# Wood Stoves in Danger......



## readytogo (Apr 6, 2013)

The EPA is coming to get you..........
https://screen.yahoo.com/wochit/epa-ready-regulate-americans-wood-104213840.html
:nuts:


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## Magus (Dec 1, 2008)

I foresee MASS non compliance and investigators reenacting "deliverance" on a weekly basis. 
You know the part:
SQUEEEE!


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## Country Living (Dec 15, 2009)

RTG, sure wish you would start copying in the articles like everyone else so we wouldn't have to click on a link.


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## AdmiralD7S (Dec 6, 2012)

Country Living said:


> RTG, sure wish you would start copying in the articles like everyone else so we wouldn't have to click on a link.


Just do what I do...whenever he posts something, I just mark it as read and ignore it. I know he's well-meaning, but I can't recall one thing he's posted in the 2 years I've been here that was worth my time.


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## SouthCentralUS (Nov 11, 2012)

AdmiralD7S said:


> Just do what I do...whenever he posts something, I just mark it as read and ignore it. I know he's well-meaning, but I can't recall one thing he's posted in the 2 years I've been here that was worth my time.


Please tell me how to do that. Do you have to open it?


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## *Andi (Nov 8, 2009)

My heartland sweetheart wood cook stove is epa approved.


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## squerly (Aug 17, 2012)

AdmiralD7S said:


> Just do what I do...whenever he posts something, I just mark it as read and ignore it. I know he's well-meaning, but I can't recall one thing he's posted in the 2 years I've been here that was worth my time.


This is one you should pay attention to. It's not something the EPA just decided to do today, they've been working on killing your rights to burn wood for quite some time now. You might not use wood to heat your home but others do, and this is a major overreach of an office that you don't even have a say in how its operated or who is in charge of it. They do what they want and you either do what they say or you get fined (or worse).

From an article dated in 2013



> The EPA has proposed banning the production and sale of the types of stoves used by about 80 percent of those with such stoves. The regulations limit the amount of "airborne fine-particle matter" to 12 micrograms per cubic meter of air. The current EPA regulations allow for 15 micrograms in the same amount of air space.
> 
> Most of the wood stoves currently nestled inside cabins and homes from coast-to-coast don't meet the new environmental standard. The EPA launched a "Burn Wise" website to help convince the public that the new regulations were needed.
> 
> ...


This is my outdoor wood furnace, which is a banned unit now too. They burn wood very efficiently and require I load it only once every 24 hours. It heats 380 gallons of water to 185* at which time a pumping system sends the hot water through a sophisticated network of tubing built into the floors of the house.

Using this highly efficient system to heat our house cuts out the need for a heat pump, thus saving money and taking strain off this nations outdated electrical grid. My house is 3,600 sq feet, I'm at the 4,000 foot level and -0 temps are a reality during winter. My electric bill was less than $90.00 last month. People using a heat pump easily see $300.00-$400.00 monthly bills.

The EPA is as F***ed up as a soup sandwich when they feel it necessary to ban my wood burner. The alternatives would be more nuclear power plants, more coal burners, etc. Tell me, which would you want to use (if you had a choice and the EPA wasn't making it for you)?


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## hashbrown (Sep 2, 2013)

I read about this a couple of years ago. How are they going to enforce this? Fines, confiscation? Or will this apply to only new stoves? and what about a fireplace will they be illegal too?


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## AdmiralD7S (Dec 6, 2012)

SouthCentralUS said:


> Please tell me how to do that. Do you have to open it?


I use the mobile app, and my approach to browse PS is this. When a new thread comes in, I look at the subject. If it seems interesting, I read it. Good threads I want to keep track of get favorited, and they have a star next to them. After I go through all the new threads (and of course the ones I've previously favorited), I hit the "mark all as read" button and it clears everything else away.


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## Woody (Nov 11, 2008)

Good questions! They will do it the way they usually do, slow and steady. Put the frog in cold water then turn on the heat... First is to enact the 'law'. Then, through "See something say something" they will catch a bunch of lawbreakers. If you go to refinance your place or to change ownership, that will require an 'inspection.' If you go to install a stove, you will need an inspection, to comply with local laws, so they will NEED to see the stove you plan to use. Then monitor sales of "used woodstoves".... It isn't going to happen overnight, they realize this. But the longer it takes, the longer whoever is in charge gets to have a job!!! Cash for clunker stoves!!!!!

For fireplaces being included? You bet! We all have known how inefficient they have been for generations, as far as heat produced for wood stoked. I'm sure they will still let folks have and use fireplaces though. You will just have to pay a special 'carbon credit' for all that extra CO2 you are producing.

Maybe they will even come up with a "fair compromise" to folks with older, illegal stoves and illegal fireplaces! If you have a special sensor installed, the annual fine....err.. penalty will be less and you will only be TAXED on the time you use it. That would be more than fair!!!!


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## jeff47041 (Jan 5, 2013)

Or maybe homeowners insurance will not cover your house if you have an illegal wood burner installed.


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## crabapple (Jan 1, 2012)

*Andi said:


> My heartland sweetheart wood cook stove is epa approved.


Please tell us more:
What is the cost?
Do you have a link?
Can it heat a large house or just a room?

I would go with a rocket stove if I was heating the whole house off the grid.
But I am not there yet.


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## *Andi (Nov 8, 2009)

Here is the link ... (pay the extra and get the reservoir )

http://www.heartlandapp.com/products/woodburning-cookstoves/sweetheart-woodburning-cookstove.aspx

The Sweetheart is based on the original Oval Cookstove that has been heating homes, warming water, and cooking meals for almost a century. Today's models offer the same dependability, comfort, and tremendous versatility. But Heartland has incorporated some important changes to make your life easier than it was for your ancestors.

Holds its own power. Keep your home glowing through ice and snow or power failures. The Oval is capable of heating up to 1,800 square feet, and the Sweetheart up to 1,500 square feet.

Keeps you in hot water. Choose an optional copper reservoir with a tap, or install a hot water jacket that can boil 40 gallons of water in an hour with the stove running at full operation. You can even run this system on a thermosyphon, eliminating the need for electricity. The water reservoir provides ample humidity for wood heating. Note: The water jacket must be installed by a professional. Refer to instruction manual for details.


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## squerly (Aug 17, 2012)

Here is a lit of EPA certified wood stoves.

PDF


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## jeff47041 (Jan 5, 2013)

*Andi said:


> Here is the link ... (pay the extra and get the reservoir )
> 
> http://www.heartlandapp.com/products/woodburning-cookstoves/sweetheart-woodburning-cookstove.aspx
> 
> .


Oh wow, that's cool!
The lovely one and I just spent almost an hour looking at the link.

Are you good at regulating the temp in the oven for baking?

I'm not fond of the idea that they only have a 1 year warranty. Have you had yours long?


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## *Andi (Nov 8, 2009)

jeff47041 said:


> Oh wow, that's cool!
> The lovely one and I just spent almost an hour looking at the link.
> 
> Are you good at regulating the temp in the oven for baking?
> ...


Regulating the temp comes with knowing your wood and stove ... it takes a little practice (as with any wood stove) but you can get the hang of it rather easy.

This is my third (or forth ) year with my sweetheart stove and no problems to date. (My cousin has had hers for over 10 years with no problems)

I have only good things to say about it ...


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## Country Living (Dec 15, 2009)

The trick is moving heat throughout the house if the house was not designed for a wood stove. Our stove is in the living room and, even though it has a circulating fan, we still needed something to push the heat into the adjacent bedroom (the door to the bedroom is at the other end of the wall). We finally put in a Through The Wall Fan from Amazon to transfer the heat. The fan is up on the wall above the stove close to the ceiling. We wired the fan into a junction in the attic and installed a wall switch in the living room wall in order to easily turn the fan on and off.

This fan has made about a 10 degree difference in the bedroom.

As for regulating the heat, Andi is right on with knowing your wood and your stove's capabilities. I finally learned how to bank an overnight fire from a You Tube video.


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## squerly (Aug 17, 2012)

hashbrown said:


> ... and what about a fireplace will they be illegal too?


Absolutely, and forest fires as well.


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## Country Living (Dec 15, 2009)

What about controlled burns in the forests and commercial timber tracts?


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## Woody (Nov 11, 2008)

Country Living said:


> What about controlled burns in the forests and commercial timber tracts?


Interesting thought...

Well, since most of those lands are Federal or State owned, which our Government just actually manages for we the people, it is considered public land. Since, in their management of our lands, they need to do burns, it is actually our responsibility for what happens on them. I would think we will be taxed, or assessed a carbon tax for all the CO2 released.


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## crabapple (Jan 1, 2012)

This is what I got from Heartland on the Sweetheart stove:


Heartland
People
David Billingsley Feb 9 at 8:56 AM
To	
me
The Oval and Sweetheart cookstoves are listed to CSA Standard B366.2M. ULC Standard S-627 & UL 1482 by Warnock Hersey Professional Services Ltd. They do not need an EPA rating because they are listed as a cookstove and are not considered a room heater.

David Billingsley
Tech Support
AGA MARVEL
1260 East Van Deinse Street, Greenville, MI 48838
-------------------------------

I did not know that cook stoves do not need a EPA rating.


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## *Andi (Nov 8, 2009)

crabapple said:


> This is what I got from Heartland on the Sweetheart stove:
> 
> Heartland
> People
> ...


All I can tell you is what I was told (and the paperwork stated) on the day I bought my stove. If they now want to sell the Sweetheart as a cook stove and not for heating to get around the EPA, then I say good for them. Well, it is till the EPA changes the rules again.  (and we all know they will)

:wave:


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## Viking (Mar 16, 2009)

Country Living said:


> What about controlled burns in the forests and commercial timber tracts?


Right, put a catalytic converter on that smoke. Not to mention that when they do those "controlled" burns here in Oregon, it's usually in the season when there is often air inversion, which bottles all the smoke at ground level. As far as I'm concerned, the EPA is just another tool that the PTB use to further erode the freedoms, don't get me wrong, I believe in breathing clean air, but I also believe in common sense being used in the process and that's not so common.


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