# CFL Bulbs



## AKPrepper (Mar 18, 2011)

I don't know if this has been discussed elsewhere on the forum, but if it has, please excuse this post. I've yet to figure out why it's in our best interest to switch to CFL bulbs. I'm sure the PTB think it's in our best interest :nuts:, but this old boy ain't buying it. I plan on stocking up on more of the good old reliable bulbs I have now. At least I won't have to go through the below I cut and pasted from the EPA site. I live in Alaska.....this whole open window and air out room and leave heating system off for several hours just ain't happening when it's -20 outside!! 




Before Cleanup
•Have people and pets leave the room.
•Air out the room for 5-10 minutes by opening a window or door to the outdoor environment. 
•Shut off the central forced air heating/air-conditioning system, if you have one.
•Collect materials needed to clean up broken bulb: 
◦stiff paper or cardboard;
◦sticky tape;
◦damp paper towels or disposable wet wipes (for hard surfaces); and
◦a glass jar with a metal lid or a sealable plastic bag.

During Cleanup
•DO NOT VACUUM. Vacuuming is not recommended unless broken glass remains after all other cleanup steps have been taken. Vacuuming could spread mercury-containing powder or mercury vapor.
•Be thorough in collecting broken glass and visible powder.
•Place cleanup materials in a sealable container.

After Cleanup
•Promptly place all bulb debris and cleanup materials outdoors in a trash container or protected area until materials can be disposed of properly. Avoid leaving any bulb fragments or cleanup materials indoors.
•If practical, continue to air out the room where the bulb was broken and leave the heating/air conditioning system shut off for several hours.


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## JayJay (Nov 23, 2010)

I used the CFL..for 18 months..one broke, a couple did burn out...and I didn't save one cent on electric bill..trust me, I read my meter.
There was no change when using and there's been no change since removing them..
I also read of house fires when the bulbs exploded/burst...and I knew mine were gonna be replaced at that point..I just did it faster..like that day.
I also read the companies that manufacture will continue to supply from the warehouses as long as the supply lasts. I know one thing--someone will be charged for the burned out disposal...guess who that will be??
And there will be those burying them in their yards to prevent paying.
-you can't fix stupid.

I have been supplying this house for two years--I have 115 at this time.
4/$1 at Dollar General.


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## Bigdog57 (Oct 9, 2008)

CFL's do have their uses - I switched for room lighting that is left on for a good time - I DO see a savings on the E-bill, but it'll take a long time to recoup cost of bulbs.
If used for 'occasional' lighting, like closets and bathrooms, they'll have a shorter life cycle - it's the "ON-OFF" cycling that kills CFLs. My Incandescents last a couple to a few months. The CFLs in major rooms last a couple years. In the long run, they DO save money.
The light quality of CFL bulbs has been improved, and the better ones do come on <almost> immediately, and have good light color and level. But some are still slow to fully illuminate and have poor color - you have to be careful when choosing.
I don't buy the "extreme cleanup" BS. I haven't broken one yet, but will apply standard US Navy Hazardous Vacuum Tube Cleanup methods, which don't involve making my home a major "Toxic Waste Superfund" area.


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## Davarm (Oct 22, 2011)

I guess I am an exception, I hate the ideal of defending the CFL's but I saw big savings in my bill. I think the savings came from running the central air less to compensate for the smaller heat load on the house during the Texas summers.

I do hate the ideal of someone mandating the products that I buy and justifying it with bogus and fabricated "facts".


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## Tweto (Nov 26, 2011)

Davarm said:


> I guess I am an exception, I hate the ideal of defending the CFL's but I saw big savings in my bill. I think the savings came from running the central air less to compensate for the smaller heat load on the house during the Texas summers.
> 
> I do hate the ideal of someone mandating the products that I buy and justifying it with bogus and fabricated "facts".


I replaced over 40 of the standard light bulbs with the new CFL's bulbs about 2 years ago. I checked my electric bill for the last 5 years and my total power usage has gone down. It is very hard to say how much the CFL's have lowered my bills, but I can say that my bills have not gone up.

1 bulb went bad an 2 didn't work put of the box.


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## gypsysue (Mar 27, 2010)

We use CFLs with our off-grid solar electric power system. They use way less power and we're able to have brighter rooms and use more lights because their power draw is substantially less than incandescent bulbs. We used to have to use Oil lamps some in the winter because the system couldn't keep up with the power draw of conventional incandescent bulbs. For the last 8 years we've been using CFLs and now some of the new LED bulbs. 

Sorry, but I wouldn't go back, even if we do have to take precautions if we ever break a bulb. We've had a few burn out, but never broke one.


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## partdeux (Aug 3, 2011)

I use CFL in some areas and incandescent in other areas. The outdoor garage lights are on dusk to dawn, I put in the lowest wattage CFL's there. Kids bathroom def CFL. Master bath, nothing but lots of high wattage incad! Depending on where and use, they each have their use. We have seen a significant drop in electricity.


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## Bigdog57 (Oct 9, 2008)

I made the error of getting a certain brand of CFL that was made with a smooth casing to resemble an incandescent - put two inthe gunroom overhead fixture - lousy! Had to wait a good two minutes before I could enter the room once turned 'on'. But I went back tot he 'curly' type I usually use - much mo' bettah! Not quite as bright as incandescent (they NEVER match their 'rating') but I can have good light almost immediately.
Just gotta select the right type.
Some people like the extreme white - I do not, too harsh. The 'yellow' type are too dim.
But I found early on if I used two of the 'white' and two of the 'yellow' in my livingroom four-bulb fixture, the overall light level was okay. Those early bulbs have all been changed out now for better brands.
I am keeping an eye on the LED bulbs - but they are still too limited and expensive. They need to be better developed - better color and intensity - and MUST come down in price. Cheapest I have seen is about twelve bucks apiece- with very mixed reviews. The $40 LEDs also have mixed reviews.


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## musketjim (Dec 7, 2011)

We've mixed and matched our lights. We only have a couple CFL's but we really use LED bulbs. Just need to aim them a bit (like headlights). We also have incandescent bulbs. We haven't watched power usage to much because we started carrying chickens thru the winter, lights, heated water. 

The whole world sucks, America sucks a lot less and Alaska don't suck at all.


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## dahur (Dec 18, 2009)

I had all CFL's in Michigan, and when I moved here to New Mexico 3 years ago, the very first day in this house I changed out out every single bulb to CFL. It has made a difference in my usage, and they last a lot longer (for me).
I have some dimmable ones that work just fine. 
1/4 the wattage for the same amount of light seems to me would make a difference in anyone's usage.

As soon as the LED ones come down, I'm changing out to those.

Maybe some of you have one of these.... Plug it in your outlet, then plug whatever into it. Shows actual volts, amps, watts, Hz, and KWH being used. Pretty handy. 









Since there is so much BS out there, I wanted to verify the wattage on these CFL's, and my appliance's too. My 23 w CFL's 
(100w eq.) are coming in at 22.9w

These "Kill a Watt" tools are great for tracking down those phantom loads, and THOSE make a difference also.


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## Jimmy24 (Apr 20, 2011)

dahur said:


> I had all CFL's in Michigan, and when I moved here to New Mexico 3 years ago, the very first day in this house I changed out out every single bulb to CFL. It has made a difference in my usage, and they last a lot longer (for me).
> I have some dimmable ones that work just fine.
> *1/4 the wattage for the same amount of light seems to me would make a difference in anyone's usage.*As soon as the LED ones come down, I'm changing out to those.


It's fact. :congrat: Some would say otherwise, but watts are watts and your watthour meter WILL NOT turn as fast when less watts run thru it. Anything else is pure bovine excrement :ignore:....I worked with them for nearly 30 years and have heard every story on the books....just saying

Jimmy


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## HoppeEL4 (Dec 29, 2010)

I am with you, I hate the idea of commerce being mandated to me and mine. I want to have choices and it ticks me off to no end to force me into buying something. I am stocking up as much as possible. We have a decent supply, but need more. I might use the compacts for some outdoor lights, but nothing more.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

gypsysue said:


> We use CFLs with our off-grid solar electric power system. They use way less power and we're able to have brighter rooms and use more lights because their power draw is substantially less than incandescent bulbs. For the last 8 years we've been using CFLs and now some of the new LED bulbs.


Sue, please tell us what inverters you are using. 
I have not used CFL's "long-term" with modified sine wave inverters, but I have read in several places that CFL's don't particularly like the modified sine wave. Something to do with the internal ballasts charging and discharging unevenly... ?

I have run 120 volt LED bulbs on modified sine wave, and they seem to not care at all (typical for how an LED operates).

However, all of the LED bulbs I have been buying lately are all 12 volt, as they are VERY easy to find, inexpensive and run right off of a 12 volt battery with no inverter. I have several 12 volt CFL bulbs (from an RV supply house) and they are not "super bright", but much easier to "read under" than LED bulbs.

I hope to eventually have all lighting be 12 volt. I will still need 12 volt/120 volt inverters for appliances and such, but I am trying to eliminate all 120 volt lighting.


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## elder (Oct 25, 2008)

Just a thought. Energy savings are nil in the heating months, especially if you have electric heat. All energy dies a heat death so incandescent bulbs just help satisfy the thermostat in the winter.


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## ManOutdoors (Dec 15, 2008)

I've been using the CFL for a long, long time with out any problems. I've seen lower energy costs and I have had most of them for several years. They aren't any more dangerous than the florescent tubes they have been using in offices, stores, etc for ages. All the hoopla about the "dangers" of CFLs is just a bunch of hot air intended to get people stirred up.

Look!!! The sky is falling!! :sssh:

(Heck, I even use them in the fish tank hood. Even with the added moisture they still last forever.)


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## Servelan (Mar 21, 2010)

AKPrepper said:


> I don't know if this has been discussed elsewhere on the forum, but if it has, please excuse this post. I've yet to figure out why it's in our best interest to switch to CFL bulbs. I'm sure the PTB think it's in our best interest :nuts:, but this old boy ain't buying it.


We are gradually reducing our electrical load, and don't want CFLs because of all the attendant problems. We've tested a couple of kinds of LED 'bulbs' (made with multiple LEDs) and there is one for $10 at Home Depot that will run for years using very little power; it has a nice white light (you need to be looking at the light produced with LED bulbs because there are white ones, yellowish ones, and bluish ones and while the differences are subtle, they do make a difference). The one that had twice the price and supposedly twice the light didn't (it's going back to the store).


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## StillStanding (Jan 24, 2009)

Well folks whether you like CFLs or not is something you have to decide for yourself. I have a house full of them so that tells you where I stand. To be sure the earlier CFLs had all kinds of problems -- I got my first one in 1997 and I know. Poor color rendition, short life, poor fixture compatibility, electrical noise, etc etc etc.

There are some crap CFLs on the market that still exhibit various flaws.

But look to the alternative energy crowd for guidance as their technologies are the ones that speak to the prepared individual. Conservation and load reduction are the key to living independent of the grid and that's just as true for standby power applications as it is for solar etc. I can run all the indoor lighting in my house on roughly 500 watts which is practical for an inverter or small generator setup. For me and for many people that means there really isn't a need for the more involved lo-tech lighting systems that used to be necessary. I don't have gas lights in my house any more and I don't have as many oil lamps as I used to. The LED flashlights and glow sticks are enough to cover the transition to the genset and a small genset is all I need.

On incandescent lights I'd be pushing 3000 watts for lighting alone. Seems like a lot but most houses average 4 60w lights per room and that adds up quickly.

I used to be a purist and want the dedicated fluorescent fixtures instead of CFLs but after a period of years and the hassle of ballast replacement and the problems with declining availability of some of the more specialized tubes I came to the conclusion that the CFLs are the answer for general residential lighting.


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## gypsysue (Mar 27, 2010)

LincTex said:


> Sue, please tell us what inverters you are using.
> I have not used CFL's "long-term" with modified sine wave inverters, but I have read in several places that CFL's don't particularly like the modified sine wave. Something to do with the internal ballasts charging and discharging unevenly... ?


We're using a Modified Sine Wave Inverter with our CFLs and we've never had a problem with the lights not working on it. If we have it set to "search for load" and nothing else is running but a 3-watt CFL, it can have trouble kicking the inverter on. But we usually have it set on regular load.

The only problem we've ever had with a CFL is that when it's cold they come on dim and take a while to brighten. That's why we have an LED bulb outside on the porch. It comes right to life even when it's below zero.



> Elder wrote: Just a thought. Energy savings are nil in the heating months, especially if you have electric heat. All energy dies a heat death so incandescent bulbs just help satisfy the thermostat in the winter.


It depends. A person might use more running all those incandescents than they'd save on their power bill. We heat with firewood that we cut around our place, so other than chainsaw gas, our heat is 'free'.

A person with electric heat could figure out the difference in watts between their heaters and the bulbs. It would be interesting to know the results. I can't say you're wrong, Elder, but it would be good to do the math and see.


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## Viking (Mar 16, 2009)

We've been using CFL's ever since they became available. Some have been great, some didn't last a week and others got hot stunk and almost fell apart. They are not good for a quick look outside in the dark, especially when it's cold outside as even with new CFL's it takes about 15 minutes to get fully bright. As soon as we can we will be changing to LED's, maybe stopping the use of CFL's due to a couple of reasons, one being that some get yellow after while and no longer give sufficient light and the second reason being some do have an annoying high frequency ring to them. I've been thinking of getting high pressure sodium lamps for outside floods because for the low wattage they put out a lot of light and as opposed to mercury vapor they are easier on the eyes.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

Viking said:


> I've been thinking of getting high pressure sodium lamps for outside floods because for the low wattage they put out a lot of light and as opposed to mercury vapor they are easier on the eyes.


I have Fluorex outside sentry dusk-'til-dawn lighting. It seems to be the best light for the lowest energy cost.


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## elder (Oct 25, 2008)

gypsysue said:


> It depends. A person might more running all those incandescents than they'd save on their power bill. We heat with firewood that we cut around our place, so other than chainsaw gas, our heat is 'free'.
> 
> A person with electric heat could figure out the difference in watts between their heaters and the bulbs. It would be interesting to know the results. I can't say you're wrong, Elder, but it would be good to do the math and see.


In engineering we use the "black box" theory and analyze all the "goesinnas" and "goesouttas". Every watt going into a room dies a heat death unless it has an escape from the box. Heat loss would be the same for all sources but if drapes were open the light that shines out the window would represent a loss.


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## ZoomZoom (Dec 18, 2009)

Bigdog57 said:


> My Incandescents last a couple to a few months.


Can you elaborate? I get years out of my incandescent bulbs.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

ZoomZoom said:


> Can you elaborate? I get years out of my incandescent bulbs.


The old ones, yes. All of the incandescents available "nowadays" seem to last only a couple months. VERY poor quality, anymore


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## elder (Oct 25, 2008)

I am stockpiling Sylvania and GE long life bulbs from WalMart and have had good luck with them so far.


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## Bigdog57 (Oct 9, 2008)

I have had low life from I-bulbs for twenty years - in my prior home and in the one I have had now for eleven years. A couple months and they 'pop'. I got tired of constant replacement.
The CFL's do last longer, though it depends on useage.


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## Viking (Mar 16, 2009)

LincTex said:


> I have Fluorex outside sentry dusk-'til-dawn lighting. It seems to be the best light for the lowest energy cost.


I have a high powered fluorescent flood that's on the east side of our home, I think it's rated at about 65 watts, it does put out a lot of light over a large area but it too takes a few seconds to come to full power. It's got a photo cell but I disconnected it and just use a switch in case I heard something and felt the surprise of a light coming on would be to my advantage.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

Viking said:


> It's got a photo cell but I disconnected it and just use a switch in case I heard something and felt the surprise of a light coming on would be to my advantage.


Then you just need a really high power Halogen floodlight - 500 watts or so.


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## patkinney1 (Nov 7, 2011)

LincTex said:


> The old ones, yes. All of the incandescents available "nowadays" seem to last only a couple months. VERY poor quality, anymore


go to a maintenance werehouse like Grainger Industrial Supply you will need to open a account but they have what you are looking for. bulbs that last 3-5 time as long as reg. bulbs


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

patkinney1 said:


> go to a maintenance werehouse like Grainger Industrial Supply you will need to open a account but they have what you are looking for. bulbs that last 3-5 time as long as reg. bulbs


Home Depot (and others) sell "rough service" bulbs... they always last much longer than regular bulbs.


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