# Homesteading/prepper concept - seeking feedback



## va22315 (Mar 29, 2012)

Wanted to get some thoughts about a homestead/prepper concept. First things first, I’m outlining a concept that I may, in a few years, be in a position to start putting together. So I’m not recruiting, or looking for people who want to join anything or sign on at this time. I’m just describing a concept to try to get feedback on how to improve it and determine whether it might appeal to anybody – not necessarily YOU, but whether you think anybody interested in homesteading/prepping would be interested in the concept.

Here’s the relevant background. I live in the DC area, and for both work and family reasons that isn’t likely to change for the next 20 years or so (barring TEOTWAWKI). I’d like to have a “homestead in waiting” for me in the event TSHTF – not just a cabin in the woods stocked with beans, bullets and bandages, but something with a few chickens, pigs, orchard, etc., where my family can “thrive not survive” as I’ve heard it said.

What I’m looking to set up is a self-sufficient homestead with a house, a small orchard of a dozen or so trees with a mix of fruits (apples, pears, peaches, plums, cherries), a milk and a beef cow, sow and boar (+piglets), a dozen dual-purpose chickens, a garden plus fields for crops (3-4 acres for hay, soy, field corn, wheat/other grains), a greenhouse (200+ square feet), and ideally a combined solar/wind energy setup for power, perhaps even micro-hydro if possible. There’s more, but that’s the general idea of the type of place I want.

That’s not possible for me to establish and maintain something like this at present given that chickens need fed daily, cows need milked, etc., and I'd be living 2 hours away. I’d guess that I’d be able to spend a week or two during the summer as well as frequent weekend visits, but that’s about it.

So here’s my concept: buy 20 – 30 acres approximately 2-hours west of Washington DC, and give some of that land to someone (individual/couple/family) that wants to live full-time on their own homestead. They would OWN the land – not lease, not held in trust, the land would be subdivided and they would own it. Right now based on what I’m seeing in the area I am looking at, a 5-acre parcel might be worth $20 - $30,000, give or take. I’d also build my own place, capable of housing me and my family (including in-laws), on the remaining land.

So what would I ask in return? Basically, 2 things: care for the livestock and minimal other “caretaking” duties, and to serve as a mentor/teacher to me in terms of passing along homesteading/prepping skills & knowledge that I don’t have.

The other person would need to milk the cow, gather the eggs, and feed all the animals when I’m not out there. I’m assuming that the other person would also want a milk cow of their own, chickens, etc., so the feeding would presumably be done at the same time.

They would get to keep most of the eggs and milk that are produced daily – simple arrangement would probably be that if I’m there and milk/collect it, it goes to me, otherwise it’s the other person’s. There would also be some modest gardening/farming duties, but not much – my hope is that if I put in a garden and a crop of wheat, I’d be out there to harvest/process it. And of course if/when TSHTF, the production all goes to me, but then I’m doing all the work at that point.

Regarding the mentoring/teaching, I’d be looking for the other person to spend an hour or two each day I’m out there passing along basic skills – how to preserve food, butcher an animal, install/maintain a battery bank, make soap, produce biodiesel, first aid, etc. FWIW, I’m not completely without skills (pretty decent carpenter, OK gardener), but there are some very, very large gaps in my knowledge and experience that need to be filled, preferably with hands-on experience.

I’d envision a few shared structures between the two homesteads, principally a barn. I’d probably also want to build a smokehouse and a shop of some sort, and some sort of small structure for food processing – make cheese, can large quantities of food (at least larger than any sane person would want to do in a small kitchen), butcher meat, etc. Co-owning a tractor and other equipment might also be an option.

So, that’s the very rough concept, with a lot of details to be filled in down the road. The basic exchange is, I provide land and a pretty substantial portion of what’s produced, and someone else provides me with perhaps an hour or so a day of labor for the feeding/milking/etc. duties plus an hour or two on some weekends of mentoring/teaching in homesteading/prepper skills and knowledge. 

I should mention there’s another version of this concept in which 5 or 6 families similar to my own buy 100 or so acres, and ask 5-6 homesteaders/preppers to join along similar terms to what's outlined above.

I’d love to hear feedback from anybody, positive or negative, particularly in terms of what sorts of problems you see arising or things that would need to be ironed out well in advance. And as I said, I’m not recruiting or trying to get anyone to buy into this right now, I’m just wondering if you think something along these lines would be of interest to the average homesteader/prepper.


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## libertyprepper3 (Aug 20, 2016)

I think it is a great idea and feasible as well. The hard part would be finding someone you trust. It would need to be set up as a business partnership in my opinion. You would be supplying The resources and your partner would be supplying The knowledge and labor. You two would need to iron out and possible conflicts that could arise and a way to deal with them if they did. For example, who all would be allowed at the homestead from each side if SHTF? Could that be changed or is it set in stone? If it can be changed what is the process? As far as homestead production goes it would need to produce enough for everyone that was agreed upon and some extra for charity or others that may be allowed to show up. When not in SHTF the extra could be sold. Who gets the proceeds? You, your partner, split, or invested back into the homestead. Also as far as your partner training you in everything homesteading it would be good to have a basic understanding of things, but it would be better if you were trained on things that your partner doesn't know such as security, communications, medical, etc... Of course it would be good to crosstrain in case something would happen to one of you, but expand the skill sets available at the homestead.


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## HardCider (Dec 13, 2013)

There is a book called "Off Off Grid" where he outlined a plan like that and it sounded like a good idea. The biggest issue will be finding a younger couple or single that is both hard working and trustworthy and without the resources to already be doing it on their own. Check out the Fort Valley Area. Nice area for a homestead. Decent soil in the bottoms, surrounded by the GWNF but most land within 2 hours of you is a little pricey. No harm but 2 hours from the DC/Balt. Metro area is a little close. As far as livestock, think heritage breeds. Might want to consider dairy/meat goats or sheep instead of cattle. Way easier to handle when you lack the experience. Small homestead breeds of pigs as well like black guineas or kune kunes. Modern hogs get enormous, the smaller breeds just fit a small homestead better.


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## Caribou (Aug 18, 2012)

Sounds a bit like a commune which I am not much of a fan. These things can work but but it is hard enough within a family. If it doesn't work out do you get the property back? After a month? After a year? After four years? After nineteen?

What if this guy doesn't know or is not much good at teaching the things you need? What if you just don't get along? How long before his indenture is finished? What if he gets sick or dies? Or you do? Does this guy ever get a vacation and if he takes his when you are there to tend the stock how does he teach you? Twenty years of milking, feeding, tending sick animals, mending fences and barns, chasing off or killing predators, dealing with frozen water and broken pumps for five acres?

You have many questions to answer and many more to ask and answer. You must look at this from both the positive and negative angles. If both you and he get along famously for the next twenty years everything is golden. If things are not golden, what then? Remember, about half the marriages in this country end in divorce. 

Not so much trying to be a downer as I am trying point out that there are some very serious issues to consider. These issues are complicated by time.


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## TheLazyL (Jun 5, 2012)

No thank you.

Two hours from D.C. is within a tank of gas. 

You want me to pay for the land and then maintain yours for free.

And when I sell out my 5 acre homestead to the Meth manufacturer...


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## Woody (Nov 11, 2008)

In theory it sounds perfect. The others involved get a place to live and get to take care of everything. You provide the land, tools and cash to get everything rolling. If something ever happens, you and your crew will appear and take things over. Or at least take half or better of everything.

Let’s look at it from the other side of the fence. I’m given, to own, 5 acres of a 30-acre tract. Good so far, saved me $150,000. House? Do I build my own? If so, I put up enough of a shed to accommodate my needs. Animals. I get a herd of stuff to take care of, not own, and get to use the products of those critters. I can live with that. I get to farm a few small fields of grains or whatever. I get to keep those rewards or have to split them? I would be willing to split them if all machinery and maintenance money was provided. Things are going smoothly… then… Suddenly you and your crew show up. Now, I have to split in half, or maybe give you more… Everything I have been taking care of. I have kind of become dependent and used to what I have had. I’ve been bartering with Ed, down the road, and receiving some service in return. Now, those goods are being used by you and not Ed. That service is gone. In a SHTF situation, Ed is going to play a pretty major role in keeping all of us happy. We now need to produce much more of that product to supply everyone involved. More than likely there are several “Ed’s” and now the same area needs to produce more than it can. I’m sure we could manage without those services, but bartering buddies are mighty important in a hard situation.

5 acres, or even 30, mortgaged. Using $30,000 for 30 acres is $900,000. I’m not going for that! That is a Million bucks for the land alone, I’m moving somewhere else. Looking at a map, not any real estate listings, there are a lot of places to move within your criteria. West By God Virginny is within that range, so is a lot of Virginny, or even Pennsyltucky, Delaware or Joisey. Usable land still should be available for $10,000/acre or so, maybe even with out-buildings and a fixable home.

Alone, it might be a $50 or $75k mortgage for your tenant farmer, on that 5 acres. I’m taking my own place and not having to look forward to someone coming in. On paper, your idea looks perfect; for your side. For me to take it, you would have to sweeten the pot a bit. Maybe give me a salary as well as being able to sustain myself and crew. I have a lot of responsibilities to just take a cut of what it produces then have to share when SHTF, just when I would need it most.

Just the thoughts of a semi-old man. Grey enough to look the part and young enough to still smile at the pretty, younger gals.


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## Starcreek (Feb 4, 2015)

You sound like a smart person. (At least I didn't spot any misspellings or grammatical errors!) I have not read the other responses yet, so this may be redundant, but you don't realize what you're doing -- or planning to do. There are some major holes in it....

1. You need to live somewhere else. Washington, D.C., has a HUGE target painted on it. Terrorists salivate at the chance to put a ding in Washington, and in the event of a nuclear war, it is the first place the Russians, Chinese, or North Koreans would hit, with the biggest bombs they've got. You simply can not "prep" while living in D.C. Your choice of residence makes it all null and void.

2. It is extremely hard to find someone you can trust with your homestead. People are generally unreliable, and finding a truly trustworthy caretaker is very, very rare. I sincerely advise you, should you choose to go that route, to make their "purchase" of their own parcel contingent upon the quality of care they give your parcel -- and following through on your other requirements of them. That way, they are motivated to keep their word.

3. There is no way I would want to go into a survival situation without a _good, working knowledge_ of those skills you'll need, like gardening, hunting, raising livestock, building and maintaining alternate sources of energy (wind, solar), etc. I am of the opinion that the best way to "prep" is by adopting a lifestyle that will give you that "good, working knowledge." For one, I know first-hand what it means to have dairy animals. I've had them for over 20 years and I'm still learning. My first herd I had for just a year, but my second herd (about 1993-96) I had a couple die on me, and I had to figure out how to overcome infertility in one of my best females. And one of the hogs nearly broke the ankle of a family member! There is a definite learning curve with raising livestock that you honestly can't pick up on a weekend here or there.

That, my friend, is my evaluation of your plan. It's a very simplistic plan. You need some practical life experience living like that before I would advise you throwing any money into it.


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## mosquitomountainman (Jan 25, 2010)

Not much in it for the "indentured servant." Plus what will you do when they sell and move or just rent the place out to???? The marriage might end in divorce,???? In essence, you are giving away your control and the other person doesn't really have much reason to stick around. Closest way to make it work would be for you to keep title to the land and sell them their land on some type of work to own contract.


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## Starcreek (Feb 4, 2015)

va, from what you've posted, I'm guessing you are in a well-to-do area with a good-paying job. Your best bet would be to buy about 20 acres in an isolated spot, maybe 50-100 miles from where you are now, put a really good fence around it, clear a garden spot (but don't worry about planting anything), put signs all around the fence saying, "Brushy Mount Hunt Club" or some-such. Build a cabin or put a trailer in there, dig a well, put solar panels on the roof. Don't tell anybody about it except family / friends you want to be there when tshtf. Stock a little pull-behind trailer with food (MREs, beans, rice), medical supplies, warm blankets, extra socks and shoes, garden seeds, 5-gallon buckets, and tools (like shovels and axes). Keep a 4-wheel-drive vehicle gassed up and with an extra can of gas at all times (make sure it can pull the trailer).

When the poop hits the fan, load up and boogie.

Oh yeah, make sure you've got a couple of big dogs, to discourage trespassers at your bug-out location.

That's the only way I'd do it, if I lived where you do and could not move.

Be aware, though, that the highways will become big parking lots in a crisis. All the major cities now have their highways fenced-in or walled-in, and all the traffic lights are controlled from a central hub. They can totally stop traffic with the push of a button. What will you do then?


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## Caribou (Aug 18, 2012)

Starcreek has some really good advice here. I'd make some slight changes. I'd park my trailer inside the garage, set some shelves up inside and use it as a pantry. When it was time to go I'd fill up any empty spots on the shelves, put the rails up to keep things on the shelves, and fill in the floor space with as much as I had time and space for. I'd also build a box on the tongue that would carry four to six gas cans and change the gas out once or twice a year.

On a bugout trailer I would have at least two axels. Not only would this give you extra weight capacity it would mean you could travel further with one flat tire. Next I would use the same tires and rims as the BOV that would be towing it. In the summer I would keep the winter tires on the trailer and just change them over twice a year. Tires get old whether you use them or not, this would keep relatively fresh tires on all the equipment. I'd suggest a couple of spare tires for the trailer. I'd use the best of the oldest tires for the spares. With the spare in the vehicle this would give you three spares. 

The only things I would leave are out at the BOL are things that are unlikely to be stolen. For example the compost pile. Every time you go to visit take the kitchen vegetable scraps and a bag of leaves if you have any. It is never too early to build the soil for your garden. Even if you don't know where your garden is going you can start a compost pile.


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## Woody (Nov 11, 2008)

Caribou said:


> Starcreek has some really good advice here. I'd make some slight changes. I'd park my trailer inside the garage, set some shelves up inside and use it as a pantry. When it was time to go I'd fill up any empty spots on the shelves, put the rails up to keep things on the shelves, and fill in the floor space with as much as I had time and space for. I'd also build a box on the tongue that would carry four to six gas cans and change the gas out once or twice a year.
> 
> *On a bugout trailer I would have at least two axels.* Not only would this give you extra weight capacity it would mean you could travel further with one flat tire. Next I would use the same tires and rims as the BOV that would be towing it. In the summer I would keep the winter tires on the trailer and just change them over twice a year. Tires get old whether you use them or not, this would keep relatively fresh tires on all the equipment. I'd suggest a couple of spare tires for the trailer. I'd use the best of the oldest tires for the spares. With the spare in the vehicle this would give you three spares.
> 
> The only things I would leave are out at the BOL are things that are unlikely to be stolen. For example the compost pile. Every time you go to visit take the kitchen vegetable scraps and a bag of leaves if you have any. It is never too early to build the soil for your garden. Even if you don't know where your garden is going you can start a compost pile.


Dual axels is also a much better tow. Stays behind you without wandering and dragging your ass end back and forth. With a single axel loaded down, you know you are towing something. With duals, only the extra weight tells you it is back there.

Then there is the issue of a flat tire, as brought up above. I've had a blowout with a single axel loaded down. You best be on top of it as it WILL cause you to have to change your shorts after you come to a stop. Two axels you feel the blowout but still have control over the towing vehicle and can come to a safe stop.


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## readytogo (Apr 6, 2013)

(So here’s my concept: buy 20 – 30 acres approximately 2-hours west of Washington DC)
Great concept but bad idea of having someone else taking care of it or living in your property, especially someone unknown to you and sometimes even family can created problems. Buying the property and visiting it on the weekends is no issue and since your estimated time is 20 years ,why no wait until then to stock it with animals and such ,and in the mean time you can work on the property and have fun with the family.


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## crabapple (Jan 1, 2012)

I do not know, I have 4 acres that has high ground back in the woods off 2 lane paved road, but it has wet feet at the highway.
I have a buyer who wants to put a mobile home on one acre, then put 3 more M homes on the other 3 acres to rent out.
She is 22 years old & has saved up $5000.00 dollars to go down on the 4 acres.
I am willing to do owner finance the land, seems to me she got her head on straight.
I know some people would try to cheap her, but I think we should help anyone trying to better them selves without using my tax dollars.
So I told her two put the M home on a half an acre, pay cash for it, then finance the other 3.5 acres.
My point is to be careful, but with the right person the OP plan could work.


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