# Found a laser for my HD shotgun



## Sentry18 (Aug 5, 2012)

Not a huge laser fan, but I did find one that I would like to try on one of my home defense shotguns. I like the idea for sure. Kind of reminds me of the movie Predator.


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## PipLogan (Apr 25, 2011)

That's pretty sweet, I would have to wait and get the one with the red laser


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## labotomi (Feb 14, 2010)

I'm sure they'll sell a lot of them. I just don't know why someone would need anything additional for a home defense shotgun. They're as close to point and shoot as you can get.


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## Sentry18 (Aug 5, 2012)

Point and shoot works great when your target just stands still. Not so much when he doesn't.


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## labotomi (Feb 14, 2010)

I still don't think a laser would be any better than the normal shotgun sights in a close quarter situation. On a pistol maybe.

Just my view. Lots of people disagree with purchases I've made, but in the end it's my money that's buying it just as it will be your money buying the laser if you choose.


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## truecarnage (Apr 25, 2010)

I would like to have one on my H/D shotgun, but I did put a highviz sight on mine and I am very happy with with the results. But a laser would work in the dark where sights are worthless. A weapons light can be good, but it also gives your position away and can light you up as a target. Damned if you use damned if you don't.


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## LongRider (May 8, 2012)

Sentry18 said:


> Not a huge laser fan, but I did find one that I would like to try on one of my home defense shotguns. I like the idea for sure. Kind of reminds me of the movie Predator.


This looks like an interesting product and like you said it definitely has the cool factor down in spades.While I have no experience with this particular product I can tell you about with laserLyte and my experince with them.
Laserlyte makes an excellent product at a great price. Laserlyte has the best customer service I have ever encountered. Changing batteries I hogged out a screw, so called them to buy a replacement screw. My bad my buy. When I called, the (American) customer service lady got my info and had a brand new laser on the way to me before we were off the phone. She only asked that I return the one I hogged out, back to them in the postage paid envelope she sent with the replacement laser, so they could examine it to see how to prevent that from happening again. The new one was on my door in two days. Hell it was my screw up, great customer service would have been to maybe give me a free screw or free shipping & handling but a new unit before I returned the old one plus pay the postage for the return. Amazing. 
Anyway, I have my HD shotgun, 10/22 and AR set up with the same furniture, including LaserLytes subcompact lasers for the same basic manual of arms other than the inherent differences of each firearm. The Laserlytes have all held up well,even with rough use with no problem ever holding zero.



PipLogan said:


> That's pretty sweet, I would have to wait and get the one with the red laser


Why? Green lasers are quicker to acquire and more visible especially in day light. That is why all the high end lasers are green.



labotomi said:


> I still don't think a laser would be any better than the normal shotgun sights in a close quarter situation.


Based upon experience with both, over forty years with iron sights that would be incorrect. Target acquisition is far faster with a laser. Plus both eyes are open on target as is our natural response to a threat, peripheral vision stays intact. All my long guns have red dot sights, all including hand guns have lasers and fiber optic sights for back up. Hits count, good sights help assure hits.

You can spend four maybe five times as much on other name brand lasers but I don't think they are one bit better. Most are made of plastic Laserlytes are made of hard anodized aluminum and Laserlyte makes the smallest compact model on the market.


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## Turtle (Dec 10, 2009)

LongRider said:


> . Plus both eyes are open on target as is our natural response to a threat, peripheral vision stays intact..


I've never understood why people train themselves to close one eye. As you said, it's more natural to leave both eyes open.


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## Magus (Dec 1, 2008)

Stupid laser story:
I bought a dime store grade laser for 5$, you know the kind, the ones that make pictures,playboy bunny, pot leaf etc.
it only lived 200 rounds but the pic I chose was a


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## LongRider (May 8, 2012)

Turtle said:


> I've never understood why people train themselves to close one eye. As you said, it's more natural to leave both eyes open.


It is how I was taught. I go cross eyed now if I try to use iron sights with both eyes open but my wife does it.


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## labotomi (Feb 14, 2010)

LongRider said:


> Plus both eyes are open on target as is our natural response to a threat, peripheral vision stays intact. All my long guns have red dot sights, all including hand guns have lasers and fiber optic sights for back up


I'd agree with rifles and pistols. I would even use a red dot, just not a laser. Most people i know use both eyes when aiming a shotgun anyway.


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## LongRider (May 8, 2012)

labotomi said:


> I'd agree with rifles and pistols. I would even use a red dot, just not a laser. Most people i know use both eyes when aiming a shotgun anyway.


Red dots and laser make it happen ALOT faster because you are looking at the target not the sight. Proper iron sight use is to have the front sight in focus the target and rear sights are blurred or slightly out of focus. With red dots and lasers your focus is on the threat when the red dot from either appear on target you fire. The nice thing about lasers is when you grab your shot gun in a panic and you see your assailant before having your weapon properly mounted but the laser is on them you can fire confident that you will hit the target and not the kids in the next room. It is much much faster I have used iron sights for forty years lasers and red dots are much faster. With a laser and red dot I can drop targets from 10 feet to 50 yards with my shotgun as quickly as I can run the pump


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## LongRider (May 8, 2012)

Bottom line each to his own. I just strongly suggest that with an open mind you use train practice with a laser, because they do take some getting used to to use properly. Than if they do not work for you they do not work for you but for most of us they do especially off hand. 

IMO for most that they do not work for it is because they do not want them to work. Being right is more important than being faster and more accurate but the bottom line is they don't work for them so they should stick with what they know.


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## labotomi (Feb 14, 2010)

LongRider said:


> Bottom line each to his own. I just strongly suggest that with an open mind you use train practice with a laser, because they do take some getting used to to use properly. Than if they do not work for you they do not work for you but for most of us they do especially off hand.


I have both on other platforms, so they're not foreign to me. I've used a red dot and tried a laser on shotguns. I liked the red dot for longer shots but was disappointed with the laser in general. It wasn't the superwhamadine model in the op so maybe its better. I just don't see a fundamental difference especially with the premium price.



LongRider said:


> IMO for most that they do not work for it is because they do not want them to work. Being right is more important than being faster and more accurate


I suppose I would rather have a shelf of equipment I bought that's not being used just to make a point in a discussion that is happening years later.


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## Sentry18 (Aug 5, 2012)

I remember attending a shotgun instructor/armorer school put on by Remington Law Enforcement back in 2007. They had a couple of pro shooters (LEO's) there putting on a demonstration. They were obviously very good with a boom stick and very fast. We had a discussion about lasers and both of the pros were very anti-laser and even anti red dot on shotguns. One of the vendors convinced them to run the course with a laser equipped Remington 870 that was very well equipped. Once through with the laser off and once through with the laser on. BOTH of the pros put in faster times and higher scores when using the laser. They were both surprised and both stated they will would still not be using them (personal choice), but admitted that perhaps that did give an edge on target acquisition. Personally, I have a tritium XS Big dot on my primary SBS.


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## Fn/Form (Nov 6, 2008)

Lasers can be useful when multi-tasking while covering a potential threat. Barricade/shield work, felony stop with a long gun, working a mechanism, dragging a buddy to safety, etc.

It is not a replacement for primary sighting on your fighting firearms. It is not a search tool--you're simply painting your position, much more so in dusty, smoky or misty conditions. 

Nor is the laser a replacement for indexing a firearm. You should know instantly if if your firearm is a foot right or left of the target without having to use a laser.

A laser often competes with white lights for optimum rail position. A white light is far more important, so the laser usually ends up in the second best position--often blocked by a barricade or support. A few white/laser combos help with this aspect (Surefire X series, military PAQ/PEQ, NOD/IR, etc.)

I'm all about having good tools... but a laser is at the bottom of my want lists.


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## LongRider (May 8, 2012)

Sentry18 said:


> BOTH of the pros put in faster times and higher scores when using the laser. They were both surprised and both stated they will would still not be using them (personal choice), but admitted that perhaps that did give an edge on target acquisition.


I never could quiet understand that. If it gives you an edge why not use it? A laser does not have to be a replacement or substitute for anything. Rather it is an enhancement to existing sights, optics, lights and proper weapons handling. Kind of along the line of if you are not cheating you are not trying. The only fair fight is the one you win. Other than the ideal of course being winning by not being in a fight in the first place.



Fn/Form said:


> A laser often competes with white lights for optimum rail position. A white light is far more important, so the laser usually ends up in the second best position--often blocked by a barricade or support. A few white/laser combos help with this aspect (Surefire X series, military PAQ/PEQ, NOD/IR, etc.)


I use a MAKO T Grip to hold my light I like it because it is intuitive and natural a trigger press turns the light on/off or allows you to cycle through its function hi/lo strobe. I tend to only use only the off/on function with a constant hold for hi 120 lumen to blind my assailant once I have found him (good gun handling, following the rules is critical. Keeping your finger of the firearm trigger until you have the target in your sights lest a sympathetic response to cycling the light cause a negligent discharge). The T Grip allows me to mount the laser right above the fore grip so I can tap the laser on/off with the thumb of my off hand. In this way as soon as I grab the gun the light and laser go on. If it paints a target before I have the gun mounted or as I am turning on the red dot I am confident I will make a hit. In my mind that is the biggest advantage of a laser, that it sights for me when the gun or I am in an off or awkward position where regular sights are not available for a moment. I rarely if ever keep the laser or the flashlight constant on.


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## LongRider (May 8, 2012)

labotomi said:


> It wasn't the superwhamadine model in the op so maybe its better. I just don't see a fundamental difference especially with the premium price.


The laser in the OP is NOT a very expensive laser. LaserLyte is known for making a very high quality product at a very affordable price. As much as a two thirds less than their competitors for a comparable quality product.

That said there is a vast difference in performance, endurance and reliability between well made quality lasers made by reputable companies and the performance of cheap knock offs. If a cheap laser seems ineffective or useless it may very well have to do with the fact that it is a cheap knock off and not because lasers are ineffective or useless.


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## labotomi (Feb 14, 2010)

LongRider said:


> The laser in the OP is NOT a very expensive laser. LaserLyte is known for making a very high quality product at a very affordable price. As much as a two thirds less than their competitors for a comparable quality product.
> 
> That said there is a vast difference in performance, endurance and reliability between well made quality lasers made by reputable companies and the performance of cheap knock offs. If a cheap laser seems ineffective or useless it may very well have to do with the fact that it is a cheap knock off and not because lasers are ineffective or useless.


My statement wasn't about price

My statement wasn't about the price. It was about the multiple dots produced by the one in the video vs the single dot produced by the ones I have.


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## WWhermit (Mar 1, 2012)

Lasers are also a great deterrant. Put that little red dot on someone's crotch, and many will think twice before acting.


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## LongRider (May 8, 2012)

labotomi said:


> My statement wasn't about price
> 
> My statement wasn't about the price. It was about the multiple dots produced by the one in the video vs the single dot produced by the ones I have.


OIC my mistake than. As you said


labotomi said:


> I just don't see a fundamental difference *especially with the premium price*.


and nothing about multiple dots. I thought you were talking about price.

Regarding the multiple dots I suppose if you can not grasp why a pattern of multiple dots would be easier to see than a single dot resulting in quicker target acquisition could be a benefit. The old biker clique 


> If I have to explain it you would never understand


 would apply


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## labotomi (Feb 14, 2010)

LongRider said:


> Regarding the multiple dots I suppose if you can not grasp why a pattern of multiple dots would be easier to see than a single dot resulting in quicker target acquisition could be a benefit. The old biker clique
> would apply


Hahaha. I'm not in a biker clique.

I can think of a cliché or two that would fit your statement though.


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## labotomi (Feb 14, 2010)

LongRider said:


> Regarding the multiple dots I suppose if you can not grasp why a pattern of multiple dots would be easier to see than a single dot resulting in quicker target acquisition could be a benefit. The old biker clique
> would apply


I'm not in a biker clique hahaha.

I can think of a cliché or two that would fit your statement though.


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## OHprepper (Feb 21, 2012)

Lasers certainly are a great deterrent. We had green lasers on a bunch of different weapons platforms in afghanistan. We made sure the locals saw that we did. At night if we were blocking a road and they tried to go around our barricade, we could spotlight their hood from 500m away and they would ALWAYS lock up their tires and throw it in reverse.


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## Caribou (Aug 18, 2012)

+1 on the LaserLyte customer service. I had my LaserLyte go down and had a new one toot sweet. I have reached the age where my arms are not long enough, a laser helps a lot. Low light shooting is an especially challenging situation. I am faster acquiring a target with a laser than without. In a situation where a fraction of a second could make the difference I want a laser. A red dot is certainly a viable option, then again why not both. Two is one, one is none. 

As far as whether a shotgun needs to be aimed, a slug is just a big bullet and can miss just as easily. While buck shot has an expanding pattern if you miss your target by two inches then you miss. At in home distances the pattern for a shotgun is less than most people think. I suggest that you pattern your shotgun. Pace out the longest distance in your home that you are likely to engage a criminal. The next trip to the range shoot a clean target at that distance. Some people will be surprised.


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## LongRider (May 8, 2012)

Caribou said:


> +1 on the LaserLyte customer service. I had my LaserLyte go down and had a new one toot sweet. I have reached the age where my arms are not long enough, a laser helps a lot. Low light shooting is an especially challenging situation. *I am faster acquiring a target with a laser than without. In a situation where a fraction of a second could make the difference I want a laser*. A red dot is certainly a viable option, then again why not both. Two is one, one is none.
> 
> As far as whether a shotgun needs to be aimed, a slug is just a big bullet and can miss just as easily. While buck shot has an expanding pattern if you miss your target by two inches then you miss. At in home distances the pattern for a shotgun is less than most people think. I suggest that you pattern your shotgun. Pace out the longest distance in your home that you are likely to engage a criminal. The next trip to the range shoot a clean target at that distance. Some people will be surprised.


Good point especially about patterning your shotgun with the ammo out of the shotgun you plan on using. I think that is a critical mandatory essential part of your home defense plan. I pattern to the furthest distances I can shoot in my house as the pattern will not get bigger than that. If shotguns spread was so great that aiming was not needed I would not use one in the house. The collateral damage to property and unintended targets would be far too great. I for one do not want to annihilate everything in my home to get the bad guy. Thankfully as you said shotguns pattern much smaller than most folks seem to think. Small enough to punch one ragged hole in the bad guy in most cases.


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