# 55 gallon water barrels; hand pump or siphon?



## hangman

Hey folks,

I recently picked up two 55 gallon blue plastic drums which were used to store soda syrup. I cleaned them out, used bleach, cleaned them again and rinsed thoroughly.

I plan on storing them in the upright position in the basement. I am looking at ways to get the water out of the drums. I see a hand pump which screws into the bung hole threads. I also see a siphon which screws in as well.

http://www.disasterstuff.com/store/...agecurrent=1&pagestyle=p&atc=1&idproduct=1056

Which is better and why? Or does it not matter?

BTW, I plan on buying the bung wrench as well.

Thanks!


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## UncleJoe

I have both. One pump and two siphons. Getting the water out is what matters.


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## Caribou

If you build a low bench, tall enough to slide a five gallon bucket under, to place your barrels on, a siphon will do fine. If your bucket and barrel are on the same level the siphon will be less effective.


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## hangman

can you precisely control the amount of water you are removing with the siphon? I was under the impression that it didn't work that way. am i wrong?


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## hiwall

Precision control is easy if you watch it fill. 
I would consider laying them down a foot or more off the floor and just putting a regular spigot on them.


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## goshengirl

If you're only getting one, I'd get the pump. The siphon is great when the barrel is full (get it going and it's just like a hose), but it has its limitations (it only works when the water level in the barrel is higher than the water level in the container you're pumping it into). Also (and this is from personal experience), the siphon pumps tend to age quickly and crack, making them ineffective.

We have a different pump than the one you're looking at, and admittedly it's not great having to pump the whole time. But the pump itself lasts longer, it provides more control, and it's much more forgiving if the bung doesn't match perfectly and seal well.

That said, we have both kinds of pumps. (Then again, we have over 30 barrels and use them extensively for watering our garden.)


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## hangman

I only have two barrels for now. Primarily to be used for drinking water as a backup. They will be in the basement. Do the siphon pumps wear out due to being outside and exposed to the elements? Or does it not matter whether it is inside or outside? Thanks


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## NaeKid

I would just use gravity-feed ... pop a hole into the lower side of it, put in a water-valve, hook up an RV-hose (kind of like a garden hose, but, designed for RV fresh-water usage) and call it good ... 

... similar to what is used with most of the rain-barrels to feed a garden ...


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## hangman

When you say "pop a hole" what are we talking about? Are we talking about drilling a hole to a predermined size that will accomodate a spigot or water valve? I would think that if it is not done correctly it could leak around the water valve. Am I wrong?

Another person had recommended laying the barrels on their sides and using a water valve that is made to fit the threads on the top of the barrel. But first putting them on a support which would keep them off the floor.


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## NaeKid

hangman said:


> When you say "pop a hole" what are we talking about? Are we talking about drilling a hole to a predermined size that will accomodate a spigot or water valve? I would think that if it is not done correctly it could leak around the water valve. Am I wrong?
> 
> Another person had recommended laying the barrels on their sides and using a water valve that is made to fit the threads on the top of the barrel. But first putting them on a support which would keep them off the floor.


Well ... ya, if you do something wrong there could be a leak, but, there are many kinds of kits - from all brass kits to all plastic kits and everything in between. You will want something with a good gasket and the threads machined to high tolerances ...

:google:

Click on the GoogleSign to see all kinds of options that are available. For in the house (basement), I would use the higher quality all-brass construction ...


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## cnsper

You can use the siphon as a pump too when the level in the barrel gets to low. You control the amount you remove by opening the air inlet and stopping the siphon. I would get both though. You can get more siphon pumps for the same price.


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## Caribou

Yes, drilling a hole near the bottom of the drum does create a potential leak. It also creates a situation where you might bang into the spigot and break it off so if you go this route place you drum with some thought.

What is your plan for these barrels? Are they going to be actively used or will they be attended to annually? If your plan is to drain and refill once a year then what is more important security or speed of access? 

In an emergency a siphon is going to give you adequate water access. If you have a floor drain a siphon will also work for annual emptying of the barrel and when it slows too much just tip the barrel over. You may want to consider a small 12V or 120V pump for annual draining. You will not be likely to change out the water if the power is out. 

All you need for a syphon is about a ten foot section of tubing so you will want that as a backup to any other method you decide on.


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## hangman

thanks. That explains it better. Now I have options.


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## GaryS

Like others, my 60 gal tanks sit on a platform that allows a 5 gallon bucket to fit below the spigot. These tanks were designed for water storage, so they came from the supplier with threads for spigots.


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## hangman

GaryS said:


> Like others, my 60 gal tanks sit on a platform that allows a 5 gallon bucket to fit below the spigot. These tanks were designed for water storage, so they came from the supplier with threads for spigots.


Just out of curiosity do you have a link to this company or this product?

Thanks


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## GaryS

Your timing is perfect! I'm in the middle of a move, and I can't recall the name of the company, but they specialize in all types of containers. I found them with a Google search, and ordered from them twice...food grade buckets first, then the tanks.

I think this was the place, but without the catalog, I'm not 100% sure.

http://www.plastic-mart.com/


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## hiwall

Like this----------


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## hangman

are those valves connected to the "fine" threaded hole? So I would assume that you would refill using the upper hole (coarse thread). Is that correct? Also I would guess that using this method you would have to leave enough empty space in the barrel in order to tighen the upper bung plug.

It looks like a good system! I like it.


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## 8thDayStranger

If you could design the rack in a way to let them lean down a little in the front you would have a better chance draining all the water out when you refresh or something. It's a small thing I know and the siphon would get the rest but why not go ahead and save yourself a little work and time. I'm thinking of setting up a system like this using multiple barrels to collect rainwater for outside water use (watering, car washing etc...) and installing a filtration system so it becomes emergency drinking water.


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## hangman

hiwall said:


> Like this----------


Do you have any dimensions for this rack that you posted?

Thanks


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## hiwall

Just look at the picture and then measure your barrels.


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## hangman

I was wondering if the wood under the barrels was flat or contoured to accomodate the curve of the barrel. It's hard to tell from the photo.


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## hiwall

I do not have the set-up in that picture. It looks like what you need so I posted it. When full the barrels weigh over 400 lbs. each so you have to plan so the wood does not cut into the barrels from the weight. I would make it slightly different than the pictured one. Use the pic just for a general idea and make your own design. Hint- I would put a couple of diagonal braces on sides (or a sheet of plywood) so the whole thing don't fold forward.


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## Caribou

hangman said:


> I was wondering if the wood under the barrels was flat or contoured to accomodate the curve of the barrel. It's hard to tell from the photo.


Put your board down, set the edge of the barrel on the board and scribe the arc, cut that and if it works use it as a pattern for the rest.


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## hangman

Hey folks,

As I said earlier on I got two 55 gallon drums from a guy nearby who said they were used for soda storage. I would assume a concentrated soda syrup or such.

I have washed these out with soap (dishwashing detergent), filling it up @ 1/3 of the way with water. Then swiching it around and let sit for a day, then turn it a bit every day so the entire inside got a chance to soak. I then drained it and rinsed it out. I then repeated the procedure with water and 1/2 gallon of bleach and then rotating daily. I can still smell an odor of the previous product. I repeated both procedures again and rinsed thoroughly. I can still smell it.

Can I use these for potable water storage? I don't know whether the faint smell is an issue for storing potable water. Or should I buy new ones and use these for another purpose?

Thanks


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## hiwall

It would totally depend on if the previous contents were potable. If the barrels held soda syrup it might make the water taste or smell a little off but otherwise be OK. Unlikely you will ever remove all that smell.


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## LincTex

hiwall said:


> you have to plan so the wood does not cut into the barrels from the weight.


If using 3/4 plywood, there is enough surface area across the arc to easily support the weight. I would make sure the arc would cover at least 25% of the circumference, but more (30+% or better).

DO NOT use a block between them like the picture... the barrel on the bottom WILL NOT support any of the weight from the barrel above it!



hiwall said:


> I would put a couple of diagonal braces on sides (or a sheet of plywood) so the whole thing don't fold forward.


Excellent idea.



hangman said:


> I can still smell an odor of the previous product. I repeated both procedures again and rinsed thoroughly. I can still smell it.


It won't hurt the water. Try a sloshing for a few days with some bleach... I had to do that with the molasses and vinegar barrels.

Regardless, you may want to treat the water that comes out with a little tiny bit of calcium hypochlorite if the SHTF, then aerate the water very WELL and good between two clean buckets to get the chlorine out (best to have a couple sets so one batch can sit and breath for a few hours while you can use the other), then run it through a PUR or Brita pitcher and you shouldn't taste a thing.


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## hangman

I did the bleach process twice. I had @ 1/2 gallon of bleach and 1/3 a barrel of water. I shook it and rolled it around. I let it sit for a day, then rolled it slightly, let sit for a day, and repeated until all sides had soaked. ThenI rinsed it out thoroughly with a hose. They have been sitting in the basement for @ 2 weeks now with the bung caps off. I can still smell it when I walk into the basement.

Just bought a Berkey light on CL from someone who was moving for $50. It has 2 arsenic/flouride filters which had 2 months of use for two people. I have to buy the black filters now ($107). I plan on using it as a final filter.

Thanks for all the replies. I will build the wooden frame in the next few weeks and install the spigot valves and fill with water.


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