the best ways to go. I wish there was a more natural approach to insulation on those but being mostly underground I don't see much else.


 I wanted to go partly undergraound when we built this block house,but we have high water tables and sink holes here.So the cost would have been a problem.

We have lots of wild fires here in draughts.So we used block and metal for roof.Have a ton of steel in the block and its filled everry few feet.

Good luck with your home.:wave:


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## Meerkat

TheLazyL said:


> Security? Only against a small fire....maybe.
> 
> Single shot


 This may be true but most bullets now will penetrate the block of an engine.AK's and M16s are fairly potent.

I say maybe make a safe room for shooting,haha.Maybe bullet proof a certain room.:dunno:


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## Jimmy24

Having built a similar "block" building, I thought I would add a few ideas for you.

We poured the wall blocks with concrete and had reinforcing bar from the slab through the last lay of blocks. These bars went through and through the top plate. This "tied down" the walls. We left a 2" edge along the outside to have a support for the exterior walls. This was a moisture barrier, 1" foam board and scabbed out with 1x4s laid flat. Over the outside we installed HardieBoard 4x8 sheets. Along with a metal roof and HardieBoard trim, the building is pretty fire-resistance. 

The inside walls were scabbed out with 2x4s, plumbed, wired and then had the sprayed in insulation. The building is 20x28 and the energy bills are VERY low. Inside walls are just normal 2x4 stick.

The slab was the most expensive part of it all. Besides the normal footers and 6 in base, we have 8-12' deep by 18" extensions to the slab. These go down and act as a thermal extension to the slab and make a difference in heating and cooling requirements. Lots of $$$ in the beginning, but free energy from now on.


Just a few thoughts.

Jimmy


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## Onebigelf

Just bought a 1850 sqft block house built in '61. The walls are poured full of concrete with 2" interior blocking for wiring and insulation. In October with daytime temps in the low to mid 90s our electric bill (all electric for now) was $52 (512kw). The house has wood floors upstairs and terrazzo downstairs (the terrazzo is like a heat sink!).

John


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## karlsgunbunker

I ran into this sight a few days ago.
Dry stacked block w/surface bonding concrete.

If the block is filled it has excellent thermal mass properties.

https://www.thenaturalhome.com/drystackblock.htm


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## readytogo

The roof is the weakest point in a house, the shape of the building has a lot to do with wind pressure, that is why dome homes are so wind resistance, a prefabricated dome home of about your size is not that expensive; fiberglass shells or rebar mesh with spray on cement is another option. A rebar mesh for your building roof will make it very strong ,your supporting walls or bearing walls should be of blocks also not wood.


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