# On the move



## Savory_Sauces (Jun 26, 2013)

So when Shtf I plan on grabbing some supplies I have and hitting the road, staying on the move.
I'm confident in my ability to find a steady supply of food, medicine, etc. - the only thing I have yet to learn that I feel would be helpful is the bow and arrow, I'm a damn good shot with guns and I favor my ugo SKS, but I know i could easily run out of ammo.
Now every now and then I might hunker down for a month or two if I find a nice spot but once it's resources are used I will move on.

Basically I'm wondering if anyone else is planning to do the same? And if so this thread could be general discussion about things that would be helpful for men on the road.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Most of the forum members are married or have families that make bugging out impossible. Plus most of us have homesteads or farms that will provide the bulk of our needs.

Also think of how your plan will impact survival in the long run. If you stay in one place til the resources are depleted you will make it hard for the next person or group that reaches that area. Once resources are gone from an area it takes a very long time for things to come back. I'm sure our resident hunters on the forum will attest to this in terms of over hunting/fishing a wild population.

With the millions of sheeple leaving the cities with the same plan as yours you will find you are not as lucky as to a constant supply of food be it foraged or hunting/fishing. Think of having a Bug Out Location that you can stock with supplies and maybe even farm an area near by. If you still plan to hunt think of seeding a plot for the deer so you can help the local population boom prior to SHTF. 

Being on the move only works til you get to a more permanent location or BOL. Take the show The Walking Dead. Rick was willing to fight the Governor to keep the prison since it was a secure and permanent location for the group. Things were hard for them when they were always on the move but stabilized once they moved into the prison. Yes, I know it is a show based on a graphic novel but it has some useful ideas.

If you really are stuck in wanting to be on the move check out the pilot to the show Apocalypse Man with Rudy Reyes. All his tips are taken from the lone wolf on the run point of view.


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## GrinnanBarrett (Aug 31, 2012)

I am afraid you may finding moving about to be tough thing once the dust has settled in a real SHTF scenario. Remember, communities are not gong to open their arms to travelers who take up resources. Consider the experience unemployed men had during the Great Depression of the 1930s. Towns would post signs at the edge of town saying "Keep on Moving! No Jobs here! No Handouts! Don't Slow Down!" 

In a real falling apart of society you will also see communities limit people coming through their "Jurisdiction". Road Blocks may be common. Some from legitimate town folks but many others by common criminals wanting to take anything you have including your wife and family. 

It is your choice but the best bet you have is to align yourself with a "Community" of folks with similar interests and an agreed upon mutual defense pact. Having a place where you have numbers on your side is one sure of way of giving yourself better odds of survival. Groups are hard to find and harder to start and maintain. 

Don't plan on hunting for survival. Every guy and gal with a gun of any kind is going to be out there trying to do the same. When people are hungry they will shoot cows in the field for one meal and then leave the carcass in the field to rot. I believe you will find as you go along the need to have a place to stop and have a safe haven. That is a decision you will have to make. 

I am not trying to flame you here. I understand where you are coming from. We all were there at one point or another. Talk to people on this or other forums and I think you will find the serious survivalists look more toward groups of strong family and very very close friends as their backup. One thing you will find is there are a lot of people who talk survival or prepping. There is a much smaller number who really live the lifestyle. The serious ones do not look like mountain men or wear camo all day long. They blend into society and basically live two lives. 

You really need one kit for you to carry, one kit for your vehicle for each person, and supplies at your eventual bug out location (BOL). Renewable resources are going to be a huge deal. Having Non Hybrid Seeds for example is going to be something you MUST Have to survive long term. Your supplies will run out and so will everyone else's. Kroger will not be open tomorrow. Neither will Walmart. 

Hang in there and best wishes to you. GB


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

Like Grimm says your situation is different than many of us. So your plan is different. Not a bad plan just different. I would have three questions for you (only in the interest of helping you look for weak spots in your plan).
1. Planning to travel on foot?
2. What general area of the country or world are you planning on doing this?
3. Is the main part of the plan scavenging abandoned homes/businesses?


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## MDsapper (Mar 12, 2013)

for the next few years my plan is very close to yours, i'll need to be on the move quite a lot. my truck will be my primary mode of transport but i'm starting to take long walks to condition my body for when my truck is no longer an option


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## mojo4 (Feb 19, 2012)

Another thought is where are you going? Assuming its not a Katrina like local event you have to assume everywhere is as bad as where you are right now. There would be no place to run to and with no semblence of law and order a sniper would take you out for yer shoes. And gun. And anything they can scavenge off yer carcass. Nope. Either get where you're going before it gets too hairy or its best to hunker down cause alone on foot in the wilderness your survival is pretty slim. Think about the book of eli but with everyone still armed. Danger Will Robinson Danger!!


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## MDsapper (Mar 12, 2013)

yeah but thats where S.E.R.E. comes in handy


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## Savory_Sauces (Jun 26, 2013)

Well I do plan to have a couple close friends if they are willing, and I don't mean literally all of an areas resources.. And I'll be on foot, bike, vehicle, whatever I can use at the time.. Although in the event if an emp most vehicles won't be usable for transportation, I do have very good stamina though as I used to mountain bike 5 miles a day in hill country (speaking of which I need to get back go doing haha).

As far as the community thing goes, i don't do we'll being told what to do (and a self righteous leader is inevitable) and I don't trust many people as it is in normal society so a post apocalyptic situation would only heighten my social barriers. 

Also it might help to let you all know I'm 18 in August so I don't have a family to support, if anything it would be me and my dad traveling around (he's ex marine) and he's taught me a lot, so I think we will be fine.


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## Savory_Sauces (Jun 26, 2013)

Oh and @hiwall I'm currently in Texas and I would most likely move north through Arkansas as I have family there, and from then on I will decide where To go next.


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## cowboyhermit (Nov 10, 2012)

I certainly wish you all the best and hopefully we never have to deal with any of this in our lives, but that plan would be the absolute last resort I could think of
If you aren't planning on looting I wonder how much experience you have in providing for yourself for an extended period of time while also on the move. Your plan of stopping for a period of time is about the only way to make it possible but you would be setting your self up for some scary encounters. There will always be someone better armed and better trained out there, especially if you are on the move because I doubt you are packing a .50cal The thing is by moving around you are greatly increasing your chances of running into that group or individual. A person moving on foot is at a severe tactical disadvantage to someone "dug in", to say nothing for the logistical (food, shelter, clothing) disadvantages.
Also a lone young male, or group of males moving in off the main road areas will likely be viewed with extreme prejudice by locals.

I am sorry if this sounds harsh, I just think that if you were to have any place at all to hole up you would be better off, worst case scenario you end up on the road like your plan.


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

Your plan is my last resort plan. And even then I only plan to travel long enough to find a group in need of the skills I possess and am acquiring. 

My order of plans are...
Bug in
Bug out to bug in with local family
Bug out with truck to a specific location
Buyout on motorcycle to a specific location
Walk to specific location
Wander the earth in hopes I find someone in need of my skills.

As I am forced down each level my odds of being able to sell my skills to a group or even survive drop substantially.


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

While your plan is hazardous, it is certainly doable. A couple of observations to consider.
Travel by bike/car/wagon would be faster,more carry capacity but require going where others are located.
Cross country backpacking- stealthier but very limited what you could carry. 
A book on edible plants would be worth its weight.
A center-fire gun is LOUD and would draw unwanted attention when getting camp meat(ammo is heavy also). 
Extreme care would have to be a constant, as ANY injury could be fatal.
Any re-supply would be hazardous and not dependable.
These are just what I thought of in 5 minutes!


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## pandamonium (Feb 6, 2011)

cowboyhermit said:


> I certainly wish you all the best and hopefully we never have to deal with any of this in our lives, but that plan would be the absolute last resort I could think of
> If you aren't planning on looting I wonder how much experience you have in providing for yourself for an extended period of time while also on the move. Your plan of stopping for a period of time is about the only way to make it possible but you would be setting your self up for some scary encounters. There will always be someone better armed and better trained out there, especially if you are on the move because I doubt you are packing a .50cal The thing is by moving around you are greatly increasing your chances of running into that group or individual. A person moving on foot is at a severe tactical disadvantage to someone "dug in", to say nothing for the logistical (food, shelter, clothing) disadvantages.
> Also a lone young male, or group of males moving in off the main road areas will likely be viewed with extreme prejudice by locals.
> 
> I am sorry if this sounds harsh, I just think that if you were to have any place at all to hole up you would be better off, worst case scenario you end up on the road like your plan.


^^^^^This covers a lot of what I was thinking. Another thing to give great consideration to is just how much food it will take to be ABLE to be on the move on a daily basis. In temperate climates, I would say a healthy young male would need on average a minimum of 2500-3000 calories per day to maintain his health strength and stamina, if you are moving the majority of the day. Colder climates will increase the amount needed. That is quite a large amount to scrounge, hunt, gather. Most of your day will be spent just trying to find breakfast!!!! As stated previously, being on the move is fine for fairly short periods, as long as you have a destination to head for. Also don't forget WATER!!! Warm/hot weather, and you are carrying everything you own, which will not be so minimal, you will need at LEAST 2 liters per day, more sweating, more water needed. Finding, purifying, carrying enough water will be a challenge. Unless of course your entire trek follows a river!!!

Thats my take.


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## weedygarden (Apr 27, 2011)

*What are your thoughts?*

Each of us makes our plans based on our needs. As Grimm says, with a family and children, that would be so difficult.

I often wonder what the situation or thinking is when people make plans. For me, I live in a city, and I know it will not be safe. But I know that being a refugee will not be safe either. As others have said, you will always be at a disadvantage.

I have watched too many movies where scenes have helped me be aware of what it could be like on foot and adrift. The Road and The Book of Eli are two examples.

If I bug out, I am aware that it needs to be very early or after things settle down. I am a homebody, and want to live in a sheltered way, even if it would be a dug out or cave in a hill somewhere. But I also know that absolutely every person is going to be affected and each of us will suffer.


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## camo2460 (Feb 10, 2013)

I agree with most of the comments here. That being said, and I don't mean to be a jerk, but if you think that you will be able to survive on your own, you are sadly mistaken. Take a look at the "primitive" people of the world and you will see that they all live in some kind of community, tribe, village, group and this is for a reason, they know that group survival trumps individual survival every time. Think about security, unless you are an Owl you can't see every place at once, many eyes are better than a single pair. And what happens if you are injured, or sick, a group can assist you, were as a broken leg could be a death sentence. I have been a survivalist/preper since I was very young, and can survive almost any where with little more than a knife, and I wouldn't try to survive on my own for any length of time, unless there was no other option


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## Caribou (Aug 18, 2012)

I say this in a friendly and brotherly way, don't show up on my property, strangers will not be welcome. The game and other resources are part of my plan to supplement my preps. There is not enough game around my place to feed everyone. I will perceive a hunter on my property as a threat.


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## Bobbb (Jan 7, 2012)

My take on this issue is that you should do your planning like you would go about cutting the lawn, washing your car, taking out the garbage. 

Huh?

The point is to look at your disaster prepping as a mundane task rather than loading it up with wish fulfillment, ego enhancement, a means to adventure and so on which I believe I detect in your plan.

The job of planning is to give you the best chance of living and surviving rather than fulfilling some other objective, such as defining yourself and who you want to be in relation to a world gone crazy. I get that there is a sense of empowerment which arises from being able to rely only on yourself and to live off the land while most of society is burning down to the ground and people are frantic with their helplessness. The problem is that embarking on your plan is going to be a very costly way of buying adventure and empowerment. I think it's safe to say that if society goes to hell then everyone who manages to keep afloat is going to be feeling pretty empowered and dealing with adventure every day.

Maybe I'm totally off-base with the above and if so, then disregard my mutterings and know that I'm not intending to slam you in any way it's just that I'm not the kind of guy who'll blow sunshine up your skirt.

If you buy-in to the strategy that the prime mission after the world goes to hell will be to survive then I would think that you'd be ready to adopt a plan which had less adventure but increased your chances of survival. Boring and alive should trump exhilarating and injured.

As others have already laid out for you there is going to be a lot of competition for you from people doing the exact same thing because they're forced to do so by lack of planning and preparation. Right now, in a society still ordered and functioning, there are limits on game hunting, limits on fishing, and these limits exist in order to manage the wildlife resources. What do you imagine is going to happen when those limits can no longer be enforced and 30 million hunters all head for the woods to shoot anything they can in order to put food on the table for their hungry wives and children? That wildlife is going to be decimated in short order. Then what will you do? Loot? Do that and people who have prepared and are protecting their land and communities will begin hunting you.

You're not wedded to a plan until you actually need to implement a plan. This goes for all of us. You're on this board before the SHTF and so you're far ahead of the game compared to about 280 million other people. I'd give serious thought to changing your plan - go the boring route and leave the adventure for after the big Die Off (whether via famine, war, rioting) after which society can begin rebuilding. Your goal should be to survive and I can't see any sense in trying to live off the land as being a better option than riding out the storm.


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## piglett (Dec 10, 2010)

Caribou said:


> I say this in a friendly and brotherly way, don't show up on my property, strangers will not be welcome. The game and other resources are part of my plan to supplement my preps. There is not enough game around my place to feed everyone. I will perceive a hunter on my property as a threat.


please do show up here at my place, you will be seen as a threat & will be delt with at once. having said that my chickens just love fresh meat:rofl::woohoo:


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

piglett said:


> please do show up here at my place, you will be seen as a threat & will be delt with at once. having said that my chickens just love fresh meat:rofl::woohoo:


Better yet, smoked long pig jerky. Bacon and long pig sausage. Green eggs and long pig. Split pea soup with long pig. Rack of long pig short ribs. Or spiral cut long pig ham on Easter...

Is long pig kosher...?


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## piglett (Dec 10, 2010)

Grimm said:


> Better yet, smoked long pig jerky. Bacon and long pig sausage. Green eggs and long pig. Split pea soup with long pig. Rack of long pig short ribs. Or spiral cut long pig ham on Easter...


i'm old & tough , probably dam poor eating:laugh:


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

Savory_Sauces, I see many have been rather critical of your plan. Remember these comments are about the the plan not about you. Also we pick apart everyone's plans for everything. This is only to find weak spots that can be fixed or changed or ignored. I'm sure they will be critical of my plan to build a nuclear reactor as a power source for my motorhome also.


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## cowboyhermit (Nov 10, 2012)

Not me hiwall, go for it, don't forget to post pics and details

Seriously though, a lot of the posts (mine at least) sound harsh but since you put the plan up for consideration (criticism) it wouldn't be right for everyone to not voice their concerns. I also agree that it is possible, it would be my last choice but I certainly wouldn't lay down and die if it came to it. I have been hunting, fishing, foraging in wilderness since I was a boy and even in areas I know like the back of my hand, the idea of traveling long term and trying to survive seems very marginal.
There I go again with the negative
Don't let constructive criticism scare you off, we are all trying to be helpful.


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## helicopter5472 (Feb 25, 2013)

hiwall said:


> Savory_Sauces, I see many have been rather critical of your plan. Remember these comments are about the the plan not about you. Also we pick apart everyone's plans for everything. This is only to find weak spots that can be fixed or changed or ignored. I'm sure they will be critical of my plan to build a nuclear reactor as a power source for my motorhome also.


 I'm sure they will be critical of my plan to build a nuclear reactor as a power source for my motorhome also.[/QUOTE]

We will be able to find him, just look for that mushroom cloud vract:


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## tsrwivey (Dec 31, 2010)

While there are many, many folks with guns, especially here in Texas, I wonder how many gun owners could hit the broad side of a barn let alone actually shoot well enough to actually kill anything? I'm thinking that out in the woods where these newbie hunters are many prove to be a very dangerous place to be. :surrender:


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## dirtgrrl (Jun 5, 2011)

piglett said:


> please do show up here at my place, you will be seen as a threat & will be delt with at once. having said that my chickens just love fresh meat:rofl::woohoo:


... so does my dog ...


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## piglett (Dec 10, 2010)

dirtgrrl said:


> ... so does my dog ...


not sure they would eat dog:2thumb:


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## Dakine (Sep 4, 2012)

There's an awful lot going on in this thread...

first of all:

I could write an entire encyclopedia of stupid shit I did when I was teens and in the Corps.

Relying on a dad or uncle or whatever that has any military experience is better than nothing but it's not the same as having been there yourself and its definitely not the same if you grew up in the 'burbs of some 100k+ city as compared to working a farm or ranch.

second:

(and I'll borrow this line from a movie, because it's actually really good) You know less than nothing, if you knew that you knew nothing you'd at least know SOMETHING.

nobody cares about how much you know, you're not going to form a collective and strike back, or defend an area. You have nothing, you've got no plan (read as: prepositioned materials, caches of supplies etc) you have a goal, but not a plan. As others have mentioned, you'll be shot by someone 5-50-500 yards away because they dont know you, want to know whats in your back pack, or just because they have nothing else better to do.

seems bleak doesnt it?

it doesn't have to be that way, $20 will buy you a used 55 gal blue barrel and you can fill that with water. Water is KING! you can go a week without food, I've done that... you can not go days without water before your body and brain start shutting down, and at that point the decisions you make are all really bad. 

if I were you... 

I'd get one of those AR-7 knock offs (which I still want one by the way) they're made by Henry rifles now, and they cost about $250 and it's a survival .22 which lets you hunt rock rat (squirrel) and all kinds of other things, isnt super noisy like lighting off a .30 cal anything, those are going to draw attention!

I'd look at water filtration instead AND water storage. Depending on where you live you can collect lots of water, even when I lived in Phoenix, there was TONS of water to be collected by rain and dew, but if you dont know how, and dont have the equipment ready... you might as well be in June instead of Sept and Nov.


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## Cabowabo (Nov 6, 2012)

You need to ask yourself these questions.
How much weight can you move constantly every single day. 
How many Rounds of 7.62X39 can you carry? 
How long ago was your dad in the Marines? What was his Job in the Marines?
Have you overlooked anything? 

The Skills your dad learned in the Marines, Land Nav, Distance Shooting, Room Clearing are all perishable skills. If he doesn't practice them on a monthly basis he may have lost a lot of what he knew. 

You don't fall back to the level of training you've recieved. You fall back onto the level of training you've mastered. When I was in high school, I was in Band, same for a little while in College. When I was in High School, and working for a competition. I would work one section of a piece, or one measure (bar) of a section until I had mastered it. Armatures practice till they get it right, professionals practice till they can't get it wrong. 

Seriously ask yourself if you are overestimating your ability to survive. Some people might help you out, especially in the beginning, but eventually someone will kill you in your sleep for your rifle. Or for your shoes. Or they might kill you to eliminate a potential threat. Can you keep watch at night with two people? Yes if you aren't moving you can. Instead of focusing on equipment that you'll have to carry. Focus on skills. Most of the work done today is done on computers. Look at the skills people had in the past, and see which of those you can learn, it will make you more valuable and give you something to trade when you run out of food or ammo.


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## musketjim (Dec 7, 2011)

Remember Don and Dan Nichols in Mont. in the mid 80's. They were survivalists who kidnapped a young lady. She got away I believe and they spent a year or 2 on the run. Even with their guerilla gardens and caches of supplies they still had to raid houses and cabins. When they were caught they were in poor shape but still alive. Luck plays as big a part as skills. At any cabin or house they could have been caught. That is in good times, in bad they would be caught and eaten. I suppose wandering around and pilfering will work but best be prepared when it goes bad. I live the fitness lifestyle to the max as part of my preps and I can't think of a more miserable existence than wandering for days trying to get the same food source that 200 million or so other folks are trying to score. Good luck, we are all going to need it if it comes down to that.

Take care of your neighbor now, you might have to eat him later.


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## musketjim (Dec 7, 2011)

Just looked up a little bit about the Nichols clan. It was only a few months they were on the run. My bad.


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## Quills (Jun 14, 2011)

I have a big (read: freaking HUGE) problem with people whose survival plan is to take from others from the get-go.

Make your own preps, or plan on not surviving, because while there may be plenty of homes where you can take what you want by force, eventually, you're going to come across someone who is bigger, stronger, better prepared, or just plain MEANER than you.

At (almost) 18, "The Road" might sound like an adventure, but it's not. Don't fall into the trap of thinking it is.


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

I don't think the guy ever suggested stealing from others or using force against others as his survival plan. From how I understood it his plan was to take off with his dad and survive off the land while traveling. Most of this thread has offered some insight on why that may not be the best of plans and some alternate plans for consideration. To be honest that was my initial plan before I put thought into the scenario and grew as a prepper.


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## pandamonium (Feb 6, 2011)

CrackbottomLouis said:


> I don't think the guy ever suggested stealing from others or using force against others as his survival plan. From how I understood it his plan was to take off with his dad and survive off the land while traveling. Most of this thread has offered some insight on why that may not be the best of plans and some alternate plans for consideration. To be honest that was my initial plan before I put thought into the scenario and grew as a prepper.


I agree, I don't think his plan was to steal to survive, BUT, if you are trying to live off the land and you haven't eaten in 4 or 5 days, you may become inclined to try to take instead of forage. I personally would try to avoid putting myself in that predicament in the first place!!


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## Quills (Jun 14, 2011)

How much "forage" do people think there is going to be after a few days of no grocery deliveries? There are going to be a LOT of hungry people out there -- "forage" is going to consist of very little after as little as a week or two, and a lot of people -- people who scoff at preparing for a "rainy day" today -- are going to have already gotten to the "forage". I doubt there will be much for someone whose plan is "hitting the road", and the stuff they "forage" will, inevitably, belong to someone else -- ergo, "stealing".

As for hunting, keep in mind that animals being hunted tend to know it. Anyone who hunts knows that, as hunting season progresses, the animals become more and more jittery -- and better at hiding or disappearing into the bush. Game is going to be REALLY scarce within months of any actual SHTF event, and anyone counting on game to survive is going to be very, very hungry, very quickly. 

If you know how to forage in nature for food, good on you, but don't rely on that, either, because other people aren't dumb, and seriously, most people will try to eat ANYTHING when they're hungry -- there will be those who get sick from eating things they shouldn't, and either they'll learn the lesson quickly on what can be eaten and what can't, or they'll die and others will learn -- either way, natural food sources aren't going to last with thousands, if not hundreds of thousands, of starving people eating everything that doesn't run away too quickly.

Reality is that, unless you have no other option, and unless you're willing to kill to survive, "hitting the road" is a really bad idea, and one that this poster can do something about NOW -- as in getting a better plan.


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## cowboyhermit (Nov 10, 2012)

CrackbottomLouis, I think for a young able bodied person being able to survive on the move and on foot is a great place to start. Anyone could potentially end up in that situation, including those of us who ostensibly are very well prepared. At the same time it quickly becomes apparent to most that with that strategy, especially in the long term, there are a lot of issues. I think trying to use this strategy long term is better suited to a plan B, or maybe plan Z


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

Couldn't agree more. That's why my plan evolved from that way of thinking and why I expressed those sentiments to savory sauces who began this thread. We know without a way to resupply that living off the land in a shtf scenario a person will likely be screwed. I just don't think he had quite thought it through enough to realize that. He was not suggesting that his plan was to steal and loot however even if that's where the plan would most likely end up in reality.


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

It must be a good plan as it has got 37 replies! Those that think game will be hard to find are not thinking enough. Any bird or animal is made of meat. Robins and blue jays are a fair sized birds, three or four birds that size would give you some protein. Any animal from chipmunks on up would do. Fish will not disappear right away. If the fish don't bite eat frogs, salamanders, muskrats, beaver and crayfish. There will likely be dogs and cats that people released to fend for themselves and they are fine to eat. Odds are if it moves you can eat it.


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## HamiltonFelix (Oct 11, 2011)

Live off the land? Nope, it's a non-starter when millions are hard up. Hunter-gatherer societies survive only with a very low population density. During the Great Depression, game was nearly wiped out in many areas. It's great to be skilled at hunting and to know every edible or useful plant and mushroom in your area, but it's not enough in the long run.


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## Aliaysonfire (Dec 18, 2012)

Savory_Sauces said:


> Oh and @hiwall I'm currently in Texas and I would most likely move north through Arkansas as I have family there, and from then on I will decide where To go next.


What part of Texas? I'm north Houston. There are a lot of great resources in our area. Lots of communities already set up. It's really pretty nice around here. About one in every 10 people I talk to are very favorable about prepping...probably 1:20 are actually storing for a short term event- we live in a very good area to meet others for sure. Spring Texas preppers is a huge group that holds regular training in their store front for free. (They pass a can around but it's not a big deal.)


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## jeff47041 (Jan 5, 2013)

"Hitting the road" may sound great, but highly unlikely to work out for anyone.

Prep now and prep big. And when SHTF you will be the most popular 18 yr old around. Think chicks.

I have signs for SHTF that say "Trespassers will be cannibalized" And then for a twist, I have some that say "sausage and chili for sale or trade" I think these signs will scare people more than signs that say something like "trespassers will be shot on sight" or other threats. The thought of being cannibalized seems more frightening than just being shot.

Traveling and trying to live off the land just sounds like a bad idea to me.


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

If SHTF it is just as likely to be martial law. That would include no un-authorized travel of any kind. And the "rounding up" of citizens to easily controlled areas.


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## weedygarden (Apr 27, 2011)

*Consider the possible scenarios*



hiwall said:


> If SHTF it is just as likely to be martial law. That would include no un-authorized travel of any kind. And the "rounding up" of citizens to easily controlled areas.


Hiwall, this is what many don't talk about, maybe haven't considered, or don't want to think about. Some people who consider themselves to be preppers may be some of these.

What if SHTF is government orchestrated? What if power, water, food, and etc. is shut down and we are under martial law? How many people would be able to hunker down and live for a week, month, or longer? What if the gathering up of the people to eliminate is based on those out and about as they appear after x amount of time? What if there are centers to go to get food and supplies, where people who show up are not given food, but a bus ride to some elimination center? What if people go out and never go home again, through no decision of their own? What if there is a list (as in the Holocaust) of people to eliminate in order by certain behaviors--criminals, welfare recipients, protesters, loud mouths, trouble makers, preppers, maybe even gun owners (not necessarily in this order)? What if there is a plan to begin to dismantle society by many of the above mentioned actions until certain things are different in society? What if the people out and about become a target to take out?

I know that some people may think in a similar way, but some can't.

Something to think about. We don't really know all that is being planned and developed by our government. We are aware of a lot of stuff that is not good, but does anyone know the whole picture?


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

If I was a government in a free country and I knew that the citizens would never allow martial law I would get them to ask for it. If I brought down the power grid nationwide and left it down for a month or two, a large part of the population would die(many of which would be the undesirables that I wanted to weed out anyway). After a large number were dead and most of the remaining were in rather dire straights I would swoop in with the military and offer salvation (on my terms). Most at this point would do or allow most anything for security and food. Once I had absolute total control, the power grid could be brought back up and life could go on but now with a whole new set of rules. Just one scenario.


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## pandamonium (Feb 6, 2011)

weedygarden said:


> Hiwall, this is what many don't talk about, maybe haven't considered, or don't want to think about. Some people who consider themselves to be preppers may be some of these.
> 
> What if SHTF is government orchestrated? What if power, water, food, and etc. is shut down and we are under martial law? How many people would be able to hunker down and live for a week, month, or longer? What if the gathering up of the people to eliminate is based on those out and about as they appear after x amount of time? What if there are centers to go to get food and supplies, where people who show up are not given food, but a bus ride to some elimination center? What if people go out and never go home again, through no decision of their own? What if there is a list (as in the Holocaust) of people to eliminate in order by certain behaviors--criminals, welfare recipients, protesters, loud mouths, trouble makers, preppers, maybe even gun owners (not necessarily in this order)? What if there is a plan to begin to dismantle society by many of the above mentioned actions until certain things are different in society? What if the people out and about become a target to take out?
> 
> ...


THAT is a whole lot of IFs!!! 
I don't know if our government could keep plans like that under wraps for long. I don't think they are that competent!! Our military for the most part, i know there would be some, would just say hell no to unlawful orders of that magnitude. America is still a very heavily armed populace and it wouldn't take long for the full blown revolution to start if those things started happening .


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## pandamonium (Feb 6, 2011)

hiwall said:


> If I was a government in a free country and I knew that the citizens would never allow martial law I would get them to ask for it. If I brought down the power grid nationwide and left it down for a month or two, a large part of the population would die(many of which would be the undesirables that I wanted to weed out anyway). After a large number were dead and most of the remaining were in rather dire straights I would swoop in with the military and offer salvation (on my terms). Most at this point would do or allow most anything for security and food. Once I had absolute total control, the power grid could be brought back up and life could go on but now with a whole new set of rules. Just one scenario.


That could be a plausible scenerio. I started thinking about the global and local effects of this scenerio. I think if this happened that our economy would definitely collapse irrepairably, everything would stop, not a soul would be getting paid so noone would go to work, I would expect that to include most law enforcement and military, since the majority of these fine folk also have families to fend for!! The global effects would be just as bad. The economies of other countries would flop right along with ours!! Global trade would pretty much stop. Commerce at home would stop too.

If something like this was attempted on purpose, with the intent of putting things back to a semblance of normal, I thing it would blow right up in their faces!! I cannot even imagine the logistics of pulling off a stunt like this!!

On second thought, maybe not so plausible...


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## cowboyhermit (Nov 10, 2012)

Not really on topic but since you guys started it I just have to say that a government using a crisis or even encouraging one in order to gain powers is not just plausible, it has happened throughout history. The examples are endless from the horrendous to the inconsequential, just look at how much power was gained by our own governments during WW2 and the great depression.


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## Savory_Sauces (Jun 26, 2013)

Sorry I haven't replied or anything recently, but no I have no intention of stealing, but I'm sure there will be abandoned places or similar with food. As far as hunting goes, I can definitely "hit the wide side of a barn" or however that saying goes haha, not trying to boast but I'm a pretty decent shot.
I will most likely be living in canyon lake texas at the time any of this where to happen, and the number of deer there is pretty high, so I'm sure I could shoot a couple deer for enough food to let things calm down (they get so close to you around here you could probably kill one with nothing more than a knife and a hand full of corn haha). 
Another point I would like to make is; you guys keep talking about other groups of people I would encounter or other single people, I'm estimating that about 1 in 20 people will survive the first two weeks, and then after that maybe 1 in 10 of the survivors. I think this because I've lost faith in humanity as the general population are so unintelligent it's appalling.


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## millertimedoneright (May 13, 2013)

I have heard many people say that the military members and law enforcement wouldn't go along with a government takeover but I disagree...all free people's would be branded terrorists and we know how much our police and military hate terrorists...think Osama bin laden...we promised him food and aid for his people and have him weapons so his people would fight the Russians for us and in return we left him and his people starving....he retaliated and became a terrorist...if that ain't enough then the government feeding the police and military's families would be enough for most to stay loyal...then the rest will be considered traitors and shot so the rest will fall in line


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

Savory_Sauces said:


> I will most likely be living in canyon lake, Texas at the time any of this where to happen, and the number of deer there is pretty high, so I'm sure I could shoot a couple deer for enough food to let things calm down....


Great. Until greater San Antonio arrives in your backyard.

You don't really think that isn't where 90% of Bexar county wouldn't be headed to, do you?


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Savory_Sauces said:


> Sorry I haven't replied or anything recently, but no I have no intention of stealing, but I'm sure there will be abandoned places or similar with food. As far as hunting goes, I can definitely "hit the wide side of a barn" or however that saying goes haha, not trying to boast but I'm a pretty decent shot.
> I will most likely be living in canyon lake texas at the time any of this where to happen, and the number of deer there is pretty high, so I'm sure I could shoot a couple deer for enough food to let things calm down (they get so close to you around here you could probably kill one with nothing more than a knife and a hand full of corn haha).
> Another point I would like to make is; you guys keep talking about other groups of people I would encounter or other single people, I'm estimating that about 1 in 20 people will survive the first two weeks, and then after that maybe 1 in 10 of the survivors. I think this because I've lost faith in humanity as the general population are so unintelligent it's appalling.


You can lose faith in humanity all you want but that doesn't make your estimation correct. Unless you are God's prophet and know how the end will come you can not be sure how many if any will die when SHTF. Plus humanity will surprise you with its will to survive. Many people here have said that they will do whatever it takes to make sure their own families survive. How many non preppers will do the same?!

Just some food for thought. You seem to be counting on a very specific scenario. Good luck but do not dismiss the warning of others... Many here will shoot on sight rather than give you a chance to shoot and I am one of those people.


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## gabbyj310 (Oct 22, 2012)

I always just pray that WTSHTF I am home and not on a ship overseas!! The main reasons being I KNOW that I will have enough of my preps and BOL to be safe for a long long time.Also there should be enough for friends and family(of my choosing) to stay put and manage for a good long time(in a small community setting) and out of the way enough to stay under the government radar,which is one of the main points of a good BOL.If we can all stick together and" out of sight out of mind" until the re-building begins then that will be a HUGE plus!


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## Jimthewagontraveler (Feb 8, 2012)

Well Savory sauce if you happen to meet a little old person sitting all alone on a bucket in the middle of no where you are being given your one and only chance to prove you are a good guy.
Dont try to hide sneak or ghost around.
Dont try to blast through.
Dont try to turn and run, its already to late.
Dont shoot first.
You will gain one dead old person.
The children will gain all.
Their will be no trial and there will be no waste.
If your blood tests clean and one of the girls wants a baby and you are a bad guy but healthy then your prostrate will be removed and chilled to service her.
Say hello from a distance and be polite and all is well.
Oh yea I live close to your intended route.


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## mojo4 (Feb 19, 2012)

As far as gov conspiracies go let's start with sandy hook. There is enough questions about that to make your head spin. So to play the devils advocate let's say that it was 100% staged. Why? To try to turn popular opinion against gun ownership. So what actually happened? It caused a gun and ammo rush that eclipsed even the infamous clinton assault weapons ban. Dang near everything that went bang sold. Every round of ammo was picked up. People still wait in lines for ammo shipments. So just because the gov may be planning shenanigans the actual effect is usually far different than the intended one. But its still advisable to keep yer head down and yer powder dry!


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## majmill (Jun 6, 2012)

I like to travel also, that is why I joined the Air Force in my youth. But what is the point of a life on the road? Where is the FUN in a life on the road? What you are proposing is simply a pointless life of simple survival. IMO that would be both pointless and no fun. Please take the time to plan for a future, not just survival. In spite of all the trials of today it is possible to find FUN!


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