# Why Medical bills are killing us



## HozayBuck (Jan 27, 2010)

*I got this in an e mail and spent a long time reading it, it's huge and will take a lot of time but it's worth it. It makes you want to kill the hospital system in this country, Not the people but the billing system...

Read it if you have a lot of time

http://readersupportednews.org/opinion2/272-39/16241-time-why-medical-bills-are-killing-us*


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## Dakine (Sep 4, 2012)

hospitals have to make a profit to stay open right?

where are they going to make up for all the people that show up and demand coverage who pay like $10 a month, if they pay anything at all! where???


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## HozayBuck (Jan 27, 2010)

I guess you didn't read the post? I know it's very long but it's an extremely in depth look at the issue. If you did read it all and can't see the point then there is nothing to say.

I've personally seen the things mentioned in the post. We live it everyday here.


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## stayingthegame (Mar 22, 2011)

:ranton:when our son had open heart surgery, his bill ran well over 400,000.00 dollars. that was what we were expected to pay. know what they charged blue cross? less 150,000.00 dollars!!!!! why? because they gave blue cross a DISCOUNT. and this was at a not for profit hospital!!!! but they won't give YOU one! people who do not have insurance get screwed by the medical field, especially the hospitals.:rantoff:


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## MetalPrepper (Nov 25, 2012)

People who do not have insurance don't pay....the insured people get a larger bill so they can pay for the un insured.


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## BillS (May 30, 2011)

So what? It's a typical liberal piece from Time magazine. Yes, medical care can be tremendously expensive. All the government intervention and the excessive liability awards have helped make it that way. Each step of the way, the government has made healthcare more expensive by pretending to fix it. Yes, it sucks when you get sick and it costs your family $100,000 to beat cancer. But don't worry. Obamacare will fix all that. Socialists ALWAYS ration care to control costs. Once it's fully implemented there will be horror stories just like there are in England. They won't talk about getting rid of the monstrosity. Just fixing it. There are too many idiots out there who want free health care and will think they're getting it. Regardless of the high taxes and the destruction to the economy.


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## partdeux (Aug 3, 2011)

Two things come to mind

When somebody else is paying and you have no skin in the game, you are much more likely to seek out the "best" medical care available
A hammer looks at everything as being a nail. MRI, Cat Scans, etc are way too easy to rationalize if the equipment is available.

For several years, we didn't have medical coverage. It totally changed our approach to handling our care, both good and bad. Good, we were much more active and involved, bad because problems tended to get much worse before taking action. When I have a choice of paying $75 for a Dr, or paying the heating bill, I better really really need to see the Md. We have coverage again, and it scares me. The whole process of going for unneeded medical exams and procedures, just because the insurance will pay. I watched my father in law with his gold plated coverage have to undergo every test designed... IMO, just because his insurance would pay for it.


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## HozayBuck (Jan 27, 2010)

BillS said:


> So what? It's a typical liberal piece from Time magazine. Yes, medical care can be tremendously expensive. All the government intervention and the excessive liability awards have helped make it that way. Each step of the way, the government has made healthcare more expensive by pretending to fix it. Yes, it sucks when you get sick and it costs your family $100,000 to beat cancer. But don't worry. Obamacare will fix all that. Socialists ALWAYS ration care to control costs. Once it's fully implemented there will be horror stories just like there are in England. They won't talk about getting rid of the monstrosity. Just fixing it. There are too many idiots out there who want free health care and will think they're getting it. Regardless of the high taxes and the destruction to the economy.


Jeeze Bills, where do you get the Liberal crap from? It don't matter who wrote it or published it the truth is the truth, I guess in reading the whole thing I missed the parts where it boosted Obamacare as the next best thing to sex?

As for England's issues I have no idea and I doubt you do if you aren't living there and using their health care.

We've had this argument for the last 4 years over OBC, and God knows I despise everything there is about the critter. But, go back and read what NK had to say about his HC in Canada. From what he's told us it beats the shit out of BC&BS or anything else except VA care. But most people don't have access to VA care.

I have nothing against Gov HC as long as it's run right which we all know it won't be. How does Canada do it Are they smarter then us? Must be.

I know I have this talk with Miz Sheri all the time and she has friends all over the world who live with Gov HC and not one of them speaks ill of it.

BUT!! Ny point wasn't to boost OBC, it was to point out the high cost of "Non Profit" health care and the very high profits in it.

I


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## cnsper (Sep 20, 2012)

Here is a question I have.....

When you go to the doc and get some tests done such as an MRI or ultrasound, why the hell do you NEED to go into the doc's office to get the results and pay another office visit? Why the hell can they just not call you with the results? That would save a little time and money on all sides.


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## stayingthegame (Mar 22, 2011)

they need to pad the bill with little things. when my son was in the hospital they charged me 1.50 (1980 price) for the diapers he used. when I tried to bring in my own they said I could not use them because they might not be sterile. they also charged him for each pillow he used, a NEW one every day. said the old one might be contaminated. vract: when I got home found a 5000.00 charge on the bill for "or expenses". asked what they were they told me that I would not understand the terms used. when I said that I would not pay the bill with out knowing what everything was, they said they would take me to court. I said that was fine take me and I would tell the judge why I wasn't paying. got a "corrected" bill a week later. had an over $20,000.00 error on it.


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## partdeux (Aug 3, 2011)

HB,

I've traveled and work with people in several countries with socialized medicine. They think it's great, until they really need something. Their basic care is so much better than ours, but when you get to needing out of the norm treatment, like bypass surgery, you wait for months on end. Cancer is another good one, Canada will take MONTHS before starting treatment, including surgery.


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## Bobbb (Jan 7, 2012)

partdeux said:


> HB,
> 
> I've traveled and work with people in several countries with socialized medicine. They think it's great, until they really need something. Their basic care is so much better than ours, but when you get to needing out of the norm treatment, like bypass surgery, you wait for months on end. Cancer is another good one, Canada will take MONTHS before starting treatment, including surgery.


Right. There is no magic involved here - you get what you pay for. Cost savings that get passed to you have to be cut from someone else's hide. Americans who like the medical care they receive but also like the cheaper cost of Canadian care will have to chose whether they wish to keep receiving the care they receive in America and pay the appropriate cost or whether they're more interested in saving money and thus submit to rationed care and physician shortages.

There's an interesting development taking place in medical education - the number of white applicants is dropping. There are better opportunities to earn money in other sectors of the economy and so whites who have grown up in America and are deeply immersed in the culture pick up on these labor market signals. The void they leave in medical schools is filled by children of recent immigrants who are very attuned to the status of being a doctor and push their kids into this profession and by affirmative action cases. The status seekers are clinging to a status marker that is growing stale, meaning that they're behind the times and eventually they'll wise up and that segment of medical students will start to atrophy.

The point is that when cost savings start really coming out of the hide of physicians, as is the case in almost all socialized systems (and why their physicians leave their countries at a disproportionate rate to practice here), then we're going to see severe physician shortages because fewer and fewer people will want to go down that career path. We're already seeing the early rumblings with primary care physicians - shortages are developing right now.

You get what you pay for. It's like a law of the universe or something.


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## JayJay (Nov 23, 2010)

stayingthegame said:


> :ranton:when our son had open heart surgery, his bill ran well over 400,000.00 dollars. that was what we were expected to pay. know what they charged blue cross? less 150,000.00 dollars!!!!! why? because they gave blue cross a DISCOUNT. and this was at a not for profit hospital!!!! but they won't give YOU one! people who do not have insurance get screwed by the medical field, especially the hospitals.:rantoff:


Nope--I broke my toes, when I received the bill, about 60% was knocked off because I was uninsured.
Their reasoning?? Better to get 40% than nothing.
This also happened to a man who visited thinking he had a heart attack--not so.
The bill was 11,000 and he settled for about 4000, wrote a check, and left.

I also had the emergency doctor of that broken toes accident; he was being paid monthly, and I was asked to pay a$100, one time pmt. and the bill would be purged...I gave the lady my debit card #, the acknowledgment was in my email within 30 minutes, and never heard from the doctor again.

Someone said that hurt my credit---who in this day cares about credit??? We are cash shoppers.


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## JayJay (Nov 23, 2010)

My dh and I have just been uninsured the last 5 years--as he became self-employed; he has history of strokes, by-pass surgery, sleep apnea, hypertension since age 19...lots of issues. Looking at him and watching him work, you'd not know it. So, guess what our premiums would be???

Yeah, out of our reach.

Now, someone reminded me of a story. This happened when we were insured through a log buying company, many years ago.
I am 62, take no prescriptions...and never see a dr.

I had a major ear ache(crying, walking around the table kind of ear ache) because of a sinus infection unknown to me...I had no congestion, headache, teeth ache, dripping--no symptoms I usually have.
I was sent a $200 emergency visit bill--this was devastating to me, years ago, that was a big bill for emergency.

Well, I called the healthcare and inquired, didn't get much of an answer...and quietly said this:
Sweetheart, you need to check my health history and see how often I visit a dr, check how many prescriptions you pay for, and when was the last hospital visit other than a hysterectomy.
Silence.
Because, I don't think I should pay this bill, that's why I have insurance, to be covered for emergencies.
Silence.
But, you send me another bill like this and I CAN visit my dr. often, like twice a year; I CAN start taking hormones I choose to not take, I CAN start taking Nexium for acid reflux I have once a month that I choose to not take, I CAN have surgery for carpal tunnel syndrome that I choose to not have, I CAN visit the dr. with these sinus interruptions every 3 or 4 months that I choose to treat at home, I CAN treat these bunyons with surgery that I continue to refuse.......

She said she'd look into it. I'm sure the conversation was recorded.

I never received a bill for that emergency visit ever.:scratch

There are still some with common sense.:congrat:


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## Dakine (Sep 4, 2012)

Bobbb said:


> You get what you pay for. It's like a law of the universe or something.


That's not true. There are plenty of people who get far more health care than they pay for.


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## Jim1590 (Jul 11, 2012)

The reason insurance companies get a discount is because of the government. Medicare sets the rates at which they will pay. The hospital can say that angioplasty costs 10k but medicare says heres 6k and shove it. To make matters worse, private insurance is paying similar rates. That plus BCBS or Aetna or United or whoever go to the hospital and say give us 10% discount (or 30,40,50...) or we will tell all of our members not to use your hospital or doctors.

As for people who cannot pay, trust me they will get their money. We are still paying off old bills.

Interesting story, but when my first son was born he needed to be transported from the hospital of my choice to another in the same city because of lack of room in my hospital in the NICU. He is fine now and this was all precautionary. He went from a Level one trauma center to a 2. It was in my opinion a service downgrade and I did not like anything about it. Well he needed to be transported by special ambulance and team. Being a paramedic myself I had no problem with this. Until the bills came. $2500 for the drive of 5 miles. But they had doctors and nurses on board as well as the medics and the trip was, I am sure, worth it. Then another grand for "medical control." Well I knew what the deal was. I told the transport company to bill the sending hospital. They asked what the deal was since I had insurance, just let them pay it. They could not comprehend that they where billing me rather than my insurance. But sir you have insurance, just let them pay it (I instructed my insurance to ignore the bill) I told them that my insurance is my authorized payer but they are billing me.

That seems to be part of the issue. I have insurance so just let them deal with it.


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## drfacefixer (Mar 8, 2013)

HOZAY! ETMC is actually pretty good about reducing your expenses in hopes of decreasing collections. Ofcourse its at the tax payers expense but atleast there is some share of responsibility. Trinity mother francis won't show you that love but its posh for the stay. I'm pretty sure if the world ends tyler would remain unchanged. You should have nothing to fear.


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