# What are they putting in new cars that you don't like?



## Tacitus

I'm looking to buy a car. I haven't bought one in a while. My wife wants a "new" car; I just want a "new to me" car.

What are they putting on the newer cars nowadays that I won't like?

Ignition shut off features if I don't make a payment?
Black boxes that will track my driving habits without my knowing about it?
If I have a satellite radio on it (even if I don't subscribe), does that allow them to access my vehicle (e.g., turn it off, as with OnStar)?

My objections to these sorts of things in vehicles is on principle. For the purposes of this thread, you should assume that _I am a generally law abiding citizen_ (I may speed every now and then, but that is it, as far as I know) and _I pay my bills on time_. My plan is to live out the rest of my years in a very plain vanilla way, by any standard. At the same time, I like being independent, and I don't like anybody looking over my shoulder. I'm sure many here can sympathize with that. I suspect that at the end of the day, I won't worry about any of this. But I'm curious if anyone has any thoughts.


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## Grimm

We have a 2014 Nissan Versa sedan. The base model with no frills. Hell! It only has one door lock on the outside, no trunk release pull and the back seats don't fold down to increase trunk space.


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## Viking

I don't think we'll buy a newer vehicle than the last Mustang built that had a mechanical connection from the accelerator pedal to the throttle body. Truth is we probably won't get anything newer than the 98 Windstar we bought new, I don't really like some of it's electronics, Service Engine light would come on if you didn't tighten the gas cap enough and it had fuel problems until we stopped buying fuel with added ethanol. We are buying a 1991 Toyota pickup that belonged to one of our best friends that died in Oct. of last year, he really took excellent care of it and it old tech FI, no electronics outside of the FI system, he loved it for hauling his bass boat and frequently bragged about how good it pulled the boat and still got good mpg.


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## Jim1590

Tacitus said:


> Ignition shut off features if I don't make a payment? Nope, unless you got bad credit then the bank insists on Lojack which can do that
> Black boxes that will track my driving habits without my knowing about it? Not unless you get Progressive insurance from Flo
> If I have a satellite radio on it (even if I don't subscribe), does that allow them to access my vehicle (e.g., turn it off, as with OnStar)? The radio itself has the satelite. You can remove the factory one and put another in without issue.


Like Grimm, I looked at the 2014 Versa. Didn't have much power to it. I looked at the 5 speed model. Went with a 2014 Hyundai Altima with 6 speed stick. Also the bare bones. Told the dealer, "You know that model you keep around just to tell people that they really don't want that when for a bit more they can have this? Yeah, I want to see that one."

thing handles great in the snow and 40mpg. Can't really complain.

New vs new to you gets you a better warranty. What you think of that depends on you. With my milage every week, my 10 year 100,000 powertrain will be gone in 4 years.


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## Caribou

I don't care for any black box or tracking device. Whether it is onboard GPS/Onstar/XM or the computer that tracks your speed and other driving habits I have no interest at all in driving such a vehicle.


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## Balls004

As a former ASE certified Tech at a GM dealership, it's pretty much all over but the crying as far as having electronics controlling everything. From engine management to controlling your seats, there are more computers than you can imagine in newer cars.

Part of it is that it is the only way that manufacturers can meet the specs from the EPA and CARB, and part of it is that the manufacturers don't want you to be able to work on your own car anyway. A well run service department is a cash cow for a dealer, allowing the dealer to make deeper price cuts on vehicles, and so selling more new and used vehicles.

Most new model cars and trucks have at least 7 to 10 individual computers that report to or are controlled by a main computer. One big EMP burst and we'll all be walking. At least I've got a diesel tractor and a four wheeler with a carb if that happens. If that fails, there's always the horses.


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## LastOutlaw

Caribou said:


> I don't care for any black box or tracking device. Whether it is onboard GPS/Onstar/XM or the computer that tracks your speed and other driving habits I have no interest at all in driving such a vehicle.


Which leads me to this question:
How can "ONSTAR" be disabled if I purchased a GM vehicle that has it in it?


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## Tweto

I think if I was buying a new car the only thing that I would not like is On-Star. The FBI has admitted that they can ease drop through On-Star (with a warrant of course).


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## Balls004

LastOutlaw said:


> Which leads me to this question:
> How can "ONSTAR" be disabled if I purchased a GM vehicle that has it in it?


As far as I know, unless something has changed, simply unhooking the harness connector to the OnStar module will completely disable it without interfering with any of the vehicles other systems. That is about 10 year old information, FWIW.


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## LastOutlaw

Found this on you tube:


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## helicopter5472

Had a 06 Trailblazer I pulled the fuse for the on star out, locked the doors, and called on-star to unlock the doors ... they could not do it. I would do as they said above and disconnect the harness to the box. This will stop any way to listen in or disable your ign at any distance.


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## Grimm

Jim1590 said:


> Like Grimm, I looked at the 2014 Versa. Didn't have much power to it. I looked at the 5 speed model. Went with a 2014 Hyundai Altima with 6 speed stick. Also the bare bones. Told the dealer, "You know that model you keep around just to tell people that they really don't want that when for a bit more they can have this? Yeah, I want to see that one."
> 
> thing handles great in the snow and 40mpg. Can't really complain.
> 
> New vs new to you gets you a better warranty. What you think of that depends on you. With my milage every week, my 10 year 100,000 powertrain will be gone in 4 years.


We have Progressive Insurance. The plug in you are referring to is by request only. We don't have that feature on our policy.


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## Woody

> What are they putting in new cars that you don't like?


Electronic everything! I want to get in the vehicle, give me a KEY. I want to roll the windows up or down, give me a handle. If I want to move the seat forward, there is a lever right under the seat! I want to turn on the radio, give me a knob to turn it on and one for volume. I don't want a touch screen with a million different options, I want to turn the radio on! I don't want a whole shebang for a dashboard. I want gauges with needles on them that tell me something, not idiot lights or warning lights. "Check Engine" means as much to me as "Bad command or file name" meant on the computer. All that fancy crap does nothing for me except make it difficult to solve an issue before it happens. AND... There is all that much more to fix if there is an issue, and that much more expensive too!!!

And plush everything also!! I don't want a Lazy Boy with built in heater and massage in the car, I want a heavy duty vinyl where it will take some abuse. After a fishing trip, I don't want to have to take the car to a "Detailer" to clean, I want to get out a bucket and sponge. They have built so much luxury into them that functionality has been tossed out the window. You don't operate a motor vehicle anymore, you have the driving experience of a lifetime! You don't even have to keep an eye on the road, if you are coming too fast to the stopped car ahead of you, the car will take care of it for your stupid butt!! Some cars even parallel park for you now, I see on TV??? Starting to wander out of your lane while texting? Not to worry! The car will tell you that you are and that another vehicle is right there, no need to even pay attention while operating a motor vehicle! It takes care of all those annoyances for you!!!

I want basic transportation. *I* want full control of the vehicle.


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## Tirediron

I think that most vehicles with OBD II (1996) and up powertrain management have the hard and software for onboard data recorders


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## labotomi

Woody said:


> Electronic everything! I want to get in the vehicle, give me a KEY. I want to roll the windows up or down, give me a handle. If I want to move the seat forward, there is a lever right under the seat! I want to turn on the radio, give me a knob to turn it on and one for volume. I don't want a touch screen with a million different options, I want to turn the radio on! I don't want a whole shebang for a dashboard. I want gauges with needles on them that tell me something, not idiot lights or warning lights. "Check Engine" means as much to me as "Bad command or file name" meant on the computer. All that fancy crap does nothing for me except make it difficult to solve an issue before it happens. AND... There is all that much more to fix if there is an issue, and that much more expensive too!!!
> 
> And plush everything also!! I don't want a Lazy Boy with built in heater and massage in the car, I want a heavy duty vinyl where it will take some abuse. After a fishing trip, I don't want to have to take the car to a "Detailer" to clean, I want to get out a bucket and sponge. They have built so much luxury into them that functionality has been tossed out the window. You don't operate a motor vehicle anymore, you have the driving experience of a lifetime! You don't even have to keep an eye on the road, if you are coming too fast to the stopped car ahead of you, the car will take care of it for your stupid butt!! Some cars even parallel park for you now, I see on TV??? Starting to wander out of your lane while texting? Not to worry! The car will tell you that you are and that another vehicle is right there, no need to even pay attention while operating a motor vehicle! It takes care of all those annoyances for you!!!
> 
> I want basic transportation. *I* want full control of the vehicle.


They even have machines now that will clean your laundry. Geeze... Give me a boiling wash kettle, some lye soap, washboard, and half a days time over this "luxury"


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## cnsper

You definitely do not want to disable the OnStar in a Government Motors vehicle, that is what makes that blue tow button work. See Government Motors is the only vehicle that equipped with this option as a standard feature. Just push the blue button and ask for a tow truck.

Ford and Dodge apparently do not need them.


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## cnsper

As for what I do not like on new vehicles, the electronics. With a mechanical engine, I can fix something that breaks. With mechanical parts it is either broken or not. I had a check engine light come on once so I pulled over and opened the hood.... Yep it was still there so I guess it was a bad sensor... LOL


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## Justaguy987

cnsper said:


> You definitely do not want to disable the OnStar in a Government Motors vehicle, that is what makes that blue tow button work. See Government Motors is the only vehicle that equipped with this option as a standard feature. Just push the blue button and ask for a tow truck.
> 
> Ford and Dodge apparently do not need them.


Maybe, but it is better than what ford did. They just put s heater in the tailgate on all there trucks. This way, your hands do not get cold while it is being pushed home.


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## cnsper




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## ZoomZoom

You drove vehicles of yester-years. Today's vehicles drive you.

I'm looking at new trucks. Thinking of going to a 3/4 ton since most don't have all the cabin gadgetry. A "nicely appointed" _as they like to call it nowadays_ 1/2 ton costs as much if not more than it's 3/4 ton counterpart with basic amenities. All I'm looking for is power windows, locks and a stereo.


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## Jim1590

ZoomZoom said:


> You drove vehicles of yester-years. Today's vehicles drive you.


Not unless you get a stick shift. There are a few still out there.


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## LastOutlaw

Woody said:


> Electronic everything! I want to get in the vehicle, give me a KEY. I want to roll the windows up or down, give me a handle. If I want to move the seat forward, there is a lever right under the seat! I want to turn on the radio, give me a knob to turn it on and one for volume. I don't want a touch screen with a million different options, I want to turn the radio on! I don't want a whole shebang for a dashboard. I want gauges with needles on them that tell me something, not idiot lights or warning lights. "Check Engine" means as much to me as "Bad command or file name" meant on the computer. All that fancy crap does nothing for me except make it difficult to solve an issue before it happens. AND... There is all that much more to fix if there is an issue, and that much more expensive too!!!
> 
> And plush everything also!! I don't want a Lazy Boy with built in heater and massage in the car, I want a heavy duty vinyl where it will take some abuse. After a fishing trip, I don't want to have to take the car to a "Detailer" to clean, I want to get out a bucket and sponge. They have built so much luxury into them that functionality has been tossed out the window. You don't operate a motor vehicle anymore, you have the driving experience of a lifetime! You don't even have to keep an eye on the road, if you are coming too fast to the stopped car ahead of you, the car will take care of it for your stupid butt!! Some cars even parallel park for you now, I see on TV??? Starting to wander out of your lane while texting? Not to worry! The car will tell you that you are and that another vehicle is right there, no need to even pay attention while operating a motor vehicle! It takes care of all those annoyances for you!!!
> 
> I want basic transportation. *I* want full control of the vehicle.


I have a 1972 matching numbers, half finished, running/driving project GTO for sale that fits your description perfectly! Sorry for taking advantage of this post to try to make a sale....lol.


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## LincTex

Woody said:


> Electronic everything! I want to get in the vehicle, give me a KEY. I want to roll the windows up or down, give me a handle. If I want to move the seat forward, there is a lever right under the seat!
> 
> I want basic transportation. *I* want full control of the vehicle.


1978 Ford F-250, NP435 4-speed, 4WD, NP205 transfer case, Cummins 4BTA-3.9L diesel.

I don't even need a key to drive it! If I pull the little rubber plunger from the fuel solenoid out, I have a 100% mechanical injection pump. I don't need a starter & battery, either - - as long as I can park on a hilltop & pop the clutch in third.


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## SRK97

Computers, I'd love to find an old EMP proof truck


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## LincTex

SRK97 said:


> Computers, I'd love to find an old EMP proof truck


Build one.

It isn't that hard to do, really.

.


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## Starcreek

*What are they putting in new cars that you don't like?

*Idiot drivers.* 
*


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## squerly

What do I hate? This.



> Obama bypasses congress: Mandates black boxes in all cars starting 2014.
> 
> We're driving off the fiscal cliff and now Obama's primary concern is the details of the crash. CNS: "_Bypassing Congress, the Obama administration has issued a proposed administrative rule, which if adopted, would mandate the installation of "black boxes" in all automobiles and light trucks beginning in 2014. &#8230; The proposed standard would require automakers to install event data recorders (EDRs) - so-called "black box devices" - to collect specific safety related data in all light passenger vehicles beginning Sept. 1, 2014_."
> 
> The tracking ability of these vehicles has been available for a long time, most people are not aware. Obama is not a leader of the people, why does this surprise anyone? My interest is in the technological aspects.
> 
> Think of these devices as those used in planes. Flight records must reveal all aspects prior to an incident involving a crash, there must be ample memory to track back from that point. Voice recorders for the pilot also must reveal aspects prior to the problem but not the entire flight. Due to limited memory, space is reused to always provide an approved number of minutes. Similar to inventory, it's last in first out.


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## Starcreek

squerly said:


> Obama bypasses congress: Mandates black boxes in all cars starting 2014.https://burstupdates.wordpress.com/...es-congress-mandates-black-boxes-in-all-cars/


This kind of unconstitutional action will not stop until Congress has the balls to stand up to this man. The way it's going, if he's not stopped -- if no one stands up to him -- we are going to have a DICTATOR.


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## squerly

mike_dippert said:


> Are they actually doing it?


It's my understanding that all cars and small trucks built from 2014 and forward have this technology built in, whether you like it or not.


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## Viking

This is why we won't give up our old 89 F-250 diesel 4X4, even though I dislike the Twin Beam front suspension, it's all mechanical except for the glow plug system and even that can be easily changed. The truck has rubber floor mats, no fancy carpeting to deal with, hand crank for windows, dial instruments and I can put monster loads in the bed, many times I've hauled over 5,000 lbs. of firewood, sand, gravel or manure and that's were this truck shines for doing the job we bought it for. I like the older Dodge Cummins powered trucks as well and wouldn't mind owning one, but as it is we're running out of driveway space with the vehicles we already have, thankfully they are all old tech stuff with the 98 Windstar being questionable, but it's great for hauling things we need to keep out of the rain or snow. It's the new vehicles that I really don't want any part of, as I tell people, very few, if any, of the new FWD vehicles will ever become "Classics".


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## Fossil

If it does NOT have glass headlights I have no interest. Anything after that is looney tunes piffle.


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