# Salt



## weedygarden (Apr 27, 2011)

I can't really add much to this video, other than, I do have alot of iodized salt, and I am going to work on getting some good sea salt. I think that in a more stressful time, having good sea salt with all the minerals will be important.

This video is by Sarah, the Healthy Home Economist. She is very knowledgeable about how to prepare food in a way that makes it better for you nutritionally. I have watched many of her videos.


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## Woody (Nov 11, 2008)

Didn't watch the flick, yet.

I had a couple.. 20# bags of sea salt on the shelves? Maybe 25#, don't recall. But a size that was easy to carry or toss around. I just put each one in a garbage bag, sealed it up and piled them on a storage shelf. Never used them but in a situation, knew they would come in handy for lots of things. A 'basic necessity' as far as I was concerned.


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## kappydell (Nov 27, 2011)

Store plenty, you can always use any extra for barter or gifts. Dont forget canning and pickling salt, and any meat curing salts for safe food preservation. I have salted fish at home, works fine, but does take plenty of the white stuff. (And no, you don't eat all that salt, you soak the fish before cooking!)


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## weedygarden (Apr 27, 2011)

kappydell said:


> Store plenty, you can always use any extra for barter or gifts. Dont forget canning and pickling salt, and any meat curing salts for safe food preservation. I have salted fish at home, works fine, but does take plenty of the white stuff. (And no, you don't eat all that salt, you soak the fish before cooking!)


As stated in the video, people were once paid in salt. It's value was like gold.

Sam's Club has 25 pound bags (or did) for less than $5.00. I have not looked at it lately, but will check it out the next time I go.

I have bought white sea salt, and evidently that is not the kind to buy either. I am going to have to get on a mission of figuring out where to get a good deal on good sea salt. Most of the good stuff is pricey.


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## BillS (May 30, 2011)

If you want sea salt you could "Instant Ocean" for the salt water aquarium. I'm sure it's cheaper than the stuff for your table.

I'm not a believer in the nutritional benefits of sea salt. It seems to me that you could take a multi-vitamin, use regular salt, and do just as well.


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## Genevieve (Sep 21, 2009)

The Sam's club I have to go to only has regular iodized salt in 4lb boxes. It *was *.99 a box but I haven't looked lately. It might've gone up.

I don't know when precisely but a couple of years back I read where you can just use *plain* salt for canning and pickling and brine-ing. And "pickling" salt is expensive as all get out around here for just a 3lb bag of the stuff


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## crabapple (Jan 1, 2012)

We use the Pink salt from Himalayan.


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## AmmoSgt (Apr 13, 2014)

Different salts for different purposes .. IMHO you need some iodized salt for the goiter thing.. unless you live on the coast and eat a lot of seafood.. but you will want non iodized salt for canning and pickling.. I got nothing against pickling salt it doesn't have iodine or anti caking agents , but other than that nothing special.

There is a lot of confusion about pink salts.. there are two kinds.. the Himalayan which is just salt and then there is the Prague type pink salts with sodium nitrate added for curing meats . You use a small amount of Prague salt ( there are two kinds differing in the amount of sodium nitrite Type 1 or sodium nitrate and sodium nitrite type 2 the sodium nitrate or nitrite is about the only way to prevent botulism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curing_salt.

use iodized table salt for table salt use plain salt for pickling and curing meats and sausage with a little of the prague or pink curing salts as called for by the recipe .

You can get as fancy s you want salt is salt you need some iodine to prevent goiter and you need some sodium nitrate/ nitrite to prevent botulism .. everything else is cosmetic or convenience the finer the grind the faster it dissolves anti caking agent just keeps it from clumping so you can use it in a salt shaker a few grains of rice do the same thing .. heat the water also speeds dissolving. The thing most folks seem to underestimate is how much salt they are going to need for curing here is an excellent article that really gets into salt and curing http://amazingribs.com/tips_and_technique/curing_meats.html


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## crabapple (Jan 1, 2012)

Himalayan pink salt has 84 minerals & elements, so it is not just(Na Cl) salt.

Below is a spectral analysis of Himalayan pink salt as it is typically found. The list shows all the trace minerals, electrolytes, and elements contained in Himalayan salt. Himalayan pink rock salt is popular among health food advocates who seek it for the nutritional value of its fairly abundant trace minerals.

Element	Ion	Atomic #	Concentration	Method/Source
Hydrogen	H	1	0.30 g/kg	DIN
Lithium	Li	3 0.40 g/kg	AAS
Beryllium	Be	4	<0.01 ppm	AAS
Boron	B	5	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Carbon	C	6	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Nitrogen	N	7	0.024 ppm	ICG
Oxygen	O	8	1.20 g/kg	DIN
Fluoride	F	9	<0.1 g	Potentiometric
Sodium	Na	11	382.61 g/kg	FSM
Magnesium	Mg	12	0.16 g/kg	AAS
Aluminum	Al	13	0.661 ppm	AAS
Silicon	Si	14	<0.1 g	AAS
Phosphorus	P	15	<0.10 ppm	ICG
Sulfur	S	16	12.4 g/kg	TXRF
Chloride	Cl	17	590.93 g/kg	Gravimetric
Potassium	K	19	3.5 g/kg	FSM
Calcium	Ca	20	4.05 g/kg	Titration
Scandium	Sc	21	<0.0001 ppm	FSK
Titanium	Ti	22	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Vanadium	V	23	0.06 ppm	AAS
Chromium	Cr	24	0.05 ppm	AAS
Manganese	Mn	25	0.27 ppm	AAS
Iron	Fe	26	38.9 ppm	AAS
Cobalt	Co	27	0.60 ppm	AAS
Nickel	Ni	28	0.13 ppm	AAS
Copper	Cu	29	0.56 ppm	AAS
Zinc	Zn	30	2.38 ppm	AAS
Gallium	Ga	31	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Germanium	Ge	32	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Arsenic	As	33	<0.01 ppm	AAS
Selenium	Se	34	0.05 ppm	AAS
Bromine	Br	35	2.1 ppm	TXRF
Rubidium	Rb	37	0.04 ppm	AAS
Strontium	Sr	38	0.014 g/kg	AAS
Ytterbium	Y	39	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Zirconium	Zr	40	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Niobium	Nb	41	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Molybdenum	Mo	42	0.01 ppm	AAS
Technetium	Tc	43	Unstable artificial isotope	N/A
Ruthenium	Ru	44	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Rhodium	Rh	45	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Palladium	Pd	46	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Silver	Ag	47	0.031 ppm	AAS
Cadmium	Cd	48	<0.01 ppm	AAS
Indium	In	49	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Tin	Sn	50	<0.01 ppm	AAS
Antimony	Sb	51	<0.01 ppm	AAS
Tellurium	Te	52	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Iodine	I	53	<0.1 g	Potentiometric
Cesium	Cs	55	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Barium	Ba	56	1.96 ppm	AAS/TXR
Lanthanum	La	57	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Cerium	Ce	58	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Praseodymium	Pr	59	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Neodymium	Nd	60	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Promethium	Pm	61	Unstable artificial isotope	N/A
Samarium	Sm	62	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Europium	Eu	63	<3.0 ppm	TXRF
Gadolinium	Gd	64	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Terbium	Tb	65	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Dysprosium	Dy	66	<4.0 ppm	TXRF
Holmium	Ho	67	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Erbium	Er	68	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Thulium	Tm	69	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Ytterbium	Yb	70	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Lutetium	Lu	71	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Hafnium	Hf	72	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Tantalum	Ta	73	1.1 ppm	TXRF
Wolfram	W	74	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Rhenium	Re	75	<2.5 ppm	TXRF
Osmium	Os	76	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Iridium	Ir	77	<2.0 ppm	TXRF
Platinum	Pt	78	0.47 ppm	TXRF
Gold	Au	79	<1.0 ppm	TXRF
Mercury	Hg	80	<0.03 ppm	AAS
Thallium	Ti	81	0.06 ppm	AAS
Lead	Pb	82	0.10 ppm	AAS
Bismuth	Bi	83	<0.10 ppm	AAS
Polonium	Po	84	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Astatine	At	85	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Francium	Fr	87	<1.0 ppm	TXRF
Radium	Ra	88	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Actinium	Ac	89	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Thorium	Th	90	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Protactinium	Pa	91	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Uranium	U	92	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Neptunium	Np	93	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Plutonium	Pu	94	<0.001 ppm	FSK
Visit Us!


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## weedygarden (Apr 27, 2011)

Thank you for this list. I wonder if all of these are found in your one a day vitamin?



crabapple said:


> Himalayan pink salt has 84 minerals & elements, so it is not just(Na Cl) salt.
> 
> Below is a spectral analysis of Himalayan pink salt as it is typically found. The list shows all the trace minerals, electrolytes, and elements contained in Himalayan salt. Himalayan pink rock salt is popular among health food advocates who seek it for the nutritional value of its fairly abundant trace minerals.
> 
> ...


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## AmmoSgt (Apr 13, 2014)

yeah . I get that about Himalayan salt and I question the health benefit of plutonium, uranium, Thorium, Cesium.. ect. but that's me.. you do you..

but the main point is , while curing salts are often called pink salts .. Himalayan pink salt is not a curing salt .. Botulism is a funny organism .. it'll kill you.. but sodium nitrate kills botulism and it is one of the few things that does, and that is the important ingredient in any curing salt.

you can cure meats using Himalayan pink salt in place of the regular salt in the recipe .. but it is not a replacement for curing salt ..

Everybody is responsible for their own cured meats , canned goods ect.. I don't shoot other folks reloads and I don't eat strangers home canned good. nothing personal just a rule I have. Y'all do what you think is best.

just a fun fact .. but the cesium and plutonium kind of gives the game away both are so rare in nature that you can be almost certain that if you encounter any it is fallout from some of the 2000 atmospheric nuclear tests... in fact it is almost impossible to consider plutonium a natural anything.. it is created in suns like Uranium , but uranium has a half life of 4.5 billion years , the approximate age of the earth .. so about half the uranium hat was part of the universal debris that formed the planet is still around .. Plutonium is 24,110 years, any stellar debris more than likely decayed back to uranium 94 Pu 239 minus an alpha particle 2alpha 4 equals 92U235 just traveling thru space to help make earth , but assuming some survived the age of the earth argues against natural plutonium still existing.. However we made hundreds or tons of the stuff for nuclear weapons and a nuke only holds together long enough to use 5-10% of the fissile material so what is in your salt is recent fallout just like any of the radioactive cesium in existence comes from splitting uranium , either in a bomb or a reactor ... between reactor accidents and atmospheric testing we have increased background radiation 6 fold since 1945 http://www.agreenroadjournal.com/2014/03/background-radiation-has-increased-600.html


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## crabapple (Jan 1, 2012)

AmmoSgt said:


> yeah . I get that about Himalayan salt and I question the health benefit of plutonium, uranium, Thorium, Cesium.. ect. but that's me.. you do you..
> 
> but the main point is , while curing salts are often called pink salts .. Himalayan pink salt is not a curing salt .. Botulism is a funny organism .. it'll kill you.. but sodium nitrate kills botulism and it is one of the few things that does, and that is the important ingredient in any curing salt.
> 
> ...


You made a blanket statement about Himalayan salt.
That is what I addressed. 
I use pickle & curing salts, but I addressed the statement on one salt.
Sorry if I hurt your feelings, just letting the facts to stand on their on.


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## AmmoSgt (Apr 13, 2014)

weedygarden said:


> Thank you for this list. I wonder if all of these are found in your one a day vitamin?


 per my recent post.. ahh.. NO... nobody knowingly takes heavy metal poisons and radioactive substances .. they may be present in Himalayan salt in quantities to low to be regulated, too low to be presumed to cause harm .. but some of that stuff , like cesium and plutonium are seen by the body as elements like calcium used to build strong bones as they say.. and once part of the structure of a bone they stay in the body .. the more H salt you use the more they build up .. to what level hard to say. strontium is kind of bad like that read this http://www.radiation.org/projects/tooth_fairy.html


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## AmmoSgt (Apr 13, 2014)

crabapple said:


> You made a blanket statement about Himalayan salt.
> That is what I addressed.
> I use pickle & curing salts, but I addressed the statement on one salt.
> Sorry if I hurt your feelings, just letting the facts to stand on their on.


aahh the H salt is just salt thing... didn't hurt my feelings what people put in their body is none of my business. And trying to argue against any health food fad or miracle cure is pointless, folks are going to believe what they are going to believe..
I just didn't want Himalayan pink salt confused with curing salt.

Like most of these kind of things, marketing got out in front and sold folks long before any counter arguments were really presented .. pointless now to argue science or facts, it's a matter of faith now for some folks .. probably won't hurt you (* with the caveat that I have already mentioned concerning the trace amounts of radioactive contamination and heavy metals), and if you can afford it.. why not


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## timmie (Jan 14, 2012)

i have alot of table salt ,so i;m going to start buying non iodized salt for canning


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## crabapple (Jan 1, 2012)

timmie said:


> i have alot of table salt ,so i;m going to start buying non iodized salt for canning


We who grow a lot of our food, do not need a lot of iodized anything.
With greens,vegetable,fruits like blueberries,blackberries,pears,fig & root crops.
We get a good balance of what we need.


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## AmmoSgt (Apr 13, 2014)

crabapple said:


> We who grow a lot of our food, do not need a lot of iodized anything.
> With greens,vegetable,fruits like blueberries,blackberries,pears,fig & root crops.
> We get a good balance of what we need.


None of the foods you mention are listed as being a source of Iodine https://www.healthaliciousness.com/articles/natural-foods-high-in-iodine.php being blue or purple doesn't mean it has iodine

Maybe about 12 boiled eggs a day ... and we might want to review the consequences again of low Iodine ..

Diets deficient in iodine increase the risk of retarded brain development in children (cretinism), mental slowness, high cholesterol, lethargy, fatigue, depression, weight gain, and goiter: a swelling of the thyroid gland in the neck.

And the conspiracy doesn't stop there.. the evil governmental forces are lacing milk with Vitamin D http://www.webmd.com/diet/guide/vitamin-d-deficiency#1 most common is rickets but also Symptoms of bone pain and muscle weakness can mean you have a vitamin D deficiency. However, for many people, the symptoms are subtle. Yet, even without symptoms, too little vitamin D can pose health risks. Low blood levels of the vitamin have been associated with the following:
Increased risk of death from cardiovascular disease
Cognitive impairment in older adults
Severe asthma in children
Cancer

and you don't even want to know what they have done to our bread https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wonder_Bread

they add vitamin C to some foods because of scurvy Arrgggh itch like a pirate

Every vitamin and mineral listed on the side on a food package has an associated endemic disease that once plagued mankind if folks didn't get enough.

this is one of the wonders of science the discovery that certain diseases are caused by certain dietary deficiencies.. the diseases, once really scary, and that killed or maimed or mentally retarded million of people, and still do in some parts of the world, not only don't exist here, they are unknown here now.

Some even say it played a big part in American history http://civilwartalk.com/threads/hard-tack-corn-pone-and-pellagra.108057/ http://www.georgiaencyclopedia.org/articles/science-medicine/pellagra basically the South may have lost the Civil War simply because when the Whiteman stole corn from the Native Americans, he didn't steal the secret of the Corn that made it a healthy food. Talk about Montezuma's Revenge.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nixtamalization 




the magic ingredient in nixtamalization http://www.truevalue.com//catalog/p...-44622122499&gclid=CKXzmYic1NACFUQdgQodqoMHKg

it might be worth noting here that about 90% of all the corn grown in America is field corn aka dent corn and it is grown as chemical stock for industrial processes ranging from ethanol to plastics to corn syrup and finally the leftovers from processing animal feed. the other 10% is sweet corn and popcorn Knowing the magic formula means all the corn grown can be healthy food.


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## crabapple (Jan 1, 2012)

ut 282,000 results (0.80 seconds) 
Search Results
Best Raw Vegan Sources of Iodine
Potatoes, 1 medium, 60mcg.---- -Root crop
Prunes, 5 whole, 13mcg.---- - Fruit
Bananas, 1 medium, 3mcg.
Corn, ½ cup, 14 mcg. ---- -vegetable
Cranberries, 4 ounces, 400mcg.---- -berries
Green beans, ½ cup, 3mcg.---- -vegetables
Strawberries, 1 cup, 13 mcg.---- -berries
Sea Vegetables. Kelp, 7 grams or ¼ oz., 3170mcg. Alaria, 7 grams or ¼ oz., 1162mcg

Tired of this seesaw :surrender:


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## AmmoSgt (Apr 13, 2014)

Okay wasn't trying to stress you as long as you get 150 mcg I don't care where folks get it.. LOL it's not like I have anything to do with the consequences.

If there is a shtf of some kind and folks have to find their own food, there is not going to be somebody making sure the basic diet contains what folks need to avoid deficiency diseases. It will be up to the individual.

History shows us without all sorts of supplementation people get sick, or lose mental function and often die. The more folks know what the critical nutrients are and what food sources have them and internalize their personal responsibility to get those key nutrients especially parents of young children. The happier and healthier everybody will be... it's like trash and waste disposal and hygiene if it gets done right everybody lives .. if it gets done wrong more folks die of disease than combat.

All this has been automagically been made so invisible and automatic many folks don't realize the deliberate need and significant consequences .. it isn't anything anybody has had to really think about for two to a few generations .. you wash your hands before and you wash your plates after each meal or you die .. right now there is absolutely nothing stopping anybody from doing that without thinking.. under field conditions, likely without plumbing maybe even without soap washing and then dipping your plates in boiling water ( we just put them in the dishwasher and turn it on) could easily fall out of practice.. in the old days we had religious requirements or rituals.. and if you didn't do the rituals the Gods made you sick .. About a million kids die around the world for lack of clean water and basic hygiene .. In India last election the one of the major campaign promise was more bathrooms and toilets about 140,000 kids die every year just because of the lack of basic hygiene , major cause of rape and violence against women, is women having to go alone, often at night, out into the fields or forest to relieve themselves because they don't have access to private or public toilets. We take so much for granted. Civilization/ public health/ clean food laws .. Look at China all sorts of food adulteration , some of it even got exported to here melamine in baby formula dog cookies that kill our pets .. The Chinese, try as they may, have to live with some degree of that as they struggle to get basic public health laws and the means to actually observe them in place.

I'm talking real survival issues here .. things we don't have to think about and that we have lost all reference of the importance of. Don't see a whole lot of insistence on the importance of it.. it will kill more folks than the armed gangs our FPS games or Zombie TV shows that shape how so many seem to see a dystopian shtf future. easier to see ourselves dying because a Zombie is eating our brain than dying in a ditch crapping ourselves to death from Typhus or food poisoning from E.coli just because somebody dropped the deer on the ground while they were field dressing it and then didn't use a meat thermometer to ensure it was properly cooked and served to their family and killed half their own kids. How many bug out bags have proper dressing and slaughtering tools, disinfectant for them, and a meat thermometer .. but you can bet for sure the Great White Hunter has gun and ammo and is going to live off the land , here, hold my beer, watch this.

Ahh an idyllic hike thru the greenwood a bountiful blueberry bush ..( that the birds have been perching on while they eat blueberries and relieving themselves on the berries below ..) wouldn't a handful be a tasty treat http://www.rodalesorganiclife.com/food/veggie-wash lots of talk about brewing your own beer or making apple jack or even distilling your own mash.. you can make vinegar the same basic way and just as easy and often from the same ingredients. Lets talk making wine instead ... okay...

https://www.motherearthnews.com/real-food/homemade-vinegar-zmaz71ndzgoe

http://www.offthegridnews.com/off-grid-foods/making-vinegar-from-scratch/

http://makezine.com/2010/03/12/in_the_kitchen_with_jarod_make/

https://www.amazon.com/s/?ie=UTF8&k...targid=kwd-41628779844&ref=pd_sl_78tw237emt_b


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## ClemKadiddlehopper (Aug 15, 2014)

A lot of time is spent regurgitating stuff , all technically true, but I will lay odds there is not a lot of _worldly _experience involved in coming to many of your conclusions and I dare say, it will limit your ability to survive if we all have the misfortune of the world coming apart at the seams to an extreme degree.

I bolded the numerous ways we are all gonna die but for me, your argument comes down to what I have come to expect from "years of government training". 
Some real life risk analysis with numbers that are not cherry picked for a particular agenda would be helpful but most likely impossible to obtain on the internet.

I guess I can expect one less for dinner when SHTF; after all, I practise the five second rule. Get up close and personal with some of the dirt in your environment or *it will kill you for sure* when you run out of ammunition to fight it.

Sixteen years living overseas, Venezuela, Egypt, and Indonesia and the people who were medevaced out were the clean freaks.



AmmoSgt said:


> Okay wasn't trying to stress you as long as you get 150 mcg I don't care where folks get it.. *LOL it's not like I have anything to do with the consequences. *
> 
> Than, what is the point of your argument? We all argue with a view of influencing someone.
> 
> ...


I sincerely hope that no one ever has to live in the real world pre or post SHTF. People are so afraid of their food these days that they will transition to vat food very nicely. What happens when the vats dry up or someone doesn't wash their hands just once before stirring the sterile pot? If SHTF, self sufficiency is the name of the game and I can tell that there are very few people on this site that are getting their information from real life experiences.

Unless we all live like the bubble boy with no human contact at all or contact with non sterilized materials *we are all going to die *from something or other. Its how you live that counts. The need for absolute cleanliness isn't sustainable nor livable in the long run. I sure hope the good people at the USDA don't go around kissing their kids and the family dog without rinsing before and after. Check out the latest stats about cell phone filth. Our immune systems were designed for the environment we live in. If we don't use it, it will use us.

Back on topic: SALT

I store a ton of non-iodized course salt with no other additives. This is it's most useful form for food preservation and tanning ecetera. You can use iodized salt (usually has anti-caking agents as well) for canning but the appearance of the food won't be as nice and there is the danger of too much iodine.
Simple solution: store several types of salt and forget about it. Pick your poison for the task at hand.


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## AmmoSgt (Apr 13, 2014)

ClemKadiddlehopper said:


> A lot of time is spent regurgitating stuff , all technically true, but I will lay odds there is not a lot of _worldly _experience involved in coming to many of your conclusions and I dare say, it will limit your ability to survive if we all have the misfortune of the world coming apart at the seams to an extreme degree.
> 
> I bolded the numerous ways we are all gonna die but for me, your argument comes down to what I have come to expect from "years of government training".
> Some real life risk analysis with numbers that are not cherry picked for a particular agenda would be helpful but most likely impossible to obtain on the internet.
> ...


yeah.. I'm new here, and I haven't yet build any credibility .. but as you point out a lot of technical correctness ... I happen to have some actual field experience , like you I made a career of the military and did my time overseas 12 years and some of that in third world less than antiseptic places .. but I am not actually relying on that.. when I got out I spent three years working with the homeless right here in America,, primarily interested in getting vets out from under bridges getting them hooked up with VA and lawyers and other community services and when we could verify records, getting them their benefits.. not that all of them wanted them. I've actually seen and dealt with folks that were displaying the mental confusion, anger, and health issues from a borderline diet and have seen the complete personality changes that come from a fixed place of residence and an adequate diet.. the changes that come from hopelessness and depression being changed from just getting basic health care and good food. It's the NCO in me and my thing about field sanitation and just taking care of the troops.

Clem, You seem to be confusing the hazards of contagious disease and systemic dietary deficiency. And you seem to be forgetting that while we are healthy and our immune system is not overly stressed, the bugs on a cell phone are nowhere near the threat they are to somebody that is sleeping rough and dumpster diving. Here is my recommendation for those that wonder about my credibility or credentials.. take an afternoon, think of it as training or field experience, go visit a homeless camp or two.. and drop by a homeless clinic and talk to the folks that work there and ask them about what they are treating.. there is probably one in your town or county ,you shouldn't have to go far.. take any extra coat or blankets you don't need any more. a couple packs of smokes , maybe have a half dozen over for Christmas dinner or thanksgiving .. even ones that live in shelters, the regulations and rules in the shelters are in some resident's opinion are bit repressive.. just getting to kick back maybe have something to drink inside where it is warm can be quite a treat ..let them get a shower have some first aid stuff because there will be skin sores and ulcers, offer to do some laundry if you have a machine, make day of it... Most of what "illness" they have won't be contagious unless you run into some TB cases, most of it will be deficiency based . Some of the presumed intoxication will not be from alcohol or drugs.. that's the niacin deficiency.. and yes probably made worse by alcohol and drugs because they do self medicate. Find out how those shelters work.. they hire the residents out at $10 an hour more less depending as day labor and charge them room and board, the lucky get to keep maybe $3 an hour maybe $4 . If you have a military background, and know field sanitation, look at how the camps are run.. maybe you can suggest an improvement or two.. I bet, if you ever make second visit, you take your own hand sanitizer.

Don't take my word for it.. check it out .. Clem is right, hygiene in the field is hard, at times it doesn't even seem practical ,, it takes either amazing self discipline or strong leadership, neither common in a homeless camp, but sometimes they will surprise you and it is usually a vet living in the camp making what little happens in that regard happen. .. heck it takes some serious political skill and salesmanship to wrangle a couple blue portable toilets and (here's the hard part) get them serviced regularly ( tip use the public health angle , the protecting the public approach.. asking folks to actually do something like that for the homeless themselves doesn't seem to work real well, been there done that got half a roll of toilet paper for my troubles )

The good solid citizen preppers on here , I am sure, will run a better camp or shelter come shtf, show greater self discipline , have nowhere near the same problems and issues, but just in case, maybe as a matter of self motivation.. check out a homeless camp or two.

I probably should mention I did most of my in the Field work back in the late 1980's early 1990's .. thing did get a little better for the veterans after the first gulf war.. but the camps and the vets are still out there


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## crabapple (Jan 1, 2012)

ClemKadiddlehopper said:


> Unless we all live like the bubble boy with no human contact at all or contact with non sterilized materials *we are all going to die *from something or other. Its how you live that counts. The need for absolute cleanliness isn't sustainable nor livable in the long run. I sure hope the good people at the USDA don't go around kissing their kids and the family dog without rinsing before and after. Check out the latest stats about cell phone filth. Our immune systems were designed for the environment we live in. If we don't use it, it will use us.
> 
> Back on topic: SALT
> 
> ...


I do not have a ton yet, but I do need to get some different types of salt.
Here in South Carolina, a person can eat half what they need out of the field year a round. So canning is mostly for the bad years. A well stock garden & orchard, as well chicks, ducks,rabbits,pigs & milk cow should be most of what a person would need.
My DW worked as a lab tec for 20 years & as a teacher for 10 years. My mother taught us to can & freeze, you guys taught me about drying foods. I worked in a food plant for 34 years & they drive food safety in ones thick head.
One of the big deals are the big 8 for allergens & to clean your shoe before entering a food processing room(or home living area). Salt could be used for that, but I would remove out door shoes & wear indoor shoes to manage the
clean area, for a safer after the fall way of live.


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## AmmoSgt (Apr 13, 2014)

crabapple said:


> I do not have a ton yet, but I do need to get some different types of salt.
> Here in South Carolina, a person can eat half what they need out of the field year a round. So canning is mostly for the bad years. A well stock garden & orchard, as well chicks, ducks,rabbits,pigs & milk cow should be most of what a person would need.
> My DW worked as a lab tec for 20 years & as a teacher for 10 years. My mother taught us to can & freeze, you guys taught me about drying foods. I worked in a food plant for 34 years & they drive food safety in ones thick head.
> One of the big deals are the big 8 for allergens & to clean your shoe before entering a food processing room(or home living area). Salt could be used for that, but I would remove out door shoes & wear indoor shoes to manage the
> clean area, for a safer after the fall way of live.


Crabapple .. something you said can't remember what, but before I forget again have you seen this book.. I just got it and kind of flipped thru the pages looks pretty good https://www.hamiltonbook.com/Garden...denseal-and-other-woodland-medicinals-revised

apologize for the interuption


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## azrancher (Jan 30, 2014)

crabapple said:


> I do not have a ton yet, but I do need to get some different types of salt. I would remove out door shoes & wear indoor shoes to manage the clean area.


That's a good idea on the shoes, the Japanese have that one right. Different types of salt, nope, you only need *SALT*, you probably will get enough iodine from the garden vegetables that you grow, just plain *SALT*, and I've said it many times before and have been shot down many times, however when many of the "survivors" run out of Himalayan salt, I will still have bags and bags of *"Pool Salt"*, it doesn't have a lot of debris in it because it has to go through the pump and filter, and guess what it comes from the same salt mines or salt evaporation ponds that your table salt comes from, oh and by the way, salt mines are sea salt from long long ago.

*Rancher *


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## ClemKadiddlehopper (Aug 15, 2014)

AmmoSgt

I read your post because it was thoughtful and well laid out. I don't much notice if someone is new or not but I do notice the quality of a post.You gave me the impression that you could handle a little conversation and difference of opinion. Guess what? You can. It just happens that the food police is one of my pet peeves. Thats on me.

I cannot figure out how you got contagious disease from my post but that is not important either. I should clarify that I am not military. I have been around and grew up living the lifestyle that most people refer to as TEOTWAWKI. It wasn't though, it was just normal everyday living that occurred in a time warp. It is commendable that you are giving back to your community.


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## crabapple (Jan 1, 2012)

AmmoSgt said:


> Crabapple .. something you said can't remember what, but before I forget again have you seen this book.. I just got it and kind of flipped thru the pages looks pretty good https://www.hamiltonbook.com/Garden...denseal-and-other-woodland-medicinals-revised
> 
> apologize for the interuption


No.
I lived on a farm, the farmhouse had a Tin roof & wood stove for heat.
We cut our own fire wood, cows,pigs,chickens,goat,rabbits,ducks,turkeys.
I learned to plow a mule & drive a tractor, put up fence in grade school.
We made our rabbit boxes for trapping.
I worked a job, with a landscaper in the some in the summer, he taught me about wild & tame plants & propagation. I am no "COTTON" but I know some of the wild here.
Most of what in half the books I lived as a child & know it as a way of life.
This is one of the reasons my son was in BSA, it is one of the few youth groups that show how to with hands on.
I have books on beekeeping, knots,trapping.
I use Peterson's book on poison plants & two on eatable wild plant.
I use the All about South Carolina Wildflowers book mostly.
I also plant flower that can be eaten like day lilies & canna,if times get real bad I can eat them. I have started a "TEA" garden.
Here are some good sites.
http://www.fs.fed.us/wildflowers/ethnobotany/oils.shtml

https://whatscookingamerica.net/EdibleFlowers/EdibleFlowersMain.htm


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## AmmoSgt (Apr 13, 2014)

crabapple said:


> No.
> I lived on a farm, the farmhouse had a Tin roof & wood stove for heat.
> We cut our own fire wood, cows,pigs,chickens,goat,rabbits,ducks,turkeys.
> I learned to plow a mule & drive a tractor, put up fence in grade school.
> ...


Yeah I got most of the Peterson's guides .. not sure what edition you have or if you have Wild Animals of North America but here is a buyers tip .. after edition 5 they started leaving stuff out small stuff like what color an animals eyes glow at night when you hit them with a light so look for the older editions .. I've been doing wildcrafting and medicinal herbs for over 40 years use to ( not that this is serious credential) my own AOL chat on herbs back when AOL had moderate chats late 1990's and I got started with plant poisons too (as a angry teenager) back in the 60's .. LOL never did anything with it but fantasize but did hide in the books and out in the desert when I had to 'visit" my Dad.

There is a survivalist thing going on here locally that I haven't read much about online .. but folks are , where appropriate to the plant seeding or starting edibles on favorite hiking trails just out in the woods muscadines on border fences and GPS'ing them check on them on hikes .. about half fail for lack of tending but overall the wild wood is much tastier

hey.. have you seen this animated knots so easy I can even tie them I do better looking and touching than reading on some things http://www.animatedknots.com/indexbasics.php#ScrollPoint


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## AmmoSgt (Apr 13, 2014)

ClemKadiddlehopper said:


> AmmoSgt
> 
> I read your post because it was thoughtful and well laid out. I don't much notice if someone is new or not but I do notice the quality of a post.You gave me the impression that you could handle a little conversation and difference of opinion. Guess what? You can. It just happens that the food police is one of my pet peeves. Thats on me.
> 
> I cannot figure out how you got contagious disease from my post but that is not important either. I should clarify that I am not military. I have been around and grew up living the lifestyle that most people refer to as TEOTWAWKI. It wasn't though, it was just normal everyday living that occurred in a time warp. It is commendable that you are giving back to your community.


That's a very nice thing to say.. thank you. The contagion was the germs on the cell phone thing by implication

ahh food police. that would be me in one sense .. the calorie and vitamin /mineral content on prepper freeze dried stuff especially the stuff sold based on so many days supply ... if you do the math on some/ most of them, if you make the little pouches with all the little servings last the number of days advertise, you are getting less nutrition the US POW's in a Japanese WW2 POW camp. Literally 800-900 calories and I'm big on asking folks to add up the calories in the #10 cans .. you need nominally 2000 calories a day most those cans only hold a day and a half rarely two and a half days sometimes less.. some vegetables ( dieting tip ) are just naturally 7 to 30 calories a cup https://www.caloriecount.com/calories-spinach-i11457
https://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/fruits-and-fruit-juices/1851/2 basically you can get by on 286 cups of spinach a day ( don't overreact , when most folks think a 'cup' they think of the two cup measuring cup you only need 143 of those to get 2000 calories )..and look what is in those canned seed banks real short on staples mostly salad stuff I can make a better salad out of my lawn.. ( I don't spray and encourage weeds very pretty my lawn blooms in purples and white and pinks and yellows and red thru the spring )

anyway I think folks should go add up all the calories in all their cans and divide by 2000 to get days of food.. most folks who do usually get real pissed to find out they only have food for half or less as long as they thought .. big fan of super pails of beans and grain just the way it comes from the plant with two exceptions the shelf life and practicality of white rice and of course oat meal. I have oat groats and yes a thermos full of hot water and groats will make breakfast overnight http://www.thermoscooking.com/ but a 50 pound bucket of oatmeal is a lot of warm happy comfort food.


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## AmmoSgt (Apr 13, 2014)

Hey.. I just noticed the time stamps .. they are like 6 hours ahead of me .. what planet is this forum on?


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## crabapple (Jan 1, 2012)

AmmoSgt said:


> Hey.. I just noticed the time stamps .. they are like 6 hours ahead of me .. what planet is this forum on?


Same on my puter, thought it was just me.****:dunno:


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## AmmoSgt (Apr 13, 2014)

betcha this forum is run from England which also explains the gun thing If it is in England or Britain no offense I just ain't sure of the preferred name. I want to give my sincere thanks for all The Enfield's in my Collection and if y'all have any extra Webley's please send them to the colonies post haste thanks in advance. OH yeah and double thanks for Midsomer Murders. And Frost and Lewis and Endeavor


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## terri9630 (Jun 2, 2016)

AmmoSgt said:


> Hey.. I just noticed the time stamps .. they are like 6 hours ahead of me .. what planet is this forum on?


You can go into your profile and set your time zone.


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## AmmoSgt (Apr 13, 2014)

terri9630 said:


> You can go into your profile and set your time zone.


Thank you.. How's things in New Mexico/ spent about a year and a half out there working at Sandia Base, loved it. Early 70's to sit out in the desert at night, all blueish purple from a full moon again.. someday


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## terri9630 (Jun 2, 2016)

AmmoSgt said:


> Thank you.. How's things in New Mexico/ spent about a year and a half out there working at Sandia Base, loved it. Early 70's to sit out in the desert at night, all blueish purple from a full moon again.. someday


Cold, wet, windy and sandy.


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## AmmoSgt (Apr 13, 2014)

terri9630 said:


> Cold, wet, windy and sandy.


Hmm cold and wet I remember very cold day so cold my cigarette literally put itself out from the tar freezing, well congealing , wearing a fairly light shirt and not feeling the cold because it was so dry .. static electricity interfering with our gear, definitely no blasting

always planed on coming back had some land up in Tijeras canyon, a small plateau and some acreage , 250-300 feet to water .. still haven't made it sold it decades ago...

before you ask Red stomach can't take green LOL


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## 101airborne (Jan 29, 2010)

After having my wake up call and realizing I had left a major hole in my preps for years by forgetting to stock stuff like salt, pepper and sugar I've been making up for it. I currently have 10 super pails ( 5 gallon buckets with 25# of salt in each) of sea salt, and almost 20 #10 cans of table salt. Plan to add another super pail every 3 months and a #10 can every month.


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## terri9630 (Jun 2, 2016)

AmmoSgt said:


> Hmm cold and wet I remember very cold day so cold my cigarette literally put itself out from the tar freezing, well congealing , wearing a fairly light shirt and not feeling the cold because it was so dry .. static electricity interfering with our gear, definitely no blasting
> 
> always planed on coming back had some land up in Tijeras canyon, a small plateau and some acreage , 250-300 feet to water .. still haven't made it sold it decades ago...
> 
> before you ask *Red stomach can't take green* LOL


I can't take either. I'm a wimp when it comes to "hot".


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## weedygarden (Apr 27, 2011)

101airborne said:


> After having my wake up call and realizing I had left a major hole in my preps for years by forgetting to stock stuff like salt, pepper and sugar I've been making up for it. I currently have 10 super pails ( 5 gallon buckets with 25# of salt in each) of sea salt, and almost 20 #10 cans of table salt. Plan to add another super pail every 3 months and *a #10 can every month.*


I am wondering about the #10 cans of salt? Are the cans treated inside? When I store salt in canning jars, I use a piece of plastic wrap over the jar before I put the lid on. Salt is so corrosive. I don't have much salt in jars, but I do have a couple jars. Mostly, I keep it in 5 gallon pails.


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## weedygarden (Apr 27, 2011)

AmmoSgt said:


> before you ask Red stomach can't take green LOL


GREEN! I am not sure where you are getting your green chili, but it can be hot as hell, or not. We have green chili stands set up in my area in the fall. When I buy green chilis, I always buy the mild ones. There are medium and hot options, and I know some people like HOT, but when you use mild green chilis, you get a nice flavor that you can actually taste before the burn kills your taste buds.

There is a restaurant on the main drag in Hatch, NM that is in an old building on the north side of the street, towards the east end of the business district. I saw lots of locals and work crews eating there which I always take as a clue as a great place to eat. The green chili they served there was different from any other green chili I had eaten. It was in a milk gravy, much like we make hamburger gravy, except with green chilis. It made a great smothered burrito, but unusual in my experience.


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## terri9630 (Jun 2, 2016)

weedygarden said:


> GREEN! I am not sure where you are getting your green chili, but it can be hot as hell, or not. We have green chili stands set up in my area in the fall. When I buy green chilis, I always buy the mild ones. There are medium and hot options, and I know some people like HOT, but when you use mild green chilis, you get a nice flavor that you can actually taste before the burn kills your taste buds.
> 
> *There is a restaurant on the main drag in Hatch, NM that is in an old building on the north side of the street, towards the east end of the business district.* I saw lots of locals and work crews eating there which I always take as a clue as a great place to eat. The green chili they served there was different from any other green chili I had eaten. It was in a milk gravy, much like we make hamburger gravy, except with green chilis. It made a great smothered burrito, but unusual in my experience.


 I've been there, it's pretty good. Just driving past that place made me hungry.


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## weedygarden (Apr 27, 2011)

terri9630 said:


> I've been there, it's pretty good. Just driving past that place made me hungry.


I love burritos smothered in green chili, and that place is memorable.


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## readytogo (Apr 6, 2013)

I`m not a heath nut and I loved to eat and cook ,coming from a tropical Island we never had fancy store bought salt and for that matter anything else in relation to our cooking ,our salt came from chunks of dry sea water or bags of it from the store ,sometimes it even had sea grass in it, coming to America was an eye opening for us but dad never deviated from his sea salt ,dad came home from his fishing trips near the shore with a bucket full of dirty sea salt ,old habits are hard to break .I buy mine at the store ,Mediterranean sea salt ,fine and coarse and clean but pure ,I admitted I have a bucket full of salt somewhere hard as a rock but that’s for a real shtf moment. Is funny the different types of salt out there like sodas and water some cost a fortune and promise a cured for all .My neighbor buys a type that is listed as 33% less sodium than regular salt but she uses a ton of it ,so what’s the idea ,is more expensive too.
Green chili sauce can be hot if using peppers only ,mix it with green tomatillos for a milder sauce.


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## terri9630 (Jun 2, 2016)

weedygarden said:


> I love burritos smothered in green chili, and that place is memorable.


I don't like chili's but their brisket is delicious.


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## weedygarden (Apr 27, 2011)

readytogo said:


> I`m not a heath nut and I loved to eat and cook ,coming from a tropical Island we never had fancy store bought salt and for that matter anything else in relation to our cooking ,our salt came from chunks of dry sea water or bags of it from the store ,sometimes it even had sea grass in it, coming to America was an eye opening for us but dad never deviated from his sea salt ,dad came home from his fishing trips near the shore with a bucket full of dirty sea salt ,old habits are hard to break .I buy mine at the store ,Mediterranean sea salt ,fine and coarse and clean but pure ,I admitted I have a bucket full of salt somewhere hard as a rock but that's for a real shtf moment. Is funny the different types of salt out there like sodas and water some cost a fortune and promise a cured for all .My neighbor buys a type that is listed as 33% less sodium than regular salt but she uses a ton of it ,so what's the idea ,is more expensive too.


If I were close to a body of salt water, I would process my own salt, just because I could. Isn't it something that many people could do as a side income?



readytogo said:


> Green chili sauce can be hot if using peppers only ,mix it with green tomatillos for a milder sauce.


 I remember being told by an uncle that he ordered green chili because he thought it would be milder than red chili and he found out different. So I always hesitated to order green chili. Green chili is something that is very common in Colorado, and I believe is the state food.

I haven't make the kind that I like over burritos very often. I often add chilis to lots of things that I cook, such as posole. Colorado green chili has pork, onions, tomatillos and more in it, so more than just chilis.

This is one recipe for how it is made. This is not chili that is eaten from a bowl, but ladeled over a burrito, and topped with some shredded cheese to make a smothered burrito. Serve it with some chopped onions, sour cream, and/or guacamole.

http://www.food.com/recipe/pork-green-chili-colorado-style-273593

SERVINGS 20

2 lbs pork roast
4 tablespoons olive oil
7 (14 ounce) cans chicken broth
13 cups water
1 large yellow sweet onion
1 head garlic
3 anaheim chilies
3 medium tomatillos
4 serrano chilies
1 (14 1/2 ounce) can stewed tomatoes, with juice
6 (4 1/2 ounce) chopped green chilies
2 tablespoons ground cumin
1⁄2 teaspoon oregano
1⁄2 teaspoon cayenne pepper
1 cup flour

Directions
Sear pork in 2 Tablespoons olive oil. Add 4 cans chicken broth and 6 cups of water, bring to a boil, and simmer until pork falls apart (aprox 3 hours).
Meanwhile, chop onion, garlic, and anaheims. Saute in 2 Tablespoons olive oil. Chop tomatillos, serranos, and stewed tomatoes. Puree 2 cans chopped green chilis. Set all aside.
When done, sift pork out of juice and shred, then add back.
Add all ingredients except flour and 2 cups water, bring to a boil, reduce heat and simmer for at least one hour.
In a separate container mix 2 cups water and 1 cup flour, shake well (grandmas rule was 100 shakes). Add mixture to chili slowly to achieve desired thickness.


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## bigg777 (Mar 18, 2013)

Sorry to hijack the thread but, I read a blip on the ticker of CNBC this morning that somebody/some company/someone had their permit to export sugar from Mexico to the U.S.A. withdrawn, I'm assuming by the Mexican .gov. So at WallyWorld today, I started stockpiliing granulated cane sugar for this Fall when my wife will do the majority of her holiday baking. I'm figuring that by Fall if there is anything to this permit withdrawl crap, it'll just be driving the price of sugar thru the roof (kinda like eggs in Fall of 2015). 4# lb. bags are $1.83, which was cheaper per lb. than the 15# or 25# bags.


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## terri9630 (Jun 2, 2016)

bigg777 said:


> Sorry to hijack the thread but, I read a blip on the ticker of CNBC this morning that somebody/some company/someone had their permit to export sugar from Mexico to the U.S.A. withdrawn, I'm assuming by the Mexican .gov. So at WallyWorld today, I started stockpiliing granulated cane sugar for this Fall when my wife will do the majority of her holiday baking. I'm figuring that by Fall if there is anything to this permit withdrawl crap, it'll just be driving the price of sugar thru the roof (kinda like eggs in Fall of 2015). 4# lb. bags are $1.83, which was cheaper per lb. than the 15# or 25# bags.


 In that case I'll head over to the store tomorrow and pick some up.


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## timmie (Jan 14, 2012)

bigg777 said:


> Sorry to hijack the thread but, I read a blip on the ticker of CNBC this morning that somebody/some company/someone had their permit to export sugar from Mexico to the U.S.A. withdrawn, I'm assuming by the Mexican .gov. So at WallyWorld today, I started stockpiliing granulated cane sugar for this Fall when my wife will do the majority of her holiday baking. I'm figuring that by Fall if there is anything to this permit withdrawl crap, it'll just be driving the price of sugar thru the roof (kinda like eggs in Fall of 2015). 4# lb. bags are $1.83, which was cheaper per lb. than the 15# or 25# bags.


i think i'll get some more sugar and salt and figure out how to store it later. right now local store has sugar for 42 cents per pound.


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## terri9630 (Jun 2, 2016)

timmie said:


> i think i'll get some more sugar and salt and figure out how to store it later. right now local store has sugar for 42 cents per pound.


Sugar and salt are easy to store. Just keep it dry. Jar, bucket, mylar any will do. I have sugar and salt in 1/2 gallon mason jars for everyday use and buckets for long term storage.


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## timmie (Jan 14, 2012)

terri9630 said:


> Sugar and salt are easy to store. Just keep it dry. Jar, bucket, mylar any will do. I have sugar and salt in 1/2 gallon mason jars for everyday use and buckets for long term storage.


yeah i know . what i meant was i already have a lot of it stored,but my daughter and her husband are on the road trucking, and i'm going to help them get some stored up.


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## weedygarden (Apr 27, 2011)

bigg777 said:


> *Sorry to hijack the thread but*, I read a blip on the ticker of CNBC this morning that somebody/some company/someone had their permit to export sugar from Mexico to the U.S.A. withdrawn, I'm assuming by the Mexican .gov. So at WallyWorld today, I started stockpiliing granulated cane sugar for this Fall when my wife will do the majority of her holiday baking. I'm figuring that by Fall if there is anything to this permit withdrawl crap, it'll just be driving the price of sugar thru the roof (kinda like eggs in Fall of 2015). 4# lb. bags are $1.83, which was cheaper per lb. than the 15# or 25# bags.


Thanks for getting us back on track!


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## timmie (Jan 14, 2012)

i did get some salt and sugar today. also bought 4 5-gallon buckets and will fill them . a friend has a son working at a local resturaunt and he's going to see about getting some buckets for me.


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## bigg777 (Mar 18, 2013)

I just read an article on CNBC.com today, apparently ALL Mexican sugar export permits have been cancelled by the Mexican government. Permits should be re-issued in April according to a Mex.gov rep., however it is difficult to work on trade issues since USA.gov has not filled all of it's Commerce Dept. positions. More later.


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## bbonjovi (Jun 16, 2017)

What about the opposite? I have a few months worth of freeze dried food for emergencies. Spouse was just put on a reduced sodium. It's the first time I've really looked at the sodium content. Seems really high. Any suggestions?


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## terri9630 (Jun 2, 2016)

bbonjovi said:


> What about the opposite? I have a few months worth of freeze dried food for emergencies. Spouse was just put on a reduced sodium. It's the first time I've really looked at the sodium content. Seems really high. Any suggestions?


Buy the freeze dried ingredients and use your own recipes. That way you can control the salt.


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## bigg777 (Mar 18, 2013)

Sorry to be late to report this but, apparently the Mex/USA sugar export permits have been renegotiated and the flow of white powder from Mexico to the streets of the US is ongoing.


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