# Seizure Of Stores/Preps By The Government



## Davarm (Oct 22, 2011)

Does anyone have the references for specific pieces of legislation or directives that can be cited as authority for the seizure of stores/preps. I know that those who "hoard" food can be identified as terrorist and therefore have their assets seized but I am more interested in what specifically can be used as authority for seizure of food for the express purpose of redistribution.

I feel the need to familiarize myself with legalities and/or directives for this for the future reference. I know their has been talk of the government doing this in times of trouble but I want to know exactly to expect, what they will cite as authority and how to fight it within the system if the need ever presents itself.

I do plan to defend myself, my family and protect my property but I just want to have all bases covered and know exactly what to expect.


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## Jezcruzen (Oct 21, 2008)

Executive Order 10998 gives FEMA the authority to seize all food supplies, farms, etc. Here's a link. Honestly, I have not read it in its entirety.

https://s5-us2.ixquick-proxy.com/do...tpage.com/do/metasearch.pl&mtlanguage=english

The feds do indeed exert some disturbing authority even without invoking an EO. For instance, recently the EPA is threatening fuel producers with huge daily fines for not blending in a certain biofuel into their products. Problem is, this biofuel is simply not available to the producers, but that doesn't stop the EPA.

A friend in the Mid-west recently told me that wheat farmers are not being allowed to hold over any of their wheat crop and use it as seed for the following years wheat crop. They are being told they must purchase "new" seed to plant the next crop. Any wheat retained must be destroyed.

All this sounds bazaar at best. It is not by accident. That is why I am adamant in my assertion that the most immediate danger to our freedom is the enforcement of regulations by tyrannical federal agencies working out of sight of most. Remember, these agencies have been staffed by the "true believers" and radicals chosen by the socialists.


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## Possumfam (Apr 19, 2011)

Jezcruzen said:


> A friend in the Mid-west recently told me that wheat farmers are not being allowed to hold over any of their wheat crop and use it as seed for the following years wheat crop. They are being told they must purchase "new" seed to plant the next crop. Any wheat retained must be destroyed.


This sounds like something Monsanto has it's hand in. Very frustrating!


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## TommyJefferson (May 12, 2010)

Jezcruzen said:


> Executive Order 10998 gives FEMA the authority to seize all food supplies, farms, etc.


Interesting. Thanks.

That Executive Order is from 1962, but it still applies. That's the bad thing about passing 40,000 new laws a year. Bureaucrats can _always_ find some administrative law or policy justification for whatever they want to do.

The basic reality is that the government does not actually need any legal authorization to do whatever it wants after it declares an "emergency".

Witness all the crazy things they did during hurricane Katrina. Witness all the illegal things they did during WWII.

If the government decides they need your tractor-trailer, house, or pond, there is really not much you can do about it.


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## jungatheart (Feb 2, 2010)

TommyJefferson said:


> Interesting. Thanks.
> 
> That Executive Order is from 1962, but it still applies. That's the bad thing about passing 40,000 new laws a year. Bureaucrats can _always_ find some administrative law or policy justification for whatever they want to do.
> 
> ...


I can die fighting for it. If enough people do, the government won't last long. Is there a better way to die than fighting for what is right? Well, maybe shot by a jealous husband............

I have to agree though that the government's seeking to make their stealing legal is becoming a bit comical.


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## survivalist72 (Jan 4, 2012)

I don't know the laws and codes but I know that when I worked with FEMA and other entities we could pretty much take whatever we needed from whoever we needed it from.
It was the job of county officials to provide us with details as to the location of chemical factories, warehouses, food storage facilities, which farmers might have certain machinery, food, water, storage, etc.etc.
It was our job to then distribute such resources as we saw fit.
It was an eye opener to see that we could just come in and take what others had and use it "for the greater good".


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## CulexPipiens (Nov 17, 2010)

jungatheart said:


> I can die fighting for it....


Yes you can and then you're dead and they still end up with it. (not judging, just saying).

Don't make it known what you have. Use cash, no names. Don't leave a trail, etc. Short of busting in and searching they shouldn't know what you have and there shouldn't be a reason for them to bust in. If they do show up, give them a little and complain alot about having to do so... just make sure the rest is well hidden.


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## GatorDude (Apr 23, 2009)

Yeah, you don't want to be ahead of the curve on the fighting the government thing. My ancestors tried that in the 1860's and it didn't work out so well. 

Plus, you might be wrong in your interpretation of laws, directives, and policies. The policy may well be intended to allow the government to seize food in grocery store and Walmart warehouses in an emergency. When the balloon goes up, it's unlikely that $7 an hour Wally World employees will be at their jobs and the National Guard may want to distribute that food to survivors.

I've known people who worked for FEMA and they are just normal middle class people like anyone on this forum. They aren't going to come shoot you for an extra case of pork and beans. Now, if you are riding around with a sword and declaring yourself the king of preplandia, you might get tazed.


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## PopPop (Sep 14, 2010)

Pay cash and be quiet. The men in black can rule without law, codes and directives.


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## Jezcruzen (Oct 21, 2008)

For three years prior to my retirement in '07 I worked exclusively in emergency management for my employer, a medium-sized city.This was during the time when FEMA was ginning up its authority. 9/11 had occurred. So had Katrina.

FEMA had introduced their NIMS (National Incident Management System) document that mandated certain changes in behaviors for emergency responders and a transition to a common procedure towards managing any emergency. It also addressed the planning function extensively, and the training/training documentation issues as well.

Having been caught multiple times previously not being prepared to mitigate large-scale emergencies and disasters, FEMA was intent on pulling everyone in to the new nation-wide system of planning, training, response, operations, and recovery.

Foremost in the planning process was conducting an inventory of regional resources, including government, emergency response, and businesses such as building supply retailers and food sales/distribution providers. We also did an inventory on regional funeral homes and cremation resources for any mass-casualty event. 

Personally, it makes sense. However, anything can be abused. At no time were potential private resources inventoried or targeted. I am not aware of any change in that.


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## Bigdog57 (Oct 9, 2008)

CulexPipiens said:


> Yes you can and then you're dead and they still end up with it. (not judging, just saying).
> 
> Don't make it known what you have. Use cash, no names. Don't leave a trail, etc. Short of busting in and searching they shouldn't know what you have and there shouldn't be a reason for them to bust in. If they do show up, give them a little and complain alot about having to do so... just make sure the rest is well hidden.


There are ways to make sure 'they' do not get it. Then, there are ways to deny them the use of their own homes, businesses, and other assets. The art of taking and destroying assets can work BOTH ways. Just sayin'........ 

Deny the enemy his logistaics, he eventually starves.


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## SlobberToofTigger (Dec 27, 2011)

Jezcruzen said:


> A friend in the Mid-west recently told me that wheat farmers are not being allowed to hold over any of their wheat crop and use it as seed for the following years wheat crop. They are being told they must purchase "new" seed to plant the next crop. Any wheat retained must be destroyed..


We plant a couple of thousand acres of wheat, beans and corn and I have not heard any such nonsense. We will sell about 3/4s of the crop and save over the rest.


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## Davarm (Oct 22, 2011)

Bigdog57 said:


> There are ways to make sure 'they' do not get it. Then, there are ways to deny them the use of their own homes, businesses, and other assets. The art of taking and destroying assets can work BOTH ways. Just sayin'........
> 
> Deny the enemy his logistaics, he eventually starves.


Yes, Bigdog, Thats my line of thought.


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## Davarm (Oct 22, 2011)

SlobberToofTigger said:


> We plant a couple of thousand acres of wheat, beans and corn and I have not heard any such nonsense. We will sell about 3/4s of the crop and save over the rest.


Just because the government is not enforcing such issues now is no reason to doubt that they will not in the future. If a power can be abused/enforced, eventually, it will be abuse/enforced.


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## musketjim (Dec 7, 2011)

I agree with some of the other posts. Pay cash and keep a low profile. Don't talk about it except with your most trusted friends who are on the same wavelength. Be invisible.


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## Jezcruzen (Oct 21, 2008)

SlobberToofTigger said:


> We plant a couple of thousand acres of wheat, beans and corn and I have not heard any such nonsense. We will sell about 3/4s of the crop and save over the rest.


Thats good to hear. My friend lives in Ohio, and I had that conversation with him on the phone a little over a week ago.

Is it possible Ohio Ag. is forcing this on Ohio farmers?


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## Jezcruzen (Oct 21, 2008)

Bigdog57 said:


> There are ways to make sure 'they' do not get it. Then, there are ways to deny them the use of their own homes, businesses, and other assets. The art of taking and destroying assets can work BOTH ways. Just sayin'........
> 
> Deny the enemy his logistaics, he eventually starves.


That was my point earlier. If draconian regulations are to be enforced, the ones enforcing them will have to live locally.


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## SlobberToofTigger (Dec 27, 2011)

Jezcruzen said:


> Thats good to hear. My friend lives in Ohio, and I had that conversation with him on the phone a little over a week ago.
> 
> Is it possible Ohio Ag. is forcing this on Ohio farmers?


When it comes to the federal government anything is possible. But if that is happening they should be banding together and having a judge block it for them. Most of the local judges will either be farmers or from farming families so they would be quite happy to place an injunction against the government.


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## westbrook (Oct 28, 2008)

PopPop said:


> Pay cash and be quiet. The men in black can rule without law, codes and directives.


yes and they are under the guise of C.E.R.T.

I recommend you get involved with C.E.R.T = Community Emergency Response Team

Every city has a CERT and these people will be sent out to a designated zone. They will be checking on people and seeing if anyone needs help. I am sure you can figure out by giving people power what will happen next!

CERT : Community Emergency Response Teams (CERT)

I recommend everyone join... it is better to be on the inside then the outside.

when they say, go gather food from the people, I am like.. first to say, I will bring everything I have! a couple of cans of tomato soup, mac & cheese, a can of tuna and so on.


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## StillStanding (Jan 24, 2009)

Davarm I think there is, in your opening post, an underlying assumption regarding scale that bears closer scrutiny.

I own a grain bin that, typically, contains 12,000 bushels of corn. That's enough food to satisfy the basic caloric needs of 12,000 people for a month. Compared to my neighbors and the larger corporate and cooperative storage and processing facilities my bin is too small to be notable. I do not believe that the government will try to seize my corn in an emergency because it isn't enough food to matter.

In the preparedness community it is rare for people to have a food storage plan that will cover their family for more than 30 days. Perhaps the most prepared might have a one year supply. Even this isn't enough to draw the attention of the government, even in an emergency, even if they know about it. Well, unless you live on a remote mountaintop where the whole town is only 20 people and however much food you have might actually make a difference.

Now, the frozen food warehouse and distribution facility in town that serves half the state? They're keeping track of that.


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## Viking (Mar 16, 2009)

I wish I had gotten the info on hearing about a dried food cannery which I think was in Kentucky where the government came asking for the names of people buying their bulk products, all in the guise of needing to know for emergency supply sources. Probably for FEMA. You got to figure things are getting bad when they go after the Mennonites for raw milk, cream and butter.


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## Ponce (May 3, 2009)

musketjim said:


> I agree with some of the other posts. Pay cash and keep a low profile. Don't talk about it except with your most trusted friends who are on the same wavelength. Be invisible.[/QUOTE
> ==================================================
> 
> WTSHTF and it comes time to feed his kids if your "trusted friends" knows that you have food and he does not he will then be your worse enemy...so keep your freaking trap shut............now then.......if you do have friends who you have told what you have then........hide away "at least" 30% of the food that you do have and tell NO ONE.........coming from Cuba I know what I am talking about............remember that if one knows is then a secret but if two knows it is then no secret.
> ...


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## gypsysue (Mar 27, 2010)

Yes, Ponce is right. I might add that it's a good idea to spread your food and supplies among multiple locations. That can work out good for yourself if something happened such as your house burning down. If you also have food and supplies stored in a shed or other location on your property, you haven't lost it all. If someone comes wanting food, you don't have to expose it all at once in one place.


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## Possumfam (Apr 19, 2011)

I've heard that before, Gypsysue, but I wonder about the temps. How much will that affect what you've stored?


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## BillS (May 30, 2011)

Jezcruzen said:


> Executive Order 10998 gives FEMA the authority to seize all food supplies, farms, etc. Here's a link. Honestly, I have not read it in its entirety.
> 
> https://s5-us2.ixquick-proxy.com/do...tpage.com/do/metasearch.pl&mtlanguage=english
> 
> ...


That executive order was repealed.

1962 Executive Orders Disposition Tables

The fact remains though that our government often ignores the rule of law. After it hits the fan Obama will declare martial law. Our rights will disappear. Still, with all the anarchy and violence it's unlikely the federal government will look for people who stored food.


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## SlobberToofTigger (Dec 27, 2011)

Possumfam said:


> I've heard that before, Gypsysue, but I wonder about the temps. How much will that affect what you've stored?


Put it in a chest freezer set at 55 degrees Fahrenheit. Your preps in the shed will last longer than any of your other stored items...


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## Possumfam (Apr 19, 2011)

AH HA! I just couldn't justify controlled temps (couldn't afford it either.) Good tip!


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## SlobberToofTigger (Dec 27, 2011)

Possumfam said:


> AH HA! I just couldn't justify controlled temps (couldn't afford it either.) Good tip!


A large chest freezer off of craigslist can be very cheap if you keep your eye out and then you either need to install a new thermostat in the freezer or buy a an external beer making thermostat (what I do as I am lazy) to get the temp up to 55 degrees. When used as a fridge the thing uses almost no electricity...


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## gypsysue (Mar 27, 2010)

Possumfam said:


> I've heard that before, Gypsysue, but I wonder about the temps. How much will that affect what you've stored?


The best thing for your food storage is a steady temperature. Food stored in a shed is exposed to the cycle of daytime highs and nighttime lows, as well as seasonal swings (well, maybe not in Florida where you live!  ). When I store food in a shed I put it at the north end, near the ground but on a pallet for circulation, and cover it with lots of old blankets and such, to reduce temperature fluctuations. We live in a climate that's cool even in summer, so it works out well up here. Other options are basements, crawl spaces, and root cellars.

The freezer idea slobber recommended might be fine for people who have grid electricity and don't mind paying a bill for it, however slight, and who only have that much stuff to store. People practically give them away up here. Decent idea, actually.

I still recommend spreading your stores around, even if it's just a few buckets of staples stuck here and there. For a related subject, search "caching" and find out about burying stores, either on your own property or another hidden location. It's another way to spread it around.


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## CulexPipiens (Nov 17, 2010)

SlobberToofTigger said:


> A large chest freezer off of craigslist can be very cheap if you keep your eye out and then you either need to install a new thermostat in the freezer or buy a an external beer making thermostat (what I do as I am lazy) to get the temp up to 55 degrees. When used as a fridge the thing uses almost no electricity...


Here is a good example of a DIY conversion:

Chest fridge


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## CulexPipiens (Nov 17, 2010)

westbrook said:


> yes and they are under the guise of C.E.R.T.
> 
> I recommend you get involved with C.E.R.T = Community Emergency Response Team
> 
> ...


Wow, your CERT sounds a lot different from my local one. They offered the free training and wanted citizens to know for the sole purpose of being able to help yourselves and if you want your neighbors. At the end of the class IF you wanted to join our city's CERT you were welcome to but it was by no means required and I'm not sure anyone in our class actually did. At no point were we "taught" to try to gather food or anything other than essentially making a BOB, basic medical, how to put out a minor (tiny) fire and some light search and rescue.


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## k0xxx (Oct 27, 2011)

westbrook said:


> yes and they are under the guise of C.E.R.T.
> 
> I recommend you get involved with C.E.R.T = Community Emergency Response Team
> 
> ...


About a week into having no power, following a large ice storm, we had a C.E.R.T. team visit and ask what supplies we needed. When we responded that we didn't need anything, their posture change to defensive and their next question was a very pointed "Why not?". At that point I realized that I had screwed up. The first thing that I could think of to answer was that some family members from out of town had heard about the storm and brought us some supplies.

If I'm ever in a similar situation I'll be sure to just reply "What do you have to offer?". I might as well give them the answer they're expecting and not draw any red flags.


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## gypsysue (Mar 27, 2010)

Wow, KO, that was good thinking, the part about saying some family members from out of town brought you supplies! 

This is similar to what I've seen discussed on here before, that if they have lines for getting food, that it might be wise to go stand in line even if you don't need it, so you don't draw attention. If you feel guilty, you can always quietly donate the food to someone else later on. 

You'd think the gov't would be happy some of us thought ahead and will be able to take care of ourselves, but like you pointed out... it just made them suspicious.


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## HoppeEL4 (Dec 29, 2010)

The government is subconciously paranoid. I hold to that, and plan to handle any time SHTF with that mindset, and make sure they have no reason to want anything from me. 

I will not put it past someone higher up to put the word out in an emergency to have local officials in each town, county and state, to gather all the supplies for common good, and this could mean someone locally will decide it warrants seeking out those they knew locally, or got word of, that had a large supply of anything (cattle, chickens, goats, etc..).

Though, my biggest concern would be someone looting locally. Even now theft is on the rise, indicating people who would stop at nothing to get what you have stored up.


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## marlas1too (Feb 28, 2010)

try looking up the new law obozo just signed 12/31/2011---NDAA


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## gypsysue (Mar 27, 2010)

marlas1too said:


> try looking up the new law obozo just signed 12/31/2011---NDAA


Yep... Indefinite detention, etc.

What I'm wondering is... can the next or future presidents undo this stuff? Are we stuck with obozo's dessicration of our nation and constitution forever now? Can it be repealed?

I heard rumors floating around today that Obama wants to bypass congress. Congress and the senate were created by our nations founders to prevent the U.S. from being run by a dictatorship. A president who can bypass congress and make his own rules without accountability or approval?

Not in this nation. I hope. Downright scary.


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## Salekdarling (Aug 15, 2010)

gypsysue said:


> Yep... Indefinite detention, etc.
> 
> What I'm wondering is... can the next or future presidents undo this stuff? Are we stuck with obozo's dessicration of our nation and constitution forever now? Can it be repealed?
> 
> ...


NDAA And SOPA: The End of America?!

The comments on here are quite interesting to read. In honesty, it probably will be hard to get rid of the NDAA now that it was passed. How can we get a case against it with the SCotUS if we disappear or can't have a trial? MEH.


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## trkarl (Jun 16, 2010)

Possumfam said:


> I've heard that before, Gypsysue, but I wonder about the temps. How much will that affect what you've stored?


Check out these video results of long term food storage part 1 and part 2. At the end of part 2 he talks about temps and the effects.

delta69alpha's Channel - YouTube


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## jungatheart (Feb 2, 2010)

gypsysue said:


> Yep... Indefinite detention, etc.
> 
> What I'm wondering is... can the next or future presidents undo this stuff? Are we stuck with obozo's dessicration of our nation and constitution forever now? Can it be repealed?
> 
> ...


Have you seen recent pictures of him? With his gray hair he looks like a caricature of a third world dictator. He even has the perfect wife for the part.

I never would have thought this could have happened in America.


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## Viking (Mar 16, 2009)

gypsysue said:


> Yep... Indefinite detention, etc.
> 
> What I'm wondering is... can the next or future presidents undo this stuff? Are we stuck with obozo's dessicration of our nation and constitution forever now? Can it be repealed?
> 
> ...


This is some of the rumblings I've been hearing, keep an eye open for something to happen around September of this year as it's possible that a false flag situation (like in Iranian waters) may come about and Obama may just claim that due to a national emergency we can't have a presidential election. So, are the caricatures of him with a Hitler mustache very far off?


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## Bigdog57 (Oct 9, 2008)

When the illegal kenyan was being run as a candidate, I truly thought someone was playing a joke, setting up a pitiful 'straw horse' for Hillary to thrash and take the election. Now I have come to realise the aweful thruth - the joke was on We The People. This tinplated Napoleaon-wannabe needs to taken down fron Office. He has usurped the Office of the President, and is slowly making himself King. How long before he has his personal Army in place and decides to abolish Congress?
The Third American Revolution is coming........


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