# Future plans what are yours, mine is



## theuksurvivalist (Feb 4, 2010)

Hi
Mine is to find a remote small holding (homestead US term i think) here in the UK and become self sufficient as much as one can. Hopefully be able to provide enough electric, own water supply, abit of livestock and crops. 
The uk survivalist


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## NaeKid (Oct 17, 2008)

What is the land-situation out there? I have heard some horror stories about buying places, castles, etc. Something about the queen owning everything and you are only paying rent to her and that you don't really control what you hold.

Homesteading is basically when you find raw land and you build it up to be self-sustaining. Self-sustaining means that the land pays you to be there instead of you paying to be there. If you breed and raise horses, you would sell the offspring to pay your bills. You would grow your own feed and sell off the excess each year - again - to make the land more self-sustaining. You could also build up a storage facility and people would pay rent to store their camping gear in your backyard. That rent would allow the land to pay for itself.

A non-self-sustaining situation would be where you are living in a city, in a small apartment and the apartment sucks the money out of your pocket as quickly as you can put it in.


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## Vertigo (Aug 6, 2009)

NaeKid said:


> Homesteading is basically when you find raw land and you build it up to be self-sustaining. Self-sustaining means that the land pays you to be there instead of you paying to be there. If you breed and raise horses, you would sell the offspring to pay your bills. You would grow your own feed and sell off the excess each year - again - to make the land more self-sustaining. You could also build up a storage facility and people would pay rent to store their camping gear in your backyard. That rent would allow the land to pay for itself.
> 
> A non-self-sustaining situation would be where you are living in a city, in a small apartment and the apartment sucks the money out of your pocket as quickly as you can put it in.


Nicely put Naekid! :congrat:

As far as my own plans, I intend to go to my parents place and bug in. It is not really rural, not really urban, but thats just how most of Belgium is. I strongly believe that for most people, bugging in (staying home) is the most viable and least cumbersome strategy. We will be able to heat ourselves, nourish ourselves, and I am working on providing energy for ourselves. Sadly the biggest thing missing here is being able to provide protection for ourselves. (unless you count the new air rifle I got  ) (btw i'll give a full review of it one of these days.)

hope this helps,

V.


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## theuksurvivalist (Feb 4, 2010)

Hi
There are places still that you can buy and build up but most places are all ready up and working. You are right the place will have to pay for itself. By breeding animals and selling them on. Growing crops and selling them locally. 
Small holdings with property can be expensive over here for example a 4 acre small holding we are looking at is £249,000 british pounds, roughly, nearly $400,000 usd. But we have a good profit in our house when we sell it.
the uk survivalist


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## greaseman (Jun 13, 2009)

*future plans*

I also agree that a lot of people will be staying put, and making the best of it. In my case, it's my best option. I live in a semi urban area, but surrounded by homes, and farmland. I found out recently that my neighbor behind me is also a prepper. Thank goodness for that. he told me what he is doing, and we are on the same page.

My best shot at a safe existence, is to work with my neighbors, give them food in exchange for covering my back if necessary. But unfortunately for me, my kids think I'm crazy, so guess who else will be here if it gets bad. I guess we just do what we can.

my plan "B", is to go to my wife's family's place in rural Ga. If I had enough time to bug out elsewhere, this my be a good second choice. They have plenty of food and guns, plenty hunting area, and endless fishingplaces.  But getting there could be hazardous. A 5 hour trip could turn into a 16 hour fight for your life. Early action would be the key, but there are no easy simple answers to anything. Good planning is the key to the best chance of success.


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## TreeMUPKennel (Jan 29, 2010)

Future plans HHHMMM, well I love were I stay except for being on the edge of a neighborhood. Got the woods to my back and real good neighbors. But my plan is to have a piece of property out in the middle of nowere were I could have a self sufficient piece of property raise everything to eat and make my own power too. Somewhere i could realy invest into my survival ways and ideas. They down fall to bugging in to me if something hits the fan and you live around town in plane view your going to stand out like a sore thumb. You know how some folks get they want what you have But if your out of site out of mind whos going to know.  But that for worst case scene. They both have ups and downs to me:scratch To me being able to have family come for shelter or whatever would be key. Seeing that me a the wife both have all are families right here in the same town would be great to have property.


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## greaseman (Jun 13, 2009)

TreeMUPKennel said:


> Future plans HHHMMM, well I love were I stay except for being on the edge of a neighborhood. Got the woods to my back and real good neighbors. But my plan is to have a piece of property out in the middle of nowere were I could have a self sufficient piece of property raise everything to eat and make my own power too. Somewhere i could realy invest into my survival ways and ideas. They down fall to bugging in to me if something hits the fan and you live around town in plane view your going to stand out like a sore thumb. You know how some folks get they want what you have But if your out of site out of mind whos going to know.  But that for worst case scene. They both have ups and downs to me:scratch To me being able to have family come for shelter or whatever would be key. Seeing that me a the wife both have all are families right here in the same town would be great to have property.


 Let's face it. There are't too many good scenerios. if you bug out to the outermost boonies, sooner or later, when the towns are sacked, the hordes will come looking, as even an animal isn't stupid. When they run out of food in their homeground, they start searching. just witness the coyotes in many parts of the country. They have come into urban areas looking for food as habitat dimenishes. Humans are no different.

Many situational judgements will have to be made. The idea of situational awareness will be most important. I think even though problems will come fast, we will get warnings. If the problem is of a human nature, we'll see government forces beginning to mass in urban areas. That will be crunch time. Time to decide whether to stand and fight, or head for plan B. As hard as it is, and depending on how bad things look, for me, getting out may be the best thing. my relatives live in rural GA, about 5 hours away. There is plenty of family, food, and guns. But leaving the homestead would be tough. I don't see leaving grown children behind. I think my daughter with my grandaughter, will realize by that time that maybe all that ranting I'd done wasn't so crazy after all. her husband thinks I'm crazy, and he's one of those"that could never happen" people. Oh well, like I've said before, if I'm wrong, no problem, but if I'm right, I'll at least stand a chance.

At the present time, I see even more evidence that as a nation, we will never escape the trap that has been set for us by the elites. It is so plain, and so devious in nature, it would make a good sci-fi movie, except it's real, and it's about to take place. of that, there can be no mistake. I see more and more people waking up, and asking the same question---what if? I'm one of those that believes in a kind of collective consciousness. A type of mass sixth sense that many have, but don't realize they have it. A gut feeling best explains the concept. many people now have a gut feeling that what the government is telling us doesn't add up to what they are seeing. They are starting to ask questions, and the light bulb is coming on in their head. Time is most suredly almost out to do anything.

Let's hope this discussion board will serve as an early warning system for us. maybe that will give us a fighting chance. The plans I can see being laid by our slavemasters are a " take no prisoners" type of plan. They want us broken, obediant to orders, and begging them to save us. But their salvation is a living hell on earth. They hope millions will take the bait of government assistance, and die while waiting for help. we only have ourselves to depend on. Don't waste time. good luck.


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## HozayBuck (Jan 27, 2010)

Vertigo said:


> Nicely put Naekid! :congrat:
> 
> As far as my own plans, I intend to go to my parents place and bug in. It is not really rural, not really urban, but thats just how most of Belgium is. I strongly believe that for most people, bugging in (staying home) is the most viable and least cumbersome strategy. We will be able to heat ourselves, nourish ourselves, and I am working on providing energy for ourselves. Sadly the biggest thing missing here is being able to provide protection for ourselves. (unless you count the new air rifle I got  ) (btw i'll give a full review of it one of these days.)
> 
> ...


I have a serious question Vertigo

You live in a country known far and wide for making some of the finest weapons on the planet and you can't own them?? did I get the wrong message in your post?? I mean in this day and age I can see almost anything happening like that... hell most of the biggest anti gun senators in our congress are from Connecticut where a larg number of our sporting weapons are made...go figger...just wondered...good luck over there !! and remember !" You can always count of the French...when they need you!! opps!  :ignore:


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## CdnMtlHd (Aug 4, 2009)

Vertigo said:


> As far as my own plans, I intend to go to my parents place and bug in. It is not really rural, not really urban, but thats just how most of Belgium is. I strongly believe that for most people, bugging in (staying home) is the most viable and least cumbersome strategy. We will be able to heat ourselves, nourish ourselves, and I am working on providing energy for ourselves. Sadly the biggest thing missing here is being able to provide protection for ourselves. (unless you count the new air rifle I got  ) (btw i'll give a full review of it one of these days.)
> 
> hope this helps,
> 
> V.


When using that air rifle, will it just piss someone off if you shoot it at them or will it do some real damage? Same kind of question regarding hunting with it, will you be able to bring home the bacon?


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## Vertigo (Aug 6, 2009)

HozayBuck said:


> I have a serious question Vertigo
> 
> You live in a country known far and wide for making some of the finest weapons on the planet and you can't own them?? did I get the wrong message in your post?? I mean in this day and age I can see almost anything happening like that... hell most of the biggest anti gun senators in our congress are from Connecticut where a larg number of our sporting weapons are made...go figger...just wondered...good luck over there !! and remember !" You can always count of the French...when they need you!! opps!  :ignore:


Yeah, its a real perversion. We have been at the edge of weapon making longer than most countries exist, yet as far as owning weapons we have some of the strictest gunlaws there are. To be honest there is no one in Belgium who fully understands what all the rules are about, but I'll give a try:

As far as I understand, for every firearm you buy, you must obtain a permit, which is processed by the governor of your province (takes about 6 months). In this request for a firerarms license (it is a request, it can be denied for any reason they see fit) you must also state what you intend to use this firearm for. Once you obtain this permit, it can only be used for that one firearm, if you decide to buy another, the whole process starts again (you can however send in up to 3 (unsure, might be 5 as well) in one single request)

You are not allowed at all any firearms, 1. of an automatic kind, 2. of having a magazine over 10 rounds (exceptions for pistols), 3. of having silencers, 4. modifying the weapon in an extensive way (like shortenening the barrel and such, or installing muzzle brakes), 5. and not anything above caliber .308 (except for hunting rifles, which are usually 2-4 shot rifles). In fact, if there exists a technology to render a certain firearm with a lower round capacity, it will be obligatory.

It is not allowed to carry a weapon on your person (bodyguards can request a permit for this, but in 99% of the cases private citizens cannot). A weapon includes, 1. knives of any kind with a blade longer than about the width of your hand, 2. no pepperspray, 3. no tazers, 4. no switchblades, 5. no batons, 5. in general no concealable weapons of any sort.

There is a permit called a "sportschutterslicentie" which is roughly translated a "permit for sporting purposes" which is for double barrel shotguns (to shoot clays) and for handguns and rifles of caliber .22 or lower. This is easier to obtain however.

Apart from all this, even taking into account the conversion of dollars into euros, firearms in general cost about 2-5 times as much as in the us, with ammo, depending on the caliber (one brick of 50 rounds of .22 for about 10 dollars) to one round of .45 for about 2 dollars.

To conclude, for being one of the best firearm making countries in the world, we are in fact very much screwed. But that is the european way of life (which I do not agree with).

In fact, concerning using a firearm to defend yourself, that is a quick way to land yourself in jail for a year or 10. Even if you were fully justified.

On the other hand, I wouldn't really want the gun laws in Belgium to become much more lax all of a sudden, since 99% of the population here doesn't know how to handle them anyway.

hope this solves some of your questions,

best regards,

V.

PS: I might be off on some of the details, but I got the majority correct, it is just impossible to fully understand them correctly.

EDIT: Oh I forgot, that firearms license (apart from being registred and everything) has to be renewed every 5 years, or you need to turn your firearm in to the police. Even if it is your great grandfathers single barrel shotgun which has been unusuable for 50 years. So many firearms get destroyed by this. By the way, these licenses are not cheap, I do not know exact figures, but I have heard about 200 euros (270 dollars) each...


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## Vertigo (Aug 6, 2009)

CdnMtlHd said:


> When using that air rifle, will it just piss someone off if you shoot it at them or will it do some real damage? Same kind of question regarding hunting with it, will you be able to bring home the bacon?


In most peoples' opinions (like in the US, where you have access to much better defensive options) this is a very poor rifle. However, I am pretty sure it is a very usuable rifle for hunting small game, up to rabbits. There is actually a thread I posted with some info on it:

http://www.preparedsociety.com/forum/f26/new-toy-2252/

I think it is quite usuable for (small game) hunting purposes. Just shot it las weekend, and at a distance of 20 meters (actual 20 meters, I made sure) it shot 5cm diameter groups (2 inches). Make no mistake, I am a complete newbie to shooting and have shot about 40 pellets in total so far through this rifle, so I expect to tidy these groups up much more as I get at least a bit more comfortable with it. (It does have a Bushnell scope now)

greetz,

V.


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## TreeMUPKennel (Jan 29, 2010)

greaseman said:


> Let's face it. There are't too many good scenerios. if you bug out to the outermost boonies, sooner or later, when the towns are sacked, the hordes will come looking, as even an animal isn't stupid. When they run out of food in their homeground, they start searching. just witness the coyotes in many parts of the country. They have come into urban areas looking for food as habitat dimenishes. Humans are no different.
> 
> Many situational judgements will have to be made. The idea of situational awareness will be most important. I think even though problems will come fast, we will get warnings. If the problem is of a human nature, we'll see government forces beginning to mass in urban areas. That will be crunch time. Time to decide whether to stand and fight, or head for plan B. As hard as it is, and depending on how bad things look, for me, getting out may be the best thing. my relatives live in rural GA, about 5 hours away. There is plenty of family, food, and guns. But leaving the homestead would be tough. I don't see leaving grown children behind. I think my daughter with my grandaughter, will realize by that time that maybe all that ranting I'd done wasn't so crazy after all. her husband thinks I'm crazy, and he's one of those"that could never happen" people. Oh well, like I've said before, if I'm wrong, no problem, but if I'm right, I'll at least stand a chance.
> 
> ...


Very true not to many good scenerios, but I agree with you on it. But i do feel that buging out to the out most places you can find or get too will help out alot in a SHTF situation. Me I beleave that the focus of the hordes would be caught up in the towns cities and rural areas. But I dont see them walking the across the tops of MTN's or so looking for folks hidden out. Most I think wouldnt even make it out of the cities or so. To me I see a better chance of survival tucked away hidden somewhere. 
I agree to, too the government thing. Not everything adds up. My wife thinks I crazy too but I tell her its up to use to help are selfs and survive. Nobody is going to come save use.


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## Tribal Warlord Thug (Jan 27, 2009)

damn......Belgium sounds like the state of Illinois......lol


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## katfish (Jan 11, 2010)

My original plan was to stay put but I realized the livestock on the farm would make my family a target if people were starving. I know about half a dozen others that think like I do so with our families there would be about 18 or so of us. We're all preppin individually but also dividing up the load for a group evacuation. With us all buying a few extra garden seeds and tools that helps to ease the financial burden as well as the tactical ones such as guard duty etc. We plan on headin for the hills. Hoping most city folks will miss the forest for the trees, so to speak. I also figure its a lot like hunting on public land the more hills you are willing to hump the fewer people you are likely to see.


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## sailaway (Mar 12, 2009)

Vertigo, how about a crossbow or a sling shot such as a wrist rocket. Wrist rockets have a brace against your fore arm and use surgical hose for a rubberband. Shoot automotive ball bearings from one and it is quite lethal. Both are quite silent weapons, another plus.


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## Vertigo (Aug 6, 2009)

sailaway said:


> Vertigo, how about a crossbow or a sling shot such as a wrist rocket. Wrist rockets have a brace against your fore arm and use surgical hose for a rubberband. Shoot automotive ball bearings from one and it is quite lethal. Both are quite silent weapons, another plus.


Well, to be honest I do not really know how these would be regulated. I know for a fact that you can have a crossbow, they are sold here. But I do not know whether one needs a firearm permit for them or not.

Concerning the wrist rocket, same thing, only problem is I have never seen a place where I could buy one (except as a children's toy). So I do think they are not allowed to some degree over here.

A.


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## sailaway (Mar 12, 2009)

Vertigo said:


> Well, to be honest I do not really know how these would be regulated. I know for a fact that you can have a crossbow, they are sold here. But I do not know whether one needs a firearm permit for them or not.
> 
> Concerning the wrist rocket, same thing, only problem is I have never seen a place where I could buy one (except as a children's toy). So I do think they are not allowed to some degree over here.
> 
> A.


Vertigo, just google wrist rocket and make one. They are fairly simple. they consist of some folded up metal bar, surgical hose and cloth or leather pocket for the shot. They cost 7-8$'s around here.


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## HozayBuck (Jan 27, 2010)

sailaway said:


> Vertigo, just google wrist rocket and make one. They are fairly simple. they consist of some folded up metal bar, surgical hose and cloth or leather pocket for the shot. They cost 7-8$'s around here.


Sailaway is right Vertigo, "AND" just a thought.. back in the 60's in Nam the Spook think tank and the US Special Forces were working with wrist rockets using light weight arrows ( think knitting needles) with broad heads as a small light weight silent sentry removal tool, can't say I know any more about it but I do know that.

I don't know anything about you or your situation but I'd be thinking about what's best for me and mine and to hell with the rule book, stay low, keep quiet and build your own home grown arsenal out of whatever you can.

Remember ! with a bit of guts and a sharp blade you can own a tank!! or Jeep complete with machine gun... but mostly just keep low and make no waves and be ready to grab any opportunity that presents it's self .

Of course I mean in the peaceful, legal sense....:sssh:


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## sailaway (Mar 12, 2009)

HozayBuck said:


> Sailaway is right Vertigo, "AND" just a thought.. back in the 60's in Nam the Spook think tank and the US Special Forces were working with wrist rockets using light weight arrows ( think knitting needles) with broad heads as a small light weight silent sentry removal tool, can't say I know any more about it but I do know that.
> 
> I don't know anything about you or your situation but I'd be thinking about what's best for me and mine and to hell with the rule book, stay low, keep quiet and build your own home grown arsenal out of whatever you can.
> 
> ...


I concur with Hozay Buck. Sail


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## horseman09 (Mar 2, 2010)

Just a thought...While Vertigo is at a disadvantage because of the European anti-gun mindset regarding hardcore defensive situations, there might be WTSHTF situations where the airgun (we call them BB guns or pellet guns) could be very useful. If your only option is to double tap an unarmed but intrusive dude in the X ring with your .357 because you have no other means to send him on his way, you then have a corpse in your yard. Hmmm. Now what? On the other hand, a few rounds from your pellet gun in various body parts will hurt like crazy and probably send him packing. Not a solution for armed villans, but an option to get someone's attention without calling attention to yourself e.g. the police or N. Guard.


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## Vertigo (Aug 6, 2009)

Hi all,

thank you all for your input on my predicament!

Thank you Sailaway, for giving the idea of building a wrist rocket myself. I might just do that some time . It might at the very least make a nice little project.

As far as other weapons that I could make, I already said in another thread somewhere I am not the handiest of people, however my little brother is. He is even stepping things up lately, with making lock-back knives (very rudimentary, but usuable non the less) from scratch. And with from scratch, I really mean so. All he has is some wood, some steel bars and such and his equipment. He is making better knives every time! So kudos to him! In the past we did make some nasty spears, (full metal tip, with hardened point and bendable shaft, mounted on a wooden handle) but thats about as far as we dared go. But that was in our younger days. 

These days I'm grown up enough to know that a little self made knife of spear is not going to impress anyone and surely not the "bad guys". 

Keep in mind that although Belgium has very very very strict firearms rules, there are also a (f-ing) lot of firearms that are not registred here. (Some even say that for every registred firearm, there are another 3 which are not) On the other hand, since Belgium is at the centre of Europe, with lots of immigration going on, there are also lots of firearms being sold and transported over here. The illegal diamond and illegal weapons trade is nowhere as large (comparatively) as in Belgium. 

best regards,

V.


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## HozayBuck (Jan 27, 2010)

Vertigo said:


> Hi all,
> 
> thank you all for your input on my predicament!
> 
> ...


I would expect that after the last great unpleasantness ( WW 2) the folks in Belgium learned something and I would bet there is a lot more hidden away the out in the open... I'd say us folks in the good ol USA could maybe be learning from their problems back then..

Anybody remember the line in the start of the movie "We were Soldiers"? where the Viet Mien fighter asked the officer about the wounded Frenchman laying there, the officer said, If we kill all they send, someday they will stop sending them...bang!...

When they come for anything that belongs to you, they will keep coming back till you have nothing but your life and then.....?? so maybe...just saying ...


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## horseman09 (Mar 2, 2010)

Vertigo, please don't take offense to this because I do not intended to offend you, but: I believe all Americans must remember world history so we don't repeat the mistakes of the Europeans. The European mindset has produced the 3 greatest calamities in the history of mankind, and they still haven't learned. Read the news........they are repeating them. Those greatest calamities were: 1. Marxism. Marxism (Marx/Engles) has killed more innocent people than any other political idology, even far more than the Nazis. Communism continues to kill tens of thousands and still threatens mankind. 2. WW 1. 3. WW2. Americans must remember that freedom is not free. Freedom means a certain level of crime on our streets, but we have a right to keep and bear arms to protect ourselves not only from street thugs but also government thugs. Freedom means tolerating intolerant KKK or Nazi skinhead's speach. It means government cannot solve most of our problems: govenment CREATES them. It means your life is not without risk, therefore it is plush with rewards if you make good decisions and work hard. It means sometimes sending soldiers to war to die to defend our freedom and the world's freedom. In short, it means outright rejection of the European mindset.


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## Vertigo (Aug 6, 2009)

horseman09 said:


> Vertigo, please don't take offense to this because I do not intended to offend you, but: I believe all Americans must remember world history so we don't repeat the mistakes of the Europeans. The European mindset has produced the 3 greatest calamities in the history of mankind, and they still haven't learned. Read the news........they are repeating them. Those greatest calamities were: 1. Marxism. Marxism (Marx/Engles) has killed more innocent people than any other political idology, even far more than the Nazis. Communism continues to kill tens of thousands and still threatens mankind. 2. WW 1. 3. WW2. Americans must remember that freedom is not free. Freedom means a certain level of crime on our streets, but we have a right to keep and bear arms to protect ourselves not only from street thugs but also government thugs. Freedom means tolerating intolerant KKK or Nazi skinhead's speach. It means government cannot solve most of our problems: govenment CREATES them. It means your life is not without risk, therefore it is plush with rewards if you make good decisions and work hard. It means sometimes sending soldiers to war to die to defend our freedom and the world's freedom. In short, it means outright rejection of the European mindset.


No offense taken, I am fully aware that there are a lot of things in Europe which are so crooked, that they are unrepairable. I do however have some remarks on the "three issues" you brought up:

1. communism: true, it was conceived in western europe. However, true communism never really got a lot of support around here, since the roman catholic church had too much of a grip on our lives back in those days. An offspring of this is socialism, maybe that is what you were referring to. Communism/Marxism has only really been implemented in Russia, China and Cuba (+ some various smaller countries) but never really in Europe itself.

2. & 3. You state that WW1 and 2 were calamities because of the European mindset. I beg to disagree there. WW1 was basically a war of the old europe, where wars have been fought with surprising regularity between the three big powers (being, Germany, France and Great-Britain). The fact that WW1 stirred up so much controverse, were the exponential amount of deaths in combat which had not been seen before. Apart from the millions of death, WW1 is nothing more than "the next war" after centuries of warfare between those three big powers.

About WW2: the biggest reason WW2 got started in the first place (or if you follow the logic back in time, why Hitler got so much power) is because of the severity of the claims and obligations that were imposed upon Germany after its defeat in WW1. WW2 could easily have been avoided, had a more humane approach been taken after WW1.

Therefore, I do not believe these are true examples of the (modern) European mindset. These conflicts were pretty much unavoidable because of past history. There are a few more prominent characteristics of the european mindset in my opinion:

1. weakness: for all our grumbling and chest-bashing, the days where the people of europe fought for their freedom are long gone. The modern european cannot (in general) fight for his life or endure hardship in order to confront a government.

2. faith: most people, despite our grumbling about it, have an almost blind belief and faith in their government. Or at least in the system.

3. entitlement: europeans have a strong sense of entitlement. They believe, that from the day they are born, they should have a cushy comfortable life, guaranteed by the government, without any sense of quid pro quo. In fact, most believe that merely being alive is enough of a claim on all the benefits that a government provides.

4. closed: no matter what people or the media tells you, the european people really have a closed mindset. Oh yes, they are open for many different viewpoints and opinions, As long as they are socially acceptable. In other words, people proposing decisions that (although they are just) are going against social equality, will be bashed beyond relief. I will probably have to explain this further, otherwise I might be misunderstood: For example: when a company is in financial trouble, the labour unions will not allow wages to be frozen for a couple of years (let alone being lowered), since this would not be "fair" in their mind. However, if after a few years this company then tells the workforce that a certain number need to be fired, again this is not "fair" to the workforce. They feel they are entitled to their jobs, they trust in the government to protect their claim no matter what and will not listen to anyone who tells them, that the company had no other choice and that they should shut up and stop whining.

I hope this is clear enough for you to understand, if you have a question or a remark (or even a correction ) please feel free to comment!

best regards,

V.


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## UncleJoe (Jan 11, 2009)

Quote: Last edited by Vertigo, Reason; My English

You have a better command of English than many people who use it as a first language. 

Sorry if it's obvious to you or others here but what is your native language?


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## Vertigo (Aug 6, 2009)

UncleJoe said:


> Quote: Last edited by Vertigo, Reason; My English
> 
> You have a better command of English than many people who use it as a first language.
> 
> Sorry if it's obvious to you or others here but what is your native language?


Thanks for that, although I try to write as well as I can, mistakes do happen every now and then. 

I'm from Belgium, from the flemish half of the country. So my native language is dutch.

greetz

V.


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## sailaway (Mar 12, 2009)

Vertigo, your American is much better than my Flemish. Uncle Joe, I've been told by the English that we speak American, not their language. Excusue me while I go for a slash.


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## horseman09 (Mar 2, 2010)

Vertigo, thanks for your reply. It is refreshing to discuss thoughts and ideas with people without the "anger factor". My point regarding mankind's 3 greatest calamities is that they all sprung from Europe and the European mindset of submission to an all-controlling government. That is certainly the basis of Marxism and Nazism. I guess I'd have to ponder WW1 a bit  , but nonetheless, WW1 started in Europe. While it is popular to blame the Treaty of Versailles for Germany's poverty, it should be remembered that the whole world plunged into the Great Depression in 1929. Furthermore, Hitler declared on the first page of Mein Kampf his intentions to conquer Europe, yet he became wildly popular amongst the German people -- very similar to the deity status far too many Americans have attached to Obama. As a side note, lots of prominent Americans were pro-Nazi also: Lindberg & Joe Kennedy to name a few.


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## HozayBuck (Jan 27, 2010)

Most of the problems caused by WW2 could have been prevented by one good man with big brass ones and a good rifle, the biggest problem is that most people see the problem but don't have the guts to stop it... Of course shooting Hitler would have done a lot of good, Shooting JFK not so... so there is a degree of common sense needed but, same for Stalin or Mao or Ho...not to mention many others... is assassination a good thing ? well no... but it can be a tool used at the right time to prevent a complete break down..or it can lead to one... WW 1 was caused by the assassination of that Arch Duke dude, or was it just an excuse? I don't think anybody cared about the fool one way or the other but it sure lit a fire..

I fear we are about to repeat history, and money problems will be the cause, and the World Bankers will get richer and the little people will bleed...as always..... 

I once made a comment about a Jew being different from an Israeli and was kind of jumped on, my reply was that if you threaten a Jew he will turn away and go on about his business and hope for the best, threaten an Israeli and he will shoot you in the head... same people, same religion, different mind set... wonder why?


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## greaseman (Jun 13, 2009)

HozayBuck said:


> Most of the problems caused by WW2 could have been prevented by one good man with big brass ones and a good rifle, the biggest problem is that most people see the problem but don't have the guts to stop it... Of course shooting Hitler would have done a lot of good, Shooting JFK not so... so there is a degree of common sense needed but, same for Stalin or Mao or Ho...not to mention many others... is assassination a good thing ? well no... but it can be a tool used at the right time to prevent a complete break down..or it can lead to one... WW 1 was caused by the assassination of that Arch Duke dude, or was it just an excuse? I don't think anybody cared about the fool one way or the other but it sure lit a fire..
> 
> I fear we are about to repeat history, and money problems will be the cause, and the World Bankers will get richer and the little people will bleed...as always.....
> 
> I once made a comment about a Jew being different from an Israeli and was kind of jumped on, my reply was that if you threaten a Jew he will turn away and go on about his business and hope for the best, threaten an Israeli and he will shoot you in the head... same people, same religion, different mind set... wonder why?


 In the last year, my eyes have been opened up some, as I have had time to see how the world really works. In my opinion, and as evidenced by history, the president is just a errand boy for the elites. His strings are being pulled just like everyone under him. The bankers seem to run the world, and don't really have any allegiance except to themselves. Their god is money, and the accumulation thereof.

Every thing that is happening to us now as a country seems to be because the money grubbers want it that way. No matter what the citizens tell them, they do what they are told by their handlers. The only times things change is when the citizens do so by force.

Just thought I'd remind you at what our government is trying to do on gun control. They are doing everything in their power to remove guns from the picture. They know they can't really do all they want before everyone is dis-armed. The elites will do everything they can in their power to do this. if the constitution gets in their way, they'll use an executive order to shut the constitution out of the problem.

These NWO people, or whateveer you want to call them are evil people. They have one goal, and that is total control of our lives. People are waking up, but I fear it is too late. The plan has been put in motion.

Also mentioned in the previoous post are the wars we have had. The only way for our government to distract us from our problems is to have a war. They will just have to dream up another reason to start one. Seems it doesn't take very much reason to get one going.

I'm just waiting for the next shoe to drop. I hope it will miss my head.


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