# shtf on vacation or business trip



## Lake Windsong (Nov 27, 2009)

Just read Hurricane Herbert - A Vignette by Jerry D Young. What if shtf while you're on vacation or a business trip? If it's a road trip, we have more space to work with, but what if it's by bus/plane etc.? Does anyone have specifics in mind for how they'd handle a shtf situation if they were away from home? Do you already have a what-if basic plan in mind when planning your trips?


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## bunkerbob (Sep 29, 2009)

Lake Windsong said:


> Just read Hurricane Herbert - A Vignette by Jerry D Young. What if shtf while you're on vacation or a business trip? If it's a road trip, we have more space to work with, but what if it's by bus/plane etc.? Does anyone have specifics in mind for how they'd handle a shtf situation if they were away from home? Do you already have a what-if basic plan in mind when planning your trips?


Just watched the movie, Panic in Year Zero, sixtyish movie staring Ray Milland, briefly, family of four start on vacation, H-bomb hits LA and other locations. Dated but realistic. I recommend this to even non-supportive spouses.
By the way when we take our travel trailer on vacation it is over-loaded with "extra" gear just in case, you might call it a 'super BOB' on wheels. Along with about twice as much food as we can use for that length of trip.


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## Lake Windsong (Nov 27, 2009)

I read the wiki on the movie, sounds interesting. It's going on my list to look for, thanks.

We tend to laugh at the travel advice of "pack light" and pack extra gear also.


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## zorro (May 6, 2009)

I always carry a few essential, even during short business trips. I live in Canada, and sometimes have to travel to USA for business. First let me say I never had problems with US customs. Recently, its getting harder to travel with a knife (which I consider is something you should absolutely have with you if SHTF - and even daily anyways...). Even if I always pack it in my checked baggage, I'm starting having trouble.

The last time, when I got back to Canada, our nice customs officers decided I was "suspect". They asked if I was carrying weapons (yes, they even used the plural form). To which I answered no. I only had brought my small pocket knife (the type the blade fold in the handle, 2.5 inches long) and it was in my checked luggage. It is written in their own list of forbidden/allowed items that _you have the right_ to carry a camping/hunting knife in your checked luggage.

Believe it or not, they opened my luggage and showed me my knife asking what it is. I answered : "This is my camping knife sir". He asked what I planned to do with it. I tough a second (remember the first question, I'm not stupid, I figured out what he wanted me to answer) and answered : "I just carry it for when it is needed, I don't actually intend to do something particular with it". He asked the purpose of my trip. I answered the truth : "I went to the USA to give industrial training to repairmen in a shop in a small town". My knife thus could even have been considered as a tool, and in fact that is how US customs consider the said knife and why they never bother me about it.

I had several other obviously new items in my bag for which they should have questioned me (and should have tried collecting taxes), but the guy didn't even noticed. All that concerned him was why a young lady traveling alone would want to carry a pocket knife. Should I have told him I keep it opened and under the pillow when I have to sleep in these crappy motels whose exterior door barely locks... Or that when you weight 120 pounds and have to go alone in dark spots of old maze-like factories with big men you feel more secure with your knife ready to use in your hand. Well I guess not, because I would have admitted carrying a weapon   :nuts:

I hope this is not going to become worst. One should be allowed to travel with survival stuff! By the way, seriously, if I wanted to do something suspect, I would sure not use the airport as my gateway when I know there are all these guys paid to watch you and all theses technological devices to detect everything *and *while there are thousand of miles of unchecked ground border... I can't even believe there are people trying to bring illegal stuff by plane when they could simply cross the woods. Plus it would even be cheaper 

Oh, this is something to think about: if they close the border while you're traveling? Ever tough of an alternative way to come home? I never tough about this scenario until the flu-panic last fall when I became seriously concerned about this during my trip. I wonder, can they also declare my mountain boots suspect?


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## NaeKid (Oct 17, 2008)

Ok .. lets see if I can picture you correctly here.

120 pound female - arms at their thickest about the same size as my wrists - very small lock-back knife in a bag seperated from yourself

and *OUR* border guys have a problem with you having a *TOOL*??

Maybe you should have told the guy that your stilletto heals have a greater chance of being used as a weapon than that piddly-little-knife ... :ignore:


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## zorro (May 6, 2009)

NaeKid said:


> Ok .. lets see if I can picture you correctly here.
> 
> 120 pound female - arms at their thickest about the same size as my wrists - very small lock-back knife in a bag seperated from yourself
> 
> ...




Well as someone already posted in another thread, these guys don't seem to have any sense of humor.


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## mosquitomountainman (Jan 25, 2010)

I thought it was just the US border guards that were jerks. To bad you have to deal with yours too. 

Some of my son's friends came bck from Mexico and were detained by our border gestapo. He didnt have the proper "documentation" so they were acting like a bunch of ........ He finally go tired of it and told them he was 6 feet 6 inches tall and white. Did he look like a fu.....g Mexican? They ransacked his car and strip searched him and his friend before letting them through. If he had looked like a Mexican or Arab they'd have been afraid ob being accused of "profiling." and let him pass through without a second glance.

We have some Canadian friends who come over here to square dance and our gestapo puts them through all kinds of stupid questions. They're both in thier seventies and white.

And they wonder why the Tea Party movement is growing.


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## TechAdmin (Oct 1, 2008)

The borders suck. Coming back from vacationing on the Texas coast there is a huge stop point where they make you submit to search. It's a good twenty miles in side the border and it's as if you were sitting on it. There are ways around it but if they see you turning they chase. I have no reason to turn so I didn't but the idea of being on American Soil and being asked if I'm a citizen and where I am going (I smiled politely and said "Home") makes me irate.


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## Nina9mm (Feb 10, 2010)

Here is an illustration of how paranoid I am becoming of a SHTF scenario happening while I'm traveling:

This coming August, in Washington DC, there is going to be a great gathering of patriots at the feet of the Lincoln Memorial. I am my state's director of one of these patriot groups - it's my responsibility to help get as many people to DC from my state as possible. I have been working for months on this project. It is estimated that all the different groups and individuals traveling to DC for this rally will number around one million.

Here's my dilemma. I don't want to go anymore because I think it might be a perfect opportunity for certain forces of darkness to strike - either enemies foreign, or domestic. I think Washington DC will be sporting a great big bullseye that weekend, and I want to be home. Imagine explaining this to the leader of my particular group - sorry - I'm chickening out, screw my paid-for airline tickets and hotel accomodations!


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## NaeKid (Oct 17, 2008)

Nina9mm said:


> Here is an illustration of how paranoid I am becoming of a SHTF scenario happening while I'm traveling:
> [..deleted..]
> Imagine explaining this to the leader of my particular group - sorry - I'm chickening out, screw my paid-for airline tickets and hotel accomodations!


Would you be able to setup a BOB and send it to Washington via postal or UPS or something like that and pick it up when you get there? Have all the BOB goodies pre-packed that you think would be good to have with you (check the BOB-thread in Tools and Kits) and just carry it where-ever you go.

I would imagine that vehicle transportation would be a bit of a problem .. would you bring roller-blades in your BOB-kit for swift travel around grid-locked vehicles? If you give yourself several levels of protection and escape and not need them, you might really enjoy the visit.


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## UncleJoe (Jan 11, 2009)

Lake Windsong said:


> What if shtf while you're on vacation or a business trip?


What is vacation?


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## bunkerbob (Sep 29, 2009)

UncleJoe said:


> What is vacation?


RETIREMENT!!!... AH YES.:congrat:


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## Nina9mm (Feb 10, 2010)

Well, NaeKid, that certainly provided me with a good chuckle. I can see me now, in Washington DC, zipping down Pennsylvania avenue on roller blades, gnawing on a cold MRE, AR-15 awkwardly protruding from my bug-out bag, a roll of toilet paper waving like a banner behind me! Really, it's okay, I don't want to go to the rally that bad. Forwarding a box of supplies to your locale IS a good idea, though. Unfortunately, I'm a bit of a girly-girl, and I'm having a challenge prioritizing the items in my bug-out bag so that it weighs less than I do. So, unless I can pack a seasoned-survivalist like you in my bag, I probably ought to just stay home


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## NaeKid (Oct 17, 2008)

Nina9mm said:


> Well, NaeKid, [..deleted..] So, unless I can pack a seasoned-survivalist like you in my bag, I probably ought to just stay home


Sounds like fun - I've always wanted to be taken along other's vacations in a bag :woohoo:


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## TechAdmin (Oct 1, 2008)

See you when you get back Naekid!


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## Expeditioner (Jan 6, 2009)

mosquitomountainman said:


> I thought it was just the US border guards that were jerks. To bad you have to deal with yours too.
> 
> Some of my son's friends came bck from Mexico and were detained by our border gestapo. He didnt have the proper "documentation" so they were acting like a bunch of ........ He finally go tired of it and told them he was 6 feet 6 inches tall and white. Did he look like a fu.....g Mexican? They ransacked his car and strip searched him and his friend before letting them through. If he had looked like a Mexican or Arab they'd have been afraid ob being accused of "profiling." and let him pass through without a second glance.
> 
> ...


I have experienced the same treatment. More often than not I have been treated with courtesy and respect, but all it takes is one or two jerks to give all the rest a bad name. Sometimes you wonder which the "jerks" are really on?

Depending on the mode of travel I either carry or ship ahead of me a GHB with my work equipment. Most vacations in my family do not involve flying and there is always a BOB in the vehicle.


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## akmike (Feb 17, 2010)

I made the mistake of starting to read "One Second After" on a plane ride to Las Vegas recently. I was going with my son who was playing in a wheelchair rugby tournament. Here I am in Vegas, 8th floor hotel room, miles from home, my sons in a wheel chair, wondering what I would do if the lights all went out! 
Still haven't figured out what I would have/could have done.


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## zorro (May 6, 2009)

*Planning trips for people with special needs*



akmike said:


> I made the mistake of starting to read "One Second After" on a plane ride to Las Vegas recently. I was going with my son who was playing in a wheelchair rugby tournament. Here I am in Vegas, 8th floor hotel room, miles from home, my sons in a wheel chair, wondering what I would do if the lights all went out!
> Still haven't figured out what I would have/could have done.


I don't want to be rude or whatever, I also do things that I find out to be stupid afterward. But, I think you should seriously consider planning better knowing you travel with someone who has mobility limitations. You could call the hotel before making a room reservation to ask if they have rooms on the ground floor, or second floor. You could also choose to stay at a motel instead. Most motels do have ground floor room and you get the ability to park your car in front of the room's door (which I would consider as benefit for someone with mobility limitations).

When I go out for dinner with my grandmother who can barely walk, I always phone before to check if we will need to climb steps to enter the dining room.


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## zorro (May 6, 2009)

> Depending on the mode of travel I either carry or ship ahead of me a GHB with my work equipment.


Wow! Great idea, never tough of doing that, but I will definitely consider this in the future  It doesn't cost much to ship a package by ground transport if you can plan your trip in advance.

Oh - and despite being a female, I'm able to pack a BOB weighting only a few pounds (providing you allow me to exclude my hiking boots and clothes from the BOB content, as I consider these part of my normal luggage).


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## Vertigo (Aug 6, 2009)

bunkerbob said:


> RETIREMENT!!!... AH YES.:congrat:


Dunno, but most 'retired' people I know have never been so busy in their lives! I'm sure some genius will think of an anti-stress pill for the retired in the coming years 

V.


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## bunkerbob (Sep 29, 2009)

Vertigo said:


> Dunno, but most 'retired' people I know have never been so busy in their lives! I'm sure some genius will think of an anti-stress pill for the retired in the coming years
> 
> V.


Gin martini, two olives, thanks.


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## flowerrosy (Feb 16, 2010)

*Just pack what I need*

It was funny, I was hiking near Mexico on vacation a couple weeks ago, right on the border. An illegal had dropped a backpack right on the trail we were hiking, so I opened it up and started going though it. It is amazing what these people drop in order to run! They had toilet paper and other hygene items and a whole gallon of water. I took the toilet paper, because I didn't have any and it came in useful.


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## akmike (Feb 17, 2010)

zorro said:


> I don't want to be rude or whatever, I also do things that I find out to be stupid afterward. But, I think you should seriously consider planning better knowing you travel with someone who has mobility limitations. You could call the hotel before making a room reservation to ask if they have rooms on the ground floor, or second floor. You could also choose to stay at a motel instead. Most motels do have ground floor room and you get the ability to park your car in front of the room's door (which I would consider as benefit for someone with mobility limitations).
> 
> When I go out for dinner with my grandmother who can barely walk, I always phone before to check if we will need to climb steps to enter the dining room.


No, not rude,I have just started getting involved in the whole preparedness thing, trying to gain knowledge!
The trip had no issues with my son, everything was completely accessible under normal circumstances,but the book made me think about what could happen.


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## NaeKid (Oct 17, 2008)

I have also done many stupid things, but, I have learned from those stupid mistakes just so that I can do new stupid things :scratch

This site is about sharing the stupid things we have done and what we have learned from them - as well as sharing the smart things we have done so that others can learn the easy way, instead of the hard way. :congrat:


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## akmike (Feb 17, 2010)

If we don't learn from the stupid things, we are doomed to repeat them! Hopefully they aren't so stupid we don't survive them.


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## Lake Windsong (Nov 27, 2009)

akmike said:


> I made the mistake of starting to read "One Second After" on a plane ride to Las Vegas recently. I was going with my son who was playing in a wheelchair rugby tournament. Here I am in Vegas, 8th floor hotel room, miles from home, my sons in a wheel chair, wondering what I would do if the lights all went out!
> Still haven't figured out what I would have/could have done.


If shtf, we all face the possibility of severe injury to ourselves or someone in our party. Even though I have a very active "what if" thought process, there are some situations and scenarios that I haven't prepared adequately for... I guess that's one reason we are all here.

Years ago in college , I had a part-time housekeeping job in a highrise senior living building. The apartment was on the 5th floor, and when the lady left the apartment, it was usually by wheelchair/elevator. She could walk, but not long distances. A fire alarm sounded one day and I helped her to the stairwell. She promptly sat down on the stairs and refused to go down; told me to leave her. Firefighters were going up to higher floors, one left an extra radio with us, and I stayed in the stairwell with her, on the fifth floor, while they extinguished the fire. Later, I was told that some of the residents simply waited in their apartments, even though they were instructed on the intercom to evacuate. If the fire had spread, I could think of 2 options: leave her and evacuate (something I didn't have the heart to do), or risk serious injury to myself half carrying her down the stairs. I remember not understanding why she didn't want to to evacuate, why she would just give up... and being thankful for the radio, so I could know what was going on.


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## mosquitomountainman (Jan 25, 2010)

Okay, we're on vacation now about 1,000 miles south of home. We are camping out of our Jeep Cherokee and have backpacks and we also brought our mountain bikes with saddle bags. Our plans are always multi-tiered with back-up plans for each degradation of travel options from vehicle to bicycle to foot. We brought a 22 rifle, 223 rifle and 357 magnum handgun along with ammo for each. I also have a take-down recurve hunting bow and plenty of arrows. We have HAM and CB radios. We also keep about a two week supply of food with us at all times. Going from vehicle to bicycle to foot we have a priority list of what we'll have to leave behind at each point. We also have netbook computers with about seven hours of run time on batteries. Mine has a Delorme Topo map program on it with topo maps of every area we'd need to travel through to get home. We have a small inverter to charge the batteries in the car.

This is my first time vacationing in the desert (southern Nevada) and It's been great. We've had a chance to do some "desert survival" training that I've always wanted to do. Plus, it's warm and there's no snow here. (A great plus when you live in northwestern Montana.)


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## sailaway (Mar 12, 2009)

NaeKid said:


> Would you be able to setup a BOB and send it to Washington via postal or UPS or something like that and pick it up when you get there? Have all the BOB goodies pre-packed that you think would be good to have with you (check the BOB-thread in Tools and Kits) and just carry it where-ever you go.
> 
> I would imagine that vehicle transportation would be a bit of a problem .. would you bring roller-blades in your BOB-kit for swift travel around grid-locked vehicles? If you give yourself several levels of protection and escape and not need them, you might really enjoy the visit.


Nina could ship her BOB by Greyhound Bus and pick it up at the station. Naekid, I like the roller blade idea.


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## NaeKid (Oct 17, 2008)

I love all the endurance outdoor sports. Mtn.Bike riding, snow-shoeing, hiking, x-country ski, roller-blading, etc. I figure that combining speed and agility in summer-time would be an awesome way to travel during troubled times. I used to roller-blade for up to 4hrs one way on the bike-paths that criss-cross Calgary ... that is why I suggested that idea.


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## HozayBuck (Jan 27, 2010)

NaeKid said:


> Sounds like fun - I've always wanted to be taken along other's vacations in a bag :woohoo:


Well when she opens her bag you best by god be in your own underwear:goodluck:!!

But to answer the OP, I'm getting too old to put up with Border crossing crap so non issue, I don't fly...ever, don't ride buses... ever I'd rather walk, have you seen the average passengers off loading from a bus these days? looks like the usual suspects.

I travel a lot, I drive my War Wagon, or I don't go. I trust my Mom , but since she thinks FDR walked on water I do keep an eye on her.. I keep the bulk tank full and fill the main tank when it's half empty.

I am paranoid and yes something is chasing me but it ain't gaining ..yet


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