# Food storage question..



## phxrising (Jun 24, 2012)

When you guys plan your food storage, do you use a set menu or do you pick up general items your family likes, then make meals from them? I'm thinking of trying a set menu, 3 weeks' meals for variety so 21 different dinners, probably about 7 different lunches and we eat the same breakfast all the time. I find if I pick up items we use but don't plan, then I end up all over the place. I seem to have 20 tons of baked beans.


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## ZoomZoom (Dec 18, 2009)

We don't plan the meals. Just have all the things we know we eat.

You can plan your meals but can you really prepare them based on the situation? What if you can't cook in your kitchen? What if the power goes out and you have to gobble up what's in the fridge/freezer and leave the shelf items for later? Lots of situations that can mess up the plan so I don't. It would just be another plan that could fail in your mind but isn't a big deal if you're more open to winging it. 

Don't forget spices and such to liven things up! Then Pepsid to calm things down.


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## rawhide2971 (Apr 19, 2013)

A plan is always going to be better. Unfortunately I follow your tactic much more than a set plan...kind of like a squirrel on crack...lol.....I have a few basics I always stock up on but really need to get better and more focused....


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## Urmomma (Jun 6, 2014)

I wrote a menu plan for 30 days plus ingredients used. There is overlap in ingredients such as meatloaf, spaghetti, and chili all have hamburger, onions and tomatoe sauce. So break your menu up into ingredients. Than count the number of times an ingredient is needed per month. This will help with inventory. You might be able to use beans as a side twice, in chili and stand alone twice in a month. Means u need to have beans on hand 5 meals per month. 

Bet you still use the same ingredients even when adding a new menu item. Spices may change but we seem to like certain foods.


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## Enchant18 (Feb 21, 2012)

I don't write out a menu plan as much as a plan for the long term items. If I am not around someone else has to take responsibility for meals and may not have any clue what to do with hard beans. 
My binder contains an inventory and a suggested meal plan with the recipes. For all the bulk items is a list of possible meals. It is a work in progress.


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## nightwing (Jul 26, 2014)

you'll get a headache thinking that hard.

when everyone is starving or your hungry you'll eat pretty much anything.

Get what you like but then if you ever ate it before and it was OK you need it too.
Diversity in foods is part of moral some things we do not include in our
stores are canned cheese a can of cheese and tomatoes & green chillies 
or chili cheese dogs from Canned hot dogs beef steak sandwiches 
from canned beef slices.
if it is canned in mason jars or store bought tin cans as long as you like it 
have it a variety is better than eating oatmeal 3 times a day.

bread is the staff of life 
I advise people to have 100 pounds of bread flour 100 pounds of salt.
Salt is actually rare in most places and has always been brought in.

30 pounds of rye and wheat oatmeal cream of wheat grits corn meal.
all grains need to be frozen 10 days and left out to come back to room temp before storing them in Mylar bags and then put down in buckets 
If not when you open it they probably be inundated with weevils.

they sell baking soda in 13 pound bags and have a pound+ of baking
powder and a vacuum sealed bag of yeast many pounds of cinnamon
cocoa powder powdered buttermilk powdered butter powdered eggs.

If you cook and bake these are staples that you MUST HAVE in a long 
or severe recession depression or all out craziness your not going to 
be able to go to a store and buy anything.

I have learned from many hurricanes that in 12 hours the shelves are empty no batteries no bread or milk most people forget that half or more of what they have is refrigerated so powdered is mandatory 
even if all you can cook is biscuits and make flour gravy you will be 
much better off than 90% of folks.

I have noticed a decline in people being able to cook from scratch 
anything they have no real recipe books the books today are 
canned cook books ( half of the ingredients are pre mixed or cooked in cans) this makes people think that they do not need powdered 
dairy and eggs because they are already in mixes and canned goods.
the first things that go bad are dairy and eggs so without powdered 
all your going to make is hard tack crackers and with the way most people buy not a hell of a lot of that.
Most people have less than a 5 pound bag of flour that will NOT make 
but a weeks worth of biscuits If your lucky and have a small family.
the other problem you cannot consider leftovers as part of your food source if power is spotty food will not last a day.

figure if you only use a can a week of green beans thats 52 cans a year 
that is over 4 cases ---4X12 is 48.
Me and a friend were talking about food and dried beans came up 
he said most people have no idea how to use/ cook dried beans
I was surprised but the more I thought about it the more i realized 
that that area in the store is only one shelf and like ammo I guess
most people take it for granted it will be there when they need it 
BIG MISTAKE there are not enough dried beans on a standard 
grocery store shelf to supply 1 family for one year.
Imagine if tomorrow the stock market flattens out your money drops in value to near nothing and the prices are 10 times as high.

We live in a just in time replenishment world warehouses for sam's costco and numerous others do not have enough to run on but maybe a week 
and that excludes a lot of things that are parceled out like eggs breads
and milk / dairy products. and cold store items fresh meats.

stockers work around the clock after the last hurricane it took 3 days 
before the shelves had enough in them to make it worth going.
I went after all the BIG EVENTS and found it takes many weeks to restock
No truckers are going to risk life and limb to supply your food.
in less than a day there will be NO food in any major city.
in a 911 event of more far reaching impact like 22 ammo it will be hit and 
miss.
Ask any good commie or fascist in Russia bread lines were common 
all over the old Soviet republic you had to wait in lines for each 
different item meat bread cheese /dairy it happened in south America 
during all the civil wars and military coups and Cuba 
in the middle east it is happening now dodging bullets to go try to find food or medications and does your money have any value or have you worked and gotten a paycheck.

America is the most stable and blessed with every food imaginable 
12 month out of the year you can have anything fresh people are so 
spoiled and don't even know that most everything is trucked in from
1000 to 1800 miles and it is done in such a way that it is seamless
even a small store gets a truck a week 52 time a year.
under NO LOAD china marts and their equals get one a day of certain foodsand most people only shop once a week.

it ends up people have less than one weeks worth of food and if the power goes out even less and how many people do not even have a bath tub 
so were are they going to save water ?
after they empty out the LOW FLOW toilet tank 1 1/4 gallons of water 
and all their pans about another 2 gallons unless the surrounding area is 
stable no replenishment will come.
it took 4 days to get Ice and bottled water here after Rita 

There are perfect storms in history people today are not patient or respectful or as well stocked and knowledgeable as let us say my 
parents much less my grand parents some families have lived in 
cities for generations and have no clue where their food comes from 
or the power fuel time and effort it takes to grow and the massive 
plants and they do not make the cans or jars those are trucked in
from other places and the lids from another.
Every plant has to have exterminators power water sewage and or waste disposal replacement parts people need to have clean clothes 
a vehicle as most live at least 10 miles from where they work 
can you imagine walking 20 miles a day?

What ever your plan it is not sufficient won't last and if not kept 
or stored properly will go bad quickly 

So in answer to your question about a menu I guess it could work 
but if things are so erratic or on us quick or others are desperately
seeking food and water I think it would be hard to find time to 
cook a 3 course meal and the scent would make you look like that 
last person on top of a building in a zombie movie. 

Pass the peach cobbler and I'll have some more ice :laugh: I remember 
when we had to make our own ice who had money to buy it except 
at special occasions.
now it comes out of the door of your fridge like manna from heaven 
and 99% of children do not even give it a thought.


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## Urmomma (Jun 6, 2014)

I'm doing something similar to enchant. How to make baking powder or vinegar, soap or pressure can beans. Most of my family do not cook but a few things from scratch. I have a ton of cook books and family can find their own recipes. I've anylized what we eat using a 30 day menu but the varity is endless with the basic building blocks.


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## weedygarden (Apr 27, 2011)

There certainly are a variety of strategies and if you look around the internet you will see lots of them.

Planning a variety of menus that you know you and your family will eat and replicating them is a great strategy.


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## readytogo (Apr 6, 2013)

*A good menu makes a good kitchen*

In order to save money a menu is always a good idea, especially with a family, all my canning and bulk storage goods are base on what we as a family like to eat, my caning s or mre`s as I like to call them are heat and served meals that with the addition of bread/biscuits or salads make a complete meal and are all based on a menu that we enjoy, whether a shtf situation or a lazy don`t want to cook day a nice dinner is always at the ready. Canning is time consuming and expensive so good planning should be involved, good rotation practices should applied to all stored goods and again, canned only what the family really enjoys based on a good menu or list.


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## Caribou (Aug 18, 2012)

I have my supplies separated into two divisions. The first is my kitchen pantry, this is where I get my daily food items and such. The second is what I call my storage, this is where I refill my pantry from, except for perishables. I then replace and add to storage from the retail stores or the internet.

If I run low in the pantry and I don't have it in storage then I not only purchase for the pantry but additional for storage. Mostly I try to buy enough for storage that I can wait till the next sale. 

I use FIFO (first in first out). Dating each item not only makes the FIFO system work but it allows me to know how fast I am going through an item. I might have a months worth of one item and a years worth of something else. This helps me identify where to focus my next purchases. 

Eat what you store, store what you eat. This keeps things fresh. I keep very little in long term storage that I don't eat now. This is because I don't want to add the stress of dietary changes to an already upsetting situation.


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## nightwing (Jul 26, 2014)

Urmomma said:


> I'm doing something similar to enchant. How to make baking powder or vinegar, soap or pressure can beans. Most of my family do not cook but a few things from scratch. I have a ton of cook books and family can find their own recipes. I've anylized what we eat using a 30 day menu but the varity is endless with the basic building blocks.


vinegar is wine that has been allowed to breath wine you need to have a
air lock to keep oxygen from air out 
an air lock can be a balloon or a P trap affair where water in the bend 
keeps the fermenting gases in and air out.

Baking powder is baking soda 1 teaspoon 
2 teaspoons cream of tartar
( 1 teaspoon optional corn starch to prevent caking}
I would use it as commercial is made this way so when you 
use recipes data it will come out correctly.

collecting air borne yeast is a way our forefathers / mothers 
collected it in a small bowl with a 1/4 cup water outside 
pollen and dust carry it on the wind it depends on color if it viable 
off white light beige is OK black red or orange or any other color NOT.
Use this as a starter some water with flour add the yeast and when it 
ferments the smell should be like yeast it can also be done 
with buttermilk clabbered milk not old as fresh as it can be to have a good 
smell like cottage cheese, I guess whey would work as it carries some of the culture.

I forgot to mention in a previous post 100 pounds of rice look up all the substitutes 
and great things you can make with rice.

I am not a scientist just a man with a plan.


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## notyermomma (Feb 11, 2014)

Personally, I use meal planning constantly in my day-to-day eating. I'm new enough at prepping for the long term that I'm just focusing on easy pre-made stuff for the time being, but that may change. A lot of factors will weigh into that ... I'll just have to see. My suggestion is that you try it both ways, and experiment to find what works best for you. Or even have both things available for the long term. 

My extended family are all foodies who love to cook, and I remember how all the neighbors came out with casseroles when Grandpa died. For us, it was actually an obstacle because we felt obligated to eat them when cooking would have been really therapeutic. The point of which is that we're all unique, and you know what will work best for you. 

In a disaster, as with any other time, you'll probably have days when you're up to cooking and days when you aren't. Know yourself, and give yourself options that you know will be effective.


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## Jim1590 (Jul 11, 2012)

You would not believe how much raman my wife has stored.

We have a lot of canned goods, dry goods, flour, rice, salt. Things like that. Plan on how you can become self sufficient in food. Store seeds. Think about how you can grow your food needs. Really cuts down on the amount you need to store. 

Most important, look at water filtering or storage.


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## Freyadog (Jan 27, 2010)

nightwing said:


> vinegar is wine that has been allowed to breath wine you need to have a
> air lock to keep oxygen from air out
> an air lock can be a balloon or a P trap affair where water in the bend
> keeps the fermenting gases in and air out.
> ...


Nightwing, could you explain the yeast gathering a little more in depth? This sounds like it is something that we should all try. I saw before BBC took off Victorian, Edwardian etc Farms(now you have to pay) Ruth doing such a thing but the program did not go into detail how this was achieved. How long does it stay outside? Where exactly do you sit the bowl? On the ground, in the garden, in the weeds?


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## phxrising (Jun 24, 2012)

You've given me and I'm sure others, some great ideas folks, Thank you!:wave:


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## JayJay (Nov 23, 2010)

Okay, at first I was getting extras of daily meal ingredients as we should be.
Now, my recipe book has gotten fatter and that's also a good thing.
So, yesterday, I just read through parts of it (chicken dishes and beef dishes) and listed what I need (that I don't have already and it's not much) and stocked those items that will stock(of course, sour cream isn't one).

So, no plan, and only foods we eat, unless an added recipe and we like it and it includes all storable ingredients.
Don't forget spices like chili/taco sauce, etc. I make my own now and vacuum seal in a jar and it's preservative free.
So many of my recipes have the same ingredients with one minor change that makes a different dish..like taco or taco soup or Mexican pizza.
I like that.

Again, I'll just go to my recipe books personalized by ....'ME'!!


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## Rooster1984 (Aug 9, 2014)

I never go by a set list but instead grab general things i know i can work with. Rice, beans, bulk items. Always try to find things on sale, buy one get one free, save 20%, ect...


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## nightwing (Jul 26, 2014)

Freyadog said:


> Nightwing, could you explain the yeast gathering a little more in depth? This sounds like it is something that we should all try. I saw before BBC took off Victorian, Edwardian etc Farms(now you have to pay) Ruth doing such a thing but the program did not go into detail how this was achieved. How long does it stay outside? Where exactly do you sit the bowl? On the ground, in the garden, in the weeds?


When I say flour I mean NOT self rising pure or bakers flour bread flour it is called 
by different names but the RISING part is baking powder and not a yeast nor is it 
as fluffy or as good Baking flour allows you to make anything your limited with self rising.

I would place it on a window sill near your garden for my self I am 
going to place a bowl under my blackberries for a night.
collect it before the dew burns off and take it in and try it with 
some warm water and flour if it rises and smells like sourdough
bread success it may take a couple of days as the amount of yeast 
is very small and it takes time to multiply to a sufficient numbers 
if it has a color of any kind or smells bad it could be a dangerous
variety so toss it out and try again in another area.
and you only need a cereal bowl and a cup of water or less
by my understanding many flowers like honey suckle berries
lavender and other edibles even oak trees have a form of good 
yeast I think it comes from the breaking down of the pollen 
a natural rot or decay all we do when we set out a bowl is catch 
them off the wind so the chance of having a good or bad is you don't know till you try.
this method can take up to a week to find out if you have a good starter
you can use what flours you have like wheat white or rye and others 
sugar feeds yeast and you may need to use a teaspoon mixed with a quarter
cup of flour and warm water ( let water set open top on a counter to allow chlorine 
to evaporate takes about 12 hours from an open top pitcher)
fruit and skins of fruit I have heard of buttermilk mixed with flour water and some sugar.
that is the crux of the matter it is those little details that screw you in making 
anything today cities are full of pollution unnatural winds from high rise buildings 
so what works here in the country may not work well or in other areas.

once you have a STARTER keep it in a warm place and in a crock 
I do not know and only guess that a crock is dark and thick enough to 
keep temps level my mother had a crock about a pint in size 
during winter when she baked bread all the time she kept it going.
summer we bought store bread YUCK
all a starter comes from is a cut of dough that has risen placed in a crock 
it has live yeast and increases over night when you take some make a new batch of dough cut some off and place it in the crock and that keeps it renewed / fresh in winter my mother kept it in the oven as it had a pilot 
light it is going to be hard to keep a culture with out a pilot light and or a wood stove if it gets too hot it dies or too cold so moving it was part of 
keeping a culture going but many things can give a similar start 
here is a monograph on the subject of wild and home grown yeast 
http://www.webpal.org/SAFE/aaarecovery/2_food_storage/2a_bread_making/grow_yeast.pdf

in winter months this will not work well or at all as most things die off 
but bottled beer will do the same thing and all it takes is a few tablespoons 
warmed to above 75 and below 100 mixed to a loose dough and allow 
it to rise dry yeast is much more dense so this method takes time for the yeast to multiply.

I hope I answered your questions


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## crabapple (Jan 1, 2012)

nightwing said:


> you'll get a headache thinking that hard.
> 
> bread is the staff of life
> I advise people to have 100 pounds of bread flour 100 pounds of salt.
> ...


This is scary, but true.


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## tsrwivey (Dec 31, 2010)

We have a set list of meals for the month, a few breakfasts, 10 lunches, & 20 dinners. I store all the ingredients for those meals & all that information is stored on a spreadsheet to help me keep track of it. That is how I know I have X number of days/months worth of food. We've planned our regular meals this way for 20 years & it's a very efficient & cost effective way of doing things. I know what we're having for dinner & I know I have everything to make that meal. 

In addition to that set list, I store large quantities of various beans, rice, pasta, sugar, & salt. We have some recipes for those ingredients that we've tried & liked, so I've bought quantities of the spices needed for the recipes but we are still in the process of trying out recipes with those ingredients as the primary ingredient. We don't really count these foods into our "we have X number of days/months worth of food" numbers. They are more of an extreme emergency food store to supplement the food we can produce/hunt/catch/gather/garden. 

Basically, we have everything we need for meals we like & eat regularly. We also have a quantity of food that stores forever but may not necessarily be exactly what we want to eat.


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## BillM (Dec 29, 2010)

If anyone needs the recipe for ice, I have it .


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## readytogo (Apr 6, 2013)

Food storage is one thing and menu is another, menu follows the storage, proper stored food leads to a happy eating experience especially under stress full situations, all of us have different habits and tastes buds, as stated by *notyermomma (The point of which is that we're all unique, and you know what will work best for you.)*.I find that by storing the basic main ingredients (grain, flours, beans, salt, sugar, black pepper, canned meats, dry /canned fruits, lard, oil, baking soda, cream of tartar, cereals, dry milk), I can cook sustainable meals in dire situations and at the same time have ingredients on hand for my daily meal preparations, I also canned my own mre`s like stews, chili, sauces, make my own pasta, bread and desserts. The main idea is to be as ready as you can be with the knowledge you have and space available, the more knowledge the better you will be, and if you read this forum you are on your way all ready, just take whatever you think it applies to your needs, is that simple.


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