# Bug out dogs



## HenryRules (Jul 12, 2013)

Alright so I've been reading and haven't seen a thing on how you train your dogs. Even searched it for a bit. The thought came to me as we were looking at getting a German shepherd puppy last week.(ultimately we had too small a space to fit that much energy) I thought are other prepers training their dogs to military precision as I'd like to? If you're running from the government or raiders or whatever is the dog going to give you away as you're hidden? Just some thoughts. Maybe some tips for those of you that have trained them.


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## CrackbottomLouis (May 20, 2012)

I think having a pet you are responsible for in that situation is more of a pain in the butt than its worth. I would certainly want a dog that wouldn't bark, could retrieve game, would cornrner and worry game till I caught up, and not be gun shy or a camp thief. The last one is probably the most important. Can't stand a damn camp thief dog. I've hunted with dogs a good bit. A working dog is not a pet and should not be treated like you treat fido. I have trained the gun shy out of dogs in the puppy stage with a cap gun let off by their head as they begin to eat. Associate bang with meal time and all that. For the rest I'd figure out what you want the dog to do (guard,attack, hunting) then have it trained in that area by a pro. A jack of all trades dog is rare and takes a lot of work.


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

> I think having a pet you are responsible for in that situation is more of a pain in the butt than its worth.


I agree. The risk/benefit leans heavily on the no-dog side.


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## FatTire (Mar 20, 2012)

Dogs offer a lot of intangeable benefits, positive attitude, companionship, a chuckle now and then.. so according to my calculus, a well trained dog would be a valuable asset.

the key here is, well trained, and we are all going to define that differently. for me, i want a good k9 citizen, non-agressive, dog and people friendly, follows commands, ect. so to sum up, a good dog now would still be a good dog in a WROL situation, IMHO


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## SmokeyNJ (Jun 12, 2013)

Best off with a well rained and proficient hunting dog, still has the pack protection sense as a sentry an is going to be an obedient dog more than just a basic pet, but NOT going to be Cairo by any stretch of the imagination.


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## Tribal Warlord Thug (Jan 27, 2009)

FatTire said:


> Dogs offer a lot of intangeable benefits, positive attitude, companionship, a chuckle now and then.. so according to my calculus, a well trained dog would be a valuable asset.
> 
> the key here is, well trained, and we are all going to define that differently. for me, i want a good k9 citizen, non-agressive, dog and people friendly, follows commands, ect. so to sum up, a good dog now would still be a good dog in a WROL situation, IMHO


exactlly what i think........well trained dogs are an asset to you and yours......these will give their lives to protect their 'pack'.....pedegree and training are something that is money well spent as another 'prep' item for loyal companions such as these.................









........my rotty's could take down game for our group, saving valuable ammo and risking less of the groups 'human' to accidents in the field......:beercheer:


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## ZoomZoom (Dec 18, 2009)

IMHO

If you're bugging out in stealth mode, a dog may not be a good thing to have around. No real guarantees they won't bark.

Otherwise, I think a good dog is a great addition. Their senses are much keener than ours, they're faster and a proper dog is a good addition to your defenses. 

Even now without any event going on, my dog warns me of something coming (that I never heard or saw), can catch varmints and nobody, including myself is allowed to grab my kids with ill intent without the dog being on you (with teeth) very quickly.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

ZoomZoom said:


> IMHO
> 
> If you're bugging out in stealth mode, a dog may not be a good thing to have around. No real guarantees they won't bark.


A sport dog bark collar is a good thing to have for this. We use a citronella one with Winter and even when its not turned on she will not bark.


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## millertimedoneright (May 13, 2013)

I own hunting dogs and wouldn't get rid of them for nothing...if the shtf they will become a great asset...they are trained and listen to my commands...one outing with them can feed me and my family for a few weeks...I have hog dogs and my treeing dog...


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## Woody (Nov 11, 2008)

I’m not sure what you mean by military precision. My black lab will listen to my commands and do as requested in the field. Keep going, closer, left, right, right there, hunt ‘em up… Haven’t gotten her to bark on command but she is only 20 months old. She knows to bark when something is up and not just howl at the wind. When I hear her bark I take stock of it.

I feel she would be a great asset if I was ever out and about. She can hear, smell and see much better than I can. Friendly when needed and being black she is almost invisible at night. Someone hearing a big dog bark and not seeing what it is or where it is would be a deterrent.


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## ZoomZoom (Dec 18, 2009)

I like this dog.


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

Most people will own, or not own, a dog for reasons having nothing to do with prepping. If you have a dog then you need to stock food for it.

My immediate family has a dog and my extended family has a lot of dogs. Our dog food stocks are not as extensive as our people food stocks, but we do have some and plan to add more over time.


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## Cabowabo (Nov 6, 2012)

Something to consider about training dogs is that they are like Humans. Their must be a consistent level of training. When something is going down you don't fall back to the level of training you've received, you fall back to the lowest level of training you've mastered. Same thing with Dogs. If your going to train your dogs to police or mil specifications. Those dogs need to be worked consistently its not just a take a dog to a class train them and then leave them on the couch. You need to take them out and do bite training, or whatever training you need to teach them so they remain competent.


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

This thread is about "Bug out dogs". You are going to carry food for these dogs? These dogs will never make noise at a "bad time"? These dogs will never scare away any potential "food" animals? Are you planning to use your dog as food? 
You can never have complete control over any animal. You can never know for sure how any animal will react to certain circumstances. If you have a well trained dog and you are under alot of stress, won't your dog feel that stress also? And wouldn't that cause you dog to act in an unknown manner?


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

So if you see a dog as more trouble than it is worth, don't own one. I already own one, for reasons having nothing to do with prepping, so I feel a responsibility to care for it in an emergency.

As for a "Bug Out Dog" I don't see that making any sense. You can't toss a dog into storage and ignore it until a disaster happens. Bug In, Bug Out, no disaster occurs at all, you've either got a dog or you don't.


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## tsrwivey (Dec 31, 2010)

If I have to bug out, I won't be on foot. I have no intentions of running from anything, my running days are behind me says my bad knee.  If we have to bug out, we plan & have done so in our 5th wheel. Our 5th wheel is stocked with everything we need for the care of our dogs, including duct tape that will keep the noise down to a minimum.


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## MetalPrepper (Nov 25, 2012)

My dogs are part of the family....they do bark though (aussies)....on the other hand they could herd me up some cows or goats....


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## ras1219como (Jan 15, 2013)

I've said it many times before and my answer will always be the same. My 4 year old, extremely loyal, GSD is coming with me no matter what. He has his own bug out bag, saddle bag style, and is accustomed to wearing it when it is full. He is very protective and alert and will be an asset, regardless of potential barking. He is very intelligent and has been trained. I have prepped extra food, water, and supplies for my dog. He's a member of the family and he simply will not be left behind.


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## Jimthewagontraveler (Feb 8, 2012)

Great white pyrenees.
Their only flaw in my opinion is they are white[how hard is that to solve?]
They can carry drag draft defend sneak or alert for you.
They are the oldest dog breed currently alive.
They were bred under very harsh conditions [that would be called inhumane today] by a people who live like the amish [ but with hidden full auto weapons].
Any dog that the german high command wanted to exterminate has to be pretty good.
During the war they would be sent over the Pryenees mountains unsupervised to smuggle chocolate silk or children.
In their native country they will use 3 studs to hunt and kill brown bear.
And yet my daughter as a baby learned to walk by hanging on to the dogs butt fur.
The one that is my bond mate at this time grew up when I was raising baby chickens in a huge aquarium in my bed room as part of an experiment.
To this day if you strangle a chicken near him you had better be fast and quiet about it.
Then again last summer he barked after I gave him the be silent command so I beat the he## out of him and he reacted like he was dying.
Oh did I mention I was beating him with a stalk of Johnson grass?
Belay all that pap about dogs being bad in a shtf.
There was a reason that primitive people went to the trouble of having dogs and it wasnt because they were cute and cuddly.
As far as military precision POO. the military has used dogs some but the mindset is just wrong.
The american military has used pyrs in the past and before they even started training them they cut off the ''EXTRA TOES''!?!?!?
If/when we have a shtf thinking military will get a lot of people dead.
Think primitive!
Think tribal!
How many other breeds of dogs can be trusted unsupervised and unfed for a week at a time with a bunch of stuped lay down while you kill them with a spoon animals[sheep are the dumbest animal I ever met]
Say what you want about dogs I dont care!
Just realise when you talk about dogs you are not talking about Pryenees.
When is the last time you heard of a pyreenes attacking the owner?
Ask the sheep owners in texas what breed of dog they brought in when dobermans and german shepards did not do the job.
Dont let that lazy apperance fool you.
Now for the bad side Pyrs will NEVER drive the herd where you want [unless it is not their protected animal and its a kill hunt]
Some Prys are real genenitic throwbacks they might hate it when your wife rearanges the furniture or the ceiling fan is suddely turned off when it has run the first 3 years of their life [I wont neglect that training again!!!]
They DO NEED to be around people who wear uniforms when they are young mailman,police,army whatever.
I trust my Pyr more than ANY human I know.
More than my Percheron draft horses [ who have flat ran a quarter mile to stomp a cow that threatened me]
When a PYR tail makes a tight double curl and they rumble deep and quiet it still makes my hair stand on end.
I used to run with the pack at night and have personally seen what happens next.
Put 10 Pyrs up against 10 large wolves and I believe the wolves would run because the pyr has know the all powerfull humans for centuries, they have known food when hurt for centuries.
Gun knife or dog? No contest guns run empty knives only kill what I can reach.
Bullets wont track for a week and then kill!
I have seen what happens when an idiot shoots a pyr who is in battle mode.
So like I have said before on this forum if you see a old person all alone be polite but do not run its to late.
The children are watching.


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## lazydaisy67 (Nov 24, 2011)

Each person would probably have their "favorite" breed that they've gotten for some purpose or another and have trained (or not) to some extent and LOVE that breed. I've had a lot of different breeds big and small and they all have their faults and each dog regardless of their breed is different from breeding to personality. You have to evaluate how much time you're willing to put into any dog, probably more so than what you want the dog to be or do. The bottom line is it really doesn't matter if it's a Yorkie or a Mastiff they have to be trained. That means hours and hours and hours, not just toss a ball after work for 10 minutes twice a week. My GSD is just plain naughty, but not because he's inherently bad, but because I simply don't have the time to do more with him. He's a great friend for my kids, he would kill to protect them, but a police dog he ain't. Not his fault, it's mine. Would he go scrounge up some grub if we were hoofing it across America? Probably for himself, but I doubt he'd drag a deer carcass to our camp site for us. Would he bark at inappropriate times? Absolutely. More than likely if people with big guns are after you, you gotta go in survival mode and not worry about what your dog is doing. Don't fool yourself into thinking that if "they" are after you that they're going to tolerate a big dog coming at them. They will just shoot them and keep coming after you. In that type of situation your beloved companion will probably just serve as a head start for you. Sad to say, but it's my opinion.


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## Jimthewagontraveler (Feb 8, 2012)

lazydaisy67 said:


> Each person would probably have their "favorite" breed that they've gotten for some purpose or another and have trained (or not) to some extent and LOVE that breed. I've had a lot of different breeds big and small and they all have their faults and each dog regardless of their breed is different from breeding to personality. You have to evaluate how much time you're willing to put into any dog, probably more so than what you want the dog to be or do. The bottom line is it really doesn't matter if it's a Yorkie or a Mastiff they have to be trained. That means hours and hours and hours, not just toss a ball after work for 10 minutes twice a week. My GSD is just plain naughty, but not because he's inherently bad, but because I simply don't have the time to do more with him. He's a great friend for my kids, he would kill to protect them, but a police dog he ain't. Not his fault, it's mine. Would he go scrounge up some grub if we were hoofing it across America? Probably for himself, but I doubt he'd drag a deer carcass to our camp site for us. Would he bark at inappropriate times? Absolutely. More than likely if people with big guns are after you, you gotta go in survival mode and not worry about what your dog is doing. Don't fool yourself into thinking that if "they" are after you that they're going to tolerate a big dog coming at them. They will just shoot them and keep coming after you. In that type of situation your beloved companion will probably just serve as a head start for you. Sad to say, but it's my opinion.


Head start works for me.
And if he doesnt break off attack on command that furthers the genetic code.
Genetic codeing done the old way take centuries to breed in and quite a long time to breed out.
I just looked up dog attacks owner and dog fatality.
Interesting reading.
And it does remind me of one thing a pyr puppie comes home at 6 weeks not before not after and if that is not convienient for you dont get one and this hurts but no rescue dogs either its a planned event or not at all.
Go look learn.


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## ras1219como (Jan 15, 2013)

Jim, 

I obviously favor the GSD but have never had a Pyrenees so I have no opinion about them. But I absolutely agree with the point you made about primitive people. Dogs of all shapes and sizes have been with man for thousands and thousands of years. There is a reason for that...they're useful! Herding, hunting, retrieving, drafting, tracking, protection, and a myriad of other uses not to mention companionship. 

And my GSD, like your Pyrenees, is great with kids. He runs himself ragged watching over them and (usually unsuccessfully) tries to herd them! His tolerance level is amazing especially when it comes to toddlers hanging all over him and "petting" him rather roughly. 

All in all dogs are great and would more often than not be an asset to keep around post SHTF


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## Jimthewagontraveler (Feb 8, 2012)

What is a GSD?
I apologise if you stated it earlier.


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## ZoomZoom (Dec 18, 2009)

GSD = German Shepard Dog.


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## Jimthewagontraveler (Feb 8, 2012)

DUH THANK YOU.
Now I think I will do some home work because it has been years since I chose pyrs.
I llove the coloration perfect for hiding


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## Jimthewagontraveler (Feb 8, 2012)

German shepherds and SH TF
Dog fatalities for German shepherds in the United States

First fatality February 7, 1947 Walter Junior victims age 4 years the boy was killed while sledding let's remember 1947 was the end of the war in which the German Shepherd was popularized by the Nazi regime

1948 baby girl surname may girl was dragged from her Bassonette and killed The girls father said the dog had never been vicious but was jealous of his other child

1958 victims name Michael Kaminski victims age 3 years dog was six months old and had been acquired by the boy's family two weeks prior to the attack family said the dog had not shown any previous aggression

1967 Jean Anthony Goodman victims age 5 years his brother Kenneth Goodman age 4 years the attack occurred behind the boys home and involve at least two dogs he had played with before

1971 Heidi Suffock cool victims age 21 months the children's parents left her in a pan with the dog which was owned by a friend 15 minutes later the baby was found bleeding from multiple bites the baby died two hours later at the hospital

1972 able valdivia victims age 2 years killed by the four-year-old pedigreed dog that belongs to his family

1975 German Shepherd Labrador retriever mix victims name Michael young victims age 5 years the boy was killed after entering a fenced in yard where the seven dogs all five months old were kept

1976 victims name Karen Bash cold victims age 5 days killed after the mother left her alone for one .5 hours with the starving four-month old 15 pound female dog mother was charged with negligent homicide

1977 elkhounds German Shepherd mix victims name Robert Boyd victims age 7 months the boy was killed after being left alone for a few minutes by his deaf babysitter the 11 month old dog entered the boys playpen and the babysitter said the dog was only playing with the child

1989 German Shepherd and possibly a German Shepherd chow chow mix victims name Alexander Jones victims age 3 years the dogs were usually kept in a building behind a storage building but were running free at the time of the attack

1990 victims name Lauren MacLeod victims age 35 years the homeless woman was killed by a police dog that entered a vacant house where she was staying

1996 Rottweiler and German Shepherd victims name Anthony Hunt victims age 4 years few details available

1999 Labrador retriever German Shepherd mix two of them victims name Alyssa Ray Peterson victims age 5 years the family had adopted the two dogs after they were found as strays the girl was alone with the dogs in the backyard when she was bitten the sheriff said that the 50 to 60 pound dogs were not pit bulls or Rottweilers

2001 German Shepherd and or German Shepherd mix victims name Alexander Jared Bennett age 3 days attacked when left alone in a bassinet

2005 Rottweiler German Shepherd next victim's name Robert Schaffer victims age Four years killed by his family's dog when he opened the dogs pen

2007 victims name Linda Mottino victims age 69 years killed by her own dog

2007 German Shepherd dog Doberman pincher victims name Magdalina Silva victims age 95 years killed by her dogs as she went to feed them

2007 German Shepherd dog next victim's name Carson Gilroy victims age 2 years killed when he wandered onto a neighbors property

2010 German Shepherd dog mix Erin Carlson two years killed by his family dog

2010 victims name Shirley blue bird victims age 79 years killed by her own dog which had bitten her on prior occasions

2012 German Shepherd victims name unknown victims age 6 years mauled to death by a medical service dog trained to help a military veteran suffering from post dramatic stress disorder

2013 victims name Rachel Tonneberger victims age 35 years. The attack happened at home involving a male dog registered to her husband. The dog was 100 to 150 pounds in three years old. One neighbor said that the dog has been aggressive and guarded the house. News sources reported that she died four days after the attack however the date given in her obituary was two days after the attack. 

Summary all things considered the German Shepherd comes off pretty well most of them were due to stupidity lack of knowledge or weakness on the side of a human. 
However some of the reported deaths were particularly disturbing due to the dogs having been trained for medical or police work. 

Conclusion: 
It doesn't take long to figure out that an unsupervised German Shepherd is not a reliable animal.


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## Jimthewagontraveler (Feb 8, 2012)

WOW 
I'm not smart enough to post a link here but if someone could I would appreciate it. 
Dogbitelaw.com Dog attacks 1982-2006.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

If we are going down the road of "my breed is better than yours" I'll toss out my $0.02. 

I have a mutt. She is just under a year old and my best bud. Half Pembroke Corgi and half English Springer. Sweet as the dickens as Roo climbs all over her and steals her toys. Also a good alert dog. If a squirrel even thinks about my garden she is on it like stink on sh*t. I just have to teach her that the raspberries are not her personal snacks...

In conclusion... My Mutt ROCKS!


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## Tribal Warlord Thug (Jan 27, 2009)

http://dogbitelaw.com/

:beercheer:


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## prepare_survive_thrive (May 7, 2012)

Jimthewagontraveler said:


> German shepherds and SH TF
> Dog fatalities for German shepherds in the United States
> 
> First fatality February 7, 1947 Walter Junior victims age 4 years the boy was killed while sledding let's remember 1947 was the end of the war in which the German Shepherd was popularized by the Nazi regime
> ...


The training for law enforcement is not conducive to being around children. I think everybody knows that. Conclusion: Train your own dog. I doesn't take long to figure out if you don't trust your dog in supervised- you don't need a dog. I trust every dog I've had more than 95% of the people I meet. Dogs are in my opinion the most reliable being on this planet. People are the least. I understand not everybody will agree with that but everybody is entitled to their opinion.


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## 8thDayStranger (Jan 30, 2013)

The best, most well disciplined, well trained dog for a SHTF situation is ...................

Neither one of these lol


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## musketjim (Dec 7, 2011)

Geek999 said:


> So if you see a dog as more trouble than it is worth, don't own one. I already own one, for reasons having nothing to do with prepping, so I feel a responsibility to care for it in an emergency.
> 
> As for a "Bug Out Dog" I don't see that making any sense. You can't toss a dog into storage and ignore it until a disaster happens. Bug In, Bug Out, no disaster occurs at all, you've either got a dog or you don't.


Excellent answer. I have dogs and will continue to have dogs. That's my choice. 'Nuff Said.:2thumb:


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## Jimthewagontraveler (Feb 8, 2012)

Thank you thug


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## alwaysready (May 16, 2012)

I don't think there is such a thing as a bug out dog. There are not many dogs that can/will protect operating purely on DNA. It takes training and conditioning. This is not a knock on anyone's dog or a breed of dog. It takes a lot of time to prepare a dog for a real life situation and even then it's not a guarantee. Here are three examples of protection.





Schutzhund more sport and routine not all dogs that excel in this sport do well in real life situations.





PSA still sport and routine but has more real life potential.





Dog operating on instinct only no training already showing an aptitude for dealing with real life situations.


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## ras1219como (Jan 15, 2013)

Dogs of any breed are capable of biting. In some cases it may or may not have anything to do with breed, treatment, training, environment etc. there are too many factors involved to draw conclusions based on reported bites. The only dog I've ever been bitten by was a Scottish terrier...I certainly don't have anything against Scottish terriers nor do I think it had anything to do with breed. Ill keep my GSD over any other any day of the week and have no worries about him being with young children. However each dog is an individual and another GSD (or any other dog for that matter) I would have to draw my own conclusions about. 

Now I figure we should end this before it becomes a giant pissing contest about which dogs are better.


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## helicopter5472 (Feb 25, 2013)

Guess I'll do the next best thing to having another dog...I'll pickup 50 rubber piles of dog crap and spread them around the yard and put up signs


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## millertimedoneright (May 13, 2013)

90% of a dogs behavior towards humans and how they listen and act is how they are raised...10% is instinct...even the most well trained dogs can turn on their master but that is usually easy to tell during their training...I've owned many different breeds and I will tell u this their is a big difference in each one...some are just dumb and a pain to train while some are smart and you can teach them just about anything...some tend to be more loyal and some are more selfish...great Pyrenees are a very good breed in my opinion along with gsd and hounds...many more breeds are very smart...in a bug out situation I would personally want either a lab, Pyrenees, or a hound...I have seen a Pyrenees rip a pack of coyotes to shreds when they came to close to his goat herd he was protecting...this same dog would wait about a half mile away from the house on top of a hay bale until his owners daughter would get off the bus so he could walk her safely home...I would use the lab or hound as aids in hunting...the hounds I have now are worth their weight in gold in wild game I get from them


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## mojo4 (Feb 19, 2012)

My dog is the perfect dog for the apocalypse. He is lazy, steals food any chance he gets, he only barks at people dogs squirrels rabbits and when the wind blows or it stops blowing. He likes comfy couches and long naps. He won't chase game, just chase it away. But al least he loves the kids!


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## Wanderer0101 (Nov 8, 2011)

My dog would just view bugging out as an extended hunting trip. She likes that and knows how to conduct herself in such circumstances. She is obedient and protective and her senses are much better than mine. If I'm carrying a gun she knows it's business time. I would add that my dog is a versatile gun dog and so has many useful skills, pointing, retrieving, tracking, vermin killing as well as being a fierce defender of the family.


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## Jimthewagontraveler (Feb 8, 2012)

Oh I am not to worried about this becoming a mines better contest.
In a lot of forums it would but most of us here are ''AMERICANS BY CHOICE''.
And like I was forced to learn while in the military that means if somebody wants to go to all the trouble to buy a flag to take a dump on and then burn it he is expressing his rights to freedom of speech.
BUT if he verbally threatens the flag I own and am proud of AND then makes a move towards it WELL THATS DIFFERENT!!!

Of course I as an American also have the right to raise my prices or deny service to anyone at any time for any reason.
If I have 10 customers in my store I can give 9 of them free product and tell all 10 that I just decided to close the store and have a paid company picnic.
I think the point will be made.

Now I really did come here to post some thing about dogs........Hmmm....
Oh yea.
It is so naturel in my family I alwas forget to tell.
Dogs like most mammels are much better at audio and visual training than one or the other and its not a 50% gain.
It is one of those exponential things so give it a try next time you have a puppy to train.
Later on you will be so impressed with your dog when you control him/her from 50 yards in total silence.
Have fun with it the dog will.


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## machinist (Jul 4, 2012)

I'm not a dog trainer, but my daughter is, so I am learning from her. Like my Dad said, to teach a dog you have to know more than the dog does. 

Some dogs require more OWNER training than others, in our experience. I could never deal with her lovable yet feisty German Shepherd/Coyote mix. He is one heckuva dog, but he is HER dog, period. Shepherds tend to be that way, IMHO. My own have bonded with me and paid little to no attention to what anyone else had to say. 

After having Labs (lovable, very smart), German Shepherds, Collies, Shelties, and Rotts, I would choose a GS for after TSHTF. We presently have a Lab/Rott mix and a pure Rott, and both are assets, especially as a team. But a GS remains my top pick for what they do best. I particularly like their independent thinking. 

We once had a pair of Pit Bull Terriers, but got rid of them in short order. Had to be the dumbest dogs we ever owned, and intent only on killing any animal on the place. I had to give them away to keep my horses from killing them, because they refused to let the horses alone. They do fight well, but I needed something with more intelligence. 

I start with establishing my place as Alpha Dog, by eating in front of them and feeding them AFTER I have finished. It works very well, but must be reinforced with behavior corrections, etc.. Then we go to verbal commands, naming things and behaviors, then combine words into commands. Once they know what "bite" means, and "no", I can tell them No Bite and they get it immediately. Then we work at combined verbal commands with simultaneous hand signals. Finally, hand signals alone will work, once they have established what they mean. The Rotts are very good at this, although kinda hard-headed like a GS.

Any dog you plan to take to a new place, such as a bugout, must be very well trained. Without that, you will have problems. It's more about your relationship with the dog than anything else, IMHO.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

machinist said:


> I'm not a dog trainer, but my daughter is, so I am learning from her. Like my Dad said, to teach a dog you have to know more than the dog does.
> 
> Some dogs require more OWNER training than others, in our experience. I could never deal with her lovable yet feisty German Shepherd/Coyote mix. He is one heckuva dog, but he is HER dog, period. Shepherds tend to be that way, IMHO. My own have bonded with me and paid little to no attention to what anyone else had to say.
> 
> ...


You make a valid point we all need to acknowledge.

Now, folks, lets stop marking our territory and agree to disagree about what is the best breed of dog to have. I don't want to see anyone else lifting their leg to pee on a tree or hydrant!


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## Woody (Nov 11, 2008)

Jimthewagontraveler said:


> Now I really did come here to post some thing about dogs........Hmmm....
> Oh yea.
> It is so naturel in my family I alwas forget to tell.
> Dogs like most mammels are much better at audio and visual training than one or the other and its not a 50% gain.
> ...


I've done that with all my labs. Every command has a verbal and hand/body sign attached. Works like a charm too. It is a great feeling to be able to direct a dog using only your hands/arms/body.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

Woody said:


> I've done that with all my labs. Every command has a verbal and hand/body sign attached. Works like a charm too. It is a great feeling to be able to direct a dog using only your hands/arms/body.


I did this with the 2 spoiled rotten house corgis we had a few years back. Their call back command was "FREE BEER" and/or certain birdcall. I have used verbal and non verbal commands to train every hunting and gun dog I have worked with as well as a few production dogs I've dealt with on set.

Winter is also trained to verbal and non verbal commands. She does well with both and even the cats are picking up some of the non verbal training. Ever seen a cat "sit", "lay" and "roll over" all by hand signals?! Its a great party trick.


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## Momturtle (Nov 2, 2009)

Discussing dogs is like discussing kids. Too many variables to reach concensus isn't it? The key is what you want the dog for ... cuddle bunny comfort dog, staunch guardian, intimidating presence? I have had and trained dogs my whole life and cannot imagine life without them. That being said, it is more important to me to have a dog that is not a liability, in that it trusts me completely and looks to me to tell it the best way to react to situations. A dog that won't stop barking when you tell it to, that bites unprovoked, that dashes off after other dogs or game without control, that ranges far away while walking off lead, and does not come when called -- these are all liabilities in a survival situation. A chihuahua that is well trained and socialized is an excellent watch dog and can be trained to alert you without making a ruckus. Intimidating, no, but useful, yes. I love a good Rottie but a lot of dogs from shutzhund lines have such a high prey drive that it takes a lot of training to keep them safe and useful. Train your dogs, love 'em and take them into as many different situations as you can so they trust you and will not react in a panic in new situations. 

My current dog is a Jindo, a wild-type dog from Korea, a breed I would not recommend for just anyone but she is perfect for me. She is quiet, clean, only about 40 lbs and is not very intimidating. When she is released, she is amazing and not to be taken lightly. They hunted wild boar with these dogs and the only weapon was the dog.


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## ZoomZoom (Dec 18, 2009)

Grimm said:


> Now, folks, lets stop marking our territory and agree to disagree about what is the best breed of dog to have. I don't want to see anyone else lifting their leg to pee on a tree or hydrant!


Too late. I went pee when reading this post earlier today. Ruined the computer power supply that was laying on the floor in my office. That was quite a "shock". Luckily I had a spare so my computer is back up and running. Foot and leg still tingles...


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## HenryRules (Jul 12, 2013)

Forgive me for the wording of the original post. By bug out dog I ment do you include them in your plans. By Military precision I ment do as I say without hesitation or question. (As much questioning a dog can do haha) As of right now my SO has a small pug. Not really a dog to put your life in their paws but a good dog none the less. We have trained him to not go farther than 30 yards. We could tell him to sit well go out of site and he'd still be sitting right where we left him till we tell him to get going. His friendliness might be a problem and he doesn't bark much. We definately would not leave him behind if the time came. Of course the best case would be bugging in though.


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## ras1219como (Jan 15, 2013)

Henry if the dog in your pic is your pug he's a good looking little guy. Does he have a BOB? If not I would suggest getting him one and a pair of booties too so his paws will be protected if you're walking.


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## Woody (Nov 11, 2008)

HenryRules said:


> Forgive me for the wording of the original post. By bug out dog I ment do you include them in your plans. By Military precision I ment do as I say without hesitation or question. (As much questioning a dog can do haha)


Ahhh. My gal is always included in my plans. I never board her when going on vacation or anywhere, except work that is. Her supply of food is almost as large as mine now! Yup, precision like that also. She looks to me for commands as to what to do in any situation. When we are out in the field and she is on a 'Hunt 'em up' mission, if she loses sight of me she comes running back to find me. The only time she does not care about me is when she is on a retrieve, that is unless she wants directions to find the item. Then she comes running back to where she can see me and waits for a command.

I love the little gal to death.


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## HenryRules (Jul 12, 2013)

ras1219como said:


> Henry if the dog in your pic is your pug he's a good looking little guy. Does he have a BOB? If not I would suggest getting him one and a pair of booties too so his paws will be protected if you're walking.


He does have a BOB but I'm still brainstorming the boots. None that I've found are fitting as I'd like them to be. They don't really stay with the paw. I'd also like them to go up the leg a bit as his little legs freeze pretty quick. We do go on jogs quite frequently so they'd be good for winters now too.


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

HenryRules said:


> He does have a BOB but I'm still brainstorming the boots. None that I've found are fitting as I'd like them to be. They don't really stay with the paw. I'd also like them to go up the leg a bit as his little legs freeze pretty quick. We do go on jogs quite frequently so they'd be good for winters now too.


Ruffwear has a boot style that goes up the leg a few inches. Here they are... They also have a lot of different sizes from XXXS to XXL. They have a lot of great products for dogs that are made for lots of use and rough conditions. I have the packs for Winter but am waiting for a deal on the boots.

You might want to think about getting so SmartWool baby or toddler socks for inside the boots to keep his feet warm in cold temps. They are superwash wool socks and are great! No need for special care! Just wash as you would cotton socks. Check ebay for a good deal. I have a few dozen pairs from when Roo was a baby. If I don't need them for any future babies I'll use them for Winter.


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## hashbrown (Sep 2, 2013)

machinist said:


> I'm not a dog trainer, but my daughter is, so I am learning from her. Like my Dad said, to teach a dog you have to know more than the dog does.
> 
> Some dogs require more OWNER training than others, in our experience. I could never deal with her lovable yet feisty German Shepherd/Coyote mix. He is one heckuva dog, but he is HER dog, period. Shepherds tend to be that way, IMHO. My own have bonded with me and paid little to no attention to what anyone else had to say.
> 
> ...


Ive had bull breed dogs for 20 + years, personally I will never be without one. The one I have now Ive been training for 3 years and would completely trust him with my family's safety. I keep him away from other people he knows me my wife and son. He has an awesome prey drive and if the shtf I want him at our side.


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## Cotton (Oct 12, 2013)

About 15 years ago I got on a list for adopting retiring working dogs. Most of these dogs retire to live with their trainers but sometimes that isn’t possible. A couple wasn’t with me very long but they are wonderful dogs. They are already highly trained but can be dangerous, especially the first year until they adjust to a life on a farm.

I once got a sheppard that was expected to die within the year from heartworms. I cured the worms naturally with colloidal silver. She was with me another 7 years. This pic is when she was 12yrs old, died 2 years later. She was the smartest of all the dogs I’ve had. She was a little small, maybe 75lbs but fierce with a drive I’ve never seen in another animal.

I wanted a puppy last time, he’s 2 years old now. He’s very smart and easy to train. This pic was last spring, shedding his winter coat. He’s put on another 20lbs since then, up to 100lbs.


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## Woody (Nov 11, 2008)

I'm not looking for a dog to be a defense. I'm just looking for an alert me to danger animal.

My black gal (American Field Stock Lab) fits the bill perfectly. If she hears something, she will POP up to attention and let out one low Woof. [email protected]@king in the direction she heard it with quick glances back to me. They are fantastic at hand signs and I can direct her silently. Their natural drive is not to attack/protect, it is to alert you then wait for you to tell them what they should do. Granted, most are right behind you, making sure your back is covered! LOL! Hey, but you know RIGHT where they are!

But if you're bugged out, and it is not a fit night out for man nor beast... A lab is the happiest critter in the world if you send them out in it to go get firewood, the pan you left out there or whatever. And they are very disappointed if you only needed one of whatever they had to get. Properly cared for their coat dries out very quickly and they shed mud, poop or whatever else they rolled in. Cleanup is a snap. Bring them to a body of water, they swim, have them roll in sand, rocks, mud or whatever, back in to rinse off, DONE! Maybe a little hand scrubbing with sand/dirt to get off major stains. Soap and shampoo, while smelling nice, takes off their oily coat. Yeah, they are soft and smell like a 4 bit whore, but then they do not dry off fast and they lost that nice Lab shine.

Given enough activity, they are pretty maintenance free, except for lots of hugs and fanny scratches that is. They thrive on human contact. If you have a thing against giving a large, wet/muddy dog a big hug now and again, a lab is NOT for you! In Sunshine's three short years with me I have never clipped her nails. My last lab I did a few times when she was older. I have brushed Sunshine once. She got one of her few baths then too. We were going to an event where I knew most folks had 'designer dogs' who go to "the salon" once a week for primping. I just didn't want to hear all day how she smelled like 'an old pond' or was dusty or looked very oily or whatever, so I did the deed. Didn't matter anyway, she spent the afternoon outside playing with all the children. They were amazed that they could throw something, she would bring it back, hand it to them then sit, waiting for them to throw it again! Once they found out she could get named items.. A ball, Frisbee, stick, No the other stick, to the left.. they kept my gal happy all afternoon! The designer dogs spent the day inside - God forbid they get dirty outside! - on someone's lap being fed off of their plates. They did know some cute tricks, sit pretty, bow, turn in a circle... And I admitted my dog knew none of those tricks. I kept quiet and just enjoyed my few friends there company while thinking... Under all that fur, there is barely a chicken's worth of meat.


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## TheLazyL (Jun 5, 2012)

hiwall said:


> ...You can never have complete control over any animal. You can never know for sure how any animal will react to certain circumstances. If you have a well trained dog and you are under alot of stress, won't your dog feel that stress also? And wouldn't that cause you dog to act in an unknown manner?


The same with humans. Some would start barking (screaming) under stress and some may remain quite. At least with a human you can gag, put unconscious or reason with. And after spending some with them you have a general idea how they will react.

Dog. Well it may all depend on the circumstances, full moon, or the time of the month. Never bit the mailman but nailed the mailman's replacement.

Now the wife's indoor overweight cats is a different story. When you see them RUN for the basement, I know a stranger's vehicle has just started coming up our driveway.


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## Wanderer0101 (Nov 8, 2011)

A versatile gun dog that will point, retrieve, track and kill vermin and also has strong protective instincts is pretty hard to beat. Several of the German breeds qualify. Having owned one I don't think there is a better dog.


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