# Horizon to horizon prepping 101



## Magus (Dec 1, 2008)

Horizon to horizon prepping is a philosophy of taking things six months at a time, many people can't afford or store ten years worth of dried food, 10 bazillion rounds of ammo and every assault rifle known to man and much less cram it all into a Honda, HOWEVER if you look this philosophy over, you will see that it CAN be rolled over AND over into a super long term survival stash that billionaires would envy!And let's face it, 99% of the survival situations last only a few weeks at worst so let's look at it like this:
*Will a Horizon to horizon plan help me get through another Katrina or 7.5 quake?*

In Style baby, hell.you might even gain weight!

*Will a Horizon to horizon plan get me through a grid crash, EMP attack,WW3 or Zombie plague?*

Hell no.without SPECIFIC ITEMS FOR SPECIFIC SCENARIOS, You're on borrowed time or dead already.that's your bad news, your good news is that you can roll this plan over and over and over until WW3 will just be a minor pain in the ass.Now let's look at the big three:

*Food, Water Well being:*
Start small and simple with rice and beans and soup mixes,make a water still or buy a Berkley or Katydyn or both and get a few field grade military med kits.
In six months start plugging the holes, see how it works?

*Shelter, BOL, hardened home:*
Not everyone has cash to sink into a nice fallout shelter/storm cellar or retreat but even us perpetually broke types can harden our homes by building safe rooms and adding insulation.a double insulated room preferably stocked can be heated by a survival candle and save your life in a lights out blizzard.might be a good time to invest in a small generator and a way to vent the toxic fumes outside.invest in a bank of storage batteries and a converter too so you can leave the generator off as you sleep.

*Guns and ammo.*You really should own a rifle, pistol and shotgun by now.let's assume your broke, get a Mosin Nagant, an [email protected] topper, any quality 22 pistol and 100 rounds for each.

As you can see, there are PLENTY of holes, holes you will fill every six month as you "roll over". Here is your "flat footed start"use the six months to study and save your pennies and remember: two bags of rice and a bag of dry beans is a week's worth of food!a 3$ box of 22LR is 45 squirrels and rabbits!get the idea? now go plug those holes!


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

My next hole Im filling is buying cornmeal so I can have a break from rice and beans with cornbread and beans. Also a solar cooker. Im ok with the 3 weapons but could use a 22 for small game along with some conibear #10's. Secure bol a big concern. Water is going to be a issue at my place ( apt living). I bought a water drum and have other containers. I also have the materials to tap into the gutters of my building into my drum on porch. I have heard tell of water bladders you can buy and fill ip in your tub in emergencies but havent been able to find them online or in stores. Any clues? Could certainly use more bleach, tools, generator, fuel, and bol. With a generator and fuel I could live for months off the venison in the deep freeze. I hope I have at least 3 yrs to get a little more ahead. Could use some comms and a hundred other things as well.


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## Magus (Dec 1, 2008)

The best kit you have is what you have and what's between your ears.know if your building has a storage tank for water? can you tap it after the pressure drops?buy a wrench to fit if you can, one more hole plugged!


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## FatTire (Mar 20, 2012)

CrackbottomLouis said:


> My next hole Im filling is buying cornmeal so I can have a break from rice and beans with cornbread and beans. Also a solar cooker. Im ok with the 3 weapons but could use a 22 for small game along with some conibear #10's. Secure bol a big concern. Water is going to be a issue at my place ( apt living). I bought a water drum and have other containers. I also have the materials to tap into the gutters of my building into my drum on porch. *I have heard tell of water bladders you can buy and fill ip in your tub in emergencies but havent been able to find them online* or in stores. Any clues? Could certainly use more bleach, tools, generator, fuel, and bol. With a generator and fuel I could live for months off the venison in the deep freeze. I hope I have at least 3 yrs to get a little more ahead. Could use some comms and a hundred other things as well.


http://www.waterbob.com/Welcome.do;jsessionid=A83B91DF7B9E3F336D44DE3F207B0793

http://www.aquapodkit.com/

i have a green belt in google=fu


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

FatTire said:


> http://www.waterbob.com/Welcome.do;jsessionid=A83B91DF7B9E3F336D44DE3F207B0793
> 
> http://www.aquapodkit.com/
> 
> i have a green belt in google=fu


Thanks. Been lookin around for that.


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## Magus (Dec 1, 2008)

Be aware each gallon weighs 8 pounds.will your floor take it?


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

Magus said:


> Be aware each gallon weighs 8 pounds.will your floor take it?


Yeah. Lower level. Good thought though. Wouldnt have even considered that.


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## JayJay (Nov 23, 2010)

Magus said:


> Be aware each gallon weighs 8 pounds.will your floor take it?


Which is why our water drums are on the concrete garage floor..and away from prying eyes.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

CrackbottomLouis said:


> I'm buying cornmeal ... I bought a water drum and have other containers. I also have the materials to tap into the gutters of my building into my drum on porch.... Could certainly use more bleach, tools, generator, fuel, and bol. With a generator and fuel I could live for months off the venison in the deep freeze.


Buy whole kernel corn and a cheap hand-crank Mexican cornmeal grinder. This will keep much longer.

Plastic drums are cheap... buy an extra one and make a bio-sand filter with it. Filter the rainwater with it and then take that water and run it through a Berkey.

Don't buy liquid bleach, buy pool shock instead to make liquid bleach in small batches.

Run your generator for just a half hour, every 8-10-12 hours. That will be plenty to keep the freezer frozen. Don't buy one that is too large.

Get a few solar panels, some deep cycle batteries (golf cart), and some 12 volt CFL and LED bulbs from an RV store. A 300 watt/600 watt inverter will run the TV/DVD player... and most small kitchen appliances. Enough solar panels and a large enough inverter (800/1600?) and you will be able to run your freezer.

Buy a Kill-a-Watt ($20) so you *know* how much juice each device uses.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hand-Crank-...Wheat-Grain-Grinder-Cereal-Mill-/190694617329










http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BioSand_Filter

http://www.biosandfilter.org/


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

So how long will the corn last buying that way? Thanks for the filter diagram. Ill have to buy another barrell. I have a good private porch to put stuff like that. Shady as well. I think I can find one of those mills pretty cheap at a farmers market in town. It serves a large immigrant population and routinely has things like that. It'll probably be pretty well made. Thanks for the point about pool shock instead of liquid bleach as well. That would never have occured to me. We did studies of different disinfectants in microbiology lab today. A 20% solutiin of bleach worked the best on everything from staph, e coli, and several other common bacteria. Im gonna start using it on any surface that wont be damaged instead of the other more expensive cleaners.


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## FatTire (Mar 20, 2012)

you can get pool shock and pool pumps (which are water pumps, useful for other things than pools) often for free at the end of summer on craigslist. not saying wait till then to get some, just keep it in mind.


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## Magus (Dec 1, 2008)

Look at all the quality replies!
we're going to be saving a lot of n00b lives in this one! 


Anyone thought of a water bed bladder as a water storage device?


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

Magus said:


> Look at all the quality replies!
> we're going to be saving a lot of n00b lives in this one!
> 
> Anyone thought of a water bed bladder as a water storage device?
> ...


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## Emerald (Jun 14, 2010)

I still sleep on my waterbed thank you. and who knows what is in the plastic of that bed.
Look online for the bathtub water liners. They showed them on doomsday preppers. you pop it in the tub and fill it up. I'm sure that they would come in handy.


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## FatTire (Mar 20, 2012)

Emerald said:


> I still sleep on my waterbed thank you. and who knows what is in the plastic of that bed.
> Look online for the bathtub water liners. They showed them on doomsday preppers. you pop it in the tub and fill it up. I'm sure that they would come in handy.


bathtub liners! thats a great idea!, i wish someone had mentioned that, and i further wish someone had mentioned supporting the floor under the tub, since water does have some weight, and tubs are designed with an overflow drain...:2thumb:


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## Emerald (Jun 14, 2010)

FatTire said:


> bathtub liners! thats a great idea!, i wish someone had mentioned that, and i further wish someone had mentioned supporting the floor under the tub, since water does have some weight, and tubs are designed with an overflow drain...:2thumb:


My family is full of contractors and they have to reinforce flooring for bathtubs by law (well here in MI). My uncle climbed under our house when my parents bought it and checked to make sure that it would support the weight of the washing machines and big double sinks when my mom got a set. apparently our stick built old house was built like a brick $hit house..  our two by fours are two inches by four inches and the something or others are placed even closer than they are required to be now.. (studs and flooring joists?) Who ever built this house meant it to last.
but if you had to, you could buy those big rubber horse troughs and put the bathtub liner in them in the basement or garage.

ETA: just found out that Amazon has the bathtub water thingys.. 
http://www.amazon.com/waterBOB-Emer...words=emergency+water+storage+bag+for+bathtub


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## pixieduster (Mar 28, 2012)

I have kiddy pools. Not just for the kids. One is hard plastic and the other is much bigger with the blow up ring at the top. Figure I could use the water for toilets and general cleaning if its kept clean with pool shock.


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## JayJay (Nov 23, 2010)

FatTire said:


> you can get pool shock and pool pumps (which are water pumps, useful for other things than pools) often for free at the end of summer on craigslist. not saying wait till then to get some, just keep it in mind.


Regarding pool shock, only purify drinking water with calcium hypochloite, not sodium hy.
All the sites say this.
I've got the directions if needed for mixing the solution, and bleach.


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## JayJay (Nov 23, 2010)

Emerald said:


> I still sleep on my waterbed thank you. and who knows what is in the plastic of that bed.
> Look online for the bathtub water liners. They showed them on doomsday preppers. you pop it in the tub and fill it up. I'm sure that they would come in handy.


Can someone explain(nicely, please) why one needs a bladder in the tub??
What, your plug don't work??
Oh..the drain can be plugged, with that blue tape from dept stores...sticks forever, and use that money for two of those bladders on rice??


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## JayJay (Nov 23, 2010)

FatTire said:


> bathtub liners! thats a great idea!, i wish someone had mentioned that, and i further wish someone had mentioned supporting the floor under the tub, since water does have some weight, and tubs are designed with an overflow drain...:2thumb:


I'll say this...I never wondered about weight on any of my floors; until I started stacking cases of fruit and vegetables in the bedroom closet.
There are 5 columns, ..(for not having a better word) stacked 6 feet high, and the floor hasn't budged.
That's a lot of weight.


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## Magus (Dec 1, 2008)

JayJay said:


> Can someone explain(nicely, please) why one needs a bladder in the tub??
> What, your plug don't work??
> Oh..the drain can be plugged, with that blue tape from dept stores...sticks forever, and use that money for two of those bladders on rice??


If the water is exposed, it collects bugs and dust no matter how clean your house,but if you're only flushing with it, who cares?
if you end up having to drink the slimy dreck, YOU'LL CARE!


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## Emerald (Jun 14, 2010)

JayJay said:


> Can someone explain(nicely, please) why one needs a bladder in the tub??
> What, your plug don't work??
> Oh..the drain can be plugged, with that blue tape from dept stores...sticks forever, and use that money for two of those bladders on rice??


What Magus said!!:2thumb: You want to keep it as clean as possible. We do have earwigs here in the summer and they just love to hang out in the shower stalls and tubs.. ick... can you imagine going for clean drinking water and having a butt load of those little buggers in there swimming around!  Plus if you are still using the toilet and force flushing fecal matter does tend to hang around in the air.. if you can smell it then it is floating up and around and will land.. 
Ever watch Mythbusters and the germ testing they did on everyday objects.. fecal coliform grew on the samples from toothbrushes stored in the bathroom.. ick... but phones and computer keypads were were the worst of the lot..


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## Magus (Dec 1, 2008)

And public ice machines...


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## JayJay (Nov 23, 2010)

Magus said:


> If the water is exposed, it collects bugs and dust no matter how clean your house,but if you're only flushing with it, who cares?
> if you end up having to drink the slimy dreck, YOU'LL CARE!


Yep--I get it.

Berkey.


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## Magus (Dec 1, 2008)

Yup. and a still!


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## MrsOHpreps (Jul 14, 2012)

Great ideas, I have a few things I will have to implement-the tub liner and barrel water filtration, and emergency candles. I'll also buy corn. Is there a certain kind of dent corn that tastes best or keeps best-or both? and, how long will it last? I have 25 lbs of wheat and barley in food grade buckets, and I got them about a year ago. I need to start using them a little more, I also never got around to buying oxygen eaters 

I wish generators were cheaper, I hesitate to freeze things because of power outages.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

MrsOHpreps said:


> Is there a certain kind of dent corn that tastes best or keeps best-or both? and, how long will it last?


A long time, many years. You can buy deer or feed corn in 50 lb bags from any feed supply or farm/ranch supply.



MrsOHpreps said:


> I wish generators were cheaper, I hesitate to freeze things because of power outages.


You need to get a small one, and only run it for a 1/2 hour twice a day to keep your freezer frozen. A freezer is a small-wattage-draw item, you can power one from solar pretty easily.


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## Emerald (Jun 14, 2010)

LincTex said:


> A long time, many years. You can buy deer or feed corn in 50 lb bags from any feed supply or farm/ranch supply.
> 
> You need to get a small one, and only run it for a 1/2 hour twice a day to keep your freezer frozen. A freezer is a small-wattage-draw item, you can power one from solar pretty easily.


I know that freezers do draw small amounts once they start but they pull a great deal more for that split second that they start up.. I had a small 100 watt dc to ac inverter for my car thinking it would work fine for the freezer.. so I tried it and instantly popped the fuse. Another member here told me it would and it did.. so make sure that the solar array can handle a big beginning draw then settle down. I'm looking into buying another inverter that will be mounted directly to my car(big suv). they come in much higher watts than the little plug in ones.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

Emerald said:


> I had a small 100 watt dc to ac inverter for my car thinking it would work fine for the freezer.. . they come in much higher watts than the little plug in ones.


Pffft.... 100 watts is useable for very little. I would think a 400/800 inverter would do fine, maybe a 600/1200 watt one.

ALTHOUGH.... I am thinking most freezer compressors use an induction motor, so I would stay away from the cheaper "modified sine wave" inverters, honestly.

Instead, buy one that uses "pure sine wave" or the freezer motor will get very hot (and not last very long).

I think about 180-240 watts of solar panels, 4 golf cart batteries and a 800 watt pure sine inverter would run a chest freezer indefinitely.


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## Emerald (Jun 14, 2010)

LincTex said:


> Pffft.... 100 watts is useable for very little. I would think a 400/800 inverter would do fine, maybe a 600/1200 watt one.
> 
> ALTHOUGH.... I am thinking most freezer compressors use an induction motor, so I would stay away from the cheaper "modified sine wave" inverters, honestly.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the information.. I have a nice nest egg going on Amazon(over $400) and have been looking at all the inverters.. there are so many and all the reviews are pretty much kinda divided. but then most reviews are going to be that way.. many people tend to not follow directions/buy stuff not knowing what they need yadda yadda..
I will take what you have given me into consideration for sure. I used ot repair electronics for a living and knew that certain things will not run very well without pure sine waves. so I have been looking into the better models. I have also been looking into solar panels. My thinking that I could easily take the inverter off the car and put it to work with the solar panels.. but the deep cycle marine batteries that I like are a bit pricy. I should have paid more attention to my old boss when he needed help working on his wind generators.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

Emerald said:


> many people tend to not follow directions/buy stuff not knowing what they need


Most inverter problems can be traced to either: 
1) too small cables to the battery 
2) bad connections to the battery 
3) or batteries that are too small (or not enough of them)
4) not a good enough system to recharge the batteries


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## Riverdale (Oct 31, 2009)

Magus said:


> Yup. and a still!


I (fortunately) have an 1¼" well in my basement, that is right under the kitchen sink.

I have a hand pump (and more than enough water to prime it) stored.

Heck, my great uncle hand a hand pump (he died in 1980) in his farnhouse.


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## Magus (Dec 1, 2008)

I have a good one [or had until my neighbor got there] but I think septic tanks might have ruined it.I figure a month after SHTF and they all go poop in buckets,it'll clear out.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

Magus said:


> I have a good one (or had until my neighbor got there) but I think septic tanks might have ruined it. I figure a month after SHTF and they all go poop in buckets, it'll clear out.


It would probably take longer than that. In the meanwhile, build a bio-sand filter to help deal with any contaminants. I, too, have tasted water from people's wells that seems to have a sewage taste to it.

I will be trying to filter rainwater and river water in my bio-sand filter to make it drinkable. I'll add a couple drops of bleach to the end product to kill that last .01% of pathogens, let it sit a while, aerate it several times, then run it through a good water filter cartridge and I should be good to go.


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