# Modern diesel fuel...



## Magus

How long will it last before it's crap?the old stuff used to keep a couple of years.


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## FatTire

Magus said:


> How long will it last before it's crap?the old stuff used to keep a couple of years.


Depends how often you stir the tanks, and how good you are at keeping air and water out. Given the proper storage system, from the time it was made till you extract it... using the obvious example, earth, tens of thousands of years


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## Magus

O.K..

55 gallon stainless steel drum.
Bone dry.
Sealed in the back of a false wall in a shed.


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## FatTire

Magus said:


> O.K..
> 
> 55 gallon stainless steel drum.
> Bone dry.
> Sealed in the back of a false wall in a shed.


Couple years tops... My dad once bought several drums of diesel for a generator, by the time we got to the last couple, it was bad from condensation and separation.... I remember him saying he should have stirred the drums occasionally.

Wish I had it now to uh experiment with


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## Magus

I can fix condensation.


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## TopTop

I think the only real threat is the bugs that live in oil & and turn bug food into bug crap. Treat it with a biocide to kill the bugs & it should last a long time. But then I'm used to the old fuels, not the new low sulphur stuff. As you say, if it gets contaminated with water it is pretty easy to separate it.


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## Ezmerelda

Isn't Pri-D an additive that's supposed to slow down separation? I've seen it at Home Depot, and the label says it's to stabilize diesel for storage.


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## chris88idaho

I worked at a prison that had diesel parameter trucks that drove in a circle all day everyday. After 3 years the diesel in the tanks turned into jelly (from what I heard) because the tanks were topped off every day and the fuel was never fully run out of them.


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## Jason

Chris88idaho, I'm not sure I buy that. We have diesel tractors (one new one and 2 old mechanical ones) and have never had fuel turn to jelly from a tank not being emptied. We top off pretty much every time we use them and sometimes the tractors sit for a week or more between uses. I think your info source was blowing smoke on this one. Or the fuel gelled for some other reason that was misdiagnosed. Just the trucks' normal driving at the prison, even on pavement at slow speed, will be plenty to keep the fuel in the trucks stirred up, what with braking, turning, accellerating, etc.

Just my 2 cents...


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## Magus

chris88idaho said:


> I worked at a prison that had diesel parameter trucks that drove in a circle all day everyday. After 3 years the diesel in the tanks turned into jelly (from what I heard) because the tanks were topped off every day and the fuel was never fully run out of them.


Does it get really, REALLY cold there? that's the only time I've ever heard of diesel jelling up.:dunno:


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## The_Blob

chris88idaho said:


> I worked at a prison that had diesel parameter trucks that drove in a circle all day everyday. After 3 years the diesel in the tanks turned into jelly (from what I heard) because the tanks were topped off every day and the fuel was never fully run out of them.


the fuel gets pulled from the *bottom* of the tank :scratch












Magus said:


> Does it get really, REALLY cold there? that's the only time I've ever heard of diesel jelling up.:dunno:


Idaho gets colder than a witch's teat!


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## Magus

Stands to reason except for your diagram....


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## chris88idaho

I can't say for certain. Prisons are infamous for making mountains out of mole hills. I know the trucks ran for 3 years and were all thrashed. Never ran much over an idle always making a left turn. Sure guards falling asleep and driving into stuff didn't help much either.

That's how it goes, if you don't own it you don't take care of it. Knowing the state doc they probably bought the cheapest diesel possible. Ya gets colder hell up here. Snowed a couple of weeks ago, still burning a little wood some nights.


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## Tirediron

Fuel will last longer if stored at cool temperatures, some kind of stabilizer would help too, fuel shouldn't gell unless there is some kind of contaminant in it. filters usually plug with wax if the wax content is not lowered for cold weather.


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## Magus

I hear pure wood alcohol busts the wax but I never tried it.


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## Tirediron

Methanol will melt the wax, the down side is that it bonds with water and can get water past water seperator filters.


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## oldwindrow

redacted done posting where illegal fantasies are promoted


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## Magus

Hmm.giving me ideas for some backyard chemistry.


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## LincTex

Mercedes Benz authorizes you to mix some gasoline with your diesel to prevent gelling in the cold.

I ALWAYS store my diesel mix with 10% well-filtered used motor oil. It is a decent lubricant, and I think it makes the diesel keep for a longer time.

Used ATF is very hard to get around here


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## Jason

How much gas will Mercedes let you put in a given ammount of Diesel fuel? I'm not discounting you but this surprises me. Good info to have.


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## LincTex

Jason said:


> How much gas will Mercedes let you put in a given ammount of Diesel fuel? I'm not discounting you but this surprises me. Good info to have.


It depends, I thinks the older 190D were authorized up to 30%, but I would NEVER use that much!!

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/267461-mixing-gas-w-diesel-cold-start.html


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## Jason

Wow. That sounds like a lot. Thanks for getting back to me!


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## FrankW

Magus said:


> O.K..
> 
> 55 gallon stainless steel drum.
> Bone dry.
> Sealed in the back of a false wall in a shed.


Diesel is a lot more robust than gasoline, which will sour within a year ( les in a hot cmilate longer in a cold climate).

If you add a stabilizer Diesel can be good for many many years..

And since Diesel engines systems are less "finicky" even partially degraded diesel will still drive most trucks.

Even w/o stabilizer if it is sealed with little or not air in it and it was fairly dry diesel to beging with you are also looking at years of longevity.


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## goodsurvivordepot

I had some diesel stored for about a year in the garage (5gal plastic fuel jugs.) Other than the occasional move from one corner to the other how would I know if it's gone/going bad? Like gas can you smell it to see if it's turning bad?


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## BlueShoe

the weekend I bought a diesel I pulled to an out of town pump and pumped 13 gallons of unleaded into the truck. At home all the green handles of that station were diesel. It was a green handle and I was tired. 
I never started it, but called an emergency diesel mechanic, who said as long as I got most of it out a LITTLE gas mixed in every now and then will cleanse things. He said a gallon in 30 wouldn't make any difference. I don't think he was saying to do it every time, just occasionally.


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## Marcus

http://www.gm-diesel.com/vbull/engine-and-drivetrain/11465-1-vs-2-diesel-fuel-question.html

It was always my understanding that the paraffin wax was the issue in colder climates. It would gel up and clog the fuel filters and fuel lines.

Here's a website that discusses fuel stability: http://theepicenter.com/tow021799.html
Of course they're trying to sell you something too.

http://www.bp.com/liveassets/bp_int...ts/downloads_pdfs/f/Long_Term_Storage_ADF.pdf


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## Tirediron

Gasoline in diesel fuel, causes a lack of lubrication,which damages the very fine tolerance injection components, If you end up with gasoline in a diesel, drain as much as you can , then fill the tank with fresh diesel and some kind of lubrisity additive, 2 stroke engine oil works well here.

Cold weather diesel problems are mostly caused by wax plugging the primary fuel filter.(like marcus said) if there is enough wax to clog the lines you are in for a real headache.


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## Magus

Think I'll just store fuel oil, the crap keeps forever.


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## LincTex

Magus said:


> Think I'll just store fuel oil, the crap keeps forever.


It is the same exact stuff as off road diesel... but wasn't always that way.

I know for a fact in the 80's it was different.... Home Heating oil/fuel was allowed a LOT more of : Sulfur, sediment %, Sediment particle size, and the makeup of the red dye was different than off-road diesel. It even smelled different.

I talked with my fuel oil distributor in the late 90's, it was all changed over to the same spec so the refineries wouldn't have to "change to a different product".

It used to be that home heating oil had all the extra sulfur and dirt left in it, so it was a lot cheaper... now, no one cares and if you want it, you just have to pay off road diesel prices or tough luck. More profit for them, as well as one less "different" storage tank to have to hassle with.


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