# Anyone else notice our Debt is not changing?



## CulexPipiens (Nov 17, 2010)

http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/100-days-treasury-has-kept-debt-frozen-16699396000000

As reported Aug 26th...



> (CNSNews.com) - The Treasury Department's latest official daily accounting of the U.S. government's receipts, expenditures and borrowings--released this afternoon at 4:00 p.m.--indicates that the legally limited debt of the federal government has now been exactly $16,699,396,000,000 for 100 straight days. - See more at: http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article...bt-frozen-16699396000000#sthash.KNNQKcXt.dpuf
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See the full article at the URL.

The take away... instead of changing the debt or asking for more they're now stealing the money from government retirement funds hoping at some later date to raise the debt enough to pay them back. Either way we're on the hook for that.

It was bad enough when they were fudging the numbers... Now they don't even bother to do that anymore. It just gets more scary.


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## RevWC (Mar 28, 2011)

Basically, as I see it, we have defaulted and should declare bankruptcy..


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

Just look here. It is flying up.

http://www.usdebtclock.org/


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

CulexPipiens said:


> http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/100-days-treasury-has-kept-debt-frozen-16699396000000
> 
> (CNSNews.com) - The Treasury Department's latest official daily accounting of the U.S. government's receipts, expenditures and borrowings--.--indicates that the legally limited debt of the federal government has now been exactly $16,699,396,000,000 for 100 straight days..


When you control the numbers.... you can fudge them all you want to!!

Very scary stuff..... who else in the world notices these things?


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## Sentry18 (Aug 5, 2012)

Maybe we are finally printing enough new money to balance the budget. Because everyone knows as long as you have a blank check you must still have money in the account....right? :nuts:


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## Woody (Nov 11, 2008)

Hey, it worked with Social Security so why not do it again! Pretty soon it will be all retirement funds then a Cyprus style robery.


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## invision (Aug 14, 2012)

It is DC fuzzy math. Obama has an etch-a-sketch now, every time he wants to make a change it is Flip-n-Shake. Saw this when it was at 60 days unchanged.


My question, once the debt ceiling is raised, how close will we be when Treasury adds in the missing links?


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## LincTex (Apr 1, 2011)

invision said:


> My question, once the debt ceiling is raised, how close will we be when Treasury adds in the missing links?


If the numbers are not kept current...

...when they DO finally come "up to date", the change will be significant enough that the markets should spook amazingly. Maybe this is the final "stall"?

Watch out for any big financial announcements!


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## partdeux (Aug 3, 2011)

how about the BLS numbers that are always revised up... 3 months after they initially come out?


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## biobacon (Aug 20, 2012)

Back to October right? Scary Stuff.


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## RevWC (Mar 28, 2011)

October 1st put it on your calander


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## Marcus (May 13, 2012)

I *strongly* recommend a book by Glen Beck called, "Broke." It was written in 2010 and deals with some of the games the government plays in their accounting plus a brief synopsis of several past presidents and their budgets.

The first thing to understand is there are 2 types of government debt: Public debt and Intra-governmental debt.

Public debt is the much ballyhooed budget deficit, which is supposed to be under $1 Trillion this year for the 1st time in 5 years. Wow, we're doing better....except we're not.
Intra-governmental debt is debt the government owes itself. Sounds rather benign doesn't it? Except it isn't. When there's a trust fund, say the Social Security Trust Fund, and money is taken (stolen???) out of it and spent, a special non-negotiable Treasury bond is used to replace the spent monies. That's Intra-governmental debt. It's an obligation to repay the monies taken. The entire surplus in all of the trust funds are gone and replaced by these special pieces of paper. Some of the surpluses were used to lower past deficits, *but the gist is all those monies are gone.* As Baby Boomers started retiring in 2010, the yearly surpluses started to shrink in the trusts and will continue to do so. So taxes are going to go up to pay those benefits or the dollar will be inflated so as to greatly reduce its buying power.

What's worse is the government uses very screwy accounting rules which would cause a publicly traded company to have officers going to jail. There's no GAAP, but rather any sort of accounting trick that will make the government look better.

The official debt is approaching $17 Trillion, but with unfunded liabilities, the true debt picture is much worse. How bad is it? Estimates vary, but the low end estimates are $60-80 Trillion plus the nearly $20 Trillion that is officially acknowledged. That's *6 years worth of GDP for the whole country.* The longer we wait to find a fix to the problem, the worse it'll get.


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## Dakine (Sep 4, 2012)

I'd be interested to know the sources that he would cite for this.

Keep in mind Drudge broke the monica lewinsky scandal, so sure... absolute unknowns can break the entire story exclusively!!! but it doesnt happen a LOT, and that much of a confluence of training and expenditures not showing up on anyone elses radar but his?...

like I said, I'd like to know what sources he'd cite. 

I'd also like it noted for the record  that I had to keep rewriting my statement on our esteemed President and his squeeze of the week... it's not my fault that so many "news" terms also fit the Bill for what she was doing in her fullest capacity as a public servant.


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## invision (Aug 14, 2012)

Dakine said:


> I'd be interested to know the sources that he would cite for this.
> 
> Keep in mind Drudge broke the monica lewinsky scandal, so sure... absolute unknowns can break the entire story exclusively!!! but it doesnt happen a LOT, and that much of a confluence of training and expenditures not showing up on anyone elses radar but his?...
> 
> ...


Actually, what was stated is true, there is enough available information at the variety of government websites that if you read and search and read and search you can find every explanation that was given. The other thing to note is two things 1- continued unfunded liabilities over the next 10 years is estimated at $110T - so $10T a year. 2- the Fed Reserve is NOT government controlled, the only aspect of the Fed Reserve controlled by the government is the election of the directors, the vice chair, and the chairman of the board. All of the monetary decisions they make - inflation rates, interest rates, bond auctions, etc is controlled by them not the government.

Scary world when you look at the numbers.


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

This year Congress will change the debt limit to about 19 trillion dollars. No one can even understand a number that big. In the latest poll (by a liberal organization) most Americans do NOT want the debt ceiling raised (by about 2 to 1). But obviously Congress will raise it. Just another thing they do against the wishes of the people they serve.


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## partdeux (Aug 3, 2011)

Unfunded liabilities are upwards of 200+T

Let that sink in. Govt is spending 1-1.5T more than revenue each and every year. 17T in debt, and has obligations of 200T. How do you fix that? Cut off welfare recipients? Them will be some angry and dangerous entitlement recipients. Maybe the retirees that are the worst of the unfunded liabilities, they ain't going to be none too happy to be cut off. I got it, let's lay off a bunch of over paid govt employees... and pay them unemployment.

Not only have we gotten painted into a corner, the paint is not drying.


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## CulexPipiens (Nov 17, 2010)

The ceiling has to be raised. If they don't we default and at this point no one wants us to... yet...

Markets won't like the raise and will react however it shouldn't be the big one as anyone paying attention can see what is happening here.


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## Magus (Dec 1, 2008)

Print it until it chokes ya..
I'll be here, or someone like me to pick up YOUR pieces.Vulture by nature and predator by style.
we're ALWAYS HUNGRY.


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## mojo4 (Feb 19, 2012)

Don't worry about the gov taking your retirement account. Why bother mugging you for 200K when they can go to the computer and spit out a couple trillion out of thin air. We are looking at a new minivan. My problem is this ..... do I buy now pre-collapse and pay it off with inflated dollars or buy PM's and buy it post collapse?? Any thoughts?


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## Magus (Dec 1, 2008)

Steal it after SHTF.


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## CulexPipiens (Nov 17, 2010)

mojo4 said:


> Don't worry about the gov taking your retirement account. Why bother mugging you for 200K when they can go to the computer and spit out a couple trillion out of thin air. We are looking at a new minivan. My problem is this ..... do I buy now pre-collapse and pay it off with inflated dollars or buy PM's and buy it post collapse?? Any thoughts?


Since you brought it up... the concern is that they do take the accounts (401K, IRA, etc) as that nets them trillions. Numbers I've heard mentioned put it around 4 trillion. Sure they can print it and accelerate the collapse or they can "help" you with your retirement accounts and pad their accounts... thus keeping the shell game going for a few more years at least.


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## invision (Aug 14, 2012)

Well right after O's speech yesterday about just "how good we are doing" blah blah ... The On of the US financial arms came out with a statement that our debt is extremely close to being unmanageable, and that within a few years would be 6.x% of GDP and within 20 yrs be 100% of GDP. Warning everyone drastic measures need to be taken now, not tomorrow and this was from a government agency...


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## hiwall (Jun 15, 2012)

> The ceiling has to be raised. If they don't we default


Well that is not exactly accurate. If we do not raise the debt limit all it means is that the USA has to work with a balanced budget. So we would still pay our obligations but the gov would have to shave over a trillion a year from the budget.


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## rawhide2971 (Apr 19, 2013)

artydance:I am a simple kind of guy....simply put ;the current administration is a pack of liar's and is with holding the true numbers from the American people, the current congress is failing to preform the functions of the jobs the swore an oath to uphold, and the current leadership of the media are failing to hold accountable the elected officials in office and expose the fraud that is being conducted. its really very simple when you boil it all down.:gaah:


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