# Utilities when the SHTF



## db2469 (Jun 11, 2012)

Pardon my ignorance, but would a town's water and sewer system necessarily be unusable by its residents? Do they each require manned operation? If it's a Mad Max scenario, there wouldn't be workers at these facilities..
DB


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

They both require power, so if the power is out they don't work (maybe for a few hours they do).


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## CulexPipiens (Nov 17, 2010)

Depends on how they work. If the town water requires pumps to pressurize the water lines or lift it in the towers and for whatever reason the pumps can't work then no water. Could be running out of gas, no electricity, mechanical failure and no one to perform the repair/maintenance, etc.

Sewer is usally grravity only... at least up to a certain point but from somewhere it has to collect and get pumped into a treatment facility. Again, no pumps and eventually it will fill up and that becomes not only a mess but a clear health hazard too.

If you're on your own well and septic, then you're isolated as long as you can keep your well working and your septic system flowing.


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## FrankW (Mar 10, 2012)

Water tower would work until empty via gravity


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## *Andi (Nov 8, 2009)

Utilities when the SHTF ...

To be honest things about to change with the power ... At the end of this year the number of coal fire power plant going down is unreal... I know the one my dad worked out at, is on its last leg. (per new regs)

Right now it is only to "come on line" when needed, problem with that is the need has went up , not down. 

I see rolling black outs ... coming soon. (just a fact)

Get ready now ...I guess you could say the Utilities will be the SHTF. (for many)


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## weedygarden (Apr 27, 2011)

*Many water towers are no longer being used*

As part of the national dependence, many small towns and cities that had water towers for a century or so, no longer use them.

Many place have gone to "rural water". Everyone had pipes layed out to their places, where ever that might be. In South Dakota, rural water was a long project that created this situation. Water districts were created and water for each district comes from a different source. In some parts of the state, water is siphoned from the Missouri River. Water towers are not needed. They have gone up a step in modernization.

No power, no water pumped. People are not drilling wells or needing to maintain personal wells when rural water layed pipes 26 miles (more or less) to deliver water to them.


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## goshengirl (Dec 18, 2010)

*Andi said:


> I see rolling black outs ... coming soon. (just a fact)


I've been wondering about this... and why we haven't heard more about it...


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## Tweto (Nov 26, 2011)

CulexPipiens said:


> Depends on how they work. If the town water requires pumps to pressurize the water lines or lift it in the towers and for whatever reason the pumps can't work then no water. Could be running out of gas, no electricity, mechanical failure and no one to perform the repair/maintenance, etc.
> 
> *Sewer is usally grravity only*... at least up to a certain point but from somewhere it has to collect and get pumped into a treatment facility. Again, no pumps and eventually it will fill up and that becomes not only a mess but a clear health hazard too.
> 
> If you're on your own well and septic, then you're isolated as long as you can keep your well working and your septic system flowing.


 I don't know of a town of any size that does not have to pump sewage some where in the system. If your house is in the wrong section of sewage lines,and then there was a power outage, sewage would start to back up into peoples houses. I could see a property becoming unlivable if this went on to long.


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## db2469 (Jun 11, 2012)

Tweto said:


> I don't know of a town of any size that does not have to pump sewage some where in the system. If your house is in the wrong section of sewage lines,and then there was a power outage, sewage would start to back up into peoples houses. I could see a property becoming unlivable if this went on to long.


So, are you saying that the sewage WILL back up into our homes when there is no power for weeks or months at a time as in a total collapse scenario?
DB


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## Turtle (Dec 10, 2009)

db2469 said:


> So, are you saying that the sewage WILL back up into our homes when there is no power for weeks or months at a time as in a total collapse scenario?
> DB


I seem to recall someone on here saying that it happened to them in a matter of_ days_ when they lost power.

I think Andi makes a great point: it could very well be the loss of utilities that causes enough upheaval to lead to SHTF.


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

"So, are you saying that the sewage WILL back up into our homes when there is no power for weeks or months at a time as in a total collapse scenario?"

We can not answer that without knowing the lay-of-the-land. If you are on a hill you are OK. If you are in a lower spot than other houses around you then you are in trouble. If your town uses water towers that means more sewer back-up(because water could still be used for awhile after the sewer pumps quit).


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## BillS (May 30, 2011)

*Andi said:


> Utilities when the SHTF ...
> 
> To be honest things about to change with the power ... At the end of this year the number of coal fire power plant going down is unreal... I know the one my dad worked out at, is on its last leg. (per new regs)
> 
> ...


I don't think there will be rolling black outs. The utilities will be forced to bid on electricity from other sources and rates will go sky high.

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/05/22/obamas-war-on-coal-hits-your-electric-bill/

"The market-clearing price for new 2015 capacity - almost all natural gas - was $136 per megawatt. That's eight times higher than the price for 2012, which was just $16 per megawatt. In the mid-Atlantic area covering New Jersey, Delaware, Pennsylvania, and DC the new price is $167 per megawatt. For the northern Ohio territory served by FirstEnergy, the price is a shocking $357 per megawatt."


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## BillS (May 30, 2011)

So when the electrical grid goes down you'd better fill up your remaining water containers and do it quickly. You can't fill garbage cans too high because they don't have the strength to hold water. We bought a water bob to put in our bath tub. It's like a big sealed bag that holds about 80 gallons of water.


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## SimpleJoys (Apr 28, 2012)

This is really scary to think about. I'm glad y'all posted about it so I can think about it while there's time to work around it rather than thinking about it when the shit hits a lot more than just the fan.


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## JayJay (Nov 23, 2010)

BillS said:


> So when the electrical grid goes down you'd better fill up your remaining water containers and do it quickly. You can't fill garbage cans too high because they don't have the strength to hold water. We bought a water bob to put in our bath tub. It's like a big sealed bag that holds about 80 gallons of water.


I used the plastic 45 gallon trash cans with wheels from Lowe's for months filled with water---just last summer transferred that water to 30 gallon water drums.
They worked fine. In fact, the water was pretty clean being stored in there for about a year. Not drinkable, but I would have washed with it!!!!
It was usable for a Berkey.


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## SimpleJoys (Apr 28, 2012)

This is really scary to think about. I'm glad y'all posted about it so I can think about it while there's time to work around it rather than thinking about it when the shit hits a lot more than just the fan.

Edited to add: if the sewage systems starting back up, it wouldn't take long for epidemics of typhoid fever and cholera to start, would it?


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## JayJay (Nov 23, 2010)

SimpleJoys said:


> This is really scary to think about. I'm glad y'all posted about it so I can think about it while there's time to work around it rather than thinking about it when the shit hits a lot more than just the fan.
> 
> Edited to add: if the sewage systems starting back up, it wouldn't take long for epidemics of typhoid fever and cholera to start, would it?


I read on another topic about sewage backup and remember being led to a link with a device to put in the toilet to prevent backup?
Can't recall the link, etc..but maybe someone here knows the device.
We aren't sewer, but if we were, it'd be nice to have 3 on hand--three toilets here. What about sinks and tubs?? We have 6 of those!!!:gaah:


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## BillS (May 30, 2011)

SimpleJoys said:


> This is really scary to think about. I'm glad y'all posted about it so I can think about it while there's time to work around it rather than thinking about it when the shit hits a lot more than just the fan.
> 
> Edited to add: if the sewage systems starting back up, it wouldn't take long for epidemics of typhoid fever and cholera to start, would it?


If I remember right you get cholera from sewage contamination in drinking water. People who get their water from rivers need to be aware that people upstream from them might use the river as a sewer.


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## Magus (Dec 1, 2008)

Good job lately BillS, keep up the good work!

Utilites huh?
deep well, check.
Wood stove, check.
Honey bucket, check.
Solar battery charger flash lights and short wave, check.

No internet blows though.


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## Tweto (Nov 26, 2011)

db2469 said:


> So, are you saying that the sewage WILL back up into our homes when there is no power for weeks or months at a time as in a total collapse scenario?
> DB


As I said in my post, if you are on the *wrong section* of sewage line, yes sewage could back-up into your house. I would have no way of knowing if you are on that section of sewage line.

I have trouble thinking of a worse situation then a prepper with a basement full of supplies and then have the sewer back-up in a SHTF scenario and ruin everything.


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## db2469 (Jun 11, 2012)

Not only supplies but I plan on living in mine!
DB


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## The_Blob (Dec 24, 2008)

it's called a backflow prevention valve, and they're pretty cheap:

http://www.backwater-valves.com/


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## db2469 (Jun 11, 2012)

Good to know Blob!


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

"it's called a backflow prevention valve, and they're pretty cheap:"

One of the local towns require these on all new houses or renovations.


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## Well_Driller (Jun 3, 2012)

The backflow valve is a good idea, I know of someone that happened to a few years back, lost power for a while and the pumping stations went down. Sewage backed up into the house and it was a real mess. Crap all over the place. If I were them, I think I would have just moved..... nasty...


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## JayJay (Nov 23, 2010)

The_Blob said:


> it's called a backflow prevention valve, and they're pretty cheap:
> 
> http://www.backwater-valves.com/


Thanks The Blob.


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