# Refill small propane tanks



## bunkerbob (Sep 29, 2009)

I've had this filler device for about 30 years now. Just connect to any 5 gallon propane tank, turn upside down, connect small bottle and turn on. It fills the tank in about 5 min, at first I opened the schrader valve to allow more propane in but I found it wasn't necessary. I just reuse the tanks over and over again, also a lot cheaper that new.
I don't believe it would be hard for most to construct one, if they aren't available anymore.:scratch


----------



## NaeKid (Oct 17, 2008)

Bob, that is awesome!!! :beercheer:

I would love to have something like that. I've always been told that you cannot refill the mini-bottles, now, I know that you can :2thumb:


----------



## sailaway (Mar 12, 2009)

Bob, I would love to have one of those. Perhaps even make one. all you would need is to find some one familiar with pneumatic and hydraulic systems and probably some custom machines parts. It would be a fun project to do. Sailaway


----------



## bunkerbob (Sep 29, 2009)

sailaway said:


> Bob, I would love to have one of those. Perhaps even make one. all you would need is to find some one familiar with pneumatic and hydraulic systems and probably some custom machines parts. It would be a fun project to do. Sailaway


I don't think it would take that much engineering. Let me look at it in detail and see what I can do, just what I need, another project, thanks alot guys.:beercheer:


----------



## gcrmcc (Mar 12, 2009)

*small propane tanks*

Harbor frieght and other places sell the refill adapters for $15-20.00. I am picking one up next time I get to San Antonio

gcrmcc


----------



## bunkerbob (Sep 29, 2009)

I found a youtube short on making one... 




The link didn't happenneed some help here Administrators:scratch
Found this at Harbor freight...- Harbor Freight Tools - Quality Tools at the Lowest Prices thanks, gcrmcc:congrat:


----------



## UncleJoe (Jan 11, 2009)

bunkerbob said:


> just what I need, another project, thanks alot guys.:beercheer:


Oh come on Bob, you don't have any thing else going on right now. :ignore:


----------



## bunkerbob (Sep 29, 2009)

Found all the parts in the shop to make one, not too bad, was that fast enough UncleJoe
One of these days I'll take a photo of my shop. Need to have a little of everything, to be prepared. I don't throw much away.:2thumb:
Matter of fact, I like this idea best, it has a valve at the small tank end, the other does not.


----------



## youpock (Oct 20, 2009)

Sometimes walmart has them for cheap.


Hey how do you know when they are full? That's what I've always wondered lol


----------



## bunkerbob (Sep 29, 2009)

youpock said:


> Sometimes walmart has them for cheap.
> 
> Hey how do you know when they are full? That's what I've always wondered lol


It just stops hissing internally, you can put your ear to the small tank to tell. Also if you put the small tank in the freezer for about a 1/2 hour it will help.


----------



## TechAdmin (Oct 1, 2008)

I'm impressed.


----------



## jebrown (Nov 7, 2008)

What you are ignoring is that these disposeable tanks are not built to be refilled. The walls are not strong enough to withstand the differences in pressure fluxuation. The walls are not thick enough. Sure you can refill them severaal times and all is well but one day your luck will run out. The tank being reilled will blow. The sasfety valve will fail or the tank itself will fail. Then you will have a rocket on your hands and where it stops no one knows. It may even catch fire. 
Here is a positive thought. You can save all the money on propane tank purchases and put it in a rebuild fund for when the tank fails.
Please do not be surprised if the local Fire Department shows up and fines you for arson, possisbley arrests you for the same reason.
Also don't be surprised if your homeowners insurance company laughs in your face as they tell you that you are not covered.
Before you relegate me to Village Idiot staus check with the local Fire Department as well as the state Fire Marshal for their opionon on what you are doing. Ask them which fire and building codes you are violating
Just as inmportant check your homeowners poicy with your company's salesman to find aout ahead of time about you coverage or lack of.
Also if there is damage ro property owned by some one else you are responssible for that damage even if you think it is an accident.

Jerry


----------



## bunkerbob (Sep 29, 2009)

jebrown said:


> What you are ignoring is that these disposeable tanks are not built to be refilled. The walls are not strong enough to withstand the differences in pressure fluxuation. The walls are not thick enough. Sure you can refill them severaal times and all is well but one day your luck will run out. The tank being reilled will blow. The sasfety valve will fail or the tank itself will fail. Then you will have a rocket on your hands and where it stops no one knows. It may even catch fire.
> Here is a positive thought. You can save all the money on propane tank purchases and put it in a rebuild fund for when the tank fails.
> Please do not be surprised if the local Fire Department shows up and fines you for arson, possisbley arrests you for the same reason.
> Also don't be surprised if your homeowners insurance company laughs in your face as they tell you that you are not covered.
> ...


Jerry, I've been refilling small propane cylinders for 30 years with out incident. Some of my 16 oz tanks are years old, they will eventually not hold any pressure. As with any tool you need to take care of them and when not viable anymore replace or disposed of them properly. The beauty of propane is the low pressure within the tanks...Portable Propane Generator LP Kit. The refill adaptor I purchased actually came with a tank with a openable schrader valve, similar to the 20lbs ones.
I agree with your cautionary comments though, and thanks for you input.
More info...Refill Disposable Propane Cylinders! | Navagear.com
I'm aware of local fire regs here in Calif which are among the most stringent anywhere, the items sold have all applicable safety listings, such as UL.
I am only sending the original post as a suggestion on whats out there and my experiences with it, not a requirement to buy.


----------



## jebrown (Nov 7, 2008)

Bunkerbob
You are living on borrowed time whether you are willing to believe me or not.
Just because someone sells ssomething doesn't mean it is safe for use. 
You may be familiar with two of my past employers. Continental Truck & Towing and Cole-Schaefer Ambulance.There was not a day that went by on eithjer job that I didn't here the "But I've have been doing the same thing for... and this never happened." It eventualy catches up with you. 
I even heard the same comments made to the Fire Department from house fire victims in the 22 years with the Red Cross. I satarted my career with the Red Cross in Pasadena, CA.
As far as California fire codes I am well aware of them too. I graduated from the Fire Sciece program at Mt. San Antonio Community college in Walnut, CA.,where I also graduated from the California State Fire Marshal's classes for Fire Prevention, all three classes. I am well aware of how stringent Caifornia fire codes are.
From the reply you made I don't see you as seeing the need to heed my advice, therefore I will not offer any more. I just hope that when your luck runs out as it will that no one is hurt by your careless disregard for safety. 

Jerry


----------



## NaeKid (Oct 17, 2008)

I never really thought about the little 2-pounders being all that dangerous. I have 2 dozen bottles in my camping trailer year 'round, bouncing and shaking and having the paint scratched off. I have a dozen of the 2-pounders in my basement in my "storage closet" right next to my portable propane stove, portable BBQ's, my catalytic heaters and my propane lanterns. That is all right beside my food-storage items and my deep-freeze - close to my canned goods (home canned as well as store bought).

I have gone camping and placed the 2-pounder propane tanks near the firepit, walked 20 yards, turn, and shoot with a .22 and watch the fire-ball rise into the air. We have made firepit molotov's where we fill wine bottles with some gasoline, push the cork back into the bottle, duct-tape the cork down and place the bottle on the edge of a hot fire ... flames will shoot 500' up into the air .. again, never thought that it was dangerous, just lots of fun and much cheaper than fireworks.


----------



## bunkerbob (Sep 29, 2009)

NaeKid said:


> I never really thought about the little 2-pounders being all that dangerous. I have 2 dozen bottles in my camping trailer year 'round, bouncing and shaking and having the paint scratched off. I have a dozen of the 2-pounders in my basement in my "storage closet" right next to my portable propane stove, portable BBQ's, my catalytic heaters and my propane lanterns. That is all right beside my food-storage items and my deep-freeze - close to my canned goods (home canned as well as store bought).
> 
> I have gone camping and placed the 2-pounder propane tanks near the firepit, walked 20 yards, turn, and shoot with a .22 and watch the fire-ball rise into the air. We have made firepit molotov's where we fill wine bottles with some gasoline, push the cork back into the bottle, duct-tape the cork down and place the bottle on the edge of a hot fire ... flames will shoot 500' up into the air .. again, never thought that it was dangerous, just lots of fun and much cheaper than fireworks.


Well I can not find any data about low pressure small 16 oz propane tanks exploding on the web, you know me I'll look until I can find hard data, but living on 'borrowed time' I might not have enough left. I will keep at it though.
Over the years we have tried to 'blow' them up by shooting into them, no luck even with tracer rounds. I remember Mythbusters doing something similar, can't remember what happened.:dunno:
What I can glean from the web is that they are safe because of the 'low pressure' property of them.


----------



## NaeKid (Oct 17, 2008)

bunkerbob said:


> Well I can not find any data about low pressure small 16 oz propane tanks exploding on the web, you know me I look until I can find hard data


I also use my Google-Fu to try to come up with facts, I also use local resources as well to locate information (businesses, emergency services, library, tech-date-sheets, etc).

If you want to try to blow-up the 2-pounder propane-bottles (the little green Coleman propane bottles) - use a small caliber bullet to pierce the shell. The propane escapes, the fire lights the propane and burns it off quickly. Sometimes the propane bottle will spin, sometimes it just sits there - but - so far, I have never seen the bottle turn into shrapnel.


----------



## youpock (Oct 20, 2009)

When I was young we poured a bunch of lighter fluid on a small green tank, ignited it then shot it with a 308, it was pretty boring.. it made a short of pop and flames came out but it didn't explore or throw metal shards through the air.

lol same day we did the same thing with a gallon of gas, explosion was way bigger and more exciting..

Maybe if you were like standing over it and it failed while attached to a stove or something but it exploding and taking your house out.. I don't know.. lol mythbusters got a better explosion with a hot water heater


----------



## Tribal Warlord Thug (Jan 27, 2009)

i hope i can have some of the "borrowed time" bunkerbob's been livin' on.......i've also been refilling little tanks all the way up to the 1000#'ers.......never a problem in 20+ years. like he said....take care of yer s**t, and it will take care of you.


----------



## longtime (Nov 22, 2009)

The only possible problem is the valve not sealing. The tanks are not going to fail because of differences in pressure. Propane is ~ 200 psi @ 100 F in big tank or small. The valves are not made to be used over and over again. Having said that, I refill them on a regular basis, I just check for leaks, keep a brass cap tight. Must be living on some of Bob's time too.


----------



## Shopsurvivalkits (Jan 8, 2010)

This is a great cost savings. Those little bottles are over priced. I think Harbor Frieght sold one a long time ago.

Affordable Survival Kits and Supplies


----------



## HozayBuck (Jan 27, 2010)

I find living by the rules or not living because something might be dangerous to be....well...boring to be honest, I'm 67 years old, I was born dying as were all of us, 
I joined the Marines at 17...opps, dangerous!!! at one time I was turned down for life insurance because I was involved in Rodeo, Scuba diving, and trying to get into Sky Diving, all at the same time I was being a Marine, ahhh !! death wish... 

I reload all my ammo, I handle lots of black powder!! I worked as an apprentice powder monkey and love blowing chit up...

Some how I equate these things with driving my truck from Montana to Texas and back... for sure lots "can happen" but the only safe thing is to not go, sit on the porch in my rocker, but then..a meteor might hit me so best move inside, except I might have a gas leak so maybe I best sit under a tree, but then a storm....... ah screw it, I'm just gonna fill that damn bottle with propane and cook a friggin steak!....:ghost:... OH!! and I'm going to chance opening a beer which could turn into a hand grenade and wipe out the city because I'm sitting by my just filled propane bottle... chit....HELP!!!!!!:surrender: 

Sorry... I got carried away with the fun of the moment... I'll play nice..as soon as I take my meds...:ignore:


----------



## bunkerbob (Sep 29, 2009)

Shopsurvivalkits said:


> This is a great cost savings. Those little bottles are over priced. I think Harbor Frieght sold one a long time ago.
> 
> Affordable Survival Kits and Supplies


They still do... - Harbor Freight Tools - Quality Tools at the Lowest Prices


----------



## NaeKid (Oct 17, 2008)

I have just recently found a great site full of technical information and one of the links is directly related to the information in this thread.

Notes on Non-Refillable Gas Cylinders

I will let you all read the technical information listed in the link above and come to your own conclusions from the information presented.


----------



## horseman09 (Mar 2, 2010)

I've been refilling 1 and 20 pounders from 100 pounders for years. The 20s are made to be refilled many, many times. The 1 pounders????????? I am concerned about metal fatigue from expansion/contraction, rust, and general wear and tear. A tank rupture in the home could be catastrophic.

My 2 oldest daughters use my refilled 1 pounders in their Buddy Heaters in their bathroooms on extra cold days, so I am extra cautious. Each time I refill a 1 pounder, I put a mark on the bottom of the bottle using white out. When a bottle has 12 marks (a purely arbitrary number), I throw it out.

I guess that's just a dad worrying too much about his kids.


----------



## horseman09 (Mar 2, 2010)

Oh. I forgot to mention............the tanks will fill quicker if you throw them in the freezer a few hours prior to filling. I also fill a bucket with ice salt water, then, after attaching the 1 pounder to the filling hose, I slip it in a plastic bag and immerse it in the ice water (I use the plastic bag because I don't want to expose the 1 pounder to corrosive salt water), then I open the fill valve. I use a postal scale to measure 1 pound of propane.

The reason for chilling the 1 pounder bottle is that a 1 pounder actually contains 1 pound of _*liquid*_ propane. If you inject liquid propane into a warm tank, it turns to vapor, the pressure equalizes between the two tanks, and the 1 pounder cannot fill.

You can use needle nose pliers to pull on the release valve on the top of the bottle, but too often it will not seal again. At least that has been my experience.


----------



## nj_m715 (Oct 31, 2008)

The little tanks are not meant to be refilled, but many small tanks are like that. I have an old freon tank that I converted into an air tank and it's going on 15 yrs old. 

I pick up an adapter about 10 yrs ago. I forget where, but I saw the same one a walmart, camping stores and harbor freight. It was about $10 when I got it and it now about $20 but still worth it if you use the little cans. You can also get an adapter and a hose to use a large tank for your little stuff. It's good for things like stoves and little buddy heaters but not so good for a torch. 

I scavenged a 100# lp tank for a waste vegetable oil project, but it was over 1/2 full. I didn't want to waste the fuel so I connected two lp regulators with a rubber hose, flipped the big on upside down and filled all of the 20#'ers I could find. Same idea as the little adapter. So I guess I can join the borrowed time club too?

I don't bother with cooling the tanks. I just fill 'em up. Some only get about 1/2 full and some take more. I figure that 1/2 id better than empty. I mostly use them for plumbing torches so 1/2 tank is fine with me. If I get a leaking tank I quickly screw it into a torch tip or stove and mark the tank to be tossed when it's empty.


----------



## Bigdog57 (Oct 9, 2008)

I am not against refilling the empty One-pounders, and intend to do that myself as I get more from camping. Just got my first 20-pounder and am looking closely at Bob's home-made adapter - ingenious!

BUT..... Federal DOT and most if not all State DOT have laws against transporting the refilled 1lb bottles in motor vehicles on the highways.  Just something to be aware of.


----------



## nj_m715 (Oct 31, 2008)

But I didn't refill it. It came that way, officer.


----------



## Tirediron (Jul 12, 2010)

jebrown said:


> Bunkerbob
> You are living on borrowed time whether you are willing to believe me or not.
> Just because someone sells ssomething doesn't mean it is safe for use.
> You may be familiar with two of my past employers. Continental Truck & Towing and Cole-Schaefer Ambulance.There was not a day that went by on eithjer job that I didn't here the "But I've have been doing the same thing for... and this never happened." It eventualy catches up with you.
> ...


Where do you get your facts . If the tank isnt safe to refill it isn't safe to fill in the first place. If you fill the little 2#ers with a pump you are asking for trouble 
And just like 20# tanks design life before retest is probably 10 years ,but the bomb and missile thing is a little overboard, 
A word of caution from someone who knows propane Don't refill the little tank in the winter and then leave them in the sun. 
refills should be done at the highest ambiant temperature expected during its full life , or run a lantern for a while to be sure that you have a 20 percent expansion space:scratch
the other surprize is that some of the newer 20# tanks have a tip over shut off valve so that you can't get liquid out of them


----------

