# Saving on the electric bill?



## Trip286

I'm renting a trailer. I just got my first electric bill, and good gawd!!! I almost soiled myself.

Anyway... everything is electric. Short of installing solar panels and a windmill, and other major renovations, what are some ways I can save?

First, here's what I've got going on. The exterior walls have had their paneling removed and spray in insulation added. The roof has been removed, insulation added, and new roofing put on. The bottom is insulated too. So all sides are insulated. The weak spots are the windows.

I don't generally use much juice, but with EVERYTHING being electric, there's only so much I can do.

This place warms easily, and I'm in Louisiana, so I expect my heating bill to not be too bad. I use space heaters for heat, and right now they're only being turned on at night, maybe once a week, on the coldest nights (so far that's been maybe 50 degrees farenheight)

So... I'm thinking oil lamps, but I'm worried about the fumes, for lighting. Any ideas on this? Info?

Also, what are the most energy efficient space heaters, or is there an alternative heat source I can use? To give a good idea of how easy it heats in here, a single 60 watt incandescent bulb makes the crapper really nice and cozy.

I'm also thinking window films, since the windows are the greatest weak spot in the insulation. Any suggestions here?

Also, any and all other suggestions would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## hiwall

All electric heaters are 100% efficient. So changing to different electric heater would do nothing. You could maybe lower the temp setting for your water heater and/or add a water heater "blanket" to it. You could line dry your clothes instead of using the dryer. Unplug unused electric items(many draw juice when off).


----------



## brownb

Call your power company and find out what the average bill on your neighborhood is if they will tell you. They probably won't tell you exactly what your neighbors pay but if there are other trailers around you can get an idea of what everyone else pays for similar housing. There also may have been a deposit added to your first bill. And not to be snoopy but what do consider good gawd worthy?


----------



## TheAnt

Pop a wood stove in that baby! I live in AZ so I dont really have to heat anything but if I did I would prefer a wood stove. Wood stoves are what I would call "double efficient" because not only do they get hot when you burn the wood but you get hot when you cut the wood! :laugh:


----------



## UncleJoe

TheAnt said:


> Pop a wood stove in that baby!


Most insurance companies won't insure a mobile home with a wood stove.


----------



## gabbyj310

You can buy mobile home approved wood burners.Also I went to a "hotel" sale and bought some of their "blackout"drapes and put those up and they really really helped with the insulation of the windows.Also even if you have "underpinning",straw bales and bushes(landscaping) helps break the air seeping under those cold floors.


----------



## Trip286

The water heater is something I hadn't thought of, thank you. Wood heater, this is a rental, can't do that.

And for me, good gawd worthy is $300. $100 was a deposit. I'm accustomed to paying about 45 dollars in my apartment I was in (about 3/4 the size of the trailer).

So you see, $45-$200 is quite a shocker. And I can't figure out how!!! My apartment was a constant battle to keep cool in the summer, with the AC really going.

Now, for window treatment, which would be better and more cost effective? Black out blinds or film?

Oh, the trailer is skirted and has the thick fiberglass insulation under the floor. The floor is warm as I walk barefoot in the fall, and cool in the summer.


----------



## sonic

Lowering electric bill with efficient lighting would only be good if you are using allot of lights to light brightly a big room ,or many rooms . Because if you put 10x 100watt bulbs in the house ,you get 1000 Watt .As much as an electric heater .But if it is only one 60 Watt bulb i think it cant do anything .
The biggest consumer in a house are appliances with power 100watt or greater and their NUMBER matters . 
You should list all your running appliances in order that some assumptions be made .
Lets just give you an example:
If i turn on my PC (400Watt) and my stereo amplifier (500Watt ,yes its big :laugh ,then i get big consumption . But if i add to that : Freezer ,Cooler ,Lighting and my mother cooking in the kitchen ,then things get hot. 
I have installed an additional consumption meter and i can see when it goes wild . 

This means that either you COMBINE the use of a few appliances with greater power and you get your bill cranked up ,or you have a hidden( to your knowledge ) appliance that is eating your bill .
What you can do is to check your consumption meter and take in to account to not use many things at one and the same time .


----------



## Trip286

Brand new refrigerator
Four eye stove/oven
Bedside lamp
Phone charger
Computer charger

I do not own a TV or stereo, microwave, toaster, toaster oven. I do have a coffee maker I don't even use (plenty of free coffee at work), and it's not even unpacked. I do have all incandescent bulbs, but it's the CFL's in the kitchen and the bedside lamp that run the most.

The only thing that is always on is the refrigerator, the kid's nightlight, and my alarm clock. The rest is as needed and unplugged when not in use. Climate control only gets used when needed, I try not to use it at all.

I'm really at a loss here. By my guess, my bill should be less than I paid at my apartment.

I have two window unit ACs, and three space heaters. They rarely get used at all. Neither have been turned on in over 2 weeks.


----------



## mdprepper

We put the plastic film up on the windows, plus use window quilts. They made a big difference in keeping the house warmer. http://www.motherearthnews.com/Green-Homes/1983-11-01/How-to-Make-a-Thermal-Shade.aspx Do you have many "vampires"? Chargers plugged in when not in use, tv and cable boxes plugged in all the time, etc?


----------



## cnsper

Any outbuildings around with power in them? An extension cord running to the neighbors?


----------



## hiwall

sounds like you have a power drain in the wiring somewhere. look at your meter to see if you are using some power then turn one breaker at a time off to see what circuit is using all that power.


----------



## *Andi

As you said oil lamps ... may I say I love my Aladdin oil lamp. They are great to break the chill when a fire in the stove would be to much. I burn one or two in the evenings, all winter long.

The Aladdin lamp as an emergency source of light (and heat) when the lights goes out! It is silent, ororless and magical. 

It has up to 60 candlepower and around a 50 watt bulb out put. It burns kerosene ... Btu is two or three steps up fron the oil lamp with the amount of light it puts out.


----------



## JayJay

I'm in a 2375 sq ft house heated with propane.
I shut off the water heater every night after we bathe and shower. I turn it on again about 4 in the next afternoon.
I dry all my clothes 5 minutes in the dryer w. dryer sheet(I have to due to my electric body that gets shocked by everything I touch from October to May ..)and then line dry. I made me a line in the laundry room costing $4.
I don't use the oven if I can cook that food on the electric grill on the back porch like my baked sweet potatoes, or any grilled meat.
My electric bill for October was $78.
I checked last year's October bill--$140!!!
These changes seem to work for me.

OOps, forgot--tv is unplugged since we don't have tv cable--but used for movies at times.
Maybe your AC are malfunctioning and you need to unplug??

Help: Tractor supply has LED lights for $3---I bought 5..1 for the 12 X12 shed and it lights it up like a real light, 2 for the nightstands, 2 for our vehicles. They have magnets on the back AND a hook for hanging..I think that is so KEWL.
It is as good as a overhead light--3 AAA batteries, but these things are so great!!! My dh bought 1 for his big truck today!!


----------



## Marcus

The other thing to look at is the meter itself.
Do you have one of those meters/ plans that charges you based on when you use the electricity?
What about outside lighting?
Is your meter old or has it been tampered with?


----------



## Redtail

hiwall said:


> All electric heaters are 100% efficient. So changing to different electric heater would do nothing. You could maybe lower the temp setting for your water heater and/or add a water heater "blanket" to it. You could line dry your clothes instead of using the dryer. Unplug unused electric items(many draw juice when off).


Radiant heat is slow but it is very efficient. YOu always lose some energy through a change of state, but radiant heat is the best way to minimize this.

Hopwever, radiant heat is a strange beast. SInce the heater is directly radiating lower-infrared range energy, instead of warming particles of air like a traditional furnace would, the preferred method of insulation is also a little bit different.

ANYONE with radiant heating should consider adding a reflective layer to all sides of the home. A mylar-laminated "bubble wrap" style insulation should help tremendously, and prevent you from having to tear out the existing insulation if it's paper or plastic-faced. It's best to add this layer wherever the vapor barrier would traditionally be (traditionally whatever the heated side is), though even facing the "wrong direction", it still reflects that infrared energy back into the home.


----------



## brownb

A few people have hit on a possibility. Check to see if your meter is feeding more than you Something's not right there. Unless you have a water heater that runs constantly or something there really is no reason for that high of a bill. I personally think you are paying for someone that is tapping your meter There isn't anything you have that should be sucking that much juice


----------



## Trip286

Thanks guys. I'm definitely going to snoop around. I don't imagine my neighbor tapping my power, but it's a possibility I guess.

Oh, I wash and dry clothes at my sister's house, so I know laundry isn't the issue. Don't have a washer or dryer.


----------



## kejmack

Your refrigerator and your dryer will suck the most electricity. Hang your clothes outside. Get your refrigerator checked. Are the seals leaking? Is it running constantly? Trailers suck energy. Lived in one for a while. Miserable.


----------



## sailaway

Marcus said:


> The other thing to look at is the meter itself.
> Do you have one of those meters/ plans that charges you based on when you use the electricity?
> What about outside lighting?
> Is your meter old or has it been tampered with?


I agree with Marcus, something may be wrong with your meter or it has been tapped into.

As for 50 degree weather that is good sleeping weather around here. I would recomend cuddling up with the one you love or a wool blanket or both. But remember accidents can happen in the bedroom so be prepared.:kiss:


----------



## Trip286

Hah, I wish. Nasty divorce and now a long distance girlfriend. I would save a good bit on heating if I had a woman around. I like the cuddly ones 

I think it's either an unknown variable I'll have to find by using the breaker trick, or I just have a high rate. I was using a city provided service before, and a friend told me today that that particular city had notoriously low energy rates. Now that I've moved, I'm with Entergy.

They should have a low rate to make up for exploding the sewer line backwards into my bathroom that one time...


----------



## Tweto

When I was stupid and lived in an apartment. My electric bill was always fairly high (all electric). Then I went on vacation and was gone for 2 weeks, all the power in the apartment was off at the main circuit breaker. When I got my next electric bill the charges were about the same WTF????

Then I started to get concerned. All the power meters (12) were on one side of the 3 story multiple unit building. The power company would go to the meters and just copy the readings into his book along with the apartment number written on the meter in permanent marker. I found my meter and it was just spinning. Went back to the apartment and turned off the main circuit breaker, then went back to my meter and it was still spinning. Then I looked at the other meters and found one not spinning, in fact it was dead. I verified that the dead one was mine.

The moron that labeled the meters had mislabeled my power meter and I was paying for another apartments power. When I took this to the apartment manager she wasn't concerned about. Later I found out that the apartment that I was paying for was her friend that had lived there for 5 years. It was never said, but I think it was deliberate.

I broke my lease and moved out the next month.

All the posters that said to make sure your are not paying for some other trailer or some extension cord going to a shed, I would check that first. Beyond that what is your rate per kilowatt hour? Some rates can be pretty high and if it is then your are screwed.


----------



## Marcus

Trip286 said:


> Now that I've moved, I'm with Entergy.


I dont know which Entergy-Louisiana entity provides your service, but their rates are reasonable:
http://www.entergy-louisiana.com/content/price/tariffs/ell/ell_rs.pdf
http://www.entergy-louisiana.com/content/price/tariffs/egsi/egsila_rs.pdf

They do have a fuel charge rate adjustment too.


----------



## Tweto

Marcus said:


> I dont know which Entergy-Louisiana entity provides your service, but their rates are reasonable:
> http://www.entergy-louisiana.com/content/price/tariffs/ell/ell_rs.pdf
> http://www.entergy-louisiana.com/content/price/tariffs/egsi/egsila_rs.pdf
> 
> They do have a fuel charge rate adjustment too.


If I'm reading it right, you have some of the cheapest rates in the country. I have an all electric house and because of that my power company gives me special rates from Oct 1 - April 1 of 4 cents per kilowatt hour. My average winter electric bill is $160. This provides me with all heat, water, lights, everything. I'm just saying this to give you a idea of what a total home is using.

If you are not paying for someone power that you are not using, then it could just be the poor (or lack off) insulation in your trailer.


----------



## TheAnt

UncleJoe said:


> Most insurance companies won't insure a mobile home with a wood stove.


I didnt know that... but it sure beats freezing to death or paying out the @#$ for electricity. I suppose your other option might be to build a small shed-like structure next to or nearby and live in that or even pipe the heat from that room to the trailer.


----------



## kappydell

we put on solar film on just the south & west windows of our house and lowered our cooling bill considerably. 
For spot lighting (how much do you need?) go down to Menards or your local construction box store, and get a solar floodlight. Mine was $35 and has a solar recharger with a cord I mount outside, then run the cord into the house. it powers the wall mounted floodlight (which has the option of either motion activated for use outdoors, or you can use the on-off switch to use it steadily). That is enough light for one room, and it recharges daily; now they make solar panels that work in overcast conditions, too. It uses LED lights for low power draw. Cheap but nicely effective. I'm getting more as my budget allows so I can have one in each room.

Look for 6 Volt appliances (truck stops often carry them or can order) and use a deep-cycle marine battery to power things like heating blankets, tiny refrigerators, coffeepots, hot pots, and even a small oven. Recharge with a solar set up: panel, controller, battery cables to connect. You can cycle the batteries through to have one charging while using the other. With care, this will give you 'free' appliances, although they are small ones. Check the back sides of small appliances you may already have, some fans and radios can be used with 6V direct current (battery) as well as house current. I am still learning about the solar stuff, but it is quite easy to make little changes that add up to considerable savings. Hope this helps.


----------



## TheLazyL

Ask the electric Company to check the electric meter for accuracy…


----------



## Trip286

Thank you guys so much. I'm going to be working on getting this stuff fixed up.


----------



## ZoomZoom

Lots of good suggestions so far. One I can add is to pull up a cup of coffee and go over the bill closely. What's the number of billing days (and is it approx. 1 month)? Is this reading and the previous both ACTUAL (not ESTIMATED)? <<< that can make a huge difference. What is the rate per KWH?


----------



## RoadRash

I have saved a bit of Money at BOL by shutting breakers off not alot cause of delivery charges but a bit Would love to do this at home. Took trim off windows and added foam insulation, plastic film over windows that are drafty, wife n i forever shutting lights off behinds kids I have put in water saver shower heads, low flow toilets, security lights re adjusted so they go off when closer to house off during day. Drop tempature 6 degress when not home and at night timer on thermastat water heater at lower setting.


----------



## machinist

*Began with a Total Electric Home*

Not so much now. Our monthly bill has a graph showing our usage for the past year, and is overlaid with the previous year's usage, also. We have consistently dropped out usage for the past 5 years, but the bills remain about the same! Cost per KWHR has soared over the years, now running between 10 and 11 cents.

Heat was the big item. We added 6" of fiberglass to the attic and covered that with perforated foil, the infrared barrier product. Those alone dropped our consumption by 10 to 15% a year. We replaced a couple storm doors, repaired storm windows, caulked, sealed, and got another 5%.

Then we added a sunroom on the South end that has a net heat gain in winter, and keeps direct sun off the house in summer when we ventilate it. Aslo added a porch on the East side, to keep sun off that outer wall, a boon for summer cooling.

A wood stove was next, with a 12 volt fan to crculate the heat, cutting our heating cost to near nothing.

We replaced the fridge and the freezer with new efficient models, knocking off a MEASURED 3.1 KWHRS per DAY = 1131KWHRS per year! Same with a couple window AC units.

My wife bakes our bread and does a lot of canning, so we added an LP gas range to the sunroom for those chores. That keeps the heat out of the house in summer by shutting off that room and ventilating it, reducing cooling costs. In winter, the heat stays in the house, reducing the heat bill.

Our home lights have all been replaced with CFL's. The workshop is next on that score, with some in place, but rewiring needed for the rest. We are almost ready to turn on 820 watts of solar panels to run the lighting and the fridge. We hope to double that system this year and also power the freezer and communications stuff.

Our water comes from a cistern we rebuilt, so we don't have a water or sewage bill. Pumping the water with a shallow well pump is a minimal cost, and all the outdoor water use is done with a hand well pump. Have a timer to install on the water heater, and I am started on a solar batch pre-heater project.


----------



## pawpaw

First things first...
Call the power Co. & have them check your meter. If they resist-insist. Also,they should check that you have no voltage drains other than what you know you have. We once felt a noticeable tingle every time we touched our front door knob. There was a voltage drain somewhere in our rental that was sending voltage into our front yard & up the door frame. The landlord admitted that the electric bill was always a source of complaints for that unit. It turned out to be the landlord's jury-rigged repairs causing the (dangerous) drain.
Finally, this happened to me once upon moving in a place, the power co. first told me they couldn't explain the extra/excessive Kw/hr charges. It was then that I learned they had billed me for the PRIOR tenant's unpaid balance at that address. They really were not going to modify the bill until I called a local television news station, who met me the next day in front of the power company with a camera crew. Sometimes ya gotta play dirty pool....


----------



## machinist

Never had a problem with a wrong electric bill, but had that trouble with the water company. We fixed the cistern and now have NO water bill. Planning to do the same with electric. One step at a time, though.


----------



## Hopetobeready

I intend to purchase a couple propane space heaters this year. We also have a large generator to power a 52ft doublewide. Lowes carries the space heaters. Those are in case the propane tank runs dry with no fill opportunity. We are both pushing 80 and can't leave if there is an emergency. Husband is bed-fast so we are stuck.


----------



## labotomi

Electric heat is as close to 100% efficient as you can get. The only loss is if there's any light generated (glowing coils) but that is very minor. This doesn't mean that electric is the cheapest alternative. Infrared, radiant... it doesn't matter. That just affects how the heat is distributed. Radiant will heat the air around the heater, infrared will heat things in front of the heater which will then radiate that heat elsewhere. In a small area such as you're describing, I'd prefer radiant, but it's a personal opinion.

My home is heated by electricity and for reasons I cannot fathom, a previous owner had the fireplace removed. 

I'm trying to figure out whether installing some NG heaters would help with my bill. I have gas to the home, but the meter isn't there. The utility company charges quite a bit for a hook up but that may be due to running lines from the street service which I don't require. I'm not sure about having a fireplace re-installed because it's expensive and I'm not certain I'll be staying in the home long enough to recover the costs.

If I were you, I would purchase one of the inexpensive non contact pyrometers and use it to measure temperatures around your home both inside and outside. There may be some places where a little sealing and insulation go a long way.


----------



## BillS

Regardless of the efficiency of electric power, electric heat is more expensive than natural gas. Electric heat doesn't have the air circulation that a furnace provides either. And I've noticed that the thermostat must be located on the outside wall because electric heat where I live is difficult to regulate when it gets colder out or warmer out. If it drops 20 degrees outside it's cooler inside. And if it goes up 20 degrees outside it's too warm inside. It's a real pain to regulate. I hate electric heat.


----------



## labotomi

BillS said:


> Regardless of the efficiency of electric power, electric heat is more expensive than natural gas.


That's why I stated that while it may be more efficient, it doesn't mean it's less expensive


BillS said:


> Electric heat doesn't have the air circulation that a furnace provides either.


I'm not sure what to make of this. Central heating has the same air circulation. Depending on yours setup, one may put out hotter air than the other, but it's not always gas is hotter or electric is hotter. It depends upon your setup. If you're talking about a heat pump they they usually don't put out air that's as hot as electric or gas but they do keep maintain temperature and are more cost effective. 


BillS said:


> And I've noticed that the thermostat must be located on the outside wall because electric heat where I live is difficult to regulate when it gets colder out or warmer out. If it drops 20 degrees outside it's cooler inside. And if it goes up 20 degrees outside it's too warm inside. It's a real pain to regulate. I hate electric heat.


Again, I'm not seeing why it's different. The only difference is what heats the air. The same blower sends the heated air through the ductwork.

Unless you're comparing a central heat furnace to electric space heaters and that's not a fair comparison.


----------



## hiwall

I think BillS was thinking electric baseboard heat(quite common). I also do not care for electric baseboard heat.


----------



## prep4four

Replace all incandescent light bulbs with compact florescence.
Get a device called Kill-a-Watt from a big box hardware store and put it on various electric devices to see what is taking up all the juice


----------



## labotomi

hiwall said:


> I think BillS was thinking electric baseboard heat(quite common). I also do not care for electric baseboard heat.


I've seen the wall electric heaters often, but they were individually controlled. I guess I haven't paid attention to baseboard heaters. They may not be as common here as other places or maybe I've just not visited the right homes.

I can see the reasoning if that's the case. I have electric but it's central. I still have to run the numbers to see if getting gas heat would be worth the investment. A fireplace to burn wood from my property would be best, but I'm sure that's more than I want to spend if I'm not staying here and I'm not planning on it for too much longer.

My mother only uses a double 55 gal barrel stove arrangement. We just replaced the hardware after about 15 years. The barrels now have a layer of refractory type coating (dri-vibe set and baked) all the way around but thicker on the bottom (and flat) in addition to fabric gaskets that shouldn't ever wear out. One of the perks from working at a place with 3000F gas furnaces and friends with nothing better to do on nightshift


----------



## Trip286

Just discovered a ground. Gonna have the landlords bring an electrician out, and they knocked half the electric bill off my rent! They're really cool people.


----------



## pawpaw

Glad to hear it! You didn't get a tingling when you touched anything,did you?
My earlier post said we felt it through our door knob, and it eneded up being the landlord's handi-work. Never got anything off because of it, though. Kudos on both FINDING it & getting a break!


----------



## Trip286

Just thought y'all would be interested. Since finding the ground (it was a box under the trailer that had shorted and grounded to the frame), my electric bill went from $300 and some change, to $93 bucks. Still too high by my standards, but a whole lot more manageable.


----------



## Trip286

Another update. Have crawled all over this house several times and found a few other small grounds.

Here's my electric bill now. NOW I'm happy.









Thank you all for your help and advice.


----------



## hiwall

Glad you found the problems. Now more money for preps.


----------



## Grimm

Since I buy and sell online I have boxes of bubble wrap. In the winter I will be placing this on all the windows to save on not buying window film. Just clean the windows, spray clean fresh water on the glass and place bubble wrap. Done.


----------



## ZoomZoom

I don't have bubble wrap but when I have big boxes, I cut them to fit in the windows.


----------



## Trip286

That's something I will be keeping in mind. Because this trailer only gets direct sunlight from sunrise to noon, it's actually harder to keep warm in the winter than it is to keep cool in the summer. I turn my AC off when I go to bed at night, and don't turn it on again until I get home from work the next day.


----------



## Trip286

Good to see ya hiwall. How ya been?


----------



## hiwall

Trip286 said:


> Good to see ya hiwall. How ya been?


Things are just fine down here!


----------



## LincTex

Tweto said:


> When I took this to the apartment manager she wasn't concerned about. It was never said, but I think it was deliberate.


That is illegal on soooo many levels...


----------



## Grimm

Tweto said:


> When I was stupid and lived in an apartment. My electric bill was always fairly high (all electric). Then I went on vacation and was gone for 2 weeks, all the power in the apartment was off at the main circuit breaker. When I got my next electric bill the charges were about the same WTF????
> 
> Then I started to get concerned. All the power meters (12) were on one side of the 3 story multiple unit building. The power company would go to the meters and just copy the readings into his book along with the apartment number written on the meter in permanent marker. I found my meter and it was just spinning. Went back to the apartment and turned off the main circuit breaker, then went back to my meter and it was still spinning. Then I looked at the other meters and found one not spinning, in fact it was dead. I verified that the dead one was mine.
> 
> The moron that labeled the meters had mislabeled my power meter and I was paying for another apartments power. When I took this to the apartment manager she wasn't concerned about. Later I found out that the apartment that I was paying for was her friend that had lived there for 5 years. It was never said, but I think it was deliberate.
> 
> I broke my lease and moved out the next month.
> 
> All the posters that said to make sure your are not paying for some other trailer or some extension cord going to a shed, I would check that first. Beyond that what is your rate per kilowatt hour? Some rates can be pretty high and if it is then your are screwed.


A similar thing happened 4 years ago to us. We rented property with a 3 bdrm house, guesthouse and converted garage. The guesthouse had a tenant and the owner of the property was living in the converted garage. We were told the guesthouse and garage were on a different meter and we were only responsible for the house energy use. When the weather started getting cold we noticed the electric bill started to jump up. Odd because the heating was natural gas.

I started looking around the property to find there was no second meter and we were paying for the electric for EVERYONE! When the $300 bill came I refused to pay it and service was cut. I left it off until the owner moved out of the garage. 2 weeks. Turns out the tenant in the guesthouse was paying the owner for his share of the power. He started paying us directly for 1/3 of the bill. I of course gave him copies of the bills and receipts for his cash payments.

That landlord turned out to be a slum lord. And he got stuck with paying the $300+ electric bill since it was in his name.


----------

