# Gas mask NBC filters



## JustCliff (May 21, 2011)

I have been looking to replace/stock up on NBC filters for our gas masks....They are expencive! The cheapest good filter I could find is $220.00 for a 6 pack. I am going to need at least 2 six packs of filters.
Has anyone else been looking into this? Do you know when your filters expire?

Gas Mask Filter Cartridge Canister from Approved Gas Masks


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## SurvivalNut (Nov 13, 2008)

Kind of depends what you want (anticipate using) them for. 

In my time in the military we always had to have current date filters on site or deployment. For training we always used expired filters. I have had full gear on many a time for 6, 8 or more hours breathing thru expired filters. During that time I have also used the expired filters in Gas Exercises and "Gas Chambers". 

Some filters are a paper/fiber/carbon composite filler. The "expiration" occurs when the filter weakens or breaks down. I have seen specific filter lots removed from stockpile early because of testing or factory flaws, but I never rejected an old filter for training use based on a visual inspection.

I don't bother to keep filters for real world biological or chemical (nerve, blood agent, etc) scenarios, just because home decontamination is just not going to work. In military grade chemical attacks, one pin head size droplet of some agents is enough to kill you. 

For Tear Gas and fun, expired filters are fine. For anything else, pay the price. I wouldn't trust milsurp filters even in date that have been bounced around who knows where as a substitute for the the quality price you referred to.


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## PS360 (Sep 10, 2010)

From the way I understand it, 
for germs and fallout dust they're good indefinitely since it's the hepa filter part that blocks that. 

For chemicals it depends, there are two things used to remove it:

1:
Activated charcoal, good unless exposed to air or could possibly be deactivated over time by neutralizing chemicals. 

2:
Neutralizing chemicals, Activated charcoal doesn't get rid of all chemicals so some filters have one or more neutralizing chemicals, these could degrade or react with each other over time.


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## JustCliff (May 21, 2011)

I know when My filters expire. Thats why im looking now. I have one more year on them. I will be getiing NBC filters, anything less would be a waste. I would never buy a mil surplus filter. That is just asking for trouble. 
For my location NBC filters and decon will work well. I am not near a large city so the amount of anything I would get would be greatly reduced by the time it got to me but there is still the chance of getting some.


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## dataman19 (Dec 4, 2011)

Many filters can be vacuum packed (giving them an almost indefinite shelf life). The expiration date for the filter is the date for the filter after being removed from the foil pack. Something you should not do until you need it..
..
Dave
Phoenix, AZ


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## Jezcruzen (Oct 21, 2008)

I question whether these masks and filters really provide the protection some think they do and feel they require. 

Does anyone think they will be in the "hot" zone of a chemical attack? With what? Sarin? VX? Nerve "gas" (actually droplets)?

If so, do you carry your mask, filter(s), and chemical protective clothing with you all the time? How fast can you don all of it when you think you will need it, and what indicators will let you know that?

How many of you who own or seek CBERN protective gear have every trained in it? Know its limitations? Have a decon plan and a means of carrying it out?

Have you ever actually been through a "gross wash"? A nine-step decon?

How do you know you are out of the hot zone, passed through the warm zone, and have decon set up into the cold zone? Do you have monitoring equipment and know how to use it? Do you have lots of friends trained in decon and available when you need them, cause if takes a few folks with the proper equipment to do a decon.

Listen, I have been there, done that. Its not as simple as buying some surplus filter mask, or even a new one from Scott or MSA. All you are doing is handing over cash to some internet store for gear that should be tossed in the dump. Fact is, if you are out somewhere and get caught up in a "for real" chemical attack, your ass is DRT (Dead Right There). That surplus junk in the trunk of your car or in the basement back home isn't going to save you.

The same thing about radiation. Even at home, is you house airtight? No! And if you venture outside, even in your "mask", you will have alpha and beta particulate matter all over you. There's that decon issue once again, and your exposed cloths cannot be deconned.

I'm not making light of the desire to provide as much protection as feasible, but there is a LOT more to CBERN protection than lay people realize.


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## Meerkat (May 31, 2011)

Auto body paint filters may be just as good for less money.These men breath toxic fumes all day long .


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## Ponce (May 3, 2009)

Cheaper to buy the whole gas mask and take out the filters.....it works for me.


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## BlueShoe (Aug 7, 2010)

I'd be more worried about nuke fallout crossing the country.
Where are the nuke power plants and nuke weapons facilities?
I know there are some in Alabama, Mississippi and Tn.
Tenn has nuke weapons developing and/or dismantling facilities too.


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## FrankW (Mar 10, 2012)

Meerkat said:


> Auto body paint filters may be just as good for less money.These men breath toxic fumes all day long .


Great point!


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## FrankW (Mar 10, 2012)

tenOC said:


> I'd be more worried about nuke fallout crossing the country.
> Where are the nuke power plants and nuke weapons facilities?
> I know there are some in Alabama, Mississippi and Tn.
> Tenn has nuke weapons developing and/or dismantling facilities too.


Dont worry about fallout form any fo those facilities.
Fallout is what happens after a nuclear groundburst .
the most dangerous isotopes are also the most active ones will and after 3 days will be at negligible risk levels

3 days= 10 half lives.

So if you are ever downwind from a nuclear groundburst:

shelter in place for 3 days then walk out of the downwind area. 
problem solved.
Anything with a HEPA works best for this, but in a pinch a N95 will do.


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## RodUSMC (May 25, 2012)

Jezcruzen said:


> I question whether these masks and filters really provide the protection some think they do and feel they require.
> 
> Does anyone think they will be in the "hot" zone of a chemical attack? With what? Sarin? VX? Nerve "gas" (actually droplets)?
> 
> ...


There is truth in the fact that there's more to this than what people realize, and clearly buying cheap or surplus CRBN gear is a very bad idea. But there are many scenarios where a good quality mask could be very helpful, even if just to evacuate. Japan's recent incident is a good example. And while slapping a mask on alone is not sufficient, it IS better than nothing. Breathing radioactive particles into your lungs is far worse than having them on your skin. And I think it foolish to believe America is immune to any type of nuclear terrorism, even if "only" a dirty bomb. There are many other possibilities too. As recently as 2005 in South Carolina there was a train accident which resulted in gas cloud that killed 8 and injured many others. Initially people were told to stay indoors...a good quality mask kept at home or in the car would have saved these people. I have used masks in the field and in several combat theaters, and was a CBRN officer in the Corps. The best mask I have ever come across is one of the Avon Protection 50 series masks (FM53, FM50, or C50). They are not cheap, but I don't want to skimp on something your life or your families lives might depend on.


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## RodUSMC (May 25, 2012)

BlueZ said:


> Dont worry about fallout form any fo those facilities {nuclear plants}.
> Fallout is what happens after a nuclear groundburst .
> .


This is incorrect. Fallout can occur from a nuclear plant, and given the nature of power plant fuel, the radioactivity can be longer lived and more dangerous long term than that from a weapon. A plant with a runaway nuclear reaction must release pressure from the containment vessel by venting into the atmosphere, and the dust which comes in contact with this radioactive plume will fall as fallout. And a full on meltdown will spread radioactive fallout from the burning debris or explosion. Chernobyl created a fallout pattern that covered several thousand square miles. Some people in Poland today still suffer from thyroid problems caused by the exposure they received.

http://http://users.owt.com/smsrpm/Chernobyl/glbrad.html


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## partdeux (Aug 3, 2011)

I'm "hopefully" going to buy a repo house that needs some TLC. I suspect the house may have lead paint, and know the bathroom will need to be scrapped down.

Also all the carpeting in the house has to come up, fmaily had multiple pets and I'm generally allergic to pet fur/dander.

What do I need for these projects?


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## echo1432 (May 16, 2012)

Meerkat said:


> Auto body paint filters may be just as good for less money.These men breath toxic fumes all day long .


TICS/TIMS and chemical warfare agents are very different beasts, chem warfare agents will destroy filters in a manner of tens of minutes in some cases. Be advised.


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## Marcus (May 13, 2012)

partdeux,
I'd test for lead paint first to see if it is present. There are chemical testing kits available commercially.
I recommend a N95 dust mask if you have to scrape the lead paint along with gloves.
If you're using a grinder to get it off, add in a Tyvek suit w/booties, and goggles. Be prepared to get raked over the coals when you dispose of the hazardous waste in a properly sealed, labeled container. 
For the pet dander, a N95 will work. They're available at large hardware stores.


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## partdeux (Aug 3, 2011)

Marcus said:


> partdeux,
> I'd test for lead paint first to see if it is present. There are chemical testing kits available commercially.
> I recommend a N95 dust mask if you have to scrape the lead paint along with gloves.
> If you're using a grinder to get it off, add in a Tyvek suit w/booties, and goggles. Be prepared to get raked over the coals when you dispose of the hazardous waste in a properly sealed, labeled container.
> For the pet dander, a N95 will work. They're available at large hardware stores.


No grinder... it will get scrapped and then primed/painted.

If I test it, then I'll know it's lead. If it's not tested...


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## RodUSMC (May 25, 2012)

echo1432 said:


> TICS/TIMS and chemical warfare agents are very different beasts, chem warfare agents will destroy filters in a manner of tens of minutes in some cases. Be advised.


Excellent post and very true! Even a dedicated CBRN filter like the M40 will only last about 12 hours in an NBC environment. The new FM50 filters last twice as long, but still only 24 hours.


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