# Shelter Vehicles?



## Ragdoll

:hmmm:Let's think about something.....
We always talk about how long we could survive at home in a :shtf: situation,
and what preparations we've made; but what if we had to pick up and leave?
If you could no longer live in your typical home, where _would_ you go?
Would you live in an RV, boat, just a regular car? Or would you go with
something less traditional, like an underground shelter,an airplane, or maybe even a tank?
If you had to find a place to exist for a long period of time- somewhere you could store food,
house people, and protect yourselves- what would it be?
I guess I haven't thought about it much, but maybe you have.
Ideas or suggestions?:dunno:


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## ms_a2gwus

Ragdoll said:


> ...If you could no longer live in your typical home, where _would_ you go?
> Would you live in an RV, boat, just a regular car? Or would you go with
> something less traditional, like an underground shelter,an airplane, or maybe even a tank?...


I think you already have the answer at the bottom of the pictures:

"Whatever it takes!!!"

Actually, it would kind of depend on the circumstances of the event, why there was a need to bug out in the first place. So many senarios to that.


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## Tweto

I would use a small airplane. 

Most people have closed minds when it comes to aircraft. They only think of the big jets and the large airports. When I say a small aircraft I mean an aircraft as small as a four person cessna to cessna 208 turbo prop that can haul two people and an additional 2000 lbs of cargo. These aircraft with a little skill can be landed in fields, 2 lane highways, deserted airports, and with pontoons on any lake.

If you have the skill to fly an airplane then you can acquire any of thousands of abandoned aircraft (if it is TEOTWAWKI) at any airport. It would be very eazy to make a compound out of a small airport. Most airports have 10 foot cyclone fencing with barbed wire all the way around the property, They have a beacon tower, that allows observation, and an underground storage of fuel (100 octane avfuel). Avfuel will run super fine in gas powered auto's and trucks.

Most airports are outside of populated areas with nothing but fields around them. There are airports that are in the middle of nowhere (used by the forest service, crop dusters, and there are private runways on large ranches all over the great plains.


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## JoKing

Tweto said:


> I would use a small airplane.
> 
> Most people have closed minds when it comes to aircraft. They only think of the big jets and the large airports. When I say a small aircraft I mean an aircraft as small as a four person cessna to cessna 208 turbo prop that can haul two people and an additional 2000 lbs of cargo. These aircraft with a little skill can be landed in fields, 2 lane highways, deserted airports, and with pontoons on any lake.
> 
> If you have the skill to fly an airplane then you can acquire any of thousands of abandoned aircraft (if it is TEOTWAWKI) at any airport. It would be very eazy to make a compound out of a small airport. Most airports have 10 foot cyclone fencing with barbed wire all the way around the property, They have a beacon tower, that allows observation, and an underground storage of fuel (100 octane avfuel). Avfuel will run super fine in gas powered auto's and trucks.
> 
> Most airports are outside of populated areas with nothing but fields around them. There are airports that are in the middle of nowhere (used by the forest service, crop dusters, and there are private runways on large ranches all over the great plains.


If the right "What If" scenario plays out, you can land your plane onto my aircraft carrier lol. Seriously, I am skeptical about using a plane as a top 3 plan. I(myself)can't imagine being able to deal with logistics safely. One thing: everybody within a "?" mile radius will see or hear where you land. If I had a plane and a sound plan though, I'd love to have it as an option opposed to running out of bullets. *The beginning of my comment is 100% an attempt at humor. In my opinion, for the most part, all ideas are worth exploring. *


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## Tweto

JoKing said:


> If the right "What If" scenario plays out, you can land your plane onto my aircraft carrier lol. Seriously, I am skeptical about using a plane as a top 3 plan. I(myself)can't imagine being able to deal with logistics safely. One thing: everybody within a "?" mile radius will see or hear where you land. If I had a plane and a sound plan though, I'd love to have it as an option opposed to running out of bullets. *The beginning of my comment is 100% an attempt at humor. In my opinion, for the most part, all ideas are worth exploring. *


Concerning the noise.

When I was younger and stupid, I thought it was fun to buzz people at 160MPH. I can start an approach to land several thousand feet up. Pull the power to idle and push the nose over. The only noise the plane is making is the wind passing around the aircraft. Every time I did this the people on the ground didn't even look up till I was within 50 yards of them. I walk my dogs at the airport and have had several occaisions when an aircraft landed right behind me an I didn't know it. Go to a general aircraft airport and watch the aircraft take-off and land. The only time you hear them is when they take off.

Very few people including proffessional pilots understand what a small plane can do.

General aviation aircraft are not required to have landing lights and the pilots are required to make landings without lights at night during training. Pilots normally use the landing lights but they can still land with out them. So at night, no one will know when you're landing. I have had to make no light lands at night because of electrical failures, this is not uncommon.


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## beansbullets

Tweto said:


> Concerning the noise.
> 
> When I was younger and stupid, I thought it was fun to buzz people at 160MPH. I can start an approach to land several thousand feet up. Pull the power to idle and push the nose over. The only noise the plane is making is the wind passing around the aircraft. Every time I did this the people on the ground didn't even look up till I was within 50 yards of them. I walk my dogs at the airport and have had several occaisions when an aircraft landed right behind me an I didn't know it. Go to a general aircraft airport and watch the aircraft take-off and land. The only time you hear them is when they take off.
> 
> Very few people including proffessional pilots understand what a small plane can do.
> 
> General aviation aircraft are not required to have landing lights and the pilots are required to make landings without lights at night during training. Pilots normally use the landing lights but they can still land with out them. So at night, no one will know when you're landing. I have had to make no light lands at night because of electrical failures, this is not uncommon.


So have you made a night landing on an unlit runway or on an unlit grass strip? If so, how long was the hospital stay?


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## Tweto

beansbullets said:


> So have you made a night landing on an unlit runway or on an unlit grass strip? If so, how long was the hospital stay?


I'm sorry I need to spell it out. In aviation the terms landing lights mean the lights on the aircraft. I did not say that there would not be runway lights. Back in the 30's and 40's, runway lights were just oil lambs set out along the edges of the runway. All thats needed are runway end identifiers, (lights) four total. And yes I have landed at night on grass with just runway end identifiers.

No, I have not landed on a dark runway, for the kind of flying I do all I need is a clear strip of grass, or, dirt, or gravel, 1500 feet long and 50 feet wide. And yes I have landed on all these and have been doing so for almost 30 years. Not every small plane pilot knows how to do this. I had to rent a small plane and had to take a CFI (certified flight instructor) with me to be signed off for the aircraft. He ask me if I can land on grass? We landed on a small 1500 foot strip next to the airport and after landing he said that it was the first time he had landed on grass and he went on to say that most pilots have no experiance with grass.

Flying in small aircraft as been life altering to several of people I've taken up. A few have even went on to get there licenses. Two of them have went on to fly for major airlines and one went on to work for NASA.

And then there are the other people that are scared to death.


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## dunappy

Horse trailers make good shelters especially some of the older steel fully enclosed trailers. My horse trailer already has a "living" space in the front where the large dressing/saddle tack area is, if Necessary, I could expand into the horse space if I wanted or needed to. But I can also haul my horses and pets in the horse trailer if I need to move so I have a home and my horses.


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## beansbullets

Tweto said:


> I'm sorry I need to spell it out. In aviation the terms landing lights mean the lights on the aircraft. I did not say that there would not be runway lights. Back in the 30's and 40's, runway lights were just oil lambs set out along the edges of the runway. All thats needed are runway end identifiers, (lights) four total. And yes I have landed at night on grass with just runway end identifiers.
> 
> No, I have not landed on a dark runway, for the kind of flying I do all I need is a clear strip of grass, or, dirt, or gravel, 1500 feet long and 50 feet wide. And yes I have landed on all these and have been doing so for almost 30 years. Not every small plane pilot knows how to do this. I had to rent a small plane and had to take a CFI (certified flight instructor) with me to be signed off for the aircraft. He ask me if I can land on grass? We landed on a small 1500 foot strip next to the airport and after landing he said that it was the first time he had landed on grass and he went on to say that most pilots have no experiance with grass.
> 
> Flying in small aircraft as been life altering to several of people I've taken up. A few have even went on to get there licenses. Two of them have went on to fly for major airlines and one went on to work for NASA.
> 
> And then there are the other people that are scared to death.


So you got your tail wheel endorsement I take it. What you flying? Just got back from S&F, was eyeing the Carbon Cub. Since I got out of military, am able to get back into flying again and it's an easy sell with the wife since we can hit the beach in 2 hours.


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## Tweto

beansbullets said:


> So you got your tail wheel endorsement I take it. What you flying? Just got back from S&F, was eyeing the Carbon Cub. Since I got out of military, am able to get back into flying again and it's an easy sell with the wife since we can hit the beach in 2 hours.


I fly a Skyhawk, It's been very dependable (knock on wood). For flying in and out of umimproved fields the high wing is critical.

Landing on a grass strip in the sand hills of Nebraska, I found that the grass was about 18 inches deep, I taxied up to the only building on the property. Went in the door and there was 2 girls sitting at desks doing paper work. They both stared at me and said "hello, can I help you"? I said, I thought this was the pilots lounge. She says "what"? I said, didn't you here me taxi up to the back of the building? She said "no, didn't hear a thing". Then she says "Oh you flew in, this hasn't been an airport for years. Both of us are accountants, this is the only building we could find to do our business in". My charts still showed this to be an airport, but whomever was incharge never had it taken off the books.

There are airports like this one all over the country, just level strips of land with no buildings or even abandoned buildings. In almost 30 years of flying, I have landed at 50 or so of these and seen hundreds more from the air. Land, put up some camo around the aircraft and wait for the SHTF to be over.


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## beansbullets

160 horse I hope


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## Tweto

beansbullets said:


> 160 horse I hope


Yes, with 10 degrees of flaps and half tanks it comes off the ground fast and then climbs at 1000fpm.


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## beansbullets

Just don't think of a 172 as much of a bush plane


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## SierraM37

The 172 would make a great limited use bush plane. Put some oversize tires on it like they run on the bush planes in Alaska, maybe a STOL kit and your good to go. Does it compare to a DHC Beaver? Not even close. Personally, I could afford a 172, but not a beaver. While the premise of a plane as a BOV has some merit as the OP pointed out, every individuals situation is different. For me, I'm not in an urban situation, have land and lots of open space near and around me so I'm not going far anyway.


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## Tweto

SierraM37 said:


> The 172 would make a great limited use bush plane. Put some oversize tires on it like they run on the bush planes in Alaska, maybe a STOL kit and your good to go. Does it compare to a DHC Beaver? Not even close. Personally, I could afford a 172, but not a beaver. While the premise of a plane as a BOV has some merit as the OP pointed out, every individuals situation is different. For me, I'm not in an urban situation, have land and lots of open space near and around me so I'm not going far anyway.


I live on an acreage next to large farm field. I will be bugging in when SHTF happens. I will decide then (depending on the situation) if I will fly the 172 here from the airport and keep it in my back yard.


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## JoKing

Question: How can you tell that there is a pilot at your party?

Answer: don't worry, he'll tell you. 

Oops, wrong forum lol.


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## Tweto

JoKing said:


> Question: How can you tell that there is a pilot at your party?
> 
> Answer: don't worry, he'll tell you.
> 
> Oops, wrong forum lol.


Pilots only party with other pilots, nonpilots are boring.:wave:


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## beansbullets

SierraM37 said:


> The 172 would make a great limited use bush plane. Put some oversize tires on it like they run on the bush planes in Alaska, maybe a STOL kit and your good to go. Does it compare to a DHC Beaver? Not even close. Personally, I could afford a 172, but not a beaver. While the premise of a plane as a BOV has some merit as the OP pointed out, every individuals situation is different. For me, I'm not in an urban situation, have land and lots of open space near and around me so I'm not going far anyway.


Well that's a jump, skyhawk to beaver, ever seen a bush 172. Tweto, it's time to trick your plane out and run some tests. I'm think 180 conversion, some VG's, heavy duty nose gear, maybe even a little chrome, since it adds horsepower, maybe just stick with chrome valve covers. Let's see, how about a 3 blade, gap seals, a power flow exhaust. You ready?


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## Tweto

beansbullets said:


> Well that's a jump, skyhawk to beaver, ever seen a bush 172. Tweto, it's time to trick your plane out and run some tests. I'm think 180 conversion, some VG's, heavy duty nose gear, maybe even a little chrome, since it adds horsepower, maybe just stick with chrome valve covers. Let's see, how about a 3 blade, gap seals, a power flow exhaust. You ready?


BB

You know way to much about this stuff. What's your back ground in aviation?

The 180 conversion is smart at TBO. The 3 bladed prop is a bad idea, the 2 bladed prop is more efficient. Do you know why the 3,4,5 bladed props are used on some aircraft? Gap seals are good, but they scratch paint. The power flow exhaust would be excellant. Now if I did every thing you suggest, I would spend more then the plane is worth. I would rather have the money for fuel.


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## beansbullets

Been around aviation all my life, you know the story, solo at 16, went on to get my inst, comm, multi. A&P and IA Was in the air force as an engineer on EC 130's, went on to be a combat controller, got into spec ops, took some twists and turns, retired. I have a aviation business in Nashville and work with some guys from the spec op world with training and stuff. Working on finishing my schooling now and that's how I ended up here. Doing a research paper with a group on preppers. As far as flying goes, I have about 2700 hours and have owned a few planes thru the years. Closing on an A-36 in a couple of weeks but after looking at the carbon cub at sun and fun would really like to get one but think I would get the kit form, have helped a few guys build a few rv7's


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## Tweto

beansbullets said:


> Been around aviation all my life, you know the story, solo at 16, went on to get my inst, comm, multi. A&P and IA Was in the air force as an engineer on EC 130's, went on to be a combat controller, got into spec ops, took some twists and turns, retired. I have a aviation business in Nashville and work with some guys from the spec op world with training and stuff. Working on finishing my schooling now and that's how I ended up here. Doing a research paper with a group on preppers. As far as flying goes, I have about 2700 hours and have owned a few planes thru the years. Closing on an A-36 in a couple of weeks but after looking at the carbon cub at sun and fun would really like to get one but think I would get the kit form, have helped a few guys build a few rv7's


Very Impressive!!

To my knowledge, combat controllers are the top of the special ops.

Pilots by their very nature are preppers. End of the world or the next flight, the mentality is one of the same.

The A-36 is a great traveling plane and for business.

I only keep track of my hours for currency (somewhere between 1800 and 2000), all ASEL, and 95% of that in the Skyhawk. Do $100 hamburgers about twice a month and then make twice yearly trips of a week or more. Made it to Alaska in 2007, now I'm spoiled for any other destination. Landed in all 50 states now, 49 of the states in my Skyhawk, Hawaii in a rental.

Wanted to fly since I was old enough to walk. Got the private when I was 34, the inst a few years later, then the comm when I retired.

If you are a survivalist, I concider the ability to fly a requirement. If you are a prepper its not necessary but very helpful.

Keep flying:beercheer:


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## beansbullets

Yeah not many people know the roles people play. Your right about most pilots, I am always prepared. Nice little feat you accomplished landing in all fifty states. You need to post a pic of your bird.


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## Mick_Jee

Thousands of these old M113 armoured personnel carriers were built and they wouldn't be at all bad in a Doomsday scenario if we could pick up a cheap surplus one.
Being bullet-proof they'd be ideal for nipping down the local store to plunder it-









And it's roomy boxy interior means you could live in it if your house was burned down-









And you could even dig a pit with a ramp to drive it in and out for maximum protection against possible hurricanes/tornadoes, like this dug-in US Army Bradley APC dug in Germany being visited by Dick Cheney-


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## freedomusa

I love flying, and have spent the last eight years flying in bush alaska. It seems half my life has been spent sitting in the left seat of a cessna caravan. It is a great airplane and is capable of just about anything. It could serve many purposes in a bug out situation such as the evacuation of people in distress, or survelance. But for me and my family I have chose to build our ark. I feel it is the best shelter vehicle out there, and it will support me indefinatly, in any kind of weather, including the below zero kind here in alaska. Check out more pics at. bugoutbus.blogspot.com


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## oldwindrow

Give me an axe, and camp shovel. I can travel light, use both as weapons, and both will build any shelter discretely.


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## Fn/Form

Tweto said:


> I fly a Skyhawk, It's been very dependable (knock on wood). For flying in and out of umimproved fields the high wing is critical.
> 
> Landing on a grass strip in the sand hills of Nebraska, I found that the grass was about 18 inches deep, I taxied up to the only building on the property. Went in the door and there was 2 girls sitting at desks doing paper work. They both stared at me and said "hello, can I help you"? I said, I thought this was the pilots lounge. She says "what"? I said, didn't you here me taxi up to the back of the building? She said "no, didn't hear a thing". Then she says "Oh you flew in, this hasn't been an airport for years. Both of us are accountants, this is the only building we could find to do our business in". My charts still showed this to be an airport, but whomever was incharge never had it taken off the books.
> 
> There are airports like this one all over the country, just level strips of land with no buildings or even abandoned buildings. In almost 30 years of flying, I have landed at 50 or so of these and seen hundreds more from the air. Land, put up some camo around the aircraft and wait for the SHTF to be over.


That's funny as hell.

What do you think about the Feds "grounding" plans during a disaster? I doubt they'd give a dang, but if you popped up on a CAP visual or radar?

I think a plane is an excellent idea for a BOV. Landing a ways from final destination would help with security.

I've never done more than touch 'n go's in a 152... not a bad idea to get more experience, even if just paying for righthand seat time.


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## FrankW

Planses would make great BOVS but not good as Ersatz houses.
*Hot* in the summer and *cold* in the winter


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## Ration-AL

oldwindrow said:


> Give me an axe, and camp shovel. I can travel light, use both as weapons, and both will build any shelter discretely.


i'm with this guy, i'm going all Dick Proenneke if the need be





i think relying on any sort of vehicle is not good as they require the 2 things that are going to be the rarest of the rare in a SHTF case, fuel and electricity, i plan for doing things on foot, but hey if i have a working vehicle and some gas my life just got 100x's better, as opposed to planning on having a vehicle and something happens and being on foot, i think it's better to plan for the former as opposed to the latter in that case...


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