# when the "SHTF", getting out of California, concerns



## Farmer (Mar 8, 2011)

Hi all,
i thought i'd run some of my thoughts and concerns by you folks to get some input and feedback if i might. A little about where i'm coming from first, which will help explain: i'm originally from the midwest (oklahoma/kansas) and have lived in California (San Francisco bay area) since coming here in '95 with the military. I've been out for some time now, and live with my highschool age son and daughter, single dad. I have a daughter, 10 yr. old nearby also that does not live with me. I do believe that in my lifetime, things are going to come unglued in our nation. I believe it's coming, it's meant to happen, and I will have to take action for myself and my children to make it through. I do not plan to stay in California when the time comes. I don't know when that will be, but I believe it will be obvious when the day comes. I have family where i came from in the midwest who are making preparations of their own. This is where i plan to go, back to the heartland. I read this article a while back and it hit home.

Letter Re: A Veteran Policeman's Observations on The Golden Horde - SurvivalBlog.com

I plan to load up my kids, with my provisions and head east as fast as i can. I am planning on driving a vehicle that cannot be shut off remotely....carburated that is . I fear that those with modern cars will be in the control of the powers that be who can render them useless with the flick of a switch. I plan to head either through the northern route (80), or through the southern route (i-40). there are many other side highways, and backroads one could take to make it back to the midwest. My concern is in the event of the "SHTF" times, do you think i'm going to run into road blocks? Vigilantes such as those seen in films like "the road" and "book of eli"? what other thoughts do you all have on this plan to leave via auto, and what should i be thinking about to prepare to make this solid? Should i plan to leave in the night or travel by daytime? any input and info would be appreciated.


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## mosquitomountainman (Jan 25, 2010)

Leave as early as possible - before TSHTF. After that you may have a difficult time getting through. Try to come up with different license plates (preferably for the state you are passing through) and dump the California plates when you hit the border. I have a feeling that people with California plates will be considered legitimate targets once they leave their state heading through conservative areas in the Mid-West.

Have a plausible story about relatives in a city far enough "beyond" any checkpoints to preclude someone knowing the people you're talking about yet close enough that they'll think you have some "local" ties in order to get them to let you through.

The best thing to do however is be at your BOL* before *TSHTF.


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## Centraltn (Feb 21, 2011)

OH heck no!! GO NOW!! It will be a much less risky trip for you and your children. You will be able to get settled in and well stocked and supplied with little effort and alot more ease! You can't dump your end of the family on the other end - the preparers - at a time of emergency! You are responsable for your own! So get un tethered from California RIGHT NOW and head to safer ground where you can provide a safe haven for your children and yourself. Get crackin darlin! Times a runnin out!


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## power (May 7, 2011)

Waiting until SHTF before leaving is like waiting until food is rationed before preparing. It will be too late.


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## Jimmy24 (Apr 20, 2011)

As many have said so far, you should be gone.

I feel that part of your true preps should be working towards moving to where you want to be in a shtf situation. Your already talking about a 2 day drive nowadays. I have made the drive from MS to Fresno LOTS thru the years. 3-4 days according how I feel.

In a shtf deal, you might be looking at a week or more and lots of driving out of the way to get by checkpoints, avoid big cities etc. Where you gonna get the gas? What if it's mostly gone? Bugging out that far is a VERY large risk to you and your family. 

It would actually be better to plan on staying put, at least within the state, maybe the Redwood Curtain, north of you. Northern Calie has lots of potenial. That would be my plan if I don't plan on getting out long before anything were to happen.

I think it's NOT a good plan to bug out that far.

BTW Welcome to the forum. Hope you enjoy it here.

Jimmy


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## Nadja (Jan 12, 2011)

The bay area, in Cal would be the last place you would want to be. First of all, you would have a min of 5 hours good driving with no problems to make it to nev. If you chose the I-40 area , you could double that time. And that is if all goes perfect. Lets see, you and 20 million other misplaced people are all going to try and leave via either the northern or southern routes right ? How ? Unless you come up with another option like "borrowing" a small plane and fly out. But they could also be on many many other peoples list of how to leave the sinking ship. The only real solution would be to start preparring to move now, while the moving is still feasable. Keep in mind going over the sierras with anything short of a freeway would be almost impossible unless you have a few pack mules at your disposal You are pinned between the mountains and the deep blue ocean.


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## Frugal_Farmers (Dec 13, 2010)

For years, we lived a lifestyle of having comfort intems in life and amassed debt just like the rest of America. We were prisoners to our jobs because we had to pay our just debts but saw no way out of the vicious debt cycle.

It wasn't until we made a concious decision to make a radical lifestyle modification that we began to be free from those chains that held us prisoner.

Our advise to anyone would be to begin this radical lifestyle modification NOW.

Today, we are debt free and are not owned by the financial institutions. We are free. Here is what we did.

Buy nothing on credit.

Cast away any though of status and image.

Determine WANTS and NEEDS. Only provide for your NEEDS.

Get back to the absolute BASICS of living.

Power pay off all of your debts.

Shop at thrift store, yard sales, estate sales.

Use it until it wears out and use it one more time.

Do away with cable and satellite TV. Go with a digital antenna.

Reduce gasoline consumption by carpooling, combining trips and stocking up on essentials.

Be smart about engery consumption. 

Know exactly what you pay for every product and buy discount brands in liue of name brands.

Quit eating out. Pre-cook meals (batch cook) and reheat them.

Grow your own veggies.

Learn to trade and barter.

Look on craigslist for deals on goods you really need.

Pay off all debt.

Learn to do without those nice to have items.

Learn to be frugal with every PENNY you spend.

Learn to fix things yourself.

Stockpile deeply discoutned essentials.

Pack a lunch to work.

Cut back or eliminate cigarette and alcohol consumption.

Network with like minded people.

Downsize--sell off anything you don't really NEED.

Get back to the basics

Simplify, Simplify, Simplify

Use the public library for books, magazines and free videoes.

Evealuate your current transportation. Downsize if possible.

Never buy new books or videos

Learn to be thrifty

Become humble

Cut back on entertainment costs by looking for free entertainment opportunities.

Downsize your current housing situation if possible.

Evealuate and cell phone plans and minimize

The list goes on...........................................................


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## Lake Windsong (Nov 27, 2009)

Farmer said:


> Hi all,
> i thought i'd run some of my thoughts and concerns by you folks to get some input and feedback if i might. A little about where i'm coming from first, which will help explain: i'm originally from the midwest (oklahoma/kansas) and have lived in California (San Francisco bay area) since coming here in '95 with the military. I've been out for some time now, and live with my highschool age son and daughter, single dad. I have a daughter, 10 yr. old nearby also that does not live with me. I do believe that in my lifetime, things are going to come unglued in our nation. I believe it's coming, it's meant to happen, and I will have to take action for myself and my children to make it through. I do not plan to stay in California when the time comes. I don't know when that will be, but I believe it will be obvious when the day comes. I have family where i came from in the midwest who are making preparations of their own. This is where i plan to go, back to the heartland. I read this article a while back and it hit home.
> 
> Letter Re: A Veteran Policeman's Observations on The Golden Horde - SurvivalBlog.com
> ...


Gonna go against the grain on this one - you can't reasonably load up & leave at this point because you have a kid who doesn't live with you. And when it comes to all the SHTF scenarios, no place is a 100% safe zone or hazard zone. So for whatever it's worth, here's my advice:
Learn all the 'life skills' you can. Basic gardening/foraging, first aid, self-defense...etc, you get the picture. This goes for all 3 kids as well. Mental preparedness will help you with any situation in any location. If you face a situation that calls for that long road trip, you would all be better prepared. You never know, the midwest might end up facing some SHTF scenario that has your family headed in your direction...


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## Idaholady (Apr 24, 2010)

If you are already thinking about heading back to family, then I'd start asking them to check into jobs for you in their area. Now is the time to start your plans to relocate; don't put if off if you can. 

As soon as your son is out of school for the summer; make it your goal to move. Unfortunately, you may not be able to take your daughter...sometimes you have to do what you have to do. Maybe once settled, you may be able to get her to visit for the summer months.

So, start setting those goals to leave CA if that is what you want.

I am currently at my bug-out location in northern Idaho for the summer months; unfortunately, all my family is in California; but I look at it this way...hopefully, they will get out ahead of any unforseen situation and have a safe haven here; no matter what time of year it is......


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## neldarez (Apr 10, 2011)

School is almost out....what a great time to start your journey....I don't have a clue when things are going to start happening or what "things" is going to look like...major earthquakes, economy melt down......but I do know that our nation as we know it can only juggle so many things at once before everything falls...........If at all possible, I suggest you start planning now to move as soon as possible........God Bless..........


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## GreyWolf (Mar 17, 2010)

Farmer that's a tough situation. Short of learning to fly and investing in a small plane you'll have some harsh land to travel across and it's anybody's guess what you may encounter along the way when TSHTF. I do recommend you acquire COUNTY maps for as many areas around you as possible. These will show smaller less traveled roads that an atlas or state map will not include. Pick a few and on weekends explore them to familiarize yourself with them. Also scout for possible safe locations to refuel, stash supplies or just rest and mark them on your maps.

The more options you give yourself and the more you plan the better you and your family will be.

Best of luck!


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## Jaspar (Feb 3, 2010)

if you wait until after tshtf you will never make it to Kansas, unless you own a plane. I would either move to the plains now, or find another bol in northern california.


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## BillS (May 30, 2011)

Farmer said:


> Hi all,
> i thought i'd run some of my thoughts and concerns by you folks to get some input and feedback if i might. A little about where i'm coming from first, which will help explain: i'm originally from the midwest (oklahoma/kansas) and have lived in California (San Francisco bay area) since coming here in '95 with the military. I've been out for some time now, and live with my highschool age son and daughter, single dad. I have a daughter, 10 yr. old nearby also that does not live with me. I do believe that in my lifetime, things are going to come unglued in our nation. I believe it's coming, it's meant to happen, and I will have to take action for myself and my children to make it through. I do not plan to stay in California when the time comes. I don't know when that will be, but I believe it will be obvious when the day comes. I have family where i came from in the midwest who are making preparations of their own. This is where i plan to go, back to the heartland. I read this article a while back and it hit home.
> 
> Letter Re: A Veteran Policeman's Observations on The Golden Horde - SurvivalBlog.com
> ...


It would be good to find a job in the midwest and leave now. As the economy continues to tank, different cities in California will cut back on police protection and the place where you live will continue to get more dangerous.

I think when the SHTF the roads will be jammed and gangs of criminals will block roads and attack people. I think we'll see hyperinflation first and the economy will completely shut down.


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## kejmack (May 17, 2011)

How good is your relationship with your ex? Is there any chance she would be into prepping? Could you test the waters in an offhanded way? You never know.


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## gypsysue (Mar 27, 2010)

The catch for Farmer could be the 10-year old daughter that doesn't live with with him. He might want to stay close to her and be part of her life. Even if the girl's mother isn't into prepping, as long as Farmer is nearby, he can plan to provide for her and even for her mother. It would be really hard to leave a child behind and take the others and move to a bug-out place. Though if he could arrange for that, perhaps even offering to move the daughter and her mother to the midwest (separate living arrangements) as well, then he'd have it solved.


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## Meerkat (May 31, 2011)

Tough situation.if you leave your kids will still be in harms way,if you hang around until TSHTF ,you'll all be in one.

Maybe go get set up,then send for them,by that time it will have gotten worse and maybe others will have awaken to the fact they are in a bad place.

I have family in Houston Texas,another gangland.They don'nt listen either.


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## Biscuit (Oct 21, 2008)

gypsysue said:


> The catch for Farmer could be the 10-year old daughter that doesn't live with with him. He might want to stay close to her and be part of her life. Even if the girl's mother isn't into prepping, as long as Farmer is nearby, he can plan to provide for her and even for her mother. It would be really hard to leave a child behind and take the others and move to a bug-out place. Though if he could arrange for that, perhaps even offering to move the daughter and her mother to the midwest (separate living arrangements) as well, then he'd have it solved.


I agree with this line of thought. You don't leave children behind, period. Consider moving north, like others have said. There's a lot of places in northern CA that are as remote as anywhere else, and you'd still be somewhat close to your other daughter.

And just my opinion, after reading the linked letter: though I am totally onboard with prepping, and have a plan of my own, I don't agree with the scenario as suggested by the author. Sorry, but I don't see inner city addicts and users as a very big threat, unless you're right THERE in their neighborhood (which if you're smart, you won't be now, much less when the SHTF).

Honestly, and as much as it pains me to even type this (because it seems to heartless to see a hungry family as "the enemy")...the biggest threat I see are middle-class families who haven't planned. Most DON'T. Most have no thought beyond a few weeks from now. Most aren't used to having more than a few days of food on-hand, and many (if not most) are used to grocery shopping EVERY SINGLE DAY, to buy just what they need for that night's meal.

But in a catastrophe and when survival-mode kicks in, God help the person who gets between a mother and the children she's trying to provide for and protect. Put me up against an addict any day...


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## Farmer (Mar 8, 2011)

*thoughts*

I just want to say thank you to all of you on this forum for your replies, input, and thoughts on my little dilema thus far. This has really given me some things to think about. I particularly appreciate the acknowledgement of my 10 yr. old, you guys are great- it shows alot about the character of folks on this board to see where i'm coming from. I don't wish to bore you all to death with my life story, but i feel it would be best to shed some light on the subject.
I suppose I'll start with a condensed version and break it down from there without laying too much on the table (i know the govt. is monitoring these sights). 
So i was born in the 70's. Grew up an Okie, and lived about half my early life in Kansas also. Right out of highschool i had a shotgun wedding, a newborn son in '95, and went straight into the US military rather than college. I was blessed with a great short career with the service, where i went to school, and have had a solid career since as a result. We had another child for $19.00 while i was in, and she's 15 now. We thought it would "make things better" in our infinite wisdom. Long story short, the wife split on our first trip home to Kansas, and ran off with another serviceman. I had to leave my kids behind, and watch over the course of the next 8.5 years, the abuse and neglect of my children at my ex's and other's hands. My children were removed from her twice for child neglect, child abuse, failure to thrive in a safe environment, and were both molested. During this time i spent over $30k in court trying to get custody, but due to being in the service attached to a ready deployment group, i could not ever get custody. The court viewed my status as "a state of flux", making me inelidgeable to have them. So, i had to watch from a distance of 1,646 miles the abuse of my children. For all those in the dark, there are such a thing as deadbeat moms, though all we hear about is the "deadbeat dad". When my son turned 10, we had a court mediation, where he stated that he wanted to come live with me, and i got my son at that time. Stop and think about that for a minute.....how bad must things be that a 10 year old kid would want to leave his mother. yeah, sad. My daughter, thank God never had it as bad as my son, but her eyes are open now at the age of 15. She has learned of all that happened, her molestation, all of it, and that her mother lied and hid it from her. My daughter has become the real life "cinderella" story, taking care of my ex's FIVE other kids with her live in boyfriend (that's right, not married). Some of the kids over there have special needs as well. My daughter has no life, and her hands look like a 50 year old farm wife's hands from doing dishes and scrubbing toilets all the time. She's ready to bounce, and she will be under my roof within this year, thank God.
Now, my other marriage. 7 years after the first marriage ended, i remarried to a woman i had dated for 6 years after i divorced the first one. I felt i had met "the one". I refused to look at the signs, and listen to my friends regarding her family, and some things about her. It wound up coming back to bite me in the ass, as 1 year after our daughter was born, she had an affair, just like her mother had done to her dad. I gave her 1 hour to pack what she could and hit the road. Due to my rotating 12 hr work schedule and having no family out here in Ca. to help out, i couldn't keep my daughter, and she has since lived with my ex. The good thing out of that is that once everything all blew up (and i paid a visit to this secret boyfriend which he will not forget), she has since been pretty much single, and has become a pretty devoted christian, and wonderful mother. We get along pretty good, and my daughter is very healthy, and very well cared for. I see her all the time, and we have a close relationship like I'd always wished I had with my first two children. That being said, I cannot walk away from this daughter. It ain't gonna happen. 
There is hope that my ex will see the signs and make a move to protect herself and our daughter, and get the f--k out of dodge before it's too late as well. She has a great, and big family out in California (my ex). They are smart people, and very resourcefull. They are Fillipino, and come from the "country" in their country. So...if she were to decide to stay, and I couldnt take my daughter with us to the heartland or elsewhere, I have to believe that she's in as good of hands as she could be. I know this much, and that's that the whole family would rob, kill, or lay down their own lives before they ever let my daughter get a hair bent on her head and that gives me great peace. 
I am currently working fast to secure my 15 yr.old daughter, and in doing so, secure a future for her. I am also teaching my son all that I can about life, survival, and last but not least, how to split hairs with a 7.62 mauser, and dissasemble and assemble a Colt 1911 blindfolded. He should take a few by surprise if he's ever put in a situation. I hope he never is, but he is one strong, smart kid, that is well above his peers in regards to survival. I've taught him to fight, as i was taught. I've taught him all that Uncle Sam taught me, as well as what "not to be named" has taught me. 
To be honest, I've not put much thought into staying put in California, but your feedback has caused me to look into the idea of it, at least as a phase one hunker down scenario. As far as relying on a car to get me and mine back to California, I realize the limitations of that mode of escape. It may sound crazy, but I would rather take a couple of horses. I'm very serious. I grew up on them in the midwest, and i'd trust a horse to get me and my kids to where i need to be, before i'd trust doing so in a car first. It's a bit of a trek to say the least, but it could absolutely be done, and it would put us very much off the grid. We could go where no car could go, and be quite safe even if it meant it would take a couple of weeks. The elements and my kids' abilities to hang in there for the challenge would be the factors in that regard. I'm not sure what the Pony Express did a straight-through run from Kansas to California in, time wise, but if they can ride a horse that far, that fast, we can do it too, in slow motion so-to-speek. The great thing is that i have friends, all along the way, that can be trusted where we should be able to take refuge for a short time on our way home. I'll be tapping into my Native American roots in these times ahead for sure. I have never in my life realized just how valuable those talks with my full-blood Indian family elders were until these last few years. Its words from them and others that have been the best sharpening stone to my life than any other single thing.
here are a few pictures that i felt okay about sharing with you all. There is one of my two teens and I, then one of my 10 yr. old, and one of me.


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## Meerkat (May 31, 2011)

Good luck with whatever you decide.

Women can be bad too.Many these days don't have a clue.if you wait till the SHTF a horse may be a better idea,just watch out for others on horses or hiking who may not have prepared.


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## gypsysue (Mar 27, 2010)

Beautiful children! Thanks for the pictures. They're lucky to have a Dad so willing to go to bat for them, and to persist through the difficulties so you can protect them. 

The idea of horses to cross the country has merit. Worth looking farther in to. Much better than a car. Haste may not be the most important thing to consider. Horses are a fairly stealthy way to travel. 

Hang in there! Let us know when your 15-y.o. daughter comes to live with you so we can rejoice with you!


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## Farmer (Mar 8, 2011)

thank you! i will keep you all posted on bringing my girl home here under this thread.
re: the horse migration idea....i am indeed thinking seriously about this as a very real plan. I would like to at least be prepared and equipped to do this if I had to. Maybe even a couple of "practice" rides to state parks that are within the state, but a good clip away would be good to get a feel for the challenges we'd encounter, etc.


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## JayJay (Nov 23, 2010)

gypsysue said:


> Beautiful children! Thanks for the pictures. They're lucky to have a Dad so willing to go to bat for them, and to persist through the difficulties so you can protect them.
> 
> The idea of horses to cross the country has merit. Worth looking farther in to. Much better than a car. Haste may not be the most important thing to consider. Horses are a fairly stealthy way to travel.
> 
> Hang in there! Let us know when your 15-y.o. daughter comes to live with you so we can rejoice with you!


Sooo funny--from Amish/Mennonite country, horses and buggy are the way to go!!

Another accident just happened last week---semi didn't see the horse and buggy---I didn't hear the outcome of the passenger or driver, yet.

Seems we're swarming with Amish and Mennonite injuries in Kentucky the last few months.


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## Farmer (Mar 8, 2011)

i'm guessing they became part of the truck grill is what happened and are making quilts in heaven now


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## NaeKid (Oct 17, 2008)

I didn't know where your hometown was, so, I google-map'd it and it looks to me like you are fairly close to a fairly major waterway that leads directly to the pacific-ocean.

I don't know if my suggestion would be feasible, but, my BOV of choice would be a boat - something that is ocean-friendly. My BOL#1 would be one of the ocean towns like Eureka (rode my bicycle into that town back in '86) and then from there plan a BOL#2 - possibly in the region of CrescentCity (on the border of Oregon and California). From CrescentCity there are options open to you - continue to head north or north and east towards Washington / Idaho / Montana ... easy enough to hide out there if you so desire.

Plan your BOL(s) specifically as a "vacation get-away" and stock it up with provisions. Bring the kids there regularly so that they feel comfortable there and it will give you a safe place to create your next plan. Make sure that you have bedding, food and fuel stored in each one.

Good luck!


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## Clarice (Aug 19, 2010)

I agree with Frugal Farmers, start preparing yourself and your family now. We do almost everything Frugal listed, but about 5 years ago we were like everyone else. The rule we go by now is "If you can't eat it, wear it or it does not have a useful purpose we don't need it". At first it was hard as with any habit, but now we don't miss all the wasteful spending. We have a full pantry. We have a nice garden, fruit trees, rabbits, chickens and hunting & fishing licenses. Wear name brand clothes from the second hand stores. Buy 90% of tools, storage containers, etc. from yard sales and second hand stores. We only have one phone that cost us $35/mo. Our friends know we are thrifty, but do not realize how rich we are in peace of mind and preps.


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