# 2nd hand and 3rd hand smoke



## NaeKid (Oct 17, 2008)

http://www.medicaldaily.com/third-hand-smoke-just-deadly-first-and-secondhand-smoke-what-it-268304

*Third-Hand Smoke 'Just As Deadly' As First- And Secondhand Smoke, But What Is It?*



> It's no secret that smoking cigarettes is (to put it mildly) bad for your health. And fewer of us, though still a substantial portion, understand that breathing in the smoke of someone else's cigarette is nearly just as bad. The risks now go beyond that, one study argues, as the toxins left behind on surfaces and objects can grow deadly over time in what researchers call, "third-hand smoke."
> 
> Anti-tobacco advocates often turn to the same general statistics in order to convince smokers to quit, and for good reason. Within 20 minutes of quitting, a person's blood pressure and heart rate return to normal levels. Within a year, coronary heart disease risks are cut in half relative to a smoker. After 15 years, the risk of heart disease is back to that of a non-smoker. For as comforting as these stats may be, University of California, Riverside, researchers argue, smokers (and their families) aren't in the clear. Long-term damage may still be done.
> 
> ...


http://www.ctvnews.ca/health/health...erous-as-second-hand-study-suggests-1.1664800

*Third-hand smoke may be as dangerous as second-hand, study suggests*



> A new study conducted on mice suggests that so-called "third-hand smoke" might be as dangerous as second-hand smoke.
> 
> While second-hand smoke is the smoke that is exhaled by smokers and that is released by burning cigarettes, third-hand smoke refers to the smoke that clings to objects and fabrics for long afterward and typically leaves behind the tell-tale odour smoking.
> 
> ...


Just another reason to seriously consider quitting smoking if you are a smoker, and another reason to give thanks for quitting if you were and another reason for non-smokers to never start ...


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## Sentry18 (Aug 5, 2012)

I started smoking in my teens when I was surrounded by soldiers who smoked (like it was a sport) and later cops who all seemed to smoke. I quit cold turkey almost 20 years ago and have never looked back. The funny thing is that we only have 1-2 officers who smoke now out of squad of 37 (at HQ). First because it doesn't seem to be the "in thing" anymore for 20-somethings around here and because their otherwise nearly free healthcare insurance go up by $50 a month if you are a smoker and requires a bi-annual cancer screening (at your expense). And yes, they test our urine for byproducts during random screenings to make sure.


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## BillS (May 30, 2011)

Secondhand smoke couldn't possibly be as bad as firsthand smoke. Not only is the smoker inhaling firsthand smoke at a much higher concentration but also the smoker's lungs have already filtered it once by the time they exhale. The idea of smoke residue building up on surfaces and that's somehow toxic to humans sounds like a joke to me. Next, I expect them to talk about 4th hand smoke. That's when you eat rats or mice that have suffered from secondhand and thirdhand smoke.

I wish the time and money being spent to deliver a politically correct scientific verdict on tobacco would be spent on the long term effects of marijuana instead.


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## VoorTrekker (Oct 7, 2012)

I am highly allergic to second hand smoke. I go into convulsions (called spasms by the doctors). When the smoke residues from cigarettes are inside of the big rig tractor, I get the killer skin itches or go into uncontrollable coughing spells. 

I don't even have to smell the cigarette to go into a "spasm."


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## NaeKid (Oct 17, 2008)

BillS said:


> Secondhand smoke couldn't possibly be as bad as firsthand smoke. Not only is the smoker inhaling firsthand smoke at a much higher concentration but also the smoker's lungs have already filtered it once by the time they exhale. The idea of smoke residue building up on surfaces and that's somehow toxic to humans sounds like a joke to me. Next, I expect them to talk about 4th hand smoke. That's when you eat rats or mice that have suffered from secondhand and thirdhand smoke.
> 
> I wish the time and money being spent to deliver a politically correct scientific verdict on tobacco would be spent on the long term effects of marijuana instead.


Most cigarettes have a filter that the smoker sucks through - the rest of the smoke goes into the air - un-filtered. When a smoker is in a car and they light one up, the un-filtered smoke (second-hand) will soak into everything that it can get into.

What the researchers are trying to say with that report is that it isn't always the scent of the smoke fresh from the cigarette that is the problem, it is the smoke that resides inside the vehicle (seats, arm-rests, head-liner, etc) and the smoke that is inside an office or home that can only be smelled days (months, years) later that is causing issues to those who are non-smokers.


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## Woody (Nov 11, 2008)

Let me see if I have this right. 

First and foremost, they use the term "Cigarettes" NOT "tobacco". Big clue there. They are two different things. "Tobacco" is a product from a plant, "Cigarettes" are a manufactured item with MANY added ingredients. Next, "third hand 'smoke'". They are talking about residue, NOT smoke. We might as well discuss flame retardants that are sprayed on all our furniture! The folks who apply them need all sorts of EPA approved respirators and other protective measures because THEY ARE TOXIC! Yet, somehow, when we buy them and use them they are good and safe now? What about 'second hand pesticides' that are sprayed on our produce? That nice apple, lettuce, asparagus or whatever you just bought and washed, is it really free of 'residual pesticides? Of course they are! You washed them off! This, to me, is all BS.

IF, and remember where the money is, IF, "cigarettes" are as addictive and as killer as the claims are, why are they not listed as a schedule 1 drug? They are HIGHLY addictive, this is a fact. They have no known medicinal value, this is also a fact. They are claimed to be more addictive that heroin, I can't personally defend this is I have never done heroin. So, why is our beloved government allowing cigarettes to be sold legally? Why is the "war on drugs" not including nicotine???


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## Foreverautumn (Oct 25, 2010)

*Can you say "witch hunt"?*

This is starting to sound more and more like a anti-smoking do-gooder WITCH HUNT! If tobacco is as dangerous as they're saying it is, then BAN it ALTOGETHER, and BE DONE WITH IT! While we're at it, we've gotta ban alcohol too! That'll solve ALL OUR PROBLEMS! Oh, yeah, that's right! We've TRIED that already! It was called "prohibition"! How well did THAT work out?

I've gotta wonder, what's next? Are they gonna start bellyaching about FOURTH- and FIFTH-HAND smoke? Where does this end?


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## tsrwivey (Dec 31, 2010)

I wonder who owns the patents to the equipment &/or materials that will make all that third hand smoke go away? Surely houses, cars, etc will all have to be decontaminated. Laws will have to be passed & enforced. Follow the money.


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## NaeKid (Oct 17, 2008)

tsrwivey said:


> I wonder who owns the patents to the equipment &/or materials that will make all that third hand smoke go away? Surely houses, cars, etc will all have to be decontaminated. Laws will have to be passed & enforced. Follow the money.


I have purchased vehicle that had been smoked in and I had a real hard time getting the scent out. I did some internet-searches to try to find some answers and beyond washing all the soft-stuff (carpet, headliners, seats, etc) and all the hard-stuff (dash, door panels, etc) and then putting used dryer-sheets into the vehicle (and replacing all the time), there isn't an easy way to clear out the scent.

Some have used ionizers to try to get the scent out, but, if there is any residue inside the cabin area of the vehicle, the scent will come back.

As far as a true fix for smoked-in areas, there are only cover-ups and "better-ments" but nothing solid yet.

I personally don't think that this is a situation of "Follow the money" as much as a "be careful" - especially with Feb4th (today) being listed as "World Cancer Day" according to the Canadian Cancer Society


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## Mase92 (Feb 4, 2013)

NaeKid said:


> Most cigarettes have a filter that the smoker sucks through - the rest of the smoke goes into the air - un-filtered. When a smoker is in a car and they light one up, the un-filtered smoke (second-hand) will soak into everything that it can get into.
> 
> What the researchers are trying to say with that report is that it isn't always the scent of the smoke fresh from the cigarette that is the problem, it is the smoke that resides inside the vehicle (seats, arm-rests, head-liner, etc) and the smoke that is inside an office or home that can only be smelled days (months, years) later that is causing issues to those who are non-smokers.


This is interesting. I remember when I was young, my grandparents smoked so much that the walls and fixtures would yellow. When we had to paint you could see the residual of the smoke on them.

There is no way all the smoke from a cigarette and that small filter catches everything that is harmful. And while I agree that about 1/2 of the smoke is only filtered I never realized that the other objects could be just as harmful, but if you look at land/buildings/areas around factories, you can see how that could happen.


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## NaeKid (Oct 17, 2008)

Mase92 said:


> This is interesting. I remember when I was young, my grandparents smoked so much that the walls and fixtures would yellow. When we had to paint you could see the residual of the smoke on them.
> 
> There is no way all the smoke from a cigarette and that small filter catches everything that is harmful. And while I agree that about 1/2 of the smoke is only filtered I never realized that the other objects could be just as harmful, but if you look at land/buildings/areas around factories, you can see how that could happen.


I had also never considered the third-hand smoke either before reading that original report. I only considered the smoke hanging in the air while at the bar with my friends. I only considered the smoke hanging in the air at friend's houses. I never considered the smoke that got into my clothing, and, then transferred from the clothing into the seat-fabric of my Jeep as being dangerous - only thought of it as being annoying.

Now - when I look at used vehicles, I will seriously consider the smoking history of the vehicle. When I look at used houses, I will consider the smoking history.

My truck was smoked in .. and my house was as well. I am still working hard to remove the scent / residue from both.


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## Sentry18 (Aug 5, 2012)

NaeKid said:


> I have purchased vehicle that had been smoked in and I had a real hard time getting the scent out. I did some internet-searches to try to find some answers and beyond washing all the soft-stuff (carpet, headliners, seats, etc) and all the hard-stuff (dash, door panels, etc) and then putting used dryer-sheets into the vehicle (and replacing all the time), there isn't an easy way to clear out the scent.
> 
> Some have used ionizers to try to get the scent out, but, if there is any residue inside the cabin area of the vehicle, the scent will come back.
> 
> As far as a true fix for smoked-in areas, there are only cover-ups and "better-ments" but nothing solid yet.


When we purchased our home the former owner used the back entry way (enclosed) as their bad weather smoking area. For about 15 years...

We ripped out the flooring and scrubbed the walls and floor with water, bleach & TSP. Then we painted the room with three coats of Kilz and two coats of interior paint then put down new floor covering. We replaced the outlets, outlet covers, light switches, light switch covers and lighting. We replaced all the windows and trim and had both doors (metal) blasted, primed and repainted at an automotive body shop. To this day depending on temperature conditions you can sometimes smell smoke in that room. When it's especially humid out, every once a while, a tar like substance will appear on the wall that smells like old ashtray.


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