# New to this Gold/Silver thing



## AUprepster (Jun 12, 2013)

Ok I am new here to Prepared Society. After reading through a couple threads, I was hooked and joined. Ok enough babbling.

I have been curious about buying Gold and Silver but I dont know where in the world to even start. Can someone point me in some direction on how to get started? Do you buy from some Internet website? Do you buy small coinage or Silver Eagles or what?

On a discussion side note, I am curious about this, in a TEOFTWAWKI scenario, would precious metal really be worth having more than barter material? You guys are more informed than I so please help me understand.

Thanks so much!


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## GrinnanBarrett (Aug 31, 2012)

Best thing to do is check around for coin dealers in your area. If you buy silver go for what is commonly called Junk Silver. This is pre 1964 quarters, dimes, half dollars and silver dollars. If the coin edge shows copper it is made up of alloys not silver. 

If you are using a smart phone there is an app showing percent of silver by type of coin. It takes 14 dimes to make an ounce of silver, 5 quarters, 2 half dollars and 1 silver eagle dollar

War time nickels 1942-1945 you need 19 

Kennedy half dollars takes 7 of them to make an ounce. 

Big thing is when you buy precious metal be sure it is in form you can hold and store yourself. Many times dealers on web sell you on idea of them holding your silver or gold in a vault half way across country. Don't do it. 

As for gold you are looking at major investment to buy it today. Again if you do buy coins. Coins have known value. Only buy from dealer you know and who has long term relationships in your area. Watch out for fake gold coins as well as silver. 

Never ever buy commemorative coins. They have no value. Most are clad in a thin silver or gold finish. Best wishes to you. GB


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## Caribou (Aug 18, 2012)

Coin dealers, precious metal dealers, and the internet are possible ways to buy metals. As Grinnan said, stay away from paper gold and silver. If you buy it in person and pay more than $10,000 in cash, in one day, they are required to report it to the government.

Gold, silver, even copper have been accepted as money for thousands of years. Fiat money is a relatively recent invention. I wouldn't trade my last pound of rice for gold but then I wouldn't trade the last of my food for anything. We use money for the convenience. There will always be people willing to accept precious metals. 

I recommend you get a good start on your food before you start on your metals. I like a balanced approach to prepping. Like having a ton of rice and no meat is a less than perfect plan having all your preps in one type gives you fewer options. If you can't afford enough food then metals take a back seat. Only you can decide if or when metals are right for you.


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## BillS (May 30, 2011)

I see PM's as a way to protect your money from hyperinflation and as a way to save your money until things get back to normal.

I prefer junk silver only. If you stick with small 90% silver coins you won't have to worry about counterfeits. I don't know anything about the silver content of Australian coins. You'll have to research that.


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## AUprepster (Jun 12, 2013)

Thanks guys! Good information here to get started. 

Concerning GB's and BillS' reply, where do you go to buy junk silver coins? 

Thanks again!


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## invision (Aug 14, 2012)

I agree if your starting out to go with the junk silver route.

Personally - I would advice per-1965 quarters, dimes, and halves only. War Nickels were only made for only 2-3 years, most people won't remember those years (besides those like us) so I feel there could be issue for doubt. I have also read on some sites war nickels are 40% silver, while other sites say 35%... The same is true for half dollars, after 1964, half dollars contained 40% silver instead on 90% until 1970. I was in a pawn shop (buying ammo) and the dude their tried to sell me a half dollar from 1976 saying it was 40% silver, I had to show him on cointrackers.com that he was wrong.

After you have some junk, and depending upon you disposable income, I would then advice to start buying silver eagles. 

Part of what you are doing is investing against inflation besides "prepping" for SHTF... Both gold and silver are a finite substance, they are both used in the manufacturing in a multitude of items, including cell phones, electronics, pcs, etc... With the demand for them in manufacturing of everyday items they are a safe hedge against inflation. Typically when equities and usd goes down, gold/silver go up... And as those go up, PMs go down.

Now to answer your question on PMs versus Barter... IMO - during SHTF - first 1-6 months (let's say economic collapse) PMs may not be as valuable as say food, water, TP, medical supplies, or ammo. HOWEVER: 1) PMs have always been used in trade from the earliest of times so I see no reason that they wouldn't still be in demand. 2) after the dust settles, some form of currency will need to be used to put more accurate pricing values on trading of goods. Is a pair of shoes worth a loaf of bread, 2 eggs, and a few slices of jerky? We are humans, and we have always had a barter system - even today everything is a barter system - only difference is your using a currency note to make the trade. Eventually, we will start rebuilding 2 months, 4 months, a year later, it will start to happen... Also, yes if our economy falls, there is a strong likelihood that the ret of the world will be greatly impacted, but are we 100% sure? No, no one can really truly state this, so to get back on the international world bandwagon, which we would do eventually, we maybe forced back to a commodity backed currency... Having PMs on hand would be a good thing over just barter items... 

Now if your in a position to invest a large sum on PMs - $10,000 or more... I would still load up 75-85% silver, and the remaining in small 10th of an ounce gold... Imagine trying to make change for an ounce of gold in a post-SHTF world at first.


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## AUprepster (Jun 12, 2013)

Thanks Invision! Good points!

Still trying to find the junk precious metal. Any ideas other than overpriced Pawn Shops?


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## BillS (May 30, 2011)

AUprepster said:


> Thanks guys! Good information here to get started.
> 
> Concerning GB's and BillS' reply, where do you go to buy junk silver coins?
> 
> Thanks again!


I got mine here:

http://www.providentmetals.com/coins/us-silver-coins/coin-90-silver-us-junk.html?limit=all

They're the cheapest place I could find. Unfortunately, I don't believe they ship to Australia.


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## PrepN4Good (Dec 23, 2011)

BillS said:


> I got mine here:
> 
> http://www.providentmetals.com/coins/us-silver-coins/coin-90-silver-us-junk.html?limit=all
> 
> They're the cheapest place I could find. Unfortunately, I don't believe they ship to *Australia*.


His/her location shows as Alabama...what'd I miss...? :scratch:


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## AUprepster (Jun 12, 2013)

Hahaha, sorry guys. I live in the state of Alabama but I'm an Auburn University fan. Hence the title "AUprepster". Sorry for the confusion!


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## invision (Aug 14, 2012)

AUprepster said:


> Thanks Invision! Good points!
> 
> Still trying to find the junk precious metal. Any ideas other than overpriced Pawn Shops?


Sometimes eBay. I found a local dealer here in Atlanta that does 1.50 over spot. Also try some of the gold/silver buy now places... I stopped in one few months ago that was $2 over spot for S.Eagles....

It depends upon the volume your buying too.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Ebay is a good place to get junk like invision said BUT you need to check seller feedback before buying. I have seen sellers list "random junk silver coins equal to 1 oz of silver" and in reality they are listing 1 oz of coins that are 35% silver.

I have a very small budget for PM but I can find good deals on ebay if I snipe auctions. Or if I check auctions closing in the middle of the night when most normal folks are asleep.


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## invision (Aug 14, 2012)

Grimm said:


> Ebay is a good place to get junk like invision said BUT you need to check seller feedback before buying. I have seen sellers list "random junk silver coins equal to 1 oz of silver" and in reality they are listing 1 oz of coins that are 35% silver.


So true... Also when buying on eBay look out for those that include war nickels in their listings.


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## mojo4 (Feb 19, 2012)

masterspark said:


> Am I missing something here? I you have miscellaneus junk silver wouldn't it be confusing trying to figure out the various values and percentages. Why wouldn't you want to have an Eagle or Maple that is marked as a troy ounce of .999. I would trust that more than junk silver. Or am I missing something?


Most people would only trust gov issued coins. Too many private companies can make coins and stamp them as whatever and you really have no idea (unless you can melt down and truly account for % content and amount) but gov issued coins can be counted on.


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## invision (Aug 14, 2012)

masterspark said:


> Am I missing something here? I you have miscellaneus junk silver wouldn't it be confusing trying to figure out the various values and percentages. Why wouldn't you want to have an Eagle or Maple that is marked as a troy ounce of .999. I would trust that more than junk silver. Or am I missing something?


Well, it is very common knowledge at least amongst collectors, investors, and peppers that us coins prior to 1965 (quarters, dimes, halves) are all 90%. Someone just starting out and/or on limited investment budget can acquire 'junk silver' for less amounts than the cost of one Silver Eagles... Example - 1 or 2 dimes at a time... Also Eagles typically have a higher margin over spot price than junk does... Now, why have junk in your preps over silver eagles... Let's say in the days leading up to economic collapse of USD, gold shoots to $5,000+ per ounce and silver jumps up over $100 per ounce... You need something, I have it... Let's say it is a 100 veggie seeds, are you willing to pay $1 per seed? Or would you rather try to get it for a pre-65 dime and quarter (right now worth $5.60 spot, but at $100/oz would equate to $26.66), which would be about .27 cents per seed... Also if you doubt junk, then how would I make 'change' from your silver eagle? I am not going to cut it into quarters...nor would I accept any quarter of a silver eagle except the part that had the .999 mark on it.

Make sense?


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## Wellrounded (Sep 25, 2011)

invision said:


> Well, it is very common knowledge at least amongst collectors, investors, and peppers that us coins prior to 1965 (quarters, dimes, halves) are all 90%. Someone just starting out and/or on limited investment budget can acquire 'junk silver' for less amounts than the cost of one Silver Eagles... Example - 1 or 2 dimes at a time... Also Eagles typically have a higher margin over spot price than junk does... Now, why have junk in your preps over silver eagles... Let's say in the days leading up to economic collapse of USD, gold shoots to $5,000+ per ounce and silver jumps up over $100 per ounce... You need something, I have it... Let's say it is a 100 veggie seeds, are you willing to pay $1 per seed? Or would you rather try to get it for a pre-65 dime and quarter (right now worth $5.60 spot, but at $100/oz would equate to $26.66), which would be about .27 cents per seed... Also if you doubt junk, then how would I make 'change' from your silver eagle? I am not going to cut it into quarters...nor would I accept any quarter of a silver eagle except the part that had the .999 mark on it.
> 
> Make sense?


Yep and that's the problem. How many people post SHTF will have any idea what junk silver is worth, how many will believe you if you tell them.

For us, knowing the locals we'd be trading to, we would be bartering much more immediate needs. We'd have a trading post here and a store credit system within weeks of everything settling down. PM's would only have value once the value was established community wide and base units agreed upon.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

invision said:


> So true... Also when buying on eBay look out for those that include war nickels in their listings.


Some will not tell you that they are including war nickles and send that as the bulk of the coins. I had a seller pull this on me. 8oz of war nickles. Ebay was kind enough to refund me because the seller said 1/2 lb of silver not 1/2 lb of war nickles at 35% silver.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Wellrounded said:


> Yep and that's the problem. How many people post SHTF will have any idea what junk silver is worth, how many will believe you if you tell them.
> 
> For us, knowing the locals we'd be trading to, we would be bartering much more immediate needs. We'd have a trading post here and a store credit system within weeks of everything settling down. PM's would only have value once the value was established community wide and base units agreed upon.


I keep a US coin reference guide as part of my preps. It is a few years old (2-3 years old) but explains the percentages of silver in what coins etc. At least I'll have something other than my word to show what the silver content is in my "junk" silver coins.


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## Wellrounded (Sep 25, 2011)

Grimm said:


> I keep a US coin reference guide as part of my preps. It is a few years old (2-3 years old) but explains the percentages of silver in what coins etc. At least I'll have something other than my word to show what the silver content is in my "junk" silver coins.


I understand where you're coming from Grimm but I can't imagine trading silver for anything here. It will be goods/labour or nothing. We're too far into the worthless paper rubbish for the average person here to have any understanding of the value of PM's and how they should anchor the value of a currency. I doubt I could find more than two or three persons locally who would have a clue what money even is.


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## invision (Aug 14, 2012)

masterspark said:


> I suppose it depends on your view of post SHTF and how you will use your PM's.
> If you're holding PM's as hedge against the dollar crash, I would think gov't issued coins like Eagles, Maples, and Philharmonics would be easier to work with. In 15 years if I want to 'cash in' some coins, I would think they would be easier to sell. Post apocalypse I don't know how useful any of it will be.


You got to keep in mind, post SHTF after the dust settles, we will start to rebuild, so not only are PMs a hedge against inflation for me, they are a hedge against the rebuilding efforts. Commerce will still be around, how you pay for it will be on the seller, personally, I would prefer to have some sort of payment methods versus labor.


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## Tacitus (Dec 30, 2012)

AUprepster said:


> Still trying to find the junk precious metal. Any ideas other than overpriced Pawn Shops?


I go to a local coin collector store. They put their junk silver in bags and sell it at a bulk price that changes with the spot silver price:


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## cowboyhermit (Nov 10, 2012)

This discussion comes up all the time and I think that the one thing that can be agreed upon is that there is no one surefire answer to "buying" things in a SHTF situation. 
Barter will absolutely take place, it always has and always will. The thing is trading gold or silver (or copper, or aluminum) that is not held by a government to be a currency (this would include junk silver where the face value does not reflect the metal value) IS barter. It just so happens that the good (gold or silver) that is traded for may not be directly consumed by the person receiving it, this can happen with other forms of barter as well.

I really think some good points were brought up this time around. For instance, I honestly believe that "tabs" or running bills will make a comeback. These were much more common in the past when cheques, cards, and such were not so cheap and easy. Even when cheques became popular it was common to settle the bill, at the grocer for instance, once a month. With barter and precious metals and/or any situation where banks or communication are compromised less transactions make a lot of sense in numerous ways. Knowing how many chickens to take with you to the doctor, or taking all your gold with you every time you buy milk is not practical and then there is the issue of getting change. People will not be trading quite so freely with random people for obvious reasons and those that are not familiar will likely pay a premium.

If a person is going to buy any junk silver or consider accepting it, get a card or something with the common coins and their composition.

I have literally tons of food (beef, grain, vegetable) and many other things that will be up for sale if/when it is safe to do so. Labour in it's many forms (chopping wood, security, surgery) probably would be one of the main things I would accept from reputable people. Certain things that we don't have would probably be next though this would be hard to predict. 
However, unless I was in truly dire circumstances and everything went wrong I would still accept gold and silver. One of the biggest reasons is events that have occurred in the past, namely governments (and entities that claimed that status) taking whatever they wanted. Unlike most "things" I can take an ounce of gold and bury it someplace where it is very unlikely to be discovered. If we were to lose everything it would still be there when needed for whatever last ditch efforts, or at least for the next generation. This has worked in the past, of course I hope we never come to needing it.


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## alwaysready (May 16, 2012)

Wellrounded said:


> I understand where you're coming from Grimm but I can't imagine trading silver for anything here. It will be goods/labour or nothing. We're too far into the worthless paper rubbish for the average person here to have any understanding of the value of PM's and how they should anchor the value of a currency. I doubt I could find more than two or three persons locally who would have a clue what money even is.


At some point when the dust settles or if the dollar is no longer accepted but we haven't yet fallen into the abyss. Some form of currency will be needed people have always used PMs as an compact way to transport/store wealth. I believe junk silver will have its use we may see bits and pieces of coins 8 bits to make a dollar kind of thing. Those that are prepared will have the luxury of trading for PMs in different forms such as silver ware and jewlery in addition to verious coins. As to the OP get prepared first with out proper preps PMs will do you no good.


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## SouthCentralUS (Nov 11, 2012)

Next week I will be in the Tulsa OK area. Is there a place in Tulsa to buy junk silver?


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