# Best all around gun?



## MR.GREEN

I'd like some opinions on what the best all around handgun and rifle would be if you could only have one of each?


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## Molon Labe

My LMT AR15 Monolithic Rail Platform. I can go from a 10.5" with a suppressor to an 18" or anything in between with the turn of two bolts. I can even change to 6.8 with the change of the barrel and bolt, although I don't, not yet at least. One rifle with multiple options by carrying 2 extra barrels. 

Glock 17 - Simple to use, few moving parts, easy to clean. High Capacity magazines and 9mm round. If it comes down to it, of all the handgun ammo in the world 9mm is probably the most easy to find. If comes to scrounging, bartering and even beg, borrow and stealing your best bet will be finding 9mm.


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## Magus

There is no do-all,what area do you live in and how do you expect to use it?
Do you expect to hunt only,hunt and fight?just get by?

If you want to just get by,I suggest a 45LC/410 such as the old [email protected] handygun and a 45LC revolver.

If you intend to hunt and fight,things change dramatically!I recomend an FAL and a BHP,the 7.62/.308 will drop most north American game,and is a darn fine ranged fighting weapon,the Browning hi power is for if it runs dry.

Now if you plan to retreat across country,then it changes even more to an AR-15 platform rifle preferrably in CAR or M4 configuration and a Baretta 92f.and just for all around use,add a 22lr conversion kit in your pack and a few mags for the AR.

Now then,if you're on a buget....an SKS and a Ruger MkII pistol with a brick of ammo.


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## Denny

Molon Labe said:


> My LMT AR15 Monolithic Rail Platform. I can go from a 10.5" with a suppressor to an 18" or anything in between with the turn of two bolts. I can even change to 6.8 with the change of the barrel and bolt, although I don't, not yet at least. One rifle with multiple options by carrying 2 extra barrels.
> 
> Glock 17 - Simple to use, few moving parts, easy to clean. High Capacity magazines and 9mm round. If it comes down to it, of all the handgun ammo in the world 9mm is probably the most easy to find. If comes to scrounging, bartering and even beg, borrow and stealing your best bet will be finding 9mm.


I'm pretty close to that combo, with a couple of different reasons. I went with an AK47 since they're cheaper and more reliable (I actually ditched an AR for my AK). And I carry a Glock 23 (.40 cal), but I fully understand the convenience of the ammo. Good combo, though.


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## endurance

Personally, I think a Ruger 10/22 is pretty hard to beat for a gun that will put the most meat on the table. If thing really do go bad, the big game populations will plummet in a matter of months. Deer and elk can only have one baby a year, so getting the herd back up in numbers is unlikely. Rabbits, squirrels, and geese (on the ground) are all easy prey with a .22 and reproduce much more rapidly. Add to that a box of 500 rounds for a .22 costs less than 20 rounds for a .308 and you're really on to something.

After that, I'd look at something that can really reach out there and touch someone at a distance. .308 or 30-06 would be my choice of calibers, as they're both commonly available and capable of taking down large game in excess of 300 yards (out to 600 yards for the highly experienced and somewhat lucky). A bolt action will get you more stealth, reliability, lower cost, and more accuracy. A semi-auto will give you a weapon that could serve two purposes, long range hunting/sniping and also serve as a volume of fire assault rifle without giving up too much accuracy. My preferences go toward the FN-FAL, M1A, and M1 Garand.

A handgun would only come after I had both a .22 and a .308. If you don't have a great deal of experience nor a lot of time to learn, then a revolver seems like a good choice. A 6" barrel .357 gives you the option of running three chambers with .357+P rounds for taking out big game out to 50 yards (with a great deal of practice and luck) and three rounds of .38 squib rounds that you could use on small game like rabbits. No semi-auto gives you options like that. There's lots of options. I'm a big fan of the Rugers, but you really can't go wrong and the pawn shops usually have plenty of options.

I don't disagree with the AK-47 approach from a practical standpoint of a cheap reliable weapon with a readily available cartridge. My only qualm is that I'm not sure you can legally hunt with a 7.62x39 round, where you can with a .308 if you have a five round capacity or less (even a 20 round magazine can be made legal if you put a stopper inside the magazine to limit capacity). While that may not be a concern of yours now, if things gradually get worse economically and you are having a hard time feeding your family, wouldn't it be a nice option to go hunting without breaking the law?


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## Denny

endurance said:


> Personally, I think a Ruger 10/22 is pretty hard to beat for a gun that will put the most meat on the table. If thing really do go bad, the big game populations will plummet in a matter of months. Deer and elk can only have one baby a year, so getting the herd back up in numbers is unlikely. Rabbits, squirrels, and geese (on the ground) are all easy prey with a .22 and reproduce much more rapidly. Add to that a box of 500 rounds for a .22 costs less than 20 rounds for a .308 and you're really on to something.
> 
> After that, I'd look at something that can really reach out there and touch someone at a distance. .308 or 30-06 would be my choice of calibers, as they're both commonly available and capable of taking down large game in excess of 300 yards (out to 600 yards for the highly experienced and somewhat lucky). A bolt action will get you more stealth, reliability, lower cost, and more accuracy. A semi-auto will give you a weapon that could serve two purposes, long range hunting/sniping and also serve as a volume of fire assault rifle without giving up too much accuracy. My preferences go toward the FN-FAL, M1A, and M1 Garand.
> 
> A handgun would only come after I had both a .22 and a .308. If you don't have a great deal of experience nor a lot of time to learn, then a revolver seems like a good choice. A 6" barrel .357 gives you the option of running three chambers with .357+P rounds for taking out big game out to 50 yards (with a great deal of practice and luck) and three rounds of .38 squib rounds that you could use on small game like rabbits. No semi-auto gives you options like that. There's lots of options. I'm a big fan of the Rugers, but you really can't go wrong and the pawn shops usually have plenty of options.
> 
> I don't disagree with the AK-47 approach from a practical standpoint of a cheap reliable weapon with a readily available cartridge. My only qualm is that I'm not sure you can legally hunt with a 7.62x39 round, where you can with a .308 if you have a five round capacity or less (even a 20 round magazine can be made legal if you put a stopper inside the magazine to limit capacity). While that may not be a concern of yours now, if things gradually get worse economically and you are having a hard time feeding your family, wouldn't it be a nice option to go hunting without breaking the law?


I forgot to mention that my AK is a .223 (WASR3) and I have 10, 20 and 30 round mags for it. I would also want a Remmington 700P (tactical) heavy barrel with a decent bipod and scope for a nice 308 package. Long range, assault and sidearm combo complete.


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## ke4sky

*.357 Magnum Revolver and Lever-Rifle Combo*

My most-used center-fire rifle is a Marlin 1894 in .357 Magnum. It is manageable by females and youngsters, has low recoil and is fairly quiet when used with standard velocity lead .38 Special ammo. It is a fun camp gun with good small game utility. Its potential for home defense with .357 ammunition, is nothing to sneeze at, either.

A .357 levergun is adequate for deer within 100 yards or so. Leverguns are familiar and nonthreatening in appearance, so they "don't scare the natives" as a "black rifle" often does. When firing .38 Special lead bullet ammo from a rifle, velocity remains subsonic, having a mild report little louder than a .22, which has advantages for discreet suburban garden varminting.

New leverguns cost less than so-called "black rifles." Used .357 leverguns sell for about 60% in stores of what a similar rifle costs new. The frontier concept of having a rifle and revolver both using the same common ammunition still makes sense.

While the .38 Special is no longer the duty gun of choice for police or military use, it enjoys great popularity in states where civilian concealed carry is permitted. A great variety of well developed factory personal protection loads are available, brass and bullets are common, the cartridge is one of the most widely reloaded amd is inherently accurate.

The .357 Magnum shares these attributes. While it is also true that compact revolvers are readily available chambered for in .357 Magnum, using .38 Special ammunition in them most of the time makes more sense. You will probably use your .357 rifle mostly for hunting small game. To reduce meat damage on edible game, and for ease of use, reduced recoil and lower noise you will find yourself using .38 Specials in it most of the time.

Think of .357 magnums as "rifle ammo," not as "revolver ammo." For while a sturdy .357 revolver handles them just fine, they aren't "fun" to shoot. Reserve their use for when more power and greater range is needed. In a rifle .357 magnums shoot "on" at 100 yards when your sights are zeroed at 50 yards with 158-gr. lead bullet .38 Specials.

The non-enthusiast seeking "one handgun-bigger than a .22" should select a "police-service-type," double-action .38 Special suitable for use with +P ammunition, or a similar gun chamvbered in .357 with 4" barrel In states where concealed carry is legal a 4-inch " gun is about $100 cheaper than a 2" snubbie of similar model. But a 4" barrel can be readily concealed in a proper IWB holster, is easier to shoot accurately and gives higher velocity which ensures good expanding bullet performance. Any sound .357 Magnum revolver of these general specifications can use .38 Special ammunition, but being more durably constructed, it won't loosen up with frequent use of .38 +P loads, as a light frame .38 Special might. And a .357 revolver has the advantage of being ablt to use more powerful magnum ammo if needed.

As recently as ten years ago the market was flooded with police turn-in .38 and .357 revolvers in good condition for around $200. These days you must shop carefully to find a used "cop" revolver which isn't worn out. Expect to pay $350 for a sound, used fixed-sight S&W .38 Special Model 10, 13, or 64 and $450 for an adjustable sight S&W Model 15, 19, or 66or Ruger GP100. If you don't know revolvers take someone with you to shop who is. Avoid buying a "gunsmithing project," because fixing a broken used gun costs more than it is worth.

If you don't currently own a gun, but have been thinking about getting both a handgun and a rifle, you can't go wrong with a sturdy 4" .38 Special or .357 revolver and a Marlin 1894C carbine in .357 to go along with it.


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## Magus

Hey,great post there!I'd missed that concept completely[mainly 'cuz I hate crank guns.]LOL.just personal preferance,still a great idea.


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## saintsfanbrian

I don't think there is one "best" gun for anyone. If you have a range near by that rents hand guns I highly recommend starting there. Talk with the owners/instructors and get their opinions. 

If you have never fired a gun before than probably a wheel gun will be the best choice as a starter gun but there are many auto-loaders out there that will get the job done.

I personally carry only 9mm pistols. My wife is partial to .38 revolvers. We also have an evil black rifle in 7.62 x 39 and a 12 gauge and a .22 rifle. We keep enough ammo on hand to feed them should the need arise. 

The 9mm is a proven round in both military and police circles. If there were a SHTF scenario I could theoretically scrounge up more 9mm ammo than I could .45.


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## endurance

I used to have a .22/20 guage over/under. That allowed one gun with two barrels to have both a .22LR round chambered and a 20 guage shotgun slug chambered with a selector switch on the hammer. It seemed like the perfect single gun, however, reloading was slow and my accuracy on moving rabbits demands a semi-auto. Also, 20 guage shells are very heavy to carry in any large quantity. Still, something to think about, as it might apply better to you and your application. There's a number of other calibers out there. A .22/.308 might be just the ticket, but I doubt it's out there.


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## oregonshooter

AK undefolder and Glock G17


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## Denny

oregonshooter said:


> AK underfolder and Glock G17


Simple and sweet!


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## Fn/Form

If there was little chance of contact with unknown risk persons (rural), a bolt- or lever-action would have to get the nod. Simple, robust, accurate. .308, 7.62x54R or 8mm would be my preferences--for ammo availability in bulk at a price cheaper than most other calibers. I really like Mauser-style actions. Few commercial products offer robust iron sights. Milsurp rifles offer the best bang for the buck. Mitchell's sells new Mausers and a Tanker Mauser.

Handgun... Glocks. If I had to have a handgun, maybe a 10mm would be more useful in hawg/black bear country. I would rather trade the handgun for a .22LR rifle, tho. The CZ 452 is a fav of mine.

If I planned to wait out an event in suburbia, or if gang contact was a possibility, my choice would be a military grade semi-auto in a common chambering. Find what platform fits, make sure the specimen is reliable and become proficient at marksmanship and medical drills. Work medical issues (gunshot wounds) into the training. I prefer .30 cal, so I lean toward AKs and FALs. However, pencil barrel ARs are a lot easier for the small-stature people to handle and practice with.

"Two is one, one is none." If you can afford one rifle, you can eventually afford another. It is important to have a backup firearm in the same caliber. It doesn't have to be the same mil-grade type... maybe a .308 bolt gun to go with the FAL. A semi-auto .22 to go with the .22 bolt gun, etc. Get it now. Bury it if you can't carry it or just can't stand to look at it, for now.

I like the idea of pistol/carbine commonality, but pistol caliber penetration performance is limited. Penetration is key. That's how firearms work. 

Consider practical use. Have you ever tried to work a lever gun or load a wheel gun inside a moving vehicle or while driving? What if someone uses simple cover that defeats pistol rounds? How about having to perform a task with one hand while having to fire with the other (grabbing your screaming kid, opening doors or windows, etc.)? Most people who have been in these situations do not consider otherwise "good enough" weapons to be adequate. They have been through the wringer once. They have the power to choose, and they choose high-capacity semi-autos you can reasonably control with one hand.


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## endurance

Fn/Form said:


> If there was little chance of contact with unknown risk persons (rural), a bolt- or lever-action would have to get the nod. Simple, robust, accurate. .308, 7.62x54R or 8mm would be my preferences--for ammo availability in bulk at a price cheaper than most other calibers. I really like Mauser-style actions. Few commercial products offer robust iron sights. Milsurp rifles offer the best bang for the buck. Mitchell's sells new Mausers and a Tanker Mauser.


On this note, I was just at a gunshow today and saw several .303 Enfields going for $120-180 that were in great shape for being almost a century old now. The Military Channel had a show on these guns and rated them as the #3 best military gun of all time. The sights were amazing and adjusted out to 1,000 yards. Sure, it's an unusual cartridge in the states, but it's still readily available and reasonably cheap for .30 caliber ammunition.


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## Fn/Form

endurance said:


> On this note, I was just at a gunshow today and saw several .303 Enfields going for $120-180 that were in great shape for being almost a century old now. The Military Channel had a show on these guns and rated them as the #3 best military gun of all time. The sights were amazing and adjusted out to 1,000 yards. Sure, it's an unusual cartridge in the states, but it's still readily available and reasonably cheap for .30 caliber ammunition.


It is indeed a good rifle design. A buddy and his girlfriend love them, but he complains there's not much quality surplus ammo available.

I owned an Ishapore Enfield .308. Good rifle, poor parts availability.


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## endurance

Good to know. I saw plenty at the gunshow, but of course it was all military ball. You'd obviously want to put away some soft point stuff for hunting and I'd suspect that would be harder to find.


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## groundhogsniper23

my two would have to be a savage mod 10 fp .308 with a tasco super sniper straight 16 power scope with mil dots( and learn how to use them if no body knows how to). also, my sidearm would have to be a glock. these guns are light and will shoot when nuthin else will. i own a beretta 92 fs and i like the gun but i don't rely on it too much like i do my glock 22 .40 s&w. 
now for semi-auto i am gonna have to go with denny on the ak. either 7.62 by 39 or .223. both are good calibers but 7.62 ammo is a little cheaper at some sites i have been looking at.


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## Fn/Form

groundhogsniper23 said:


> my two would have to be a savage mod 10 fp .308 with a tasco super sniper straight 16 power scope with mil dots...


Keep a few spare extractors for the Savage. They are bronze or something similar, and they wear easily. I went through two in my 16FSS before I sold it.


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## Backwoods

There's no way I could ever pick just 2 that would cover all situations so I'll go with the ones I like best.

SSR85-B (AK-47)

1911 45 ACP


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## groundhogsniper23

fn/form i have a savage 111 benchgun in 6mmbr that i have put over 300+ rounds and before it was a 7mm mag i put around another 300 down the tube, about how many rounds did u have before u had to change extractors?


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## Fn/Form

g'sniper, It was usually around 800rds. You will notice ejection become weaker, no matter if you work the bolt soft or hard. Eventually the worn extractor will flop the empty case on top of the magazine, and you'll have to hand clear it. 

I suppose they had to make it small to fit on the bolt face, but the material (bronze colored, if I remember correctly) seemed softer than steel.


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## Magus

I'll have to check that in my weather warrior,thats not a good thing!


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## ke4sky

*Savage 24 various versions*



endurance said:


> I used to have a .22/20 guage over/under. That allowed one gun with two barrels to have both a .22LR round chambered and a 20 guage shotgun slug chambered with a selector switch on the hammer. It seemed like the perfect single gun, however, reloading was slow and my accuracy on moving rabbits demands a semi-auto. Also, 20 guage shells are very heavy to carry in any large quantity...


I have a Savage Model 24C camp gun with 20-inch barrels chambered .22LR with a cylinder bore 20-ga. underneath. The .22 LR barrel will shoot 2-inch groups at 50 yards with its open sights. The cylinder bore 20-ga. shoots typical skeet patterns. It has a 2-3/4 inch chamber, but within 25-30 yards it is more effective than a .410. The best all around load is an ounce of 7-1/2s or 6s. 20-ga. ammo is common and less expensive than .410s , but is more heavy and bulky. The 20-ga. slugs don't shoot to the sights, but hit way low. You can do better ignoring the front sight blade and using the front sight base only up in the open sight notch as a makeshift slug sight, if you can remember. Brenneke slugs shoot best, but are hard to find in the 2-3/4 inch length.

I had a Savage .22 LR over .410 years many ago, but sold it. Its full choke .410 was hard to hit small game with at short woods ranges less than 25 yards, but it shredded rabbits and squirrels up close if you did. But by the time you got out to 25 yards for the patterns to get larger, they were too thin with any shot larger than 7-1/2 to be useful. The .410 slug is pathetic and ineffective on game. Today's .410 buckshot loads are better for predator defense,

I used several times a Savage 24V with .30-30 rifle barrel over a 3-inch. magnum 20-ga. full choke. For the subsistance hunter/farmer in big game country this may be close to ideal. While the .30-30 isn't the best big game round, it is plentiful and common, and does the job at short range if you do yours. A 3-inch 20-ga. is almost as effective as a 12-ga. and having a choke bore is a plus. They also made this gun in a .357/20-ga. and in a .222 or .223 over 20-ga. which would be an option if you has other firearms in those calibers.

Valmet of Finland made an over-under rifle shotgun which could be had in either .308 Win. or .30-'06 under a 3-inch. magnum 12-ga. The one I hunted with in Europe (1980s) was a high quality gun with quick-detachable scope mount and was a common rig used for moose hunting. One of these would be worth looking for, but would not be an inexpensive gun.


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## JeepHammer

endurance said:


> Personally, I think a Ruger 10/22 is pretty hard to beat for a gun that will put the most meat on the table.


I'll second that!
I used a 10/22 for years rabbit and squirrel hunting, made some pretty good money thinning out the feral cats and ground hogs around here when I was younger also.

I sure wish they still made the 20" barrel model of 10/22, I'd sure like to have another one!
---------------

As for all around gun, I'd have to say that 10/22 MAGNUM would do about anything I would need to do around here.
We don't have bears or mule deer, or anything larger than a white tail, so a 10/22 Mag would be an exceptional rapid fire rifle!

The 77/22 Magnum is a FINE rifle, I have one, and it's my favorite squirrel gun of all time!
With inexpensive optics, I can reach out 100 yards and knock those little bushy tails out of the trees with no problems at all, and it doesn't tear them up like larger/faster bullets would.

That 77/22 mag has put down MANY a coyote also! So anyone that says a .22 Mag (.22 WMR) won't knock down a coyote at 150 yards has NO IDEA what they are talking about!
-----------------

If I were in bear or mule deer/big horn sheep/moose, ect. country, I'd probably want something larger, 
But since I don't, .22 WMR is just fine with me!


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## Magus

JeepHammer said:


> I sure wish they still made the 20" barrel model of 10/22, I'd sure like to have another one!


There are loads of aftermarket barrels,Numerich arms carries the originals however.anybody with a set of allen wrenches can swap them out.


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## Jezcruzen

Ummmm, the poster asked opinions about only having two guns, which two guns would you choose. Think about that for a minute. Only two guns. With those two guns you must be able to provide for the table, have a means to address encrouching varmints, and offer some personal defense against those that would do you harm.

My first pick would be a Remington 870 in 12ga. with a 26" barrel. It would be able to use RemChoke with at least cyn., mod., full, and rifled choke tubes. Why this choice? Because there is not anything in North America I can't kill with a 12ga. From squrilles to moose and everything inbetween. I personally have killed deer using a scope and saboted slugs out to 167yds. using the rifled choke tube. Shells are common and available.

Next, a decent .22lr. I'd prefer a rifle, but some might choose a pistol. Ammo is cheap and available, like the 12ga. With care, you can take up to deer sized game with a .22. What's not to like? Auto or bolt gun, you make the choice.

Exotic assualt weapons in military calibers are nice to have. So are major caliber scoped bolt guns. But if limited to only two gun that will both protect and provide, the exotic weapons don't cut it.


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## Fn/Form

Jezcruzen said:


> ...My first pick would be a Remington 870 in 12ga. with a 26" barrel... Exotic assualt weapons in military calibers are nice to have. So are major caliber scoped bolt guns. But if limited to only two gun that will both protect and provide, the exotic weapons don't cut it.


And here I thought you were the "Jus' me an' m'bolt gun" guy. ;-) (inside joke)

I grew up with full-size Mossberg shotguns and .22 rifles we kids purchased ourselves. We lived on 100ac. and had no other firearms (we wuz poor) until I was in my late teens. A 26" barrel is pretty unwieldy indoors and in brush. IMO, the shotty has the same limitations as the lever gun. I'm not saying it can't work if it's the only thing available--but it is NOT what I would choose again. The rifle is the queen of all. Penetration, precision, reliability. A military rifle steps it up a notch in reliability and utility.


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## Denny

Fn/Form said:


> And here I thought you were the "Jus' me an' m'bolt gun" guy. ;-) (inside joke)
> 
> I grew up with full-size Mossberg shotguns and .22 rifles we kids purchased ourselves. We lived on 100ac. and had no other firearms (we wuz poor) until I was in my late teens. A 26" barrel is pretty unwieldy indoors and in brush. IMO, the shotty has the same limitations as the lever gun. I'm not saying it can't work if it's the only thing available--but it is NOT what I would choose again. The rifle is the queen of all. Penetration, precision, reliability. A military rifle steps it up a notch in reliability and utility.


Couldn't have said it better myself. I can get what I need done with the AK... near or far. Distance, weight, ammo capacity, reliability. I gotta stop now. I'm getting myself all hot and bothered.


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## Jezcruzen

Your right. I do like dem bolt guns! (And, that 870 isn't even a rifle) 

But I view these circumstances as being different from that other site. I would want all the versitility I could get here. 

I have a Mossberg bolt-action 12ga that has a fully rifled barrel. Using a 4X scope, it shoots a 3" group @ 100yds using Remington copper solids. My 870 "Turkey Spl." shoots just as well with the rifled choke installed. Not bad for shotguns!


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## flatwater

I would have to go with a 12 guage pump and a 45 colt Ruger hand gun. If the choice was three I would add my marlin 45/70
flatwater


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## groundhogsniper23

jeep hammer, check out Cabela's Official Website - Quality Hunting, Fishing, Camping and Outdoor Gear at competitive prices. they have alot of different upgrades for the 10/22.


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## JeepHammer

groundhogsniper23 said:


> jeep hammer, check out Cabela's Official Website - Quality Hunting, Fishing, Camping and Outdoor Gear at competitive prices. they have alot of different upgrades for the 10/22.


Thanks man!

Same story, stock length.
If you get a couple of inches extra (and who couldn't use 2" extra! ) they want to sell you a bull barrel, and I don't want the extra weight.

Tried Gun Parts Inc. (Numrich) and the barrels they had were shot out pretty badly.

I guess I'm going to have to order a custom Kreiger or some other $$$$$$ barrel if I want the extra length...
---------------------------------------

Anyway, like I said, my most all time useful gun when I was hunting all the time, was a Over/Under in .22 LR & 20 Ga. 
Sure wish I had that thing back!

I saw one at the gun show a while back, but the guy wanted over twice what they sold for brand new!
Said the 'Survival Nuts' will pay big money for them...

Guess he know where the real 'Survival' guys are!


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## Magus

Any compitent gunsmith can make you an extended "match?"barell for not much more than those stock barells,I suggest getting a Walther blank from Brownells or one of the cryogenic steel blanks.


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## mrboma

IMHO, MidWayusa.com is the best place to go for your 10/22 mods. 
30+ pages of goodies and not-so-goodies for your favorite plinker.
Regards,
Mike



groundhogsniper23 said:


> jeep hammer, check out Cabela's Official Website - Quality Hunting, Fishing, Camping and Outdoor Gear at competitive prices. they have alot of different upgrades for the 10/22.


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## Magus

Fixed.LOL
MidwayUSA - Shooting Supplies, Reloading, Gunsmithing, Hunting, Ammunition, Gun Parts & Rifle Scopes


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## groundhogsniper23

ur right mrboma i forgot about them till after i posted this. they do have alot of stuff


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## Canadian

I should have my permit soon. I'll have to bring the wife along to see what she is comfortable with. In our complex most buildings are only 30 feet away from each other. The longest open stretch is a road about 60 feet long. 

So far we're looking at Remington 870 Police 14" barrel and Steyr M9A1 handguns. The shotgun is good at close range and we'll be shooting at targets about 30 feet away at most. My wife is a little lady and a 14" with a Knoxx stock + Vang comp shooting reduced recoil loads sounds good. We can also vary the ammunition so we don't shoot through walls and doors if we have to use the guns. 

She's fired a 9mm and is comfortable with it. 9mm is also inexpensive. 

The Steyr was designed by one of the same guys who designed the Glock. It has all the Glock features plus it can fire lead bullets, has an external safety, and can be locked with a key. It also points very well and the trapeziodal sights are a great innovation. It's also slightly less expensive than the Glock. 

I like the 1911's but they are a lot more expensive. Plus most gun makers don't make a full sized 9mm 1911. I like the feel and accuracy of a larger pistol with a longer barrel. They are also more complex depending on the safety items that are built in to the particular model. 

The first time I picked up a 1911 it felt like it was made for one purpose only. Kind of like a race car or a jet boat. Plastic guns don't have that feel. I love the single action shooting. Trigger feels great. Follow up shots are good. I also feel very safe with that solid wing safety up. They feel good to shoot, very accurate, and the single stack mags are so easy on the hands when you load the cartridges. Some double stack 10 round mags make rounds eight through ten feel like a struggle. The 1911 feels like a serous piece of equipment. The way the slide locks back feels so solid. I can see why they are still so popular. However .45 ammo is more expensive than 9mm. 

The mayor banned all gun ranges from our city so I have to drive to a range far out of town to shoot. It takes about an hour on the highway to get there. This means the guns will pretty much sit in the safe for years "just in case." If I was going to go to the range on a regular basis I'd get a custom full size 1911 in 9mm. It's just too far away for more than an occasional visit. However, since the guns are part of my survival stash and I have nowhere to shoot or hunt going with the less expensive Steyr is what I'll probably do.

Those are the two guns that work for me. My wife and I probably won't go for a rifle since at 30 feet we can hit most things with the shotguns anyway.


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## JeepHammer

Sorry guys, been around those blocks, no 20" or 22" NEW barrels for cheap....
Everything I find is stock length, or if I find a longer one, it's a heavy barrel.

Kreiger or Green Mountian if I'm going to buy a blank and turn it to stock dimensions myself...
More work than I wanted to do!


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## Magus

If you have the tools,then get to it,and be proud of your masterpiece!

I want a shorter barell myself,but having to pay 200$ for a SBR permit sucks.


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## risabee

A lady can shoot a .357 with practice, I'm proof -- and I have arthritis, too. It can be toned down for practice with .38 and .38 wadcutters. My open carry is a Ruger Security Six. It is quite accurate considering the 2.75" barrel. I've taken small game with .357 birdshot, though the .22 discussion is spot on. 

My current long gun beyond .22 is a 20 ga. mossie 500 -- I've been looking for a Trapper in .357 or, dream gun, Timberwolf .357 pump, but neither has shown up in a price I can reach to, and that's likely to be true for awhile.


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## NaeKid

Please visit our sister site at http://www.FireArmsTalk.com to continue this discussion.

Thank you,

Moderator


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