# Gasoline stored for 5 years - success!



## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

Fuel:
Regular unleaded 87 octane (10% ethanol sticker located on the pump)

Container:
55 gallon drum, epoxy lined, not cleaned (was once bread pan "release grease"). Still a little grease left in it.

Conditioner:
Sta-Bil (IIRC, I used the 64 gallon rate for the 55 gallons)

Where stored:
Outside, under the shade of a tree: on,surrounded by and covered with old pallets

Well - the 5 year anniversary came up on some stored gas. This was my first "zero contact with the atmosphere batch" I had done, and it was a complete success!! No more of those rumors of how gas goes bad in 30 days, or 6 months, blah blah blah blah. This stuff was sealed 100% from air or water, and looks and smells like the day I put it in back in 2008! I was expecting a lot of degradation, but I was plumb wrong.

The only other special treatment I used that would be different than most is the vapor expansion space was purged with propane vapor to make sure no air was present.

One oddity - the metal bung plugs are not epoxy coated, and they were VERY rusty. Probably because of the ethanol?

This gas is going to be treated with Sta-Bil again (I think they recommend a re-treat every year, LOL!) and will be put into a large 150 gallon propane tank for _permanent_ storage. If I don't see any degradation of quality after 5 years I am going to speculate I will never see any, ever.

I started the transfer into its new home last night. The propane tank was still full of vapor, but was down to around 10 psi (very nearly empty). I had to release the last of the vapor in order to remove the specialty valve over the liquid withdrawl tube and install a standard ball valve in its place.

I did this quickly to reduce the amount of air getting into the tank (I don't think any got in, I was working against positive pressure the whole time). That way I can just open my valve to get the fuel out, without any "specialty" fittings like a propane truck would use.

Gasoline is pumped into the tank under pressure using an old EFI fuel pump from an early 90's Ford/Lincoln and a 12 volt battery. I just drop it down the big hole in the 55 gallon drum! I release vapor from the big tank occasionally as it fills so the pump doesn't have to work so hard pushing it in. Ultimately, the goal is to have the gasoline stored in a propane atmosphere, under positive pressure.

*DISCLAIMER:* All of what I type is intended only for people who have their heads pulled out of their rearends. If you don't think you have the brain cell activity to pull this method of storage off, then you had better not try ANY of it!!! All of these fuels are VERY flammable and you will receive a Darwin Award if you screw up!!


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## Geek999 (Jul 9, 2013)

Why the change of tanks? Why not just epoxy coat the bungs to prevent rust? Personally, I have taken old gas in jerry cans and just tossed it in the tank to mix with whatever was already in the tank to get rid of it and never had a problem.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

Geek999 said:


> Why the change of tanks?


Because I have never viewed 55 gallon drums as an "excellent" long term storage container. Drums are "good" but not great - they are thin metal, and the rubber seals around the bungs have a limited life span. They "oil can" very easily under pressure changes (negative and positive) and if that occurs enough times the metal will crack and leak (that has happened to me before). I am just simply not impressed with their limited durability.

Now, a propane tank has .199" wall thickness (The heads are .230") so it'll last forever, no flexing ever, no vapors in or out ever.... they are just a fantastic storage vessel!


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## FrankW (Mar 10, 2012)

They key thing you did that prevented degradation was no exposure to air.
As a Chemist I will say that purging the expansion space with propane was very clever on your part and something a chemist would have suggested.


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## ZangLussuria (May 25, 2012)

Would the ethanol and/or octane rating make a difference in storage?
We have slightly higher octane ratings here and I've only seen 89 octane in a few stations. Average which can be found here would be 91, 93 and 95. Some places have higher end 97 octane made for high end cars. All these have 10% ethanol.

I sometimes put 100 octane no ethanol Euro 4 gasoline in my car. I know places that have it. A bit more expensive though.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

"No Ethanol" gasoline is ideal.... but oh, so very hard to find.

The only local alternative is unleaded racing gasoline: It is ethanol-free.

The level of octane you desire depends on the intended use of the fuel. I may store some racing gasoline (sealed 5 gallon cans) to mix in small amounts with stored regular gasoline just to make sure the chainsaw stays alive and healthy (the same result could *probably* be achieved with stored toluene or xylene). Chainsaws like to have fresh gas and do not tolerate low octane gasoline well.

At the opposite end of the spectrum is a Farmall tractor which is used for food production (my main reason for storing gasoline). It is only around 6:1 compression ratio, so it will tolerate low octane gas very easily. In that case, I could actually blend in a little diesel fuel to extend the gasoline supply a little further (search for Tractor Vaporizing Oil)


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## ZoomZoom (Dec 18, 2009)

I too have had treated gas last a couple years. I do have some older (like 5 years) but haven't tried to use it.

Here's a site that lists by State ethanol-free gas stations.
http://pure-gas.org/

The most common locations are marinas.

If you have a local airport, you can often get ethanol free gas at their pumps. Read up on this first since their gas has been tweeked specifically for aircraft.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

ZoomZoom said:


> The most common locations are marinas.
> 
> If you have a local airport, you can often get ethanol free gas at their pumps. Read up on this first since their gas has been tweaked specifically for aircraft.


Marina gas is as expensive as AvGas!

If I remember correctly, 100LL AvGas is almost pure toluene. 
It will NEVER make varnish no matter how old it gets!!

I can actually buy toluene for industrial use cheaper than AvGas. However, old tractors like the Farmall without hardened exhaust valves and seats can benefit from the lubrication that is offered by the tetraethyl lead still found in 100LL AvGas. I may store a small amount of AvGas for that reason (but not a lot of T.E.L. is needed).... Also, I believe a little two-stroke oil can also accomplish this same task (protecting the valves)


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## Caribou (Aug 18, 2012)

Why didn't you use this batch up and replace it with new? Did you use any to see how your vehicle ran?


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

Caribou said:


> Why didn't you use this batch up and replace it with new? Did you use any to see how your vehicle ran?


I figured that since it hadn't got old yet, it probably wasn't going to. It will make up 1/4 of what is now being stored in the big propane tank, the remainder being new.

Yes, I ran my truck down to near empty and poured in 5 gallons. Runs like a top, no weird odors or smells, no knocking or pinging. The gas looks and smells like the day I stored it.


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## Caribou (Aug 18, 2012)

Anybody here try the PRI-G or PRI-D rather than Sta-Bil?


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

Pri-G is "supposedly" better. Because no one sells it locally and it must be ordered and shipped (and it is expensive) I have never tried it.

I don't think I am going to try it, either.....

BECAUSE -
The only reason in my mind gasoline goes bad in the first place is it: 
absorbs water 
evaporates volatiles, and 
oxidizes (in the presence of air)

Take away those things from it, and it **should** become _chemically stable_. Storing it in an oxygen-free environment (propane tank) and protecting it from the elements appears to be the secret to its longevity.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

The marine guys swear by StarTron Star-brite Enzyme Fuel Treatment... I have never tried it either.


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## ZangLussuria (May 25, 2012)

The no ethanol racing fuel I mentioned here can only be had at 100 octane. The 97 octane racing fuel has ethanol in it.
The 100 octane no ethanol one costs about $1 more per gallon vs standard 91 octane unleaded here.

I'm planning to get a small generator for emergencies. Something to just run the fridge and some fans and lights. It holds about a gallon of gasoline at a time and I'm looking for a small container to keep some gas on hand. Would just a jerry can and stabil work? How long would it last? Will most probably get the 100 octane one for storage to eliminate the ethanol.


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## Viking (Mar 16, 2009)

Great idea LincTex on the propane topping. I have some non ethanol gasoline that's been stored pretty close the 5 years in 5 gallon plastic fuel cans sealed as tight as possible with two ounces of Stabil per can, they expand and contract without pulling in air and moisture and so far none have gotten to the varnish stage and in fact smell quite fresh. When I've used the fuel it runs great. If I remember right this non ethanol fuel about 92 octane.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

mike_dippert said:


> Rookie question. What's the valve setup like that you can pour in liquid gas?


Go back and show me where I used the wording: "pour in liquid gas" .............

Everything is done with proper connections and is always under pressure. Plan for this or you may be very sorry.



mike_dippert said:


> The only non-BBQ tank I've seen is a 100# model with a single valve.


You can do it with those, too. You have to pull down a vacuum on the bottle with a vacuum pump, then let the vacuum suck the fuel in. When it stops sucking, force the fuel in under pressure with the pump. I shouldn't have to tell you how to make the hoses properly to make all this happen like it should.

The fuel vapors are heaver than air, so if you need to let some vapor out in order to get more liquid fuel in, simply shut off the pump and let the vapors push out (not all, just some) until pressure decreases enough to continue filling with liquid.

Once you have enough liquid inside, you can add some more propane under pressure if you wish, but it will not be truly needed until you are ready to empty the bottle. When that need arises, pressurize the bottle with propane vapor (you'll need to make a double male hose) and turn it upside down to get the liquid out. That is how I do the 20 and 30 lb size ones, a 100lb bottle will be no different.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

*DISCLAIMER:* All of what I type is intended only for people who have their heads pulled out of their rearends. If you don't think you have the brain cell activity to pull this method of storage off, then you had better not try ANY of it!!! All of these fuels are VERY flammable and *you will receive a Darwin Award if you screw up*!!


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

ZangLussuria said:


> Would just a jerry can and sta-bil work? How long would it last?


If you can keep the jerry cans at a constant temperature, it would be fine. Do you have a deep pit or insulated building you can store them in that would not have large temperature swings?

Your guess is as good as mine for how long it will last. 
http://www.preparedsociety.com/forum/f2/gasoline-stored-5-years-success-22028/index2.html#post297928



LincTex said:


> BECAUSE -
> The only reason in my mind gasoline goes bad in the first place is it:
> absorbs water
> evaporates volatiles, and
> ...


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

mike_dippert said:


> Ah. Not sure why, but I assumed you continuously vented. Your process makes perfect sense.


Correct, this method requires a pump with some decent pressure output. I don't know what the typical junkyard EFI gerotor fuel pump "dead heads" at, but I suppose its over 80 psi? At any rate, the more it has to work to pump, the less the flow will be. As the vessel fills with liquid , the pressure on the vapor will increase since volume is being displaced. How much vapor needs to be removed to allow filling to continue is just a guess, really.... but no biggie. I have found a pretty close guess is that around the half to 2/3 rds mark full, not much venting is needed any longer, just force the fuel in under pressure, and when you get to the 80% full level (same as the safe fill level for liquid propane) you can stop pumping and close the valve. Now you are done, the gas is ready to store.... for forever?

I do like to add additional propane vapor - just because:

the extra pressure is helpful when you are emptying the bottle, especially through small diameter tubing or line
the tank can serve as it's own fuel pump on an EFI vehicle because the pressure is high enough for the injectors
if you stop the flow once the liquid is removed, you can still use the pressure and vapors left behind to run your camp stove
propane vapor is super cheap for the small amount needed, so why not?


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## Viking (Mar 16, 2009)

LincTex said:


> If you can keep the jerry cans at a constant temperature, it would be fine. Do you have a deep pit or insulated building you can store them in that would not have large temperature swings?
> 
> Your guess is as good as mine for how long it will last.
> http://www.preparedsociety.com/forum/f2/gasoline-stored-5-years-success-22028/index2.html#post297928


I keep my stored fuel in a wood shed which almost always has a fair amount of firewood stored on the East and West side which makes for constant cool temps even on the hottest days, it seems that the firewood mass slows down the temps swings. Also the shed has a concrete floor and about a two foot high concrete stem wall all around. The only thing better for controlling temp swings would be something like a root cellar.


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## jsriley5 (Sep 22, 2012)

Thanks for the updates as I recall it was this fuel storage question that originally brought me to this site OH so long and so many posts ago. It also reassures me that the cases of quart cans of pre mixed saw fuel that come pre treated for storage and in sealed cans will also store quite well on the shelf in the garage which is attached and while the temp does change it is FAR less than outside temps. Now how to get the propane place to sell me old tanks that they don't feel are worth replacing valves and gauges on like to have three or four more to go with my single 500 gallon tank. store gass deisel both for the farm uses that will make producing food FAR easeir whyile it lasts.


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## Tirediron (Jul 12, 2010)

LincTex said:


> "
> 
> At the opposite end of the spectrum is a Farmall tractor which is used for food production (my main reason for storing gasoline). It is only around 6:1 compression ratio, so it will tolerate low octane gas very easily. In that case, I could actually blend in a little diesel fuel to extend the gasoline supply a little further (search for Tractor Vaporizing Oil)


You would be amazed what an allfuel tractor engine will burn, I ran 50% used canola / gasoline mix in a John Deere AR running a pto water pump , it would actually run on a lot higher percentage of veg oil, but it started to wet stack at about 75%, maybe it would have done better with a heavier load too, just something to file away as a fuel extender

the gasoline storage information is very helpful. I think that I will try a few gallons without stabilizer in a small propane tank to see what happens.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

jsriley5 said:


> Now how to get the propane place to sell me old tanks that they don't feel are worth ...


I am sure there is a way to get them. I see a local guy selling them on Craigslist all the time with the valves out. He make BBQ pits out of them. Problem is he wants $1 per gallon size and that's with no valves!

Also, a local Farm & Ranch supply near me that does propane refills always has scrap bottles, any sizes from 20lb to 100lb that people bring in to get refilled but the F&R won't fill them because the tank is bad or out of date. People just leave them there. The scrap metal place won't take them, so I pop in and clean him out once a year


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

Tirediron said:


> I ran 50% used canola / gasoline mix in a John Deere AR running a pto water pump... it started to wet stack at about 75%, maybe it would have done better with a heavier load too,


Definitely need a hot and heavy load to keep the exhaust manifold hot enough, and water temp needs to be kept near boiling always. I don't think the AR has a pressurized cooling system?


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## HamiltonFelix (Oct 11, 2011)

I have never trusted Sta-bil for more than a season. But I have personally experienced fuel stabilized with PRI-G sitting in a motorhome for eight years, then siphoned out and used in a car with no problem. 

I'm sure keeping fuel sealed from air, and temperature stable makes a big difference. 

I intend to get a test kit from fuel-testers.com very soon. The MPG figures my wife has been getting in our Corolla suggest that Shell and Chevron premium must be a lot closer to "real gas" than their Regular 10% ethanol. NOT Arco, though.


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## Viking (Mar 16, 2009)

The last time I used Arco-BP fuel from an AM-PM station the whole place smelled like varnish thinner and our mpg dropped to 14 on our Windstar and 1987 Samurai both previously got in the 20 mpg range, never again will we use that fuel. In fact the 10% ethanol fuels run so bad in the Windstar that I now run non-ethanol fuel exclusively, the mileage is back in the 20+ mpg range and the Service Engine light doesn't come on anymore. I do not store gas with ethanol any longer mainly because the main use of my stored fuels are weedeater, chainsaw and generator. I've seen the damage that ethanol does to small engine carb parts and hoses. Thankfully the Outdoor Power Association, and others got together and pushed for non-ethanol fuels to be available for outboard motors, small engines and such. The classic car people here probably helped as well.


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## Jimmy24 (Apr 20, 2011)

I have saved it successfully for 2 years. I also used Sta-bil but I used NON-ethanol premium 93 octane and added Lucus Octane additive. At 2 years it was still quite good and ran my truck and car just fine. I used an 18 gal oil barrel.

It's good to know others are having success.

Jimmy


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## readytogo (Apr 6, 2013)

Caribou said:


> Anybody here try the PRI-G or PRI-D rather than Sta-Bil?


yes, on a boat ,gas Eng. ,never had a problem ,also in a generator ,gets crank every 90 days without a miss . main problem is storing fuel is humidity so by keeping the container/tank full you avoid it, also a water separator filter will help before using the fuel, but as long as there is fuel is a good idea to rotated or used it to avoid problems.


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## Tirediron (Jul 12, 2010)

LincTex said:


> Definitely need a hot and heavy load to keep the exhaust manifold hot enough, and water temp needs to be kept near boiling always. I don't think the AR has a pressurized cooling system?


Nope it is thermo syphon, but the intake manifold is heated by the exhaust. I was surprised at how much oil I could add to the mix and have it keep running


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## ZangLussuria (May 25, 2012)

LincTex said:


> If you can keep the jerry cans at a constant temperature, it would be fine. Do you have a deep pit or insulated building you can store them in that would not have large temperature swings?
> 
> Your guess is as good as mine for how long it will last.
> http://www.preparedsociety.com/forum/f2/gasoline-stored-5-years-success-22028/index2.html#post297928


Hmmm.. My last message didn't post.

No deep pit or shed. Tropical country so no wild temperature swings but definitely hot and humid.


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

Just in case some forgot. 
LincTex, thank you for posting valuable information that many on here can use.
:2thumb::thankyou:


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

I need to do a picture thread, and maybe try my hand at some youtube videos


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

Still too busy for pictures.... eventually!


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## Caribou (Aug 18, 2012)

Tirediron said:


> it would actually run on a lot higher percentage of veg oil, but it started to wet stack at about 75%, maybe it would have done better with a heavier load too, just something to file away as a fuel extender


If you add insulation to the exhaust system you will delay the condensation. The primary product from the burning of gas or oil is water. The goal is to prevent the exhaust gasses from cooling to the condensation point till after they have left the exhaust system.

The problem is that there is usually a small amount of sulphur in our fuel. This sulphur burns, mixes with the water vapor and when it condenses it forms a mild sulphuric acid.

I have used insulating paint and insulating wrap on exhaust systems. I love the paint but the insulating wrap is by far less expensive and less time consuming to install.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

Gas is getting really close to the $3 mark.... time to store more.


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## Dakine (Sep 4, 2012)

LincTex said:


> Gas is getting really close to the $3 mark.... time to store more.


Hovers at a tad under $4 here, cheap gas is $3.80 Commiefornia loves to tax things! :gaah:


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## besign (Aug 9, 2014)

If nobody else has any gas, why do you think that they won't steal your vehicle, and/or your gas, killing you if they have to do so? Man, if things get that bad, I'm staying out of sight and as silent as possible. Diesel motors will run on soybean or peanut oil. the Chinese do it all the time (mostly for generators). So we don't really need to bother with the gas, possible exception of off road motorycles, after nearly everyone has died off. ON roads, you'd better have a full fairing, keep your head down and don't exceeed 20 mph, cause there will be wires stretched across the road, just for you.


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## besign (Aug 9, 2014)

all it takes, to stop vehicles, is some 3" nails driven thru boards, or thru limbs split lengthways. Scatter a lot of them all over the road, shoot up vehicles that stop or slow down. Naturally, the predator types will do this in a dip in the road, at a corner, etc, so people can't see the road in time to avoid the ambush.


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## labotomi (Feb 14, 2010)

besign said:


> If nobody else has any gas, why do you think that they won't steal your vehicle, and/or your gas, killing you if they have to do so? Man, if things get that bad, I'm staying out of sight and as silent as possible. Diesel motors will run on soybean or peanut oil. the Chinese do it all the time (mostly for generators). So we don't really need to bother with the gas, possible exception of off road motorycles, after nearly everyone has died off. ON roads, you'd better have a full fairing, keep your head down and don't exceeed 20 mph, cause there will be wires stretched across the road, just for you.


It's true. I saw it in Mad Max Beyond Thunderdome


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## Caribou (Aug 18, 2012)

besign said:


> If nobody else has any gas, why do you think that they won't steal your vehicle, and/or your gas, killing you if they have to do so? Man, if things get that bad, I'm staying out of sight and as silent as possible. Diesel motors will run on soybean or peanut oil. the Chinese do it all the time (mostly for generators). So we don't really need to bother with the gas, possible exception of off road motorycles, after nearly everyone has died off. ON roads, you'd better have a full fairing, keep your head down and don't exceeed 20 mph, cause there will be wires stretched across the road, just for you.


:feedtroll:


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## Grimm (Sep 5, 2012)

besign said:


> If nobody else has any gas, why do you think that they won't steal your vehicle, and/or your gas, killing you if they have to do so? Man, if things get that bad, I'm staying out of sight and as silent as possible. Diesel motors will run on soybean or peanut oil. the Chinese do it all the time (mostly for generators). So we don't really need to bother with the gas, possible exception of off road motorycles, after nearly everyone has died off. ON roads, you'd better have a full fairing, keep your head down and don't exceeed 20 mph, cause there will be wires stretched across the road, just for you.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

besign - 

You are losing nearly all credibility with people here. 

You need the lay off the "apocalypse now" & Mad Max crap ASAP.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

With Gasoline now this cheap, we all need to be storing some for a rainy day!


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## cowboyhermit (Nov 10, 2012)

LincTex said:


> With Gasoline now this cheap, we all need to be storing some for a rainy day!


"cheap", don't forget the scare quotes But I have to agree, at least with the prices you guys are seeing, it has yet to back off much up here but when it does the tanks are getting filled.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

$2.49 USD/gal at Sam's in Harker Heights, Texas -- but that's WAY too far for even me to drive!


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## Jewel (Sep 6, 2014)

Thank you LincTex and all for the information!!! Very important stuff!


As for used propane tanks, you might try craigslist, I've seen them there from time to time. 


I do have to add though that not all folks who are new or have trouble understanding every part right away have their heads up their .... People are wanting to learn and that's important


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

Jewel said:


> As for used propane tanks, you might try craigslist, I've seen them there from time to time.


I get some small ones for free from time to time. I still use them for propane though... mainly because I like their portability and don't like lugging big ol' 100lb'ers allover!



Jewel said:


> I do have to add though that not all folks who are new or have trouble understanding every part right away have their heads up their .... People are wanting to learn and that's important


There's no such thing as a stupid question.... 
But I AM ALWAYS willing to answer questions and help in any way I can!!!

But folks that refuse to be careful? well... 

That's why *I leave it up THEM* in my disclaimer:


LincTex said:


> If you don't think you have the brain cell activity to pull this method of storage off, then you had better not try ANY of it!!!


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

Welll..... crap! The price of gas is going up again.... FAST!!!! 

$1.90 here, 
It was just $1.64 a few days ago!!!!

Time to store some more!!!!!


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## talob (Sep 16, 2009)

LincTex said:


> Welll..... crap! The price of gas is going up again.... FAST!!!!
> 
> $1.90 here,
> It was just $1.64 a few days ago!!!!
> ...


Are we surprised? Slow to come down and quick to go up, picked up another fifteen gallon myself yesterday.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

I was given two 250 gallon bulk tanks from a foreclosed farm, on skids. Both are a little rusty inside and I haven't checked them for leaks, but there are no stains on the outside. I'm tempted to fill one with gas and the other with diesel.

Should come down again. Oil prices fell 8.7% yesterday.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/oil-holds-on-to-bulk-of-recent-gains-1423031216
Oil Prices Slump as Inventories Rise Near 80-Year Highs
Nymex Crude Posts Biggest One-Day Drop in Two Months

By 
Nicole Friedman 
Updated Feb. 4, 2015 4:56 p.m. ET

Oil prices tumbled 8.7% on Wednesday, halting a robust four-day rally, after data showed that U.S. crude supplies had climbed to their highest level in about 80 years.

U.S. crude oil for March delivery *sank $4.60*, or 8.7%, to $48.45 a barrel on the New York Mercantile Exchange, the largest one-day decline since Nov. 28, 2014.

Brent, the global benchmark, declined $3.75, or 6.5%, to $54.16 a barrel on ICE Futures Europe.

U.S. prices rallied 19% in the four days ended Tuesday as a slowdown in U.S. drilling activity and spending cuts by major oil companies spurred some speculation that oil prices, which have plunged in recent months, had reached a bottom. But analysts caution that the market remains oversupplied and that it could take months before reductions in spending and drilling lead to lower oil output.

U.S. crude-oil supplies rose by 6.3 million barrels in the week ended Jan. 30 to 413.1 million barrels, the U.S. Energy Information Administration said Wednesday. Analysts surveyed by The Wall Street Journal had expected a gain of 3.7 million barrels. Stockpiles are at the highest level ever in EIA weekly data going back to August 1982. In monthly data, which don't line up exactly with the weekly data, inventories haven't been this high since 1930.

"U.S. crude oil inventories are at the highest level for this time of year in at least the last 80 years," the EIA said in the report.

Oil prices have plunged more than 50% since June, but U.S. crude production remains at multi-decade highs.

"The inventory report was really, I think, a reality check," said John Kilduff, founding partner at Again Capital in New York. "You still have this dynamic of high output and shaky demand."

Refineries typically shut units to perform seasonal maintenance in February and March, so analysts expect inventories to continue growing in the coming weeks as refiners buy less crude.

"Overall, that was a pretty bearish report, and I think the market's taking it as such," said Kyle Cooper, analyst at IAF Advisors in Houston. "I'm not sure the market's fully factored in the reality that we're going to build a lot of crude in the next few months."


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

I have been given a ton of old R22 (Freon) tanks, and made an adapter to fill them with gasoline. I'll leave 'em green & blue (for now) and stash them in my "junk pile" so they are "incognito!"

I'll put a few of the smaller propane tanks back to their original purpose/fuel.


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## Kodeman (Jul 25, 2013)

LincTex, I just came across this thread and wanted to thank you for it. I garnered a lot of useful info that will be put to good use in the future.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

http://www.wsj.com/articles/crude-oil-futures-nudge-up-in-asian-trade-1438744436

By Nicole Friedman
Updated Aug. 5, 2015 12:12 p.m. ET



> NEW YORK-Oil prices fell near multi-month lows Wednesday after weekly inventory data showed a larger-than-expected drop in U.S. crude supplies but a small increase in production.
> 
> Light, sweet crude for September delivery recently fell 58 cents, or 1.3%, to $45.16 a barrel on the New York Mercantile Exchange, on track for the lowest settlement since March. It briefly dropped below $45 a barrel. ...the lowest intraday price since January.
> 
> ...


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

I honestly thought I would NEVER see gas this cheap again in my lifetime!!

It's getting into the $1.8x range around here!!


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## kinda (Sep 8, 2015)

Some engines burn bad gas a lot better than other engines. Just cause one works with such fuel best not assume that all your engines will handle it as well. Do the testing in all of them.


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## kinda (Sep 8, 2015)

I'd find a way to test those fuel tanks for leaks, under pressure, before I filled them with $500 worth of fuel.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

The newest built "Murphy's USA" (walmart) gas stations in Texas are now offering NO ETHANOL gas for sale! Yay! People with boats or small engines need this - period. No exceptions.

But it's 40 cents a gallon more!! OUCH!! Still cheaper than AvGas or race-gas. Places all over Oklahoma sell ethanol free gas, but the price is much closer. 

I don't advocate buying 1-quart cans of "pre-mix" for your 2-cycle engine equipment.... at $8 a quart, you are spending $24 a gallon (plus sales tax!!!) for regular unleaded with a couple ounces of 2 stroke oil and a few drops of Sta-Bil. Just make your own.


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

After all the hurricane season events, gas was over $2.60 for a while here.....and I never bought one drop of it! Hahaha!

Now I am debating, of whether to "rotate" (use oldest stuff up first and then refill) or just add new fuel. *My oldest gasoline is about 8-9 years old* now... I think I'll burn it up while I see the prices are still dropping like crazy everywhere ($2.08 in Waco now). In the next few weeks, I'll probably empty my 150 gallon propane tank (filled with ~80 gallons gasoline) and move it to a different location (I'm expanding my garden) and then I'll fill it with as much E-0 as I can afford to. It's nice to know it doesn't *HAVE TO BE* E-0, as E-10 stores just fine with this method.


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## ZoomZoom (Dec 18, 2009)

As for rotate or just add, I do the add method (I only have 1 bulk tank so not much of a choice). The oldest stuff in there is probably 4 years old but I what I add every year equates to about 40% of the total tank size so it stays relatively fresh. No problem using the fuel in any of the engines.


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## terri9630 (Jun 2, 2016)

2


LincTex said:


> After all the hurricane season events, gas was over $2.60 for a while here.....and I never bought one drop of it! Hahaha!
> 
> Now I am debating, of whether to "rotate" (use oldest stuff up first and then refill) or just add new fuel. *My oldest gasoline is about 8-9 years old* now... I think I'll burn it up while I see the prices are still dropping like crazy everywhere ($2.08 in Waco now). In the next few weeks, I'll probably empty my 150 gallon propane tank (filled with ~80 gallons gasoline) and move it to a different location (I'm expanding my garden) and then I'll fill it with as much E-0 as I can afford to. It's nice to know it doesn't *HAVE TO BE* E-0, as E-10 stores just fine with this method.


2.08!! Ours is $2.49 and diesel is $2.79.


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## ZoomZoom (Dec 18, 2009)

$2.49 isn't even bad. Our pump prices are $2.75 and up. Thankfully, our grocery store offers fuel discounts when buying groceries so I buy fuel at a cheaper rate.


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## ssonb (Oct 24, 2017)

LINCTEX I skimmed thru the posts on this thread and did not see where you actually Tested to prove that the gasoline was 10% etoh. Not saying you did not, but if it was then your process is great the O2 exclusion may be the ticket. I have stored gas for 8 years also non etoh, 89 octane 15 gal steel drums PRI-G and stored in a Root cellar type structure. The etoh gas would only keep for 3 years max under the same conditions and even that was not the best, the cans would start to rust from the inside.Thanks for the info it has me thinkin.


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## RedBeard (May 8, 2017)

Most of the gas stations around here that sell e10 test higher. 18 percent is pretty common. O2 exclusion is the key. Always has been. Stabil when added to gas and left to sit creates a thin layer across the fuel surface that keeps o2 out, Thats why it's used for storage. Pri-g is an excellent product. If you have gas that is already stale add pri-g and it will bring it back to usable. That said my favorite is star tron. It was designed for the marine industry to specifically fight ethanol. It works very well for storage. Linctex's idea to use propane tanks is pure genius! Wish i thought of it, but since he did im going to try it.


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## Meerkat (May 31, 2011)

Don't know but we use gas treatment for storage. May not be a good idea but thats what we do.


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## sewingcreations15 (Aug 19, 2017)

We just buy all our fuel when it is cheapest and store in jerry cans here in the garage and we add fuel preservative to it. The important part is to rotate through it regularly and replace with new stocks so you are not caught with stale fuel.


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## VoorTrekker (Oct 7, 2012)

Lao shi LincTex, would it suffice to use N2 (nitrogen) gas for the blanket instead of propane? I assume that this system must use venting for the vacuum to work. I will give it a try with my friend who is smarter than I am on matters of physics and stuff.


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## sewingcreations15 (Aug 19, 2017)

Our current pump prices here in Australia are, and you think you got it bad in America  , are unleaded $1.338 per litre and for E10 are $1.32 per litre. 

Fortunately while out of town at a function a couple of weeks ago we picked up E10 for $1.01lt with discounts using our roadside assist club discount grocery cards and filled up 3 jerry cans. It is regular that we carry empty jerry cans with us if we travel from our small country town to the cities to fill them up.


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## Tank_Girl (Dec 26, 2011)

sewingcreations15 said:


> Our current pump prices here in Australia are, and you think you got it bad in America  , are unleaded $1.338 per litre and for E10 are $1.32 per litre.
> 
> Fortunately while out of town at a function a couple of weeks ago we picked up E10 for $1.01lt with discounts using our roadside assist club discount grocery cards and filled up 3 jerry cans. It is regular that we carry empty jerry cans with us if we travel from our small country town to the cities to fill them up.


I hear you SW.
Pension day was yesterday and I used my handy dandy ap. on my phone to look for the best prices in town....wow! The fuel price wars are well and truly over.
The best I found was $1.33 per ltr. *OUCH*
I'm holding off buying until I can get a better price and until that time I'm hoarding my fuel supply and making combined appointments with shopping even though it makes it huge painful day.
I got 3/4's of a jerry can left of the stupid crazy cheap fuel I brought a month ago for $1.09 per ltr and I'm saving that for the next trip to the big smoke for my next surgeon's appointment as their fuel prices are worse than ours.


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## sewingcreations15 (Aug 19, 2017)

Tank_Girl yes the fuel is so dear here at the moment but what we are going to do is buy more jerry cans as the budget allows and build us up to 12 in total for the car and 2 for the gardening equipment. We have 6 for the car currently and 1 for the garden machinery.

It is a delicate monetary juggling act when you are on pensions such as us  .


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

VoorTrekker said:


> Lao shi LincTex, would it suffice to use N2 (nitrogen) gas for the blanket instead of propane?


I suppose so, as would other inert welding gases like Argon and Carbon Dioxide would? The REASON I went with propane is because I can use it as a cooking fuel, and I know it's compatible with gasoline vapors when the pressurized vapor is used as a fuel before tapping out the liquid product.


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