# scout project planning help...



## 2bgrand (Jan 9, 2009)

my wife and I have recently been enlisted to coordinate some of the activities and projects for our 7 yr old's cub scout den. The previous den leader has only done artsy-crafty stuff, and due to the economy now has had his job shuffled a bit.

When I was in scouts, it was more about survival and camping and hiking, not so much of the glue this and paint that for a christmas ornament. I have done web searching for a variety of projects, and found this forum and thought it would be a relevant forum.

I have tools, a woodworking shop, minimal fundage, 2 jeeps to get us anywhere, and take a lot of pride in everything I do. I want to be able to guide these scouts before their mothers cry mutiny and remove them from a program that has helped many of us.

I was on Instructables - Make, How To, and DIY for ideas, and like the cotton ball film canister thread here so far, as campfire starting should be a primal skill for a scout. Any other ideas?

Thank you in advance for your help.


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## NaeKid (Oct 17, 2008)

Found your other thread asking the same kind of question .. you can peak at my answer over there:

http://www.preparedsociety.com/forum/f26/scouting-ideas-958/


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## ke4sky (Oct 21, 2008)

*Great ideas for Scouts*

Your family may not be together when disaster strikes, so it is important to plan in advance: how you will contact one another; how you will get back together; and what you will do in different situations.

It may be easier to make a long-distance phone call than to call across town, so an out-of-town contact may be in a better position to communicate among separated family members.

Be sure every member of your family knows the phone number and has coins or a prepaid phone card to call the emergency contact.

You may have trouble getting through, or the telephone system may be down altogether, but be patient.

Many many ideas can reduced to short half-hour workshops with "play time" for the scouts to discuss and try out ideas under adult supervision. Some concepts to introduce are:

Positive mental attitude

Situational Awareness

First Aid / Sanitation

Shelter

Signaling

Fire

Water

Food

Shelter construction

Fire making without matches: 
flint striker with cotton balls and petroleum jelly 
battery and steel wool
Fresnel lens
bow drill

Signaling with whistle, flashlight, signal mirror

Home hazard hunt, how to turn off the water, electricity, gas
Use the CERT Field Operations Guide and discuss
https://www.citizencorps.gov/cert/cert-fog.shtm

Home emergency equipment and supplies
72 hour kit calendar

Safe neighborhood refuge - where do I go if something happens and Mom and Dad aren't home? Who do I call? Safe places to go, fire station, uniformed school security officer or policeman

Involve children in familiy PREPAREDNESS

Sheltering at Home During an Emergency 
For using a building without working utilities as shelter

Exhaust - candles, camp stoves, lanterns, generators, 
heaters, charcoal grills, all generate carbon monoxide 
and must not be used indoors! 
Open flame - above ignition sources 
must never be left unattended! 
Fuel - most of the above require flammable fuels 
to operate, which must be stored outdoors. 
Use Fire Marshal approved fuel containers

Avoid as shelter: 
Areas around downed utility lines 
In or near culverts 
Within the "collapse zone" of a damaged building 
(maintain 2:1 ratio of distance away to building height)

Improvised Shelters: 
Sheds 
Tents 
Tarps 
Vehicles

Emergency Shelter Materials: 
Salvage building materials from debris or 
from damaged structures only when it can be done safely 
TYVEK building wrap 
Plastic sheeting 
Roofing paper and shingles 
Siding, plywood 
Chain link fence 
Lumber 
Carpeting 
Wire, rope, and fasteners

Build Your Shelter In Layers 
Structural framing: lumber, plywood, fencing, metal 
Fasteners: reinforce structural connections with nails, wire or rope ties, wooden spikes 
Water and wind proofing: TYVEK, plastic sheeting, tarp, shingles, roofing paper 
Insulation: drywall, leaves, tree branches, carpeting, (may also be used as ballast to hold water/wind proofing layer in place)

SIGNALLING

Day: Mirror flashes - best daylight signal device 
Smoke 
Brightly colored cloth flag / panel (VS-17) 
ICAO surface-to-air signals 
V Require assistance 
X Need medical assistance 
Y Yes - affirmative 
N No - negative 
→ I am proceeding in this direction

Night: Flashing strobe light 
Fire 
Signal flares 
Sound, i.e. whistle, siren, vehicle horn

FIRE: 
Maintains body temperature 
Great morale booster 
Deters wild animals and insects 
Boils water 
Cooks food 
Used as day (smoke) 
or night (light) signal

WATER SUPPLY 
Minimum for drinking 
1 gallon per person, per day 
More water is needed for 
Cooking and food preparation 
Personal hygiene, sanitation and decontamination 
Store a two week supply as minimum 
Food grade containers with screw caps 
Away from direct sunlight

EMERGENCY WATER SOURCES 
Captive water in household hot water tank and interior plumbing is OK 
Filter cloudy water to remove particulates, using an EPA-rated filter 
with a pore size ≤ 1 micron, then: 
Disinfect with Clorox (6% sodium hypochlorite) add 8 drops of Chlorox 
bleach per gallon if clear, 16 drops if cloudy, let water stand 15 minutes before use 
Or boil vigorously for 15 minutes 
Store potable water in clean containers.

All natural sources (from springs, ponds, rivers or streams) 
must be boiled or chemically disinfected. 
Chemical disinfection or boiling - Kills bacteria and viruses 
Doesn't remove particulates or chemical pollutants 
Filtration - Coffee filters, etc. remove gross particulates only 
EPA-rated filters (pore size smaller than 1 micron) are needed 
to remove bacteria, viruses and Giardia cysts, but don't remove chemical pollutants. 
Distillation is the most effective method.

FOOD 
Lowest of the seven survival priorities 
Need is mostly mental, because we are used to eating regularly 
Healthy people will do OK without food for a week or more, if they are well hydrated 
Balanced nutrition is a important health factor for elderly and infants.

SHELF LIFE OF FOOD STORED IN THE HOME 
Food in a refrigerator is safe for a day after the power goes off, 
either use it in 24 hours or throw it away 
Frozen food is safe if there are still ice crystals, 
once thawed, cook and consume it within 24 hours 
Next use non-perishables and dry staples 
Canned foods are best for long term storage 
(up to 4 years) but are heavy to transport and bulky to store 
Dry packaged foods are easiest to transport 
Choose foods requiring minimal preparation 
Eat at least one balanced meal daily 
Include nutritional supplements in supplies 
Drink enough water.

EMERGENCY FOOD SUPPLIES 
MREs, or Heater Meals® 
Prepared survival rations 
Primitive survival methods: 
Fishing 
Hunting 
Trapping 
Foraging

ESSENTIAL SUPPLIES 
Each person should have their own backpack of personal essentials 
Flashlight 
Portable radio 
Extra batteries 
First Aid Kit, (containing a first aid manual) 
Personal medications and sanitation supplies 
Cooking and eating utensils 
Wool blanket or sleeping bag for each person 
Sturdy shoes and extra socks 
Rain gear 
Change of warm clothing and underwear 
Items for special needs, care of infants

For further information: 
Prepare - Fairfax County, Virginia 
Make a Plan - Fairfax County, Virginia
http://www.fema.gov/txt/library/f&web.txt 
VAEmergency.com > Prepare & Prevent > Family Disaster Planning


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## dilligaf (Oct 17, 2008)

call me crazy but i think its a bad idea to be putting 7 year olds and fire skills together..

it cant end well. some kid will burn his house down practicing..no matter how much you preach safety your dealing with 7 year olds.the temptation will get the best of one of them..

why not something a little less potentially destructive?
maybe what to do if you get lost,building a basic shelter,basic map reading,how to read a compass,take them fishing,make simple bird traps or snares,plant identification,nature hikes,preparing a day pack,animal tracking are just a few ideas and most cost next to nothing to do.

you need to remember these are just kids,the goal now is to make it fun for them and keep it basic and simple so they will be encouraged to continue into boy scouts and start learning skills and collecting badges.

i think at that age its more important to keep them happy and interested than it is to teach them vital skills.keep whatever you do down to a very basic level.

hope that helps..


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## The_Blob (Dec 24, 2008)

I've heard that the older cub scout/boy scout manuals have a lot more relevant information in them that has not been reprinted in current editions, so my advice (along with the good suggestions offered by others so far) would be to get your hands on some older scouting manuals & photocopy parts of them for 'home handouts' maybe you'll get some of the other mothers/fathers involved if they see that these are useful skills & not just a way to get the kids out of their hair for 3 hours once a week...


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## ke4sky (Oct 21, 2008)

dilligaf said:


> call me crazy but i think its a bad idea to be putting 7 year olds and fire skills together..


It can work both ways. You have to gage the maturity of the kid and his sense of responsibility.

When I was in first grade my Dad taught me how to build a fire in the wood stove and to prepare a charcoal grill for a picnic. This was to be my job when called for, but only when supervised. Dad impressed upon me how serious a house fire was. It was made it clear that if I screwed up there would be no scouts, no camping, hunting, fishing or backyard barbeques because we'd all be dead! I had no curiosity about either fire or firearms, because neither were forbidden. I treasured those times with Dad when he would let me help do "big boy stuff." He is long gone but I remember his firm, gentle teaching like he is still right there beside me and surely do treasure those memories.

A neighbor kid was forbidden to have even toy guns, or go anywhere 
near matches. He was too curious, a firebug and would sneak around, light matches and start small fires. Once I saw this, I knew how dangerous it was and told my Dad. My Dad told the kid's father. They sat the kid down on the curb in front of the house with a big box of Ohio Blue Tips. They made him strike each one and hold onto it until his fingers burned and he had to let go of it. Today they would call that child abuse, but that kid never picked up a match again. He got cured of that curiosity.

I "lost" my friend only for the summer until school started. Shortly after we started third grade a kid across town died in a house fire which was started by playing with matches. They talked about it in school. I approached my neighbor again and said. "I'm sure glad that wasn't you!" and the little lightbulb came on in his head. We are still friends to this day.


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## dilligaf (Oct 17, 2008)

ke4sky said:


> It can work both ways. You have to gage the maturity of the kid and his sense of responsibility.


i agree,however when dealing with a group you cant really go on a individual basis,simply because the kid seems mature enough to be taught such things is in no way a guarantee that he will treat the skill responsibly. kids will be kids. its not like the child is yours and you can be around most of the time to reinforce safety,nor can you be confident that the child will be under proper supervision should they decide to experiment when not with the pack..

that being the case what this boils down to is in todays litigious society you simply cant risk taking a large group of kids and teach them such a potentially dangerous skill without setting yourself up for all sorts of potential legal ramifications..

far be it from me to tell anyone what to do or how far to trust kids,but if it was me personally,their is no way in hell i would show a buncha 7 year old kids how to make cotton ball fire starter..lol

but then,,,thats just me...


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## Canadian (Dec 14, 2008)

I'd say be careful what you teach the kids. In this day and age everyone is eager to sue everyone. A wood shop can be a dangerous place. If a kid so much as gets a small cut you could be in legal trouble. I'd stick to activities that are very safe and injury free. Also activity waivers area good idea. Have the parents sign one before every "dangerous" activity for a little extra legal protection.


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## Merlin (Dec 25, 2008)

2bgrand said:


> my wife and I have recently been enlisted to coordinate some of the activities and projects for our 7 yr old's cub scout den. The previous den leader has only done artsy-crafty stuff, and due to the economy now has had his job shuffled a bit.
> 
> When I was in scouts, it was more about survival and camping and hiking, not so much of the glue this and paint that for a christmas ornament. I have done web searching for a variety of projects, and found this forum and thought it would be a relevant forum.
> 
> ...


Hi I have been asked a few times to sit in at some scout meetings because of my SAR work.. In my opinion part of the lessons taught should be something useful they can use the rest of their lives. I would suggest at their age Mabe knot tying two great books you could buy or get from a library are Ashley book of Knots... 2nd The Ultimate encyclopedia of knots and rope work both have pictures and drawings both give history and use of the knot I thing all preparedness people should have one or both also to practice a few.. The low funds would not be a issue do to library and you could find a rope and cut into many pieces for them to work with maybe other parents would have some even if their different sizes and types all good to learn with this could also enable a next step of making lanyards for the items and would lead to other lessons.. Next would be hiking sticks or staffs made of broom handles tree branches from downed trees or my favorite is the hollow alum pole now this brings out lessons of what would they put in it. what to do to the outside of it like wrap string on it for gripping.. and storage for items when needed I will try to post some pics of some we use out in the woods hiking look in my picture gallery I hope this helps you along with all the others ideas


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## Ridgerunner (Oct 27, 2008)

When I was in Cub Scouts We did not do much in the way preparedness stuff, except for first aid and some knot tying. most of our survival Stuff was covered in Boy Scout (11-17 yrs).

I think for the young kids (<10yrs) they Should know the basic Stuff and not be over loaded with to much.

They should know the following.

General first aid and maybe a CPR class.

Where to go if they are separated from there parents or guardian 
( I was always told to go to a Church or find a policeman)

How to make temporary shelter.

how to make a fire (for the older ones)

how to find food and clean water

Contact information for relatives

Know their full name and address ( for the little ones.)


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## mtnscout (Oct 9, 2008)

*Scout ideas*

Seven year olds are wolves=second graders. They can earn the emergency preparedness badge the requirements are found at http://usscouts.org/advance/EmergPrep.asp
They list requirements for each age group in scouting, this can be combined with knots and other activities that teach all sorts of different skills. 
The activities listed in the program helps for each month tie into the theme of that month and are age appropriate. While teaching the boys the camping skills has always been part of the program if it's not fun the boys won't keep coming back and a lot of boys are now from a urban background and find outdoorsy stuff strange but are always eager to try it.
I say with a lot of scouting background that over time and careful choosing of activities that you can teach them what you want them to learn and in a way they enjoy but don't rush because as another poster said the meat of learning outdoor skills happens later in boy scouts.


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## flight or fight (Feb 3, 2009)

Wolf Scouts are way too young to be learning about building fires. As a 10 vet of Scouting you need to go through the Wolf Book at the pace that it is designed. Subsequent books ( Bear, Webelos1, and WebelosII) are designed to build on the knowledge they have learned in previous years and if you jump to the great stuff you will find your boys quitting before Boy Scouts because they will get bored with all the repetition to earn their achievements.


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## racer944 (Feb 5, 2009)

Fightorflight and ridgerunner have the right idea. When I was a cub scout, we pretty much learned the very basic basics while going on lots of campouts (car camping is a great idea at this point) and doing all the silly competitions that are a ton of fun (pinewood derby, anyone?). The best thing at that point is not to overload them with heavy talk of survival, just stick to what ridgerunner said and make sure they go on tons of car camping trips with campfires, smores, and the like. Once they get into Boy Scouts, it's time for going on the Appalachian Trail, SeaBase, and getting the Polar Bear Award.

Also, keep them away from fire as long as possible. Every year at summer camp we required from our parents at least a bottle of bug spray a day from all the pyromania, seriously. Once they are in Boy Scouts, it's going to be pretty much necessary to teach them how to make fire without a lighter/matches, but until then, keep them away.


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## Smithy (Oct 15, 2008)

I've been working with Scouts for 13 years now, and I think at the age of 7, you need to cover the fundamental personality-builders that will enable them to think right later on. Self reliance, personal accountability, and very elementary skills applicable to their immediate environment (how to dial 911, how to tie a knot, how to put on their own band-aid, how to avoid high-risk situations to start with... ie, don't go pet the snake.)

You can teach the basics of fire, such as the rule of 3 - needing oxygen, fuel, and heat, to offer the principle behind the thing, and approach it from the angle of putting one out in an emergency. Lighting them? Tons of good age-appropriate material on scout resource websites, but I wouldn't go too far.

As for other scouting activities, since you're asking here, I'm guessing you haven't been to U.S. Scouting Service Project. and there's an activity guide for cubs there at USSSP: Cub Scout Activity Guide

Good luck.


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